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2x4 tent and tray, House and Garden + Botanicare, coco, 11-2 gal

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guest5703

Title basically describes most of it, then I have two fans inside to cool the ladies and one 4" inline. I've got a dehumidifier and a reservoir too if I want to ebb and flo, but for not I think I'll be hand watering since my luck has been shit for the past few grows.

If ya don't know me then here's some info, been growing for about 6 years now and had shit on lock for a almost the entire time. My past three or four grows have all been horrible, and I'm not sure why, if I knew what I was doing differently I'd try to change it. The only thing different could be my ebb and flo set up which I have not been properly flushing from the top and I believe the salt build up has really been the problem. Take into consideration my very last grow, my Green Ice strain finished in half of the time of the other strains and was very very dank, I was very happy with how it turned out. Since it finished in half the time, it didn't build up on salts. The other plants went about 2-3 weeks longer and by the time they were done they were burned to shit, lack of flavor/smell/resin, and were fluffy, pretty much like hemp!!!

Well any way I have been busy the past few weeks and when I got around to transplanting lets just say the girls weren't too happy. They were very rootbound but getting good food(800ppm and 5.8PH) and good flushing (RO water and 300ppm) so they were growing a bit.


Anyways I have 1-GDP(looking ok, strong branches yellow leaves), 1-Stardog(looking ok, almost sad and my buddy said needs more phosphorus), 1-Chem D(same exact state as stardog), 1-Bubba and 1 Platinum Kush that both look pretty decent, and the rest are Alien Dogs which my buddy keeps telling me need more cal mag because they have very skinny leaves/curled leaves and are also kind of weak and I know this cut has been strong for other growers and even grew very well for me in the past, outdoors.


Basically I think everything needs more food for sure, I hate going by EC because my ppm is always at a decent level but then my EC is high as fuck and its a new meter and my old one used to do the same thing....I really just don't know how to go by the EC and ppm together, so I follow just the ppm and PH. I'd love a few people chiming in, please help me!!! I'll describe everything I do, I just want these bitches to come around.


They have been vegging for about 2 months 24/7 now(have always done 24/7 lights for veg and it works great), just transplanted 5 days ago. They get some Magic green spray once a week. Bug free as far as I can tell now, I dealt with several different bugs(had spider mites, thrips, root aphids, and gnats).

Main nutrients are Aqua Flakes A and B but I also have Cocos A and B which I will use when I run out of AF. They are basically the same nutrient. Then H & G Multi Zen and somtimes Drip Clean. Botanicare Cal mag and Silica Blast.

Been feeding at 800ppm-5.8ph. 6ml A/gal and B/gal, 5ml/gal cal mag, 4ml/gal silica.



before transplant, this is one of the Kushes and remember they are happy! The Alien Dogs all had weak ass roots, really weak.

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hieagle420

Cannabis Creeper
Veteran
sup cali-- when i was running my ebb and flo , i had my ph about 5.4,never had a ppm or ec meter.. i just checked my ph daily and when it would get to 5.8 id ph back down to 5.4.. never had any problems.. have you grown in the tent b4, maybe its offgasing and screwing you up.. i know you know what you are doing.. maybe it bad nutes, could be a number of things.. Keep It Green and Stay Safe..HE
 

northstate

Member
ICMag Donor
Caligreen sorry to hear of your troubles and I hope I can offer something... Rootbound as hell is my first thought, I know you transplanted it but that is a lot of roots for a small pot IMHO. I like 20/4 for veg. sleep is needed to rebuild cells, move sugars ect. EC is the way to go with readings, ppm is converted from EC by your meter's software, EC measures salt through conductivity in the solution.
Yes, they are hungry and praying for Mag. but if you are feeding them cal/mag it should be there, this leads me to Ph or salts. You do a good job of identifying the potential probs. with self diagnosis. I think that salt build up may be it also. I would bring that Ph down to 5.5 or so to make mag. more available. You clearly know what you are doing and that makes this situation even more frustrating im sure. RO water has no buffers so do you add anything to this when you flush with it? Take one of those A-dogs, flush it really well then feed it EC 1.2-1.5 @ 5.5 ph just for kicks! I will check back to see how its going and best of luck. NS
 
G

guest5703

hieagle420-Yo bro!!! How you doing mang??? Long time no talk, glad to see your the first to post on my new thread! This is the first time I've posted in diary section, so far so good! Merry xmas dude!!! I made a batch of 15 gallons last night, and PH'd to 5.5, great advice for sure. I've noticed checking the run off in the past and the PH has been high.

northstate-Nice to hear from you man, you've got some good points. Following both yours and Hieagle's rec I have lowered the PH to 5.5......I actually went with 1.7 EC and the plants seem to be taking well. Thanks for the help dude, and please stick around!


