Canadian Marijuana Market

[Buddha1]

Lots of basement Lab tech and scientists in the world of Marijuana now a days...lol...making as potent a THC product, as they possibly can...Any of you guys ever make pure THC crystal?

I had that shit back in the 70's.

You want potent and crazy...That's the stuff...It will rip your hair off...LMAO! Its a cannabis high times 50, with full on hallucinations. I'm to old for anything like that now, even hash oil sets me back, but back in the day...WaHoo!

But, once you hit your late 50's...Mellow, becomes your middle name...lol.

Peace...B

 

[Ras Mason]

haha. no doubt.sometimes 40 feels mellow when you started at 9...lol.

do you mean thc acetate ?

 

[Buddha1]

haha. no doubt.sometimes 40 feels mellow when you started at 9...lol.

do you mean thc acetate ?

I don't know...All I can tell you is it was called "Pure THC Crystal".

We paid $100.00 a gram and we split it into 10ths, to make 10 hits(the guy that sold it to us said...No more than a tenth of a gram each). A hit would get you really high for about 12-14 hours with hallucinations, then for the next day or so all you needed to do was smoke a joint and you were totally ripped again until the joint wore off. The hallucinations weren't dragons and weird scary stuff like LSD, it was more like your perceptions were out of line. When driving around(best part of getting high, back then...lol), the road was always curving up and to the left(a straight buddy was driving for us), everything was bright, clear and crisp. When I was laying down on my bed in the dark, I turned into a 6 inch thick rectangular slab with only my nose sticking out so I could breathe and when I slept, dreams were real and vivid, but not scary. Its been a long time so I'm probably missing a lot of the experience now.

We liked the effect, but only found it from that one guy, we bought all he had and once it was gone, never came across it ever again. I think the guy was studying to be chemist in university and made the stuff...not really sure. People just drifted around back then, it wasn't uncommon to party with someone and never see that person again.

Hope this helped.

Peace...B

 

[Ras Mason]

hehe.ya.nice description.
I am sure a chemist could bend the laws of nature to create those extreme effects.
Then again, i have not yet sampled thc acetate...
peace

 

[vapor]

sounds like crystal meth/...

I don't know...All I can tell you is it was called "Pure THC Crystal".

We paid $100.00 a gram and we split it into 10ths, to make 10 hits(the guy that sold it to us said...No more than a tenth of a gram each). A hit would get you really high for about 12-14 hours with hallucinations, then for the next day or so all you needed to do was smoke a joint and you were totally ripped again until the joint wore off. The hallucinations weren't dragons and weird scary stuff like LSD, it was more like your perceptions were out of line. When driving around(best part of getting high, back then...lol), the road was always curving up and to the left(a straight buddy was driving for us), everything was bright, clear and crisp. When I was laying down on my bed in the dark, I turned into a 6 inch thick rectangular slab with only my nose sticking out so I could breathe and when I slept, dreams were real and vivid, but not scary. Its been a long time so I'm probably missing a lot of the experience now.

We liked the effect, but only found it from that one guy, we bought all he had and once it was gone, never came across it ever again. I think the guy was studying to be chemist in university and made the stuff...not really sure. People just drifted around back then, it wasn't uncommon to party with someone and never see that person again.

Hope this helped.

Peace...B

 

[Buddha1]

sounds like crystal meth/...

I don't think so...It was extremely easy to sleep on.

Just lay down and almost instantly you were sleeping and dreaming. "Crystal meth" pumps you up, makes you active, and keeps you awake for days. Like I said...Only had it from that one guy and never seen or heard of it or him again. If it wasn't pure "THC", it sure simulated the effects of thc, only hugely intensified. It definitely wasn't any drug I had ever taken before or since and we did a lot of drugs back then...Believe me.

It was fun, but not something I would go looking for, but if it was there, I definitely would have done it again(back then, not now...lol). I can't say what it was...But it wasn't "Meth". Meth was just called "Speed" or "Crystal Speed" back in the 70's...This definitely was not speed.

Peace...B

 

[blastfrompast]

icdog, where do you purge in the winter time with butane in a residential setting?

U need to move out to the country...neighbors suck...

