Bitcoin cracks US$100

[HUGE]

Hey pheno maybe you can answer my bitcoin question. If I understand correctly it comes down to the computing power required to factor large prime numbers. Tjere are bitcoin miners who just have massive computers running the crypto amd generating the new bitcoins. What will happen when quantum computing comes online and makes this factoring work childsplay. Will bitcoin be dead or is tjere something in it tjat I'm missing?

 

[PhenoMenal]

Huge,
No, bitcoin mining (mining being a form of brute-force attempts) does not involve the factoring of large prime numbers, it's based on hashing ... SPECIFICALLY, it involves hashing data with SHA-256 (which helps explain the difficult of mining 1 bitcoin and therefore helps explain its value).

Wikipedia sums it up as:
The mining process or proof-of-work process involves scanning for a value that when hashed with SHA-256, the hash begins with a number of zero bits. The average work required is exponential in the number of zero bits required and can be verified by executing a single hash.

Quantum computing might find a way to get a leg in with Bitcoins someday, their calculation speed is certainly fine due to superposition, but no - Peter Shor's quantum algorithm (that would break RSA) would not be applicable.

Also keep in mind that quantum computing in regards to cryptography is in very early days -- as of 2012 the largest prime number factored by a quantum computer was 21.

 

[TheArchitect]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-03/bitcoins-go-parabolic

In the last 48 hours, the price of the virtual currency has surged by 50% from $94 to $141 as the rate of expansion goes more than parabolic. This leaves us with the question, which line item on the Fed's Balance Sheet is 'Virtual Currency Transactions'... what better way to destroy an up and coming currency competitor than to blow a bubble in it and explode it?

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

went to buy some but coins.. 10 day approval... it was 114 when i tried first time.. today its 141.... bullshit...

by the time my shits approved i could have doubled up my money and shit will b e 200 +

anyone know how to be apporoved faster?

 

[PhenoMenal]

anyone know how to be apporoved faster?

Yes, find a better exchange! Most have your Bitcoins in your wallet within a few hours of you paying, because they need you to pay within a few hours of them giving you a 'current value'

 

[PhenoMenal]

anyone know how to be apporoved faster?

Yes, find a better exchange! Most have your Bitcoins in your wallet within a few hours of you paying, because they need you to pay within a few hours of them giving you a 'current value' payment. That's actually quite risky for them though, because as we saw just a few hours ago the value changed from $121 to $148 in under an hour.

I've never heard of a "10 day holding period" though, **** that **** off and move on to a proper exchange

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

Yes, find a better exchange! Most have your Bitcoins in your wallet within a few hours of you paying, because they need you to pay within a few hours of them giving you a 'current value'

went to mtgox.com and to sign up you have to be approved... make sure your a real person... after that i can buy instantly... but till then i sit.

is it not like this for all of the exchange sites?

 

[FlowerFarmer]

Not familiar with how it all works, but wait until this bubble pops.
There will most certainly be a correction soon.


Now is not the time to be buying bitcoins.. A 50%+ increase in a matter of days, bitcoin "boom" is all over the news, 6-pack Joe is trying to figure out how to buy some.

^this is not the time you want to be buying.


Be a contrarian investor. Everyone is buying right now. You want to be selling. Buy when everyone is crying because their bitcoin's value is collapsing. Buy when their is "blood in the streets". The objective is buy low and sell high, not the other way around. Buy high, sell higher? Might as well go spend it on roulette.

Regardless of where bitcoin is going to be priced at down the line, buying at an all time high is a foolish move.



My 2c.

Disclaimer - I'm not too versed in bitcoins, but I do like what I see in regards to alternative currency and the other PROs of bitcoin, but I warn those looking to jump on the bitcoin bandwagon right now merely to speculate that they'll be going higher in the short term. Wait, watch, learn.. then make your move.

PS - I got into precious metals (physical gold/silver, etc) as a means to hedge inflation and protect myself from unsound monetary policy. I purchased in the high 30s like the USD was going to $0 tomorrow. Prices have since corrected quite a bit and a lot of my stack (at least silver) sits at a loss should I choose to sell (I wont).

I still believe in the fundamentals of precious metals and am glad I hold some hard assets outside of the banking world, but I lost of lot of purchasing power because I didn't open my eyes and learn what was happening before rushing to buy. I bought right into the hype (and rapid price rally at that time) that it's going up and up, and I "could have made X amount of dollars by now".

Do your own due diligence.. time your entry. Now is an extremely risky time to buy bitcoins. Never buy into a rally like this unless you're going to be in/out lightning fast to take opportunity small moves/profit taking opportunity.. and even then, be fucking careful.

 

[foaf]

I had left 10 coins in my account on silkroad last year when they were worth $20 each. sweet.... spent it the other day on a part sheet of lsd.... thank you bitcoin.

