5000 barrels a day of oil (210,000 gallons) leak off the coast of Louisiana

[Danks2005]

And yes, the majority of tar and oil that washes up in FL is not from this spill. Or perhaps you know something I don't?
You do realize that the largest contributor to free flow of crude into the ocean (get over your gulf self, jr..it's an ocean) is natural seepage? By a large margin natural oil seeps far outweigh all the rig spills and drilling incidents of the earth put together.

QUOTE]

 

[dagnabit]

And on top of that this thing has a long way before it fully plays out. I can't blame people for not wanting to go down and swim at some of these beaches. If this is irrational fear or not that is something that has yet to be determined. A couple of tar balls isn't going to kill anyone, but I never like swimming in the ocean anyway so that would further lead me to look elsewhere for a vacation spot. It's to each and his own, but this disaster is going to have a large impact on tourists psyche. Again, irrational or not.

yea the government is telling everyone swimming in p,cola is "ok with some caution"

i personally dont believe it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZlJ-RpQRO10


of course most of this

is "natural" and nothing to be concerned with

 

[SpasticGramps]

yea the government is telling everyone swimming in p,cola is "ok with some caution"

I hear you on that it sucks that we can't hardly trust anyone these days. Be it MSM or the Gov. It makes understanding what's really going on very difficult when the truth is such a closely guarded secret.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

And yes, the majority of tar and oil that washes up in FL is not from this spill. Or perhaps you know something I don't?
You do realize that the largest contributor to free flow of crude into the ocean (get over your gulf self, jr..it's an ocean) is natural seepage? By a large margin natural oil seeps far outweigh all the rig spills and drilling incidents of the earth put together.

QUOTE]

How many miles of coastline does FL have? And do you think tar balls wash up on these shores? You think any oil ever gets into the swamps?

And if you actually do some research, you will find that natural seepage attributes LOTS more oil into the seas than any leaks or spills.

And all of this information concerning seeps is what gives me a good deal of optimism...in this pit of doom and despair. I have confidence in the good earth being the ultimate hero in this debacle.

 

[dagnabit]

Look, jump off the comprehension thing, dipshit.

you should jump on it..
right "uncle"?

 

[Danks2005]

How many miles of coastline does FL have? And do you think tar balls wash up on these shores? You think any oil ever gets into the swamps?

And if you actually do some research, you will find that natural seepage attributes LOTS more oil into the seas than any leaks or spills.

And all of this information concerning seeps is what gives me a good deal of optimism...in this pit of doom and despair. I have confidence in the good earth being the ultimate hero in this debacle.

So you really think it is coincidence that the NW part of FL (closest to the spill) is the only part that has seen oil on the beaches. What is a moot point is that there is ton more coatline. This thing is still gushing, don't worry more ruined coastline will come.

I am completely aware of natural seeps. But what you need to understand is an ecosystem is a very balanced thing. So, yeah nature can deal with natural seeps. Nature is not set up to "take care of" 140,000,000 gallons in 60 days. At least not in a fashion timely enough for gulf coast residents.

 

[SmilinBob]

Just to add a piece of info into this frenzy. BP's skimmers only collects about 670,000 barrels of oil. 36,000,000 shy of what they estimated.

Can we get a little more civilized in here? It's for the greater good of the thread, I promise.

 

[BabyHuey]

The oil is starting to get around the barriers into
Lake Pontchartrain
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100707...sZV9zdW1tYXJ5X2xpc3QEc2xrA3RoaXN0aW1laXRzbw--

 

[mriko]

Please, be carefull is you take part to some clean up operation nearby birds nesting areas.

Christine Dell'Amore

in Gulf Islands National Seashore and Pensacola Beach, Florida
National Geographic News

Published July 6, 2010

Standing on a white-sand beach at Florida's Gulf Islands National Seashore Thursday, blotchy stains from the Gulf oil spill could be seen creeping past the red-lettered "keep out" signs meant to protect nesting shorebirds.

And, according to conservationists, some well-meaning cleanup crews who unknowingly walk into nesting habitat may be doing more harm than the oil itself, experts say.

From April to August each year, rare shorebirds such as the snowy plover and least tern lay nests of two to three eggs directly on the softly undulating, open dunes about 40 feet (13 meters) from the water's edge.

Snowy plovers and least terns are considered threatened in Florida. When nesting, both species' survival depends on limited contact with people.

But with oil encroaching on Florida's coasts, an army of cleanup crews has descended on the seashore. About 44,300 people are now de-oiling roughly 450 miles (720 kilometers) of Gulf coastline, according to the website for the Deepwater Horizon Unified Command, the joint federal-industry task force responding to the Gulf oil spill.