 

[vapor]

Crystal meth would only keep you up for days if you smoked that whole gram{and only if you were new to it, fresh head, a meth head could smoke a half a gram and have a nappy lol}}, doing a point at a time like the guy who sold it to you would have been very mild{in crystal meth terms} and at the same time you would feel very focused like the initial rush of a good coffee without the gut rot. In the crystal meth world the buzz would be like 10- 12 hours and you could easy lay down on small amounts of crystal meth and go to sleep, i do know that people who make drugs some times call them other things.... I have never seen pure thc crystal{ that dont mean it dont happen}, i think i recall a dude posting a pic or two of tiny shards....would love to hear if others ever came across pure thc crystals? do you recall the smells or flavors of the smoke.?

 

[Buddha1]

Crystal meth would only keep you up for days if you smoked that whole gram{and only if you were new to it, fresh head, a meth head could smoke a half a gram and have a nappy lol}}, doing a point at a time like the guy who sold it to you would have been very mild{in crystal meth terms} and at the same time you would feel very focused like the initial rush of a good coffee without the gut rot. In the crystal meth world the buzz would be like 10- 12 hours and you could easy lay down on small amounts of crystal meth and go to sleep, i do know that people who make drugs some times call them other things.... I have never seen pure thc crystal{ that dont mean it dont happen}, i think i recall a dude posting a pic or two of tiny shards....would love to hear if others ever came across pure thc crystals? do you recall the smells or flavors of the smoke.?

We were very new to it and this was long before anything was smoked other than pot or hash...lol. We dropped it(swallowed) and it was bitter tasting if the tissue paper broke, made you gag.

Because of the time period(the 70's)...If it was any other drug than pure THC...I would guess "Angle Dust", over "Meth"...only it would have to be the purest of pure of "Angle Dust", for such a small amount to have such a large effect.

Peace...B

 

[OGEvilgenius]

I've heard (I think there's a thread on this forum actually) about people adding methyl hydrate (I think this is the chemical but I could be wrong) to concentrate to allow it to pass the blood brain barrier more easily (same process as converting morphine to heroin basically) and apparently it works.

 

[vapor]

We were very new to it and this was long before anything was smoked other than pot or hash...lol. We dropped it(swallowed) and it was bitter tasting if the tissue paper broke, made you gag.

Because of the time period(the 70's)...If it was any other drug than pure THC...I would guess "Angle Dust", over "Meth"...only it would have to be the purest of pure of "Angle Dust", for such a small amount to have such a large effect.

Peace...B

Interesting the gag bitter taste is just like meth it burns horribly when it is snorted, and the crazy thing happen at higher doses. So a small dose like a point would be focus and easy to ride. I think if you had angel dust{pcp, which i have seen folks high for 5 days off less the a half gram ingested} you probably would not mistake that for anything cause you would wake up beside a dumpster wondering what happened the last 6 hours, pcp is not clear and focused it is crazy and can be a "good" experience if it is done in the right amount...Meth has been around for a 100 years some Japanese chemist if i recall. So a chemist playing around and wanting to make stuff. This would be a interesting challenge back in those days not very hard but interesting because of the novelty i guess. I would still like to hear more about pure THC crystals as i have never come across it. thanks for sharing.

 

[blastfrompast]

I've heard (I think there's a thread on this forum actually) about people adding methyl hydrate (I think this is the chemical but I could be wrong) to concentrate to allow it to pass the blood brain barrier more easily (same process as converting morphine to heroin basically) and apparently it works.

isn't methyl hydrate = methanol = Poison

 

[Ras Mason]

how about decarbed 99% heads in DMSO?
rub that shit on your temples and third eye.

 

[Dr. Buddington]

Ras, that's what I was thinking! I do have a gallon of DMSO for dissolving TDZ, and I do have a few "greasy" jars, hmmm.

 

[Ras Mason]

hmmmmm is not even a question....
I teyed 9 years ago but i haden t decarbed it like a dummy.
peace

 

[Buddha1]

Interesting the gag bitter taste is just like meth it burns horribly when it is snorted, and the crazy thing happen at higher doses. So a small dose like a point would be focus and easy to ride. I think if you had angel dust{pcp, which i have seen folks high for 5 days off less the a half gram ingested} you probably would not mistake that for anything cause you would wake up beside a dumpster wondering what happened the last 6 hours, pcp is not clear and focused it is crazy and can be a "good" experience if it is done in the right amount...Meth has been around for a 100 years some Japanese chemist if i recall. So a chemist playing around and wanting to make stuff. This would be a interesting challenge back in those days not very hard but interesting because of the novelty i guess. I would still like to hear more about pure THC crystals as i have never come across it. thanks for sharing.

