Bogbubble and Tsi Fly

[GrowForIt]

Thanks for the input every one, the plants are a looking much better by keeping the maxi bloom above 1.5 and the ph right where it was.

Chimera once they are healthy I will flush the pots with ro and give the higher ph and lower ppms a shot, and see how they respond. I just want to eliminate the other variables first, they were just moved to different tray, with much stronger lighting, and a different flood schedule 5 days ago.

 

[MileHighGuy]

Hi GFI,

no problem brother, I felt the need to say something when I saw your pics.

I know a lot of people on these forums push the sub-6 nutrient regime- I personally do not believe it works in anything but bubbling buckets with no medium, or aeroponics. Whenever you have a medium, salts tend to accumulate, which in turn forces the ph of the medium DOWN. When you are already @ 5.8 (imo the very verge of lockout) and the pH drifts downwards, you are going to start having problems. I see this day in and day out at different med gardens I consult with, on multiple continents. It's a factor of this "more nutes is better" agenda that salt companies push to sell more salts and line their pockets. It's pervasive in our industry, and not only destructive to the environment, and a waste of our heard earned dollars, it doesn't make the plants grow any better of faster.

People can argue that 5.8-5.9 is better for this reason or that, but let's look at the evidence- the condition of your plants. They are experiencing a moderate Mg deficiency, which has already slowed them down significantly, and will probably result in the complete loss of all the leaf matter on the plant at this point. When new leaves grow (if you correct the problem), you'll see these ones shrivel and die.

This deficiency is probably not about your nutrient containing insufficient Mg... all commercial salts intended for cannabis use have plenty. What happens is the pH gets too low, and Mg is locked into the medium and become unavailable to the plants.

You need to get your pH up and from the looks of your plants, ASAP. I would suggest bringing the pH right up to 6.5. You will start to see correction on the colour within a day. If you have Epsom salts at home, add a teaspoon to a gallon of mild nutrient solution (say 250 ppm) and foliar feed... spray the plants from the underside of the leaves. This will bypass the root system, and get some much needed nutes directly into the leaves.



I hope I don't come off as a dick here, but this is just not true at all. If 5.9 were an appropriate pH, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Look at the plants man, and tell me the pH is OK. It's just NOT.... there is clearly a problem.

Secondly, the concentration of the nutrient is not going to mean there isn't enough nitrogen. We've been brainwashed by nutrient companies to use WAY MORE salts then we need. Plants can be grown very well using as little as a few hundred ppm of a balanced nutrient profile.

~~

If I can make a suggestion for next time, do not use peat pucks in a hydro system.. it doesn't hold as much oxygen as rockwool, and can lead to root rot as the peat decays. Rockwool can stay wet all the time, as long as it holds enough O2, the plants will thrive. The same is not true for peat, because it just doesn't hold as much oxygen and really needs to dry out.

Get the pH up right away, your seedlings should stop looking so mutated and the rest of your growth will normalize and get out of this funky mutant twisty thing it has going on. You'll notice the leaves will develop a solid uniform colour, and get away from these darker veins and limey-green leaves you are currently seeing. The splotchy yellow/brown patches will not appear on the new leaves... but the damage is done and where you see the spots, the leaves will likely just die. Luckily, they are so young it won't matter in the end when all of this leaf is dead and gone anyhow.

Remember the colour they are now, and look for it in the future.. when you start to see this limey-green colour and darker green 'textured' veins, it's an indication you are losing Mg and your pH is likely dropping in the medium.

Again- the mentality that you need a lower pH is due to people thinking you can force the plant to take up more by having a low pH. This is not the case, as you can see from your plants... trying to push them has gotten you in a lockout condition, and as you can see it's slowing them down tremendously.

Bring the pH up to a slightly acidic condition as suggested above, and just let the plants take up the nutrients they need... cannabis has done really well by for herself in an evolutionary sense, colonizing 6 continents... and she's done this successfully without the nutrient companies forcing food down her throat over the past 5 Millenia. Give her a complete diet, and let her do her thing... she has surprised me time and time again with her efficiency... she can turn a little bit of salts into something incredible. Just give her the chance and let her do her thing... she'll reward you kindly if you don't try o push her too hard.

My $0.02; hope it helps,
-Chimera

Okay Okay, Let me clear a few things up.

