Advanced Foliar Techniques Explored

[Pod Racer]

7 Day Foliar rescue Compared

7 Day Foliar rescue Compared

Let me see if I can get a decent comparison.
Twig before - Twig after

Clones starting off 7 days ago.

Note: No hydroponic fertilizer to the (at that point non-existent) roots. All Foliar Fed for 5 days.

I learned a lot.

 

[Guest]

Oh if only had the space and seclusion........

Oh if only had the space and seclusion........

There are so many things I would like to try. Need more resources and space.... and be able to dabble without worrying about it all.

Excellent information.

Peace

 

[Pod Racer]

Well that is why I'm here my friend. :wink:

Here is the fully recovered twig today, You'd never know a week ago it was struggling to survive with a huge gash ripped out of its side.



And though these are horrible pictures I know, I want to show the ideal leaf position for those that might not know what a fully healthy and well fed plant should look like. Not bragging, stop the hate posts, just want anyone that cares to take note of the leaf position. Notice that they are broad and at a 45° angle UP, that means they are working at 100% capacity and I have achieved my goal of optimum conditions. This is in a soil grow with hydro nutes to demonstrate my 'control group' to measure against my aero rig. I was up too high and now that I've dropped my ppms to 750 my plants are much happier. The heavier nutes went into the soil as it can take the higher ppm amounts at around 900.






Just nice architecture I thought and some never see it. Took me a while.

 

[whereisbrianV.]

PR you never fail to amaze me. I thought for sure that those clones were toast. That goes to show you what a balanced environment and positive energy will do. Thanks for the props, it was and still is all my pleasure to help you in anyway possible. You have lit the fire under my ass to get my sad clones to premo state. After all it seems with foliar feeding a little goes along way and I am all about that.

 

[Pod Racer]

I got some great ideas on those Twin Towers, if you want to revamp them. :wink: You'd love it I'm sure. lol
Let me get it together for you.

 

[PHB]

What a wonderful thread! You have provided a wealth of information - both theoretical and practical. Consider me sitting at your feet ready to absorb more info.

Thanks,
PHB

 

[Pod Racer]

Wow, high praise indeed. Thanks my fellow grower.
Feel free to come along and join the jamboree.

brianV. here is the schematic I was thinking for your Twin Tower closet, or any if anyone was interested.

 

[Pod Racer]

New thread launched ya'll

New TAG thread

 

[Guest]

I like your concept of only feeding in foliar for a period of time to see really gain an understanding on in its effects and effectiveness.

Maybe we should set up some sort of chart with different peoples foliar schedules to get an idea on what everyone does.

 

[Pod Racer]

Ok, just checking in on the patients. All looks well with the twig and her friends. I'd say a full recovery and back to work.




And some shots of the Bubbliscous...damn this girl is fine! Just the sexiest plant I swear. Is it me? Just H.O.T. HOT!



And I seriously don't know where I am in flower as I 're-flowered' them and they gave me all new pistils. So I figure I'll just leave them on 12/12 until they let me know they are finished.

Need to get back to the rig building.

 

[Pod Racer]

14 DAY UPDATE

14 DAY UPDATE

2 weeks from near death, I hardly know Yea!

Tell me this isn't freakin' amazing! I'm sold.



The last picture is what she looked like 14 days ago, she is the tall twig sticking out of the cloner - the other 2 are her today 14 days later after foliar rescue—for reals. Snap!

And the recovered Clones...even more amazing.



Here are my new seedlings, doing well, next to them is a clone that was rescued, just a match stick with two little leaflets, I thought for sure it wouldn't root, much less turn into this.



And this little gal has been floating in a cup of water for ages...she needs a home, but I can't decide whether to aeroveg her or bubble bucket her. So she sits waiting in her own jacuzzi.

And the best for last, my Bubble Seedlings all grown up. Boy, isn't she just a doll? This is why I love this strain, the fan leaves are so beautiful and they form these beautiful colas right up the center with the fans way out. Easy to trim and the resin...man the resin. The high, ...man the high. But mostly it love the 45° fan leaves that say, "Thank you lord he's not killing
me!"



Though I do see some spots of powery mildew I need to get too. But that last shot down, wow...what a spread.
I can't wait to have a forrest of them. Love them, love them, love them!

 

[MaxYield]

What kind of schedule (timing and concentration) would you get if you would foliar feed everyday + normal feeding?

I am really thinking to get a TAG using ultrasonic fogger and why not use those ultrasonic fogger to foliar feed!?!

I would of course use a DIY ionizer in the root zone (since it's not high pressured mist, it won't be electrostatic) and for the foliar feed, so it can cover everything on the plant.

