yellowing leaves 25 days into flowering ???

dansbuds · Mar 25, 2011

1 of my 2 og plants are showing nitrogen defs already . its 1 of 8 plants total ...of which she is the only one showing signs . lower to middle of the plant fan leaves . none of the other girls are yellowing yet . thinkin i may need to give her a little nitrogen boost ..... any suggestions on what to use ? nutes are maxibloom (lucas), G O calmag 1tsp /gal & EJ ph up . 1 dose of overdrive a week ago to all plants . all in hempys . 3to 1 per/verm .

on the chart its the second pic 1st row .no red stem yet ...so its in the progression stage still .

Kinjo37 · Mar 31, 2011

Sorry don't have an answer for, I wanted to know where did you get that chart. its handy.

DiscoBiscuit · Mar 31, 2011

The chart is misleading. If your low to mid fans appear like the 1st row second pic, it's a Mg def. Those N toxicity pics are accurate but not the def stages. A quick check of your pH will prove it. Your plant will absorb N at 5.0 and lower. You need closer to 6 for Mg uptake.

Mg needs surge in late stages of longer veg cycles and/or through the first 3 weeks of flower. After that, you'll have less visual symptoms of Mg def. Long flowering sativas may absorb Mg at elevated levels a little longer.

A pH range is better than static pH. An upward swing to 6.0, maybe 6.2 should satiate your Mg needs.

IMO, your plant is absorbing more water than nutes. This will make your pH dive, making Mg absorption more difficult. Try 1/2 strength nutes in your next few waterings. Don't use more pH down to compensate for less nutes.

With less nutes, plain-water absorption won't trough your pH swing as drastically. With less nutes, your pH may drift higher between feedings. This is what you want. Your plant showing the def is probably a lighter feeder than the others not showing visual def signs. Best wishes.

dansbuds · Apr 1, 2011

Thanx DB , i feed at PH of 5.8 to 6.2 usually in that range no higher no lower . i was wondering if i'm using to little of the calmag . i'm only using a light feeding of 1tsp per gallon cuz its my first time using this stuff . should i up the dosage to the OG's & not the rest / or do like you said & feed the nutes light for the next few feeds ? i will get a runoff test of the PH & EC to see where they're at .
they get fed tomorrow so will test them then .

DiscoBiscuit · Apr 1, 2011

Good points. If you're getting a swing up to 6.2, that should cover the sweet spot. Whatever you do, try to avoid excessive buildup. The more dried salts you have in the medium the lower the pH MAY swing.

Sounds like you're much closer to dialed in than I previously thought. Go with your gut on this one and observe the results. My last grow gave me fits but gnarly fans never hurt the buds as far as I could tell. Those primary fans are especially expendable indoors. IMO, it's just a matter of if how much stress generates. Some strains won't flinch at less than healthy fans.

dansbuds · Apr 2, 2011

OK ... Fed them tonight as i always do . i mixed 2 1/2 tsp of Maxi bloom in a 2 1/2 gallon container of RO water (20 ppm , 6.9 PH ) then added 3 tsp of G.O. calmag & bubbled for an hour . PH was @ 5.5 so i used earth juice PH up to bring the PH up to 5.9 ... ppm was 1140 @.7 conv. bubbled again for half hour ...tested again & levels were the same . so i took out the OG plant & watered till i had enough runoff to test . runoff was PH @ 6.9 & ppm was 1870 @.7 conversion . doesn't seem to extreme to me but i'm new at this shit . whatcha think DB?
I'm really thinkin this strain is just a nitrogen hog ... its defenatly got a more yellow tint to the whole plant than any of the others & is dropping yellow leaves like a nitrogen def but just seems to early & 32 days today .

& DB i wanna thank you again ... it seems like every time i had a prob recently you've been one of the main people here to help out . i really appreciate it alot .

DiscoBiscuit · Apr 2, 2011

Generally, pH rising indicates lowering ppm. IMO, CalMag is building up and the Ca is helping cause the pH increase. IMO, it's also a big part of the runoff ppm increase.

Maxi is a great base. IMO, you could hold off on the CalMag and observe the results.

IMO, label-strength CalMag as a regular supplement is overkill. MyNameStitch's thread in the infirmary is a good read. You might check the Ca and Mg sections on the first page. It'll indicate what too much Ca and Mg will do to other elemental absorption.

Stitch also says that too much water inhibits N absorption. If the affected plant doesn't drink as fast as the others, double check your watering schedule. I don't know how much hempy medium needs to dry as compared to soil less. But dryness of the unaffected plants should compare to the affected medium before watering again.

My tap water is 12ppm and the outdoor spring water I use is less than 5. I only need CalMag supplements when my early feeding regimen starts too late or is too lean. Even then it's only used once or twice. Most of the time, proper base at the correct time and pH greatly reduces and often eliminates the need for CalMag altogether.

Don't hesitate to fill out the infirmary form. You could paste it here or start another thread. If you indicate "hempy" in the title, you may attract the hempy experts. Best wishes fixing the problem.

dansbuds · Apr 2, 2011

Thanx DB ... i will give them a flush till i get the same reading out as i put in then i'll cut out the calmag until its needed .

have gone through that thread numerous times looking for solutions but will go over the cal & mag sections again .