 

[Harry Gypsna]

went to mtgox.com and to sign up you have to be approved... make sure your a real person... after that i can buy instantly... but till then i sit.

is it not like this for all of the exchange sites?

Have a look for Bitinstant and bitstamp.

 

[Harry Gypsna]

Now is not the time to be buying bitcoins.. A 50%+ increase in a matter of days, bitcoin "boom" is all over the news, 6-pack Joe is trying to figure out how to buy some.

Now may not be the time to buy them as an investment, but buying them and using them immediately is no problem. I would guess that most ICmag members buying btc, will be buying it for some SR/BMR shopping. Buy em, spend em.

 

[PoopyTeaBags]

i was going to buy at 114 and wait to 200 its going to hit 200 maybe even 3 or 400 i think...

if they are purposely bursting the bubble they want to wait for enough people to get in so they make more money and rip off as many people as possible... i was just gonna make a few grand sitting at my computer. 3 months is a small window for a bubble me thinks.

 

[SpasticGramps]

that's exactly the definition of a scam.

it is creating a bubble, empty of value.

this is exactly what created the recession.

you have people betting on whether a stock would go up or down... where is the value in that? real value that is.

how is wealth being produced?

it's not.

you cannot make real value out of thin air, and if someone tells you that you can, it's a scam 100%.

You just perfectly described the current centrally planned markets of the world. Assets prices (stocks, bonds, etc) are being blown up by central banks printing money and pushing liquidity into such assets.

Bernanke and his ilk call it the "wealth effect" of quantitative easing. If all asset prices are up, even if it's just artificially inflated, then people will feel wealthy and spend money. So, blow bubbles everywhere and try and fool people into ignoring the underlying fundamentals in the "real economy". Bernanke and his ilk are making value out of thin air, or so they say. And yes, it's all one big scam.

The reason Bitcoin exists and is going bananas is because it's a free market reaction to the global printing scam. The market is desperately looking for something to have faith in. The price has exploded after the Cyprus collapse because everyone now knows their deposits aren't safe from insolvent governments that are owned and operated by insolvent banks.

Whether Bitcoin is a scam or not I cannot say for sure. All I know is that its price action is a reaction to the fiat money scam that crumbles a little more everyday.

Either way, sheep will be slaughtered.

 

[PhenoMenal]

For the past 3 hours MtGox (note: MtGox, not Bitcoin) has been having issues, here's the log i took every 5min (time is AWST / GMT+8) ...
---

21:10 $141.32000 (-0.379990)
21:15 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
21:30 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
21:35 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
21:50 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
21:55 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
22:00 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
22:15 Database access error error, please retry later (+0.000000)
22:20 Database access error error, please retry later (+0.000000)
22:25 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
22:30 Database access error error, please retry later (-141.320007)
22:35 Database access error error, please retry later (+0.000000)
22:40 Database access error error, please retry later (+0.000000)
22:45 Please wait a bit (+0.000000)
22:50 Database access error error, please retry later (+0.000000)
22:55 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:00 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:05 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:10 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:15 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:20 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:25 TYPE html>
23:30 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:35 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:40 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:45 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:50 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
23:55 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
00:00 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
00:05 $141.32001 (+0.000000)
00:10 $136.00000 (-5.320007)

It still seems to be affected though, so again I'm suspecting an attack such as a DDoS.

 

[TheArchitect]

Or a flood of people taking their profits.....



Welcome to the wonderful world of speculation.


I sure hope when shit gets straightened out it doesn't show 10 bucks a coin.

 

[FlowerFarmer]

Now may not be the time to buy them as an investment, but buying them and using them immediately is no problem. I would guess that most ICmag members buying btc, will be buying it for some SR/BMR shopping. Buy em, spend em.

Fair enough. So long as you spend it quick and aren't sitting on bitcoins during a sell-off.

and I believe that is a large problem with bitcoin gaining ground as a alternative currency. It is way too volatile and will get treated much like a high priced commodity...due to speculators.

This article sums a lot of how I feel about it.