With so many people working so close to breeding grounds, frightened adult birds are abandoning their nests, and adults and chicks are being inadvertently trampled. (See "Gulf Oil Spill Pictures: Ten Animals at Risk.")

"Most of us know that the cleanup can do more damage than the oil could ever do," said Riley Hoggard, a resource-management specialist for Gulf Islands National Seashore (picture).

"Our bigger responsibility is to the [wildlife], whether it's to a turtle nest or nesting shorebirds. If we have to get cleanup teams off the beach, we'll do that—and deal with the oil cleanup later."

Birds Flushed, Cooked, Squashed During Cleanup

Oil on beaches is clearly a threat, since the toxic substance can affect shorebirds at all stages of their life cycles, Hoggard said. (Read "Oil-Coated Gulf Birds Better Off Dead?")

An oil-contaminated egg could have a higher likelihood of not hatching. And even if an egg does hatch, a curious chick could get mired in the sticky oil, which may kill the bird or hinder feather development, Hoggard said.

Deepwater Horizon Unified Command has sent assessment teams to monitor beaches and marshes and determine whether oil should be removed by hand—preferred in delicate regions such as the national seashore—or by heavy machines.

Each morning local conservation groups share information with BP's cleanup supervisors about where nesting colonies exist, as well as cautions about not trampling, driving through, or otherwise encroaching on these areas.

But even with precautions in place, there have been instances of cleanup crews disturbing nesting colonies, noted Melanie Driscoll, director of bird conservation for the National Audubon Society's Louisiana Coastal Initiative.

Eric Draper, executive director of Audubon of Florida, said many volunteers have inadvertently wandered into piping plover nesting areas throughout the state.

"The responders' activities have been more threatening to shorebirds than the oil itself," Draper said.

Cleanup operations are most damaging when people "flush" nesting birds—frightening them enough to abandon their nests, the Gulf Islands' Hoggard said.

Crews first dispatched to the Fort Pickens area of the national seashore flushed many shorebirds, and some colonies have abandoned their nests, he noted.

Even a temporary flush—when the parents are frightened off but return soon after—can be disastrous.

Without a parent's belly to cool an egg, the embryo will literally get cooked in the Gulf Coast heat. Likewise, predators such as seagulls may swoop in to snag an unprotected egg or chick.

Increased foot and vehicle traffic have also harmed bird parents and chicks.

Losing even one parent will doom a nest, Hoggard said, since it takes two to raise a chick: one to keep the egg cool and safe and another to search for food.

New, handmade signs on the national seashore's main road implore drivers to watch out for skittering baby birds. Even so, at least one chick was run over on Thursday, according to Adrianna Hirtler, a public information officer for the park.

Gulf Sand Dwellers Also at Risk From Cleanups

Florida Audubon's Draper has begun recruiting volunteers in the state to act as "nesting-bird stewards," keeping nests safe from nearby cleaning crews.

But even cleanup operations farther from nesting sites can pose threats to Gulf shorebirds, said Joel Kostka, a microbial ecologist at Florida State University in Tallahassee.

Standing on a sun-baked Pensacola (map) beach Friday, Kostka surveyed a wide, compacted crater made by heavy machines used to scrape away about a foot (0.3 meter) of sand close to the water.

(See "Gulf Spill Pictures: Toxic Oil Found Just Under Beaches.")

Such techniques clear away oiled sand, but they may also permanently harm sand-dwelling animals, which shorebirds prey on, Kostka said.

"People generally think about beach environments as being dead to biology, and that's not at all the case," Kostka said.

Sun-shy ghost crabs swarm Gulf beaches at night. Small invertebrates such as mollusks and worms burrow in the sand, while thousands of microbe species feast on organic matter that the ocean washes ashore.

Members of these species may be killed outright by cleanup operations, and survivors are left with habitat that may never recover. For instance, certain species adapted to one type of sand—say, coarser particles—may die off if another type of sand replaces the lost layers.

Rather than digging deep, Kostka said, beach cleaners should simply pick up and remove oiled sand from the surface, wherever possible. There's also a chance that in some cases doing nothing will be the best approach.

Natural forces—such as oil-munching microbes—will degrade some oil buried in beach sand, and scientists are now working to figure out how fast and how completely Mother Nature will clean up what's there.

Gulf ecosystems were already in dire straits before the Deepwater Horizon oil spill, Kostka said. Years of coastal development have wiped out large chunks of beach habitat, and sea-level rise linked to global warming threatens to inundate even more of the coastline, he said.