First off, I don't use the Lucas Formula anymore.

That being said, I had some solid results with it.

Everytime I mixed my Maxibloom up it was always at 5.9 by default.

I also didn't use full strength for small seedlings, 1/4 strength until nutrients are needed in hydro like any grow. (Mostly Clones for me)

Here is what happened for me using the lucas formula in a DWC, or a RDWC.

The PH would start at 5.9 and then rise over the next week to about 6.5 before I would remix and it would be at 5.9 again.

After awhile, it stayed between 5.9 - 6.3 or so and I would always let it drift up awhile before bringing it back it.

I'll agree with you Chimera on the Seedlings being Mag def and also Cal def....

I think that your suggestion about a PH lift may very well be valid, and this could help. But certainly for a healthy plant, I've never seen issues with Maxibloom Lucas formula at 5.9

Respectfully I think that Chimera has more experience with growing and anything he says should be taken with some consideration.

Peace and Respect - MHG

Oh and I just had a drink and a bowl full o'hash, so be nice

 

[MileHighGuy]

Oh yeah, and I Really Really Dislike Rockwool, I've had WAY better success with peat pucks.

Here's the thing though, I have near 0% humidity where I live, so everything helps.

Keep in mind, Everyone is in a unique environment

Peace

 

[GrowForIt]

Lets this thread back on track!!!

After getting off to a poor start I finally managed to get these plants straightened back out. I was having deficiencies in all of my grows since I started started using the last batch of maxi I purchased and just assumed it was due to the cooler temperatures. But after not being able to get them straightened out by increasing the ec, adding cal mag, epsom salts, and raising the ph as Chimera suggested, I decided to dust off the Flora Series and try some different nutes.

Bingo! Shitty part is I knew all along because the problems started when I started using the new batch, I just refused to believe that the maxi was causing the problems. I'm really bummed about this, I've been using maxi for well over a year now and have always been happy with the results even though I've noticed huge inconsistencies in the color when mixing it. Apparently the color isn't the only inconsistency! And it's not a fluke, I've got bags of maxi locally, and from both sides of the US that are all inconsistent in mixed color. Anywhere from bright pink to light yellow.

So I grabbed some Flora Nova to run these on, they were on the FNG for 4 days before I put them in the flowering tent last night. They are at 6 weeks veg and 1 day 12/12 today, I have the FNB at around 2.0.

So far I have one confirmed female the Tsi Fly #4, and the tiny Tsi Fly that was only 1/2" tall in the last update is about 6" tall now. I'm glad I didn't give up on this one, if it turns out to be a female I'm sure she'll be special!

I'll try to get pics of them tonight after lights on.

Happy New Year All!

GFI

 

[GrowForIt]

Ok picture time

I was going to do each plant individually but I got side tracked cleaning up the mums, by the time I got to these they were flooding soo.....

Day 1 12/12

Peace
GFI

 

[budelight]

Bravo!

 

[killerweed31]

healthy green as hell, respect to you grower!!!
happy new "green healthy" year!!

 

[GrowForIt]

Bravo!

healthy green as hell, respect to you grower!!!
happy new "green healthy" year!!

Thanks man it's appreciated.

Ok here we are at 5 days in to 12/12 so far I have two Tsi Fly that have shown to be female. They have all been clean up, and received lst sessions twice since the last update. This will most likely be the last update with them all together before the males are removed. Keeping the new nutes around 2.0 and they seem to be doing fine.

I believe the one on the back left and the back center are the two female Tsi Fly

Peace
GFI

 

[nameless]

hey man i just flipped my bogbubble the other day, they look pretty similar at first glance, mine loved to bush out...

 

[killerweed31]

primo quality staff for primo quality grower...keep it up GFI!!!

 

[GrowForIt]

hey man i just flipped my bogbubble the other day, they look pretty similar at first glance, mine loved to bush out...

Right on bro, I'll have to get my ass over to your thread and check them out.

primo quality staff for primo quality grower...keep it up GFI!!!

Yo Killerweed thanks for dropping by bro, I'm hoping I can get this stuff half as nice as the dank ass nugz you're churning out in your thread.

 

[GrowForIt]

Getting to the final weeks of this round, got a few pics to share...