I have zero experience with "Meth"...So you maybe correct.

You are correct in that Meth has been around for about a hundred years. I do know that it was invented/discovered by a Japanese chemist before WWII and that they gave it to the "Kamikaze Pilots" before they flew out on there suicide missions against the allied forces. And it was also widely used and prescribed in the 50's and 60's by women as part of a weight loss program/diet. Its funny to think of Grandma as a "Meth head"...lol...But completely possible...lmao.

People think of the older generation in the 50's and 60's as uptight conservatives(Hollywood's conception). But, in fact...They were all partying 24/7 on booze and prescribed drugs from there doctors...lol. I remember my parents had some huge rager's(Parties) when me and my brothers were really small kids(we were ordered to stay in our rooms), and the Ol'man getting totally pissed at us in our teens for using illegal street drugs...lol. I guess if we went to the doctor, like the adults and got scrips, it would have been alright...lmao.

Anyways...It was nice chatting with you about the past, but I think we better get back to the threads intended subject matter...I don't want to be labelled a hijacker.

Peace...B

 

[Buds Bundy]

I have zero experience with "Meth"...So you maybe correct.

You are correct in that Meth has been around for about a hundred years. I do know that it was invented/discovered by a Japanese chemist before WWII and that they gave it to the "Kamikaze Pilots" before they flew out on there suicide missions against the allied forces. And it was also widely used and prescribed in the 50's and 60's by women as part of a weight loss program/diet. Its funny to think of Grandma as a "Meth head"...lol...But completely possible...lmao.

People think of the older generation in the 50's and 60's as uptight conservatives(Hollywood's conception). But, in fact...They were all partying 24/7 on booze and prescribed drugs from there doctors...lol. I remember my parents had some huge rager's(Parties) when me and my brothers were really small kids(we were ordered to stay in our rooms), and the Ol'man getting totally pissed at us in our teens for using illegal street drugs...lol. I guess if we went to the doctor, like the adults and got scrips, it would have been alright...lmao.

Anyways...It was nice chatting with you about the past, but I think we better get back to the threads intended subject matter...I don't want to be labelled a hijacker.

Peace...B

Meth didn't really get popular in BC till about later 1990's. Before that it was mostly speed (powder) and then you started to see Meth/Crystal/Glass/etc... start showing up. Meth and the other variants were WAY more potent than speed, at least that's what I saw from people who started to use it intead of speed as meth was much stronger.

 

[OGEvilgenius]

isn't methyl hydrate = methanol = Poison

I believe it's used to get the methyl molecule, but I'm no chemist and like I said, I could be and probably am wrong.

 

[c-ray]

http://www.hightimes.com/read/dabs-20-co2-extraction-cannabis-concentrates

Dabs 2.0: CO2 Extraction for Cannabis Concentrates
BY CESAR SORIANO · TUE MAR 25, 2014

As of May 1st, a new regulation will be in effect for the state of Colorado requiring all concentrates to be tested. There are several dispensaries that might suffer if they don't change their methods. We interviewed Alex Cahoj, president of Evolab and John Kruse, Evolab's lead extractor here in Denver to find out some of the facts behind the CO2 concentrates, and debunk some myths circulating about the process.

What made you get into CO2?
John: It kind of happened by chance. I was working for another extraction company doing CO2 here in Denver. I learned how to run the machine and just kind of fell in love with the process.

Alex: The safety, and selectivity of the extraction is what I liked the most. You have a lot more control over it versus the hydrocarbon set ups. Plus, I’m not into poisoning people.

Can you briefly explain the process?
John: You take CO2 as a gas or a liquid and pressurize it to the "Super Critical" state -- anything above 1078 PSI -- but you don’t have to have super-high pressure. As you pass the gas through it will pull the oils, waxes and other materials out of the plant. Certain parameters will preserve more of your terpenes and others strip more material.