"If you superimpose all of the [oil's] impacts on top of all those other threats to the ecosystems," Kostka said, "the oil may tip them over the edge."
from http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/07/100706-science-environment-nation-gulf-oil-spill-cleanup-florida-birds/

Irie !

 

[Flying Goat]

I haven't posted since the 28th, because it's been almost too much to take in & deal with emotionally & intellectually... to hell with physically.

As of this minute, there is NO WAY BP is going to cap Mocambo... The well casing has been breached way underground... Mud blowback from the area around the wellhead was proof & the reason why they stopped the attempt, after saying that in 48 hours it would be a trickle...

Now we have BP taking over our First Amendment & have a media blackout!

I have to laugh a little at all of this... Mocambo is only 1 of the 3 "leaks" going on right now. The wellhead we see on TV is the 2nd largest. The one we need to worry about is 8 miles from the Mocambo wellhead, spewing roughly 1.5 times as much up from a breach in the sea floor...

A military pilot flying over was heard on radio as saying 40% of the sea floor is now covered in oil...

BP has tapped into the world's 2nd largest oil reserve using EXPERIMENTAL technology, without acoustic switches required in Europe... Now they seek to cover up what they have done.

Corexit reacts with the water to eventually become a vapor, which will be condensed in the atmosphere into toxic rain & is expected to devastate the entire US East of the Mississippi.

I went down to Gulf Shores July 3rd, with Jyme & his wife, to see what was really going on... When we dug down 6-8", we found stripes of oil under the sand... The bulldozers are merely moving sand from the sunbathing areas near the boardwalk & pushing it onto the beach to cover up the oil that is visible... They have constructed a berm so that people driving the beach road cannot see/photograph the dirty waves coming in.

Booms are everywhere, people are everywhere, no one is doing anything. BP's "security personnel" are driving up & down the beach, hasseling families who have their buckets & shovels & cell phone cameras. If you get caught with a camera, they take it from you until they have "reviewed" your photos... This is Nazi shit if ever I saw it.

In the Pink Pony the other day, normally it would be packed & overflowing, standing room only... Nope. Just 2 barmaids, maybe 4 or 5 locals, & the 3 of us... The only people coming in were just buying drinks to use the indoor restroom...

Most of the oil/investment experts in the field are expecting BP to declare bankruptcy, followed by a rapid 2-month sell-off of their holdings in the US.

Please pressure your representatives (not that it will do any good) to seize BP's assets.

The whole cleanup thing is merely a 2nd-grader's school play, designed to keep the public's attention off what is really going on with the other 2 loose leaks....

What we have here is a complete ecological disaster... This will destroy Cuba, Jamaica, Virgin Islands, Barbados, Salvador & Haiti. Half of Mexico will be poisoned, and practically all of Central America.

It is expected that the toxic rains from the Corexit will poison all crops from the Gulf up to the Great Lakes region, as well as Atlantic fishing. Once the chemicals in Corexit are rained down, they poison & kill plant life, then taint the soil, contaminate the water table... Soon, in addition to horrible livestock devastation, we will begin to see deformed human births...

Just ask the Houma indians of Ecuador who had their Amazon homeland contaminated by Chevron a while back. They are here touring the Gulf region, trying to give hope to expectant mothers, etc., sharing their stories of how they have dealt with the heartache of dying children & explosion of strange cancers in their families...

I already have a compromised immune system. I will NOT be one of the ones who survive, unless by some miracle, we can work out a plan to flee back to our home state of Texas, where we can at least grow a comparatively untainted garden & raise our goats.

Every time I have a glass of milk, I am reminded that it came from my sweet goats who are eating grass & brush that has had toxic rain for the last 10 days or so...

When I cultivate my indoor gardens, I have gone back to using tap water, as my rain barrel where I used to get my "pure" has rainbows on it now... As for the outdoor garden... FUCK IT - I can't be outdoors enough to tend it. I simply cannot breathe. Our family is eating Benadryl & decongestants like candy... Even the goats are having watery eyes & snotty noses...

I can truly understand how it is so easy for some people to decide to eat a bullet... And I love the way that BP's rep, ________Ameson, said "human life in the Gulf is expendable." That's us - expendable.

Sorry for the long post. I had to vent to someone.

This is going to be so horrible & affect so many people... You Yankees get ready - it has not begun to affect you yet, but toxic rain travels thousands of miles... Look for white streaks & spots on your grass & shrubs to be one of the first signs. Don't let your pets or kids out in the rain. Don't let pets drink from puddles of rain.

Fuck it all...

Yes, the oil has entered our precious Mobile Bay...

 

[pine boy]

Thanks for posting girl,My heart is with you and I have been wondering how your doing.Send me a note please
pb

 

[dagnabit]

goat this is a horrible situation but believing everything you read will only make it worse.