So, I made a new batch of 15 gallons of RO, 7ml/gal of aqua flakes A & B, roughly 6ml/gal cal mag, 30ml/15 gal silica blast, and 3ml/15 gal drip clean.

Fed the girls last night heavily, at 1.7ec and 850ppm with a 5.5ph. Today=1.8ec, 900ppm, and 6.24ph. Notably different. Also the 11 ladies drank a total of 5 gallons last night!!!

I am planning on adding 5 gallons of RO to make it an even 15 gal again and lower the ec, but also lowering PH back to 5.5.....Just for one more watering, then I will change out water for fresh batch. DOES THIS SOUND GOOD???? Or should I feed them once more with what is in the res now(1.8ec) and lower ph to 5.5?


Things are looking better, check it out!!!


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Alien Dog, a good branch.

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One of the Kushes....

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hieagle420

Cannabis Creeper
Veteran
sup bro merry christmas.. like i said b4 i never had a ec meter, but i just always topped the water off and readjusted the ph, changed rez once a week and gave them a little more nutes each week until about done week 8(on a 9 week strain) then nothing but straight ph'ed water for last week.. always came out clean burning. Keep It Green and Stay Safe..HE
 

TRA1NWRECK

Member
Looking good. Funny how we run the same strains. I just got a couple stardogs.

If youre running everything in coco, you should be using the cocos A and B.

aqua flakes is for hydro, right?
 

Khaleel

Member
Veteran
hiya cali :wave: looking outstanding, a merry christmas/honakuh/whathaveyou lol cheers bro girls looking great there! :joint:
 
K

Kindman69

Merry x-mass brother, I'm sorry that you are having problems. But to be honest, I do think that they are on the verge of disaster. They look like they have endured some outgassing or offgassing, whatever people want to cal it, I called it the 1year fucking disaster. But as long as you have grown a healthy plant in that space before you can rule that out.
I use Aqua flakes as well, I am in hydro though, and I have to tell you that you are running a little hot (nute strenght) for their overall condition during veg. I would consider halfing the nutes until you get some normal growth.
Also, drip clean is meant to be used from the beginning consistently, it can nuke your plants when not uses all the time. It does that by freeing up nutes in the medium that were 'stuck' for lag of a better word.
I do not rely on my 2 ph meters (they are shit) I shoot for 'piss yellow' with the ph drops. That is about 6.0ph, and hg loves that general area. I tried it lower, but the plants look happier at about 6.0. Bottom line, you want to get them healthy before they go into 12/12, and I would start with a flush in your situation and follow up with 1/2 strength nutes until I get normal growth. The Magic Green you are using can also not be so good when applied too strong. I use it from time to time, and have to say only with mixed results. Sometime it burns them a bit.
I think you can pull this grow around!
Good luck!
Kind
 

TRA1NWRECK

Member
Run 5ml of a and b per gallon in veg, and just run 6ml thru flower. You will get the best results with h&g youve ever seen. And follow everything else by the chart. and switch to cocos a and b.
 

Cannabean

Active member
yay caligreen!! glad I found your thread. :watchplant:

I hope you get your troubles sorted out...this looks to be a great grow! can't wait/!!:)
 
G

guest5703

Update

Update

Yo yo, lets go over some things then....

hieagle420-I hear ya brotha, and it used to be as simple as that haha. Now I find myself going over every little thing that could possibly be wrong, and am still coming up short.

TRA1NWRECK-Sup dude, I used cocos A and B for about a year and a half and it worked great! I wanted to try some other lines and went for canna which worked but I wanted H & G back since I really think I got the best results with their line....I followed Sirsmokealots threads pretty well and he used H & G Aqua Flakes with amazing results. The reason IMO to use Aqua Flakes is because I actually do run a bit of a hydro setup, its ebb and flo and I have a reservoir that sits with nutrient in it for no longer than a week. Since using AF I thought I should change back to cocos A and B to see if it brought back my good results so I have a set of cocos bottles waiting til the AF is done. The thing is if you look as the ingredients for both AF and Cocos they are really, really, similar. I hear you on the 5ml through veg and 6ml in flower since I also hear that H & G has "hot" nutrients, but my plants are like bushes and I've been wondering if they need more???