@ 5 weeks 12/12

@ 6 weeks 12/12

Tsi Fly #1 @ 6 weeks 12/12

Tsi Fly #2 @ 6 weeks 12/12

Tsi Fly #5 @ 6 weeks 12/12

BogBubble @ 6 weeks 12/12

Peace
GFI

 

[killerweed31]

amazing resin production at this stage..cant wait to see in the final ripe what happen, sure stiky triky nuggs coming out!!
GREAT JOB friend!!!

 

[GrowForIt]

^^^ Thanks killerweed my friend....

I'm wrapping this grow up, last night I chopped the Tsi Fly #5 and the lone BogBubble at 56 days 12/12. I am planning on chopping the Tsi Fly #1 and Tsi Fly #2 tonight.

Tsi Fly #5 aka The Runt

Gonna start the show with the runt of the run. The TF #5 took an unbelievable amount of time before she started to grow. In all reality I should have discarded this plant after the first week when it was barely alive, but I've seen the runt become the star of the show too many times before so I kept it. When I put this girl into flower with the others she was about 2 - 3 weeks behind the others so don't use her size to judge her.

She had the smallest calyxes of the Tsi Flys when in early - mid flower with large groups of pistils emerging from each calyx, her stems are super strong and and are probably the thickest for the size that I've ever grown. The buds are rock hard and very heavy, I'd have to say they are the heaviest wet buds I've ever trimmed up, not sure if the thick stems add to the weight or if they are just that dense. She smells like apricots covered in sugar and was an absolute dream to trim up. She was mostly cloudy with about 5% amber.

Peace
GFI

 

[GrowForIt]

Bogbubble

Next up is the lone female Bogbubble out of 5 beans I planted. This was my first time running Bog gear, and for some reason I never managed to get this girl to a happy state. She stayed short and compact, and didn't start to put on weight until around week 5 of 12/12. Her stems are thick but her buds are much lighter then the Tsi Fly #5. Her trichs are mostly cloudy with about 30% amber, nothing all to impressive in the smell department, very low odor and kind of generic smelling. It did at one time have a great sweet bubble gum smell, but now I can't detect any bubble gum odor at all. The buds that received the most light are hard, but everything else is airy and underdeveloped. Although I didn't find any nanners on her or any of the others I did find some tiny dark non viable seeds about the size of a few grains of sand, and a few light colored slightly larger seeds.

Peace
GFI

 

[budelight]

I am quite Stunned, once again. If i could pay someone as a personal gardener, you would already have the job.

Thank you for sharing this Grow with us once again.

 

[Superstone]

The Bogbubbles are looking fine but those Tsi flies look even better. Nice grow!

 

[GrowForIt]

^^^ Thanks for the compliments

This is the Tsi Fly #1 chopped at day 57 of 12/12, this girl's trichs were about 70% cloudy, 28% clear, and 2% amber. She has a sweet fruit/floral smell with a bit of rotten meat hiding within, this girl smelled like over ripe pineapple a few weeks ago but that smell is gone now. Her stems aren't as thick or as strong as the Tsi Fly #5 but they have no problem holding up the colas. She isn't as frosty as her two sisters and the buds are much lighter then the Tsi fly #5's lead sinkers. Using volume as an indicator this girl yielded in the middle of the three tsi Flys, however another week of flower may very well have changed the outcome.


Tsi Fly #1

Peace
GFI

 

[GrowForIt]

This is the Tsi Fly #2 chopped at day 57 of 12/12, her trichs were 30% clear, 50% cloudy, and 20% amber. She has a sweet sugary/fruit smell that quickly changes to assault your nostrils chemmy smell when you stick the bud close to your nose. I had actually forgot this strain was crossed with c4 because it always had such a wonderful apricot smell. A few days ago I was rubbing them all to get a idea of the smells and this was the last one to be tested, I was caught off guard after smelling her still sweet smelling sisters. I rubbed her and sniffed my fingers, I immediately without thinking spit out "ewe god damn does that fukin stink" I was so unprepared to smell that!

Her stems are strong and her buds are heavy and beautiful, I believe this girl will come out the yield winner this round.

Tsi Fly #2

Peace
GFI

 

[budelight]

This last photo is my favorite!!!

Its like a huge bud shlonggggg - I love picking the individual nugs off buds like this... 1 per sesh seems to work perfectly for my back pain and to help me sleep.

Good Work GFI