 

[Flying Goat]

Dag -

I haven't had time to read much... I've been down to the Orange Beach, Gulf Shores & our Bay... talking to people...

We've already had suicides down here.

We're making plans for bugging out back to the Texas hill country...

Hopefully, we can make it before the goats or we become seriously poisoned...

After last nite's rain, my rainbarrel had rainbows on it this morning.

We can deal with the oil - it's the Corexit 9500 & it's breakdown that will get us...

and the fucking other sea floor breach NO ONE is talking about...

If you lived under flight path for Pensacola & Mobile (Navy, Air Force & Coast Guard), either you'd be paranoid they found your grow or, like me, you'd listen to their convos off & on... just for some chatter in the house besides myself...

Hubs is old family Air Force people & does this as a habit, kinda like turning the TV on for "company"... What you hear, once you hear it, cannot be forgotten, my friend.

BTW, his job will go. He works for an Australian/American shipyard which will pull out as soon as our economy hits the crap zone...

I'd love to go to Washington State, where they permit 2 lbs. in storage, but am curious as to whether the shipyards are all union... (anybody out there know the situation?) My DB is a supervisor of supervisors for the pipefitting on the new LCS they've built for the Navy (radar-proof interceptor boat)...

Hell, the dampness would kill me...

Dag, would you like to come down & see my goats & my rain barrel? How about the white stripes & spots on my garden plants (chili peppers & corn & sweet potatoes)? I'll put you up... Heck, we could even visit the beach & go swimming... BTW - the crap in my dress July 3 did NOT wash out. Just wiping my fingernails on my shirt left indelible marks... C'mon over, mate... I have 5 gallons of wine put by that I don't wanna hafta carry to Texas...

Hang back & watch... We're the people living it. Already one of our charter boat captains has eaten his pistol.

This is not fucking funny & all I can say to those who think it is is this -- Just wait - toxic rain will come your way...

 

[dagnabit]

spent 25 years in the flightpaths of eglin hurlburt and pcola nas

i understand what your saying but for instance there are no "houma" indians from Ecuador there were some indans from Ecuador that went to houma LA.

and look back you'll see a pic i posted you wont find anywhere else because i took it.

i understand what you are feeling..hell just read my posts about my mothers reaction.

what im getting at is try not to let your reaction lead you from tragedy to folly.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

EPA, Coast Guard, and BP PR Tied to Airborne Corexit Denials

At the Deepwater Horizon Joint Command press conference last week (June 30) on the toxic studies of Corexit, Paul Anastas, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's Assistant Administrator for Research and Development, answered a question from the Associated Press. He said clearly that there was no evidence of dispersants in the air. Here is the relevant portion of a recording of his remarks. (Listen at 1:50)

However, the EPA site which provides real time data for air quality monitoring on the Gulf Coast indicated that from May 18-June 6 "two chemicals found in dispersants" were detected at numerous GPS locations on the Gulf. The data for June 6 can be found here and the data for the other sites is available at the TAGA Route website. The chemicals detected were 2-butoxyethanol and 1-(2-butoxy-1-methylethoxy)-2-propanol.

We called the PIO at Deepwater Horizon and asked for a clarification on the discrepancy. Joint Unified Command consists of BP, the Coast Guard, NOAA, CDC, MMS, and the EPA. Here is our email exchange.
Our question:

At a press conference on dispersants today, EPA representative Dr. Paul Anastas, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency's Assistant Administrator for Research and Development, said "no dispersants" have been detected in the air. However, TAGA website says:
EPA's TAGA bus monitors for two chemicals found in the COREXIT dispersants: EGBE (2-butoxyethanol), and dipropylene glycol mono butyl ether, which have the highest potential to get into the air in any significant amounts. EPA has been monitoring for these chemicals since May 18, 2010. The TAGA bus monitors are able to detect and measure these chemicals if they evaporate into the air. The TAGA bus has detected very low levels of these chemicals in the air, at a limited number of the locations sampled along the Gulf Coast. The levels found to date are well below those that are likely to cause health effects.
And comma delineated files show low levels of dispersants
Can you clarify for me?

The response:

I've been informed that the EPA question has to be worked through the EPA PIO in area command in New Orleans and then sent to Washington. I can pass it to them if you'd like for an answer?

We indicated that we would like to have the information forwarded to Washington, but as of this writing there has been no response. I want to make it very clear that the PIO has tried her best to get answers for us.