I’ve posted a very long piece on bitcoin over at Medium. Obviously, I’d love for you to go over there and read the whole thing — or at least save it somehow for reading later. But here’s the heart of the article:

Volatility is a serious problem, if you’re trying to put together a currency, rather than a vehicle for financial speculation. If the currency of a country ever fluctuated as much as bitcoins did, it would never be taken seriously as a medium of exchange: how are you meant to do business in a place where an item costing one unit of currency is worth $10 one day and $20 the next? Currencies need a modicum of stability; indeed, one of the main selling points of bitcoin was that it couldn’t be destabilized by government institutions. But that comes as scant comfort to people watching the value of a bitcoin behave like some kind of demented internet stock during the dot-com bubble.
In reality, then, bitcoin doesn’t really behave like a currency at all. In terms of its market value, it looks much more like a highly-volatile commodity. That’s by design: bitcoins were created to be the most fungible commodity the world had ever seen – to the point at which they would effectively erase the distinction between a commodity and a currency.
But is that a good idea?
​

The answer, of course, is no. It’s a bad idea to turn a currency into a commodity, because if the price of the commodity goes up, then everybody using the currency suffers from enormous deflation. Imagine a sucker who took out a loan in bitcoins a few weeks ago — she’d never be able to pay it back today. That’s a pretty good sign that bitcoins don’t work as a currency.
More profoundly, it’s incredibly corrosive to try to build a currency on mistrust, as bitcoin has attempted.

It’s because we place so much trust in banks, after all, that they are forced to take on a great deal of responsibility. Banks and central banks are given an important job to do, are regulated and scrutinized, and can be held responsible for their actions. The population of the entire country, as represented by the government, stands behind bank deposits and promises to honor them even if the bank goes bust. Money, in other words, is a key ingredient in the glue which keeps the social compact together. (What we’re seeing in Cyprus is in large part a demonstration of what happens when that compact starts becoming unglued.)
Bitcoin, in that sense, is anti democratic. It’s based on mistrust rather than trust, it refuses to take any responsibility onto itself – indeed, it doesn’t even have a self to take responsibility onto. It’s nihilistic.
​

It’s fun to watch the bitcoin bubble, but it’s also important to understand that almost no one actually wants to live in the kind of world that bitcoin enthusiasts are looking forward to. Thankfully, the rising price of bitcoins is not some kind of market signal telling us that we’re closer to that world. But at the same time, it’s certainly not something to celebrate.

 

[bentom187]

im not hating on the btc, i love to see people ditching the FED,but I want to know if that was accomplished here.to me it seems like FRN's in and FRN's out since that's what we are paid in and pay our bills in.

I just want to know after going through all that trouble,how does anyone avoid the use of FRN's or its unit of account at a bank, during these transactions? and what would be the downward pressure to stop inflation of bitcoins ?, or FRN's by the use of btc since banks fractionally lend and create most loans out of thin air. this(btc) is like the government/banks, trying to export its inflation back into cyberspace and loose blackmarket associates instead of trying to get a third world country to accept dollars and export their goods in it.real resources are used aswell , so basicly to me this just seems like a poor mans FED.

ill be avoiding this roller coaster myself uless there's other advantages that have not been stated yet.

 

[FlowerFarmer]

inflation of bitcoins is not a problem I believe. The algorithm to mine bit coins becomes harder and harder.. requiring more work/resources to procure this digital currency. Similar to mining for gold as opposed to Benny and the ink jets pumping inflating the money supply out of thin air.

Its capped at like 21 million or something I believe..
And then gradual deflation is built in.



The advantages of bitcoin (at least at this point) seem to be anonymity and the ability to transact digitally outside of normal means/fees. Great for international transactions as well.


... not so great if you forget your password. Although that would be a kin to losing your wallet full of cash.

Its essentially highly volatile digital cash if I'm understanding it correctly. Great for the digital underground.. but extremely risk currency to sit in at the moment due to speculation. People are not buying bit coins to transact. They are buying bitcoins in hopes to sell to someone else who think they'll be going higher.


The problem is the majority of bitcoins remains unused and "hoarded".. with suspect that a few "key" players holding a larger % of them..giving them a lot of control over the market.



At least that is how I'm understanding it.

 

[bentom187]

so i guess this could work but if everything stays on the up and up and works as you said. i think there's a lot of less risky options out there to put your money into. perhaps once it takes off and its more widley excepted it wont be so volitile but may come under more scrutiny by the government if everyone is using it to buy drugs ect... then i guess you just switch to something else.only if your lucky and people are willing to accept them at that time.alot of risk there.

 

[Femora]

I was looking at those BTC about a year ago.. then they were at~ 7 USD or so.
Its a bubble, for sure.. but...

Here is a theory;
I was thinking... The BTC has a upper cap at like 21kk or so. I dunno the introductionvalue, but its not THAT much compared to alot of other shit in this world.. And the use of BTCs are strongly disliked by alot of people running the upper shit in this world.
What if someone or a few ppl has been buying alot of coins, just to block the market and make it what it is today(?).
Its a kinda paranoid way of thinking at it, but it could for sure be true.
eg. some government that acts just as a blocker cus everything is avalible "over there".

I haven't read the thread, just found it at "new posts". Sorry if this already been up.


Anyone out there as paranoid as me, or am I just way off and the bubble is a result of the common knowledge of that the black market acctually excist?

Stay safe!