Khaleel-Yo dude what up! Glad to see your checkin in, I'll try to make it by your thread in a bit!

Kindman69-What up man, you've got some great advice. I will bring my H & G a bit down cuz I hear they are hot all the time, I just figured they needed a boost right after transplant. I've been using drip clean for about 2 weeks now. The plants were super flushed at the beginning, I didnt even take pics cuz I thought they were gonna die. I was giving them pure RO trying to flush whatever it was I put in that I thought fucked em up, but in all reality I think I was over-flushing. So now that I have transplanted they are putting in new growth and looking better. I have just switched to flower a few days ago. On to offgassing, I have grown a couple of very quick flowering plants in my tent and they came out dank, but I do think they were starting to experience maybe a salt build up or off gassing toward the end since all of my others strains that flowered longer did really poorly, which could of again just been salt build up from improper flushing. Thanks for the comments and please stick around, I'll try to explain everything I do so you can see what I fuck up on and stop me! Gonna check my tubes when my light is on tonight and see if they are made by NGW, I read a thread on NGW tubing that had chemicals that fucked growers with off gassing. If that aint it, then I duno what to do....

Cannabean-Thanks bro I hope so too! Good to see ya around ;)


:ying:
 

KRD

Active member
Hey bro looking good so far. Hey cali how much do you water each plant? and how much do you let them dry out?
 
G

guest5703

Yo KRD glad to see your here, now you can really nail what I'm doing wrong hopefully....I've been using coco for years dude! I have found that letting the girls dry out after transplant is good to let those roots search. I let them dry pretty well at transplant. Now the ladies have decent root systems in the 2 gal and I've been watering every other day. Keeping em moist, but light enough I can lift a pot with one hand. When they are watered they are pretty heavy. Does this kind of help? Thanks dude!
 

KRD

Active member
Hey bro I have been checking out your setup and your running recirculating ebb and flow right? Have you ever ran feed to waste?
 
G

guest5703

I used to feed to waste when I hand watered mainly. I do change the res once a week though so it should be pretty fresh?
 

KRD

Active member
Once nutes go through coco I dont think they should be reused,When did you go auto water?
 

TRA1NWRECK

Member
I handwater in coco, and from what Ive read, it doesnt hold salts, so I never have runoff. Maybe a tiny bit, but not much. Last run wasnt great, but it wasnt because i wasnt letting them flood and drain. i was overfeeding them.
 

KRD

Active member
coco holds lots of salts your suposed to have 20 percent runoff everytime thats what Ive always done. I dont agree with everything head says about coco but he has a great thread on coco its a must read.
 
G

guest5703

KRD-I started doing ebb and flo before I got my new tent or res. I hand watered into trays and the plants sucked it up and loved it! Never heard that you can reuse the water just for the same week.....I'd suspect its ok as long as I am keeping the PH at a steady level.

Tra1nwreck-I've done a lot of reading on coco, and like I've said before have been using it for years. The story goes that a 6% runoff is needed every time. I fought this theory and in my head won because I got dank buds all the time before. I said fuck the run off, I'll just feed them all week, and then once a week I flush hardcore with RO water. That's what I used to do when I hand watered/top fed. It worked, and I never had salt problems, I also used drip clean though and some attribute that to getting rid of salts.....

KRD-I believe coco holds a lot of salts yes. But a 20% run off I don't think is needed, at least not every time....What do you think about that? Refer to what I told Tra1nwreck^^^ I used to do no Run off at all, for about a year and a half and got great results with flushing with pure RO once a week very heavily.



Thanks guys, the plants are actually looking really nice!!! I have watered them twice now since I have started flower. The ladies will need another watering tonight, and its almost end of week one flower.....Should I feed them again, third time watering from the same res mix, but remember I've reduced the PPM/EC with some RO water and I adjust the PH at 5.6 or so right before I water. Right now they are getting 800PPM. I'm going to start defoliating/lollipopping as well, they should take well to losing some lower crap.

PEACE and THANKS!!
 
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