The public, as well as journalists, need timely answers to this question. Since dispersants have been detected in the air, toxicity levels must be addressed. We need scientific interpretation more than ever now that we are faced with an unprecedented release of oil and other chemicals into the Gulf of Mexico. The government's Deepwater Horizon Response website reports that more than more than 1.62 million gallons of dispersants have been used so far, including more than 1.03 million gallons of surface dispersant and more than 590,000 gallons of subsea dispersant.


The most important questions about the potential for long-term heath effects due to exposure to dispersants, such as cancer and nervous system disorders, have not been addressed, although the EPA says it is doing further testing. The problem is that a study of long-term health effects will take years, and the sea life and people living along the Gulf Coast do not have the luxury of time. The wellhead explosion at Mississippi Canyon block 252, took place on April 20; we still do not know much about air quality, and the information we are given is contradictory.


The public's inability to get answers is especially troubling, since more and more information is coming to light regarding the cozy relationship between the Government, the EPA and private industry involved in this catastrophe. The New York Times reported that Nalco Co., the manufacturer of Corexit 9500 hired a former EPA employee as a lobbyist.

llinois-based Nalco Co., manufacturer of dispersant Corexit 9500, recently hired Ramola Musante to run the company's Washington lobbying effort. Musante previously worked at both EPA and the Department of Energy. Nalco also recruited Ogilvy Government Relations, whose lobbyists include Drew Maloney, past assistant to former House Majority Whip Tom Delay (R-Texas).

The chemical company brought on those lobbyists in March and April to talk to lawmakers about potential environmental regulations. But Nalco now faces a host of new concerns because of its tie to the oil spill cleanup.

According to Source Watch, Ogilvy Government Relations and Ogilvy Public Relations are one and the same.

The firm was acquired by Ogilvy Public Relations Worldwide for $60 million in 2005, and changed its name to Ogilvy Government Relations in early 2007. [1] According to O'Dwyer's PR Daily, the firm decided "to switch its name as the Democrats take control of Congress," adding that "the Republican PR lobbying firm" had "recently made inroads with Democrats as evidence by the December hire of Moses Mercado (former deputy executive director of the Democratic National Committee) and ex-Louisiana Congressman Chris John.

This provides a stunning connection, since Ogilvy Public Relations is the same PR firm that represents BP and also has the Coast Guard Media Relations person, Petty Officer Rachel Polish, employed as a Vice-President of the company. See Coast Guard Media Liaison Works for BP PR Firm.


Rawstory reported yesterday (June 5) that the Coast Guard has been involved in spraying Corexit and that it has traveled inland, an allegation that is supported by the TAGA route monitoring.

A marine biologist working with a group of environmentalists to save sea turtles claims the U.S. Coast Guard is involved in spraying a toxic chemical dispersant over the Gulf of Mexico; and he says it has already traveled inland. Pincetich, a marine biologist and toxicologist who works with the Sea Turtle Restoration Project, was speaking to a group of activists who call themselves Project Gulf Impact.

In fact, two days after the press conference announcing the test results on dispersants, "Unified Command" issued a press release directing readers to the CDC website that recommends use of respirators for workers exposed to oil and dispersants.

A summary of studies about the human health effects associated with selected oil tanker disasters can be found in Appendix A. These studies may underestimate the health effects associated with the Deepwater Horizon Response activities since the magnitude and duration of the Response is unprecedented. In addition, there is an incomplete understanding about the human health toxicity associated with the use of large amounts of dispersant, about the toxicity of the mixed exposure to large amounts of crude oil, dispersants and combustion products together and the cumulative effect of such exposures occurring over a long duration.

So, dispersants are clearly present in the air, both over sea and land. If Unified Command is suggesting that oil spill responders might want to reconsider using respirators, why have we been told by the EPA, at a press conference, that there are no dispersants in the air?

Could it be the answer lies in the deep connections between the Coast Guard, the EPA, BP, government lobbyists, and the manufacturer of Corexit?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/georgianne-nienaber/epa-coast-guard-and-bp-pr_b_636268.html

 

[pine boy]

plane putting dispersant down...5-5-2010
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY8KH7m5XyI

 

[Anita Bonghit]

should i move to canada right now and buy land?
just saying cause i just read the words DEATH WINDS
now im scared

 

[turbolaser4528]

whatever, lifes overated anyway. We all gotta die sometime.


I'd rather be dead than living in a post apocalyptic America personally..


Hopefully we survive and fix this, right now its not lookin too good tho haha

FUCK IT ALL !!!!!!!

but, love you guys, see yall on the other side !

 

[SpasticGramps]

Could it be the answer lies in the deep connections between the Coast Guard, the EPA, BP, government lobbyists, and the manufacturer of Corexit?

Shit, DB. That almost sounds conspiracy-ish.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

May be Gramps, depending on what the conspiracy entails.