Wow, imagine TAG + Foliar feeding everyday, that should make some huge monster in no time.

 

[bonecarver_OG]

i really found this thread an intersting read.

well done - lots of research and pics to ilustrate.

awesome

just using rhizotonic misting on the plants is enough to revive the clones - but it seems foliar feeding is actually making the plant grow while it is rooting and that saves time and money.

peace

 

[Pod Racer]

Thanks Buddy.

Here are some updates: The Skunk Twig is just going insane, I haven't even foliar fed for a week. All new growth, just crazy, only what? 15 days from death.



And the other clones that were toast.




This is a Durban skinny a buddy gave me. Pop! Love aerocloning.

 

[Guest]

I know it is redundant ..........

I know it is redundant ..........

But awesome thread Pod Racer. Maybe I missed it but do you use Dutch Master for any of your foliar feeding? Seems they are well developed in that area. Would you recommend them as a ready made if you were to use them? I have not used them yet but have a friend that swears they are the Alpha N Omega.

I do like the way you shape some of the those plants. I again have to say I wish I had more space to just experiment and try different things.

Peace

 

[Pod Racer]

Yes I used their Folitec/Penetrator combo in the first few feedings, to get the nutrients back in. Then my little cocktail once they had recovered and were eating normally. I should have kept up with the regular feedings, I actually stopped as I'm not ready for the clones yet...,now is when Pod Racer goes crazy with clones. My army is going to try and get away from me.

But my next run, once I have the new pod done, is to use their Folitec combo and a new booster mix I'm going to make up once I have five minutes to think straight. (Did I say straight? I'm sorry, bent)

But yes, once I finished all my research and trials with TAG I found their product, though back then you couldn't get it easy in the states and Advanced was something else. Anyhow, when I researched their products down to the ppms of each element and what they created their mix out of, it was like they just made it for growing pot in a TAG system or True Aero anyhow. Everything is based on the same research I found on nutrient uptake and profiling for aeroponic respiration. Even down to the Calcium chelation, which is brilliant as it is the one major def. in advanced flowering I couldn't get rid of.

It is the black freckles that look like rust spots, but tiny. The Calcium needs to be chelated in aeroponic systems as it gets out of balance very rapidly by the plant changing nutrient desires and sometimes falls out of suspension due to ph fluxuations. Its easily locked out by Mg as well. So there are myriad issues with Calcium a much needed nutrient in building strong stems and leaves. So, they are in the lead as far as I can tell, but I've not looked at anything new in a year. Things might have changed, however until I see new data or a convincing argument otherwise, they set the standard for aero growing - but there are plenty of others that have close enough products, especially if you aren't running a TAG system. NFT might actually have different requirements or needs...that is why I hesitate to answer any questions on Tubes or Fence Post designs of FAG or Lo Pressure, as I'm not as well versed in that method or in its research. I don't spread bullshit, only what I find to be concrete. That you can always count on. I hate gossip and corrupted truths. There is an ideal state and it can be identified objectively. That is my goal.
If you find anything of interests, please do share. Always up for new info, especially in this area as I'm still a novice in Foliar Feeding, but learning fast.

 

[Guest]

Pod Racer and all

Pod Racer and all

I have been doing much research on the Dutch Master stuff lately. They have a lot of products like AN but I find they are not redundant and not necessary to buy all 12,000 products to get the job done like AN. I do use AN overdrive and a couple others but I just think there are far too many must haves to get the job done. Nothing really specifically addresses the foliar aspect the way Dutch Master does. I definitely agree with the chelation, I use Bio Biz's--Top Max due to the 30% humic acid in it, as you know acts as a chelation agent. I don't use it past the first couple weeks of flowering because it seems to encourage branching. Just observation not any studies to back that up.( the branching not the humic acid)

Peace

 

[Pod Racer]

Funny you should say that Bree, I just posted over in IGT's thread this in response to all the additives. Spooky.