Where do you see the movement going due to the 100 PPM max rule?
Alex: A lot of people are getting into CO2 now because of regulations. That being said, we were there from the beginning. We had that standard internally, morally, ethically. It's the only thing we think about really. That was/is our challenge. It's not easy.

What's the minimum amount of cannabis flowers you would need to produce a batch, and what are the yields?
John: With CO2 cannabis extractions, your usually looking at around eight percent yield being pretty average, and 12 percent being pretty good. You can use CO2 and strip everything out. The problem begins when you start running higher pressure, you’re going to get everything else out too: undesirables such as chlorophylls, etc. All you want is your cannabinoids and terpenes. With great material we are getting 10 to 12 percent, with machine trim we’re getting about five or six percent. Machine trimmed material is darker because the chlorophyll in the plant cells are cut by the blades when wet trimmed.

Are there yield differences from trim and nugs? How about quality?
John: I see higher yields typically with the smaller buds and sweet leaf trim. The nug runs do have great material available there, but part of the percentage of that nug weight is going to be stem weight, plus some other things. When you’re dealing with sweet leaf trim and small buds you have material latent with crystals. Nug runs usually work better with butane and the hydrocarbon processing. With CO2 extraction we get a lot of terpenes naturally with any type of trim we run. For most dispensaries, the flower is still more valuable in its flower form, and the cost of the concentrates hasn't really caught up to that yet.

Can you de-wax CO2?
John: Yes, we can separate oils from waxes. CO2, is selective, you can set the parameters as much as you need. If you just want to pull the waxes, you can pull them out and leave your oils separate. With CO2, you don't have to winterize to get the wax out, which keeps our product cleaner and purer than the competition.

Will molds, mildews, residuals or contaminants show up in concentrated form? Does the CO2 process get rid of all that?
Alex: When you run Super Critical CO2, microbial bacteria, mildews and molds are destroyed. The things you have to watch out and screen for, and what the State of Colorado Marijuana Enforcement Division will be screening for, are pesticide concentrations, residuals and chemical additives. If somebody sprayed some pesticide right before harvest, it's going to be a problem.

Would the taste and color leech into the CO2 concentrate from using a lot of fan leaves?
John: Water leaves, big sun leaves, big hand-sized fan leaves are a no-no pretty much for anything but edibles. Fan leaves still have quality cannabinoid content, and they are also good for juicing. There might be a larger content of THCA and CBD in the fan leaves, it's just not as efficient. If we're going to get a three percent yield, and it takes the same amount of time to run it, it just doesn't make sense.

How has the process been refined since you started? How have you guys evolved since you started making CO2?
John: Huge, huge learning curve from where we started. In CO2 extractions, one worry is getting out your water concentrations. That's a huge challenge. The methodology in doing that is where we’ve evolved. We have always avoided using solvents. We don’t winterize our waxes because it involves using ethanol. For us, it has been an evolution of finding techniques that are used in similar industries, which we can apply to our product. There are other industries that separate oils and waters. For us, it was kind of stepping back, looking at these methodologies, and trying to figure out what fits our product and standards.

Alex: We recently started expanding our product line and we have amazing vape pens. Fundamentally, we wanted our vape pen quality to be the same as our dab oil. It was just a matter of waiting for the technology to catch up in the vape pen market. We're not going to sacrifice the purity of our product just so we can make a bunch of vape pens to increase sales. We decided to wait for some better products to come on the market, and we’ve found better cartridges that allow us to vape our oil as-is. It's a benefit to us, especially when testing starts and you see our cartridges aren’t cut with anything. Not only are our THC percentages higher because of that, but we are also meeting the new regulatory standards required by law.

CO2 in edibles? Anything going on in the edibles market with your company?
Alex: We are really excited to announce that we will be putting Evolab oil into the edible line we are creating this year: Evolife. We currently extract oil for a few edibles companies in town and they swear by our CO2 oil because it is raw, pure and without residual solvents. Our oil lacks the chemical aftertaste that some BHO, propane and ethanol extractions can give to edibles, so our clients prefer to infuse with CO2.

Has any CO2 product been used in topicals?
John: Not yet. We’ve seen salve products made with BHO, but not yet with CO2. The cool thing is that it can and will be with our future product lines. The same wax we get from the extractions can be used as the wax in topicals and balms. That de-waxed material is not garbage. You just need the right equipment, and know the right way to activate all the material left behind.