I'll be honest with you all here, you (no one in particular) should really try mastering growing without all the addatives first. I know everyone is all gun ho to have huge liter sized cola, but honestly until you really understand how your rig and strain perform you really don't know what is working and what isn't.
I find so many jump into the wagon to scorch their newly rooted cuts having no idea that the 5 root hairs can't possibly absorb more than 150 ppms - not 600.
I found that by learning to grow huge apple sized nugs with just the basic hydro mixes allowed me to understand just what is needed and not. I think a lot of those expensive products go unused and right down the drain. Sort of like Protein Shakes for that guy that works out 3 times a week.
Truth is, if he just had an optimal healthy diet and optimal environment to grow he would do so a optimal speeds. The use of enhancers, like steriods, mega vitamins, mega protein suppliments, mega creatine, should be left for the 'Athletes' that are training 4 hours a day, 7 days a week under high pressure early burn out scenarios.
For Joe Blow with a trick rig and 6 or 8 plants, he doesn't really need all that crap in his blood. That is the beauty and allure (of NASA) that is Aeroponics - you literally need almost nothing to grow the healthiest plants possible that look like they are on steroids. No medium, .5 gallon of water per table of plants per cycle, possibly 1/3 the regular requirement of nutrients, in 1/3 less time.
You have to ask yourself, do I really need to add 1000 ppms of mega ultra bloom kaboom predetor anihilatrix? As an example DM One already has a Bloom formula and a MAX additive which is for MAX push. Does there need, or can there be a Super Mega Ultra Sonic Extreme push? Is that really necessary? Just my thoughts on it, and thought I'd share. Like all deciplines I feel, the student should ALWAYS learn the basics first, master the basics next, THEN graduate to the level of a Master to Push your abilities beyond reason. This is why the infirmary and the Sick Plant threads are packed with questions about 'burn' and 'lock out'. If you don't understand the combination lock and how it works - you are just throwing poop at it all day and that ain't going to unlock its potential.

But I concur, which is why I really promote DM One. They seem to have their shit together and they don't try and make a huge profit off a zillion products you don't really need. Like I said - If you TAG it right - You could grow in thin air with practically nothing. Its like juggling ballons in slow motion, except every time the ballon drops its bigger and bigger and bigger until it pops like a pinata.

 

[reaperz]

body building glad you mentioned this. so many people thinking they need this and that, this sup and that sup, when indeed, they need to nail the basics down first, diet, routine, sleep all need to be 100% otherwise you would be using supplements just to be how you would normally be if you got your act to together, supplements are meant to supplement you not carry your lazy arse cos you cnt be bothered to make food in the early morning then go running for 2 hours.

get the basics down perfect enviroment, perfect light space and what not, then think about adding boosters and.... to help grow more buds

 

[Pod Racer]

Yes, exactly. As a perfect example Sulfur might be more of a 'supplement' that someone might consider using over Hot Bloom Mixes.

Did you know (I didn't)

Plants require as much sulfur as phosphorus, one of the elements usually considered a major plant nutrient. Sulfur is found in cystine, cysteine, and methionine, amino acids that make up plant proteins. It activates certain enzyme systems and is a component of some vitamins (vitamin A). Sulfur is found in mustard oil glycosides, which impart characteristic odors and flavors to such plants as mustard, onions, and garlic. Sulfur fertilization has also been shown to increase the seed oil content of crops such as soybeans and flax. Plant and animal scientists have shown that plant tissue should contain one part sulfur for every 15 to 20 parts nitrogen for optimum growth and production of high-quality animal feeds. If the ratio is much greater than 15 to 1, crops may benefit from sulfur fertilization.

Sulfur deficiency symptoms are not always readily recognizable and are frequently confused with the rather similar nitrogen deficiency symptoms. Learn to recognize unusual color development or abnormal growth. The following list of general sulfur deficiency symptoms may be of some help.

* Plants are small and spindly with short, slender stalks.

* Growth rate is retarded and maturity is often delayed, particularly with cereal grains.

* On most plants, young leaves are light green to yellowish, with even lighter-colored veins. On others, such as tobacco, and cotton, some of the older leaves may be affected first. This leaf yellowing is frequently confused with nitrogen deficiency symptoms. On sorghum and corn, early symptoms may also be confused with those of iron and zinc deficiencies.
* On legumes, nodulation is frequently reduced.
* Fruits often do not fully mature and are light green. Spotting of leaves may occur, as with potatoes. This information will be even more helpful if you understand the cropping and fertilization history of each field. High yields remove large amounts of sulfur. Also, recall whether you have been using sulfur free single nutrients or fertilizers made from sources as urea, anhydrous ammonia, nitrogen solutions, triple superphosphate, DAP, or muriate of potash. Also, if you have soils with deep sandy surfaces (greater than 20 inches of sandy loam) sulfur deficiencies may show within that crop season. In summary, using a soil test and a plant tissue analysis, giving careful attention to unique visual symptoms, and recalling fertilizer use history will greatly enhance the identification of sulfur needs.

But no one ever thinks of simple solutions like this - they just go for the Mega Ultra Kaboom Phosphorus Meltdown, rather than realizing that their plants are just out of balance, not lacking in resources of N-P- or K. Most probably didn't know Sulfur was that important at all. Knowledge is power.