How is Evolab getting better?
Alex: The game is changing for us now because we will be testing every batch of trim, every run, all the wax content, all the terpene content. We have an onsite PhD chemist and have acquired equipment so that we can really start to dial in all the data. From how much moisture content, to how much wax content, how much of each cannabinoid, how many terpenes, flavonoids, paraffins and waxes, all of that we are actually going to be able to measure and give the consumer that information. We are also learning from the trim that we outsource, what to expect before the extraction has even started. That's huge.

CO2 Wax and Shatter?
John: It's just more processes. With CO2 Shatters, we are getting into the 80-90 percent THC range. You really purify it. You’re taking everything that's not THC out. The more things that you take out that block the crystallization process, the easier it is to crystallize it. The downside is that there's pretty much nothing else left except for THC. Everything else is removed so that the crystallization process can occur.

How CO2 compare to BHO in test results?
John: There's virtually no difference, it really just depends on what your secondary practices are. We can get up to 95 percent THC if we wanted to. Raw on average is going to come out at around 55-65 percent, fresh out the extractor. With other processes, we can bump it to 70-75 percent. It's basically removes the water. You’re getting waxes and other inert material out which make the potency go up. In BHO you have to winterize and other things. With anything, you have to do the secondary processes to get that concentration level up.

How do you keep your terpenes intact and preserve the best flavors while not getting the PSI too high? What would say would be the best range?
John: We will never tell. Terpenes are volatile, all the data can be found by anyone. You will always lose some. Just being in the environment you lose terpenes. With concentrates, you really wouldn't want to store them out in the open for very long.

Alex: By avoiding high heat, by avoiding winterization, fractionating with better means mainly by avoiding exposure. Try to keep it out of the light and definitely don't leave your concentrate exposed to air very long, and keeping it under constant temperatures preserves what you've extracted.

How is consuming CO2 internally such as eating it alone or infusing it into tinctures?
Alex: There is variability based on whether we activate the cannabinoids or not. For example, if you use THCA you won't feel any psychoactive effect, but you will reap the medicinal benefits. We can activate it and create a THC product for tinctures, and it will have a different effect. We've done them both. This type of product is definitely in demand.

How pure is your product using CO2?
Alex: We've been told we can just use food grade CO2, the same CO2 that is in a soda machine or beer tap. The tank costs about $40. We've taken the extra measure and get the same instrument grade CO2 used in dental hygiene, hospitals, that tank is about $120. The difference between food grade, and instrumental grade CO2, is that food grade claims to be 98 percent free of contaminants. It could be hydrocarbons, it could be water in the tank, it could be rust in the tank, it could be any number of things. The instrumental grade that we use for our CO2 extractions is 99.9999 percent clean. We've been told that the customer is not going to notice, taste or feel the difference, so why waste the money? Fundamentally, I would rather have 99.9999 percent of assurance for me and my customers. That philosophy runs through and through in every sector of our business. We're not trying to bullshit anyone. It's what we live by. For example, on our premises, we have 160 solar panels. We power 40 lights and our extractor with solar, being ecologically conscious and providing a safe clean product is very important to us.

John: When you dab CO2, that sizzle you hear is the sound of any latent water remaining from the extraction vaporizing on your dome/nail. It's what we call Bound Water. It's water attached to the THC or wax, or some molecule. It's still bound up. It hasn't come out. The heat unbinds it, and unbinding can be kind of violent depending on the amount of water. You'll see and hear the popping, but we work diligently developing new ways to remove the H20. There are no residuals, no additives, no solvents in evolab oil. It is raw, pure, and clean. I dab a lot. And the reason why I like CO2, why I stuck with it, is because I appreciate the cleanliness. The cleanliness and flavor of our CO2 definitely shines through compared to the other products on the dab market.

What do you need in order to make CO2?
John: The CO2 extractor itself and the equipment to do any of the secondary processes, if wanted. Some people have vacuum ovens, some have centrifuges, distillation columns and RotoVapes. BHO extractors are required to do the secondary processes for us its optional. You wouldn't want to dab BHO in the collection dish. Honestly, the product right out of our machine is an amazing raw smoke-able product.

 

[ortsa1]

c-ray, dont post stuff like that you are killing the pocket books of every 2bit welder selling skunkpharm knock offs