I basicly use the lift method of telling me when they need water cuz with the hempys its really a noticable difference in weight . can't wait to get my blumats set up .

i really wish you were here so you could see the difference in the 4 indicas i'm flowering . the 2 unknowns are nice green & healthy ... no def signs at all but the 2 og are def nitrogen deficiant . its wierd .... same buckets same medium same feedings everything only difference are the strains .

this is a thread i started on the 2 unknown indicas to see if anybody could give me an idea what they are .... you can see how healthy these girls really are ....https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=208639

& thanx again man ... your an asset here & I appreciate that ....alot !

DiscoBiscuit · Apr 2, 2011

Sounds like you're not over watering. Any pics of the affected plant(s)? The indicas look great, btw... nice and shiny.

Could be your affected plants are heavier feeders. You may just have to play with the maxi/calmag ratio to see what they like best. If you're uncomfortable nixing the calmag, you might try it at half strength and observe the results.

dansbuds · Apr 3, 2011

i'll try & get some pics tonight after the lights come on .

was using a light feed with the calmag at first cuz i wasn't sure how much to use . 2 weeks ago when i started seeing the yellowing leaves i bumped it up to 1 1/2 tsp per gallon . should i bump it to 2 tsp or not use it at all till i see defs ?

PoopyTeaBags · Apr 3, 2011

get a picture of your plant if you really want some real help. pictures worth 1000 words...

DiscoBiscuit · Apr 3, 2011

You may have a heavier feeder. IME, indica leaners are usually the heavier feeders. My guess is it's more balance than strength. If high doses of calmag don't do the trick, you might consider a bit more Maxi. This might mean a bit less calmag. Sorry I'm generalizing but it's tough to know exactly what's needed.

P will wash with the least amount of runoff. You might also consider a plain watering as opposed to flush volume. Observe the visual results and measure the runoff strength. When it approaches the strength you're feeding you can consider imbalance problems less. Then it's just a matter of dialing in your ratio.

dansbuds · Apr 3, 2011

heres some pics which cuz of my camera & skills don't do the plant justice but ......
heres a few of the worst leaves i pulled off tonight

not very good pics but ....you can see how its yellowing

here it is side by side with the unknown thats real healthy ... the og is on the left

a shot of some of the bad leaves

this is in the cab under the hps lights ... you can see how its yellower .

DB yeah its been an adventure learning the feeding of these plants but i think i'm doing pretty good . i'm measuring levels in & after to see how its feeding . got the over & under watering down pretty good . now basicly its learning what each individual plant wants . the other 6 plants (2 indicas & 4 sativas ) are doing great ...its just these OG kushes that are confusing me right now cuz it just seems to be yellowing to soon . I have 5 more almost 5 weeks in veg in my veg cabinet & they're lookin healthy as can be too . so its gotta be it needs more or less of something in flowering & i think your right about it being the calmag ... just gotta figure out how much she likes .

DiscoBiscuit · Apr 3, 2011

Nice plants, bro. Most of the yellowing is large fan limited. If it progressed you might have a struggle. I just don't think it's going to get that bad. Changing up your solution will more than likely deliver the ratio you're seeking.

Based on the loose leaf picks I think you've got a K def. I think I recall too much Mg or Ca inhibits K absorption. K is a macro element so dialing in your ratio a bit further should help. Adding a PK booster at this point might make correcting ratios more difficult.

Keep up the good work.

Butte_Creek · Apr 3, 2011

look for any bugs, little flying gnats specifically, check the top of the medium and around the base of the stalk as well.
root aphids could be the culprit.

i've had a fair share of root aphids, just last run as a matter of fact. terrible bugs.

the damage from the root aphid looks like a nutrient deficiency(your leafs look identical to my plants leaves effected), the leaves turn yellow and the tips progressively burn until the leaf dies and falls from the plant. the first leaves to show root damage from the aphid will be the lowest fan leaves and then they will rise up the plant until the fans all fall from the plant. usually you don't notice damage during veg because the roots are growing faster than the aphids can do damage. usually see signs of root damage after stretch. not saying that this is your problem, just check the soil or stalk for any gnat like bugs, could be your problem. you seem to grasp pH and feeding, so made me think it could be aphids.

DiscoBiscuit · Apr 3, 2011

Good point, BC. The loose leaf pics I saw more mimic a K def. The ones on the plant don't appear to have the margin burn associated with K def. But the tips are burned like you're describing. I started to mention water quality but op already mentioned RO.

Seeing the pic for the first time made me wonder if the bucket is too small, lol.

Best wishes and hoping it's not critters. If it doesn't advance it's a pretty impressive plant. I bet your next run with her will be as green as her sisters.

Butte_Creek · Apr 3, 2011

thanks DB

the moment i read this thread my intuition told me root aphids.

Tomatoesonly · Apr 3, 2011

I've been struggling with this till I just ran across this thread.

So, I went and scooped some res water from a flood and drain setup, and look....
You can see the dark head, antennae, and wiggling body.

They are ALL OVER THE PLACE. There must be millions of them.

I'm gonna have to do some real research. I have a feeling these things are tough, and live in the old medium, even if it's lightly damp.

dansbuds · Apr 3, 2011

Nope ... no bugs here . i check all the time cuz i had aphids on my first run & mites on my last run . now i have no pest strips in both cabinets full time & have plenty of insectisides on hand if i even think i see them .

DB ... what kind of PK boost do you recomend ? i've read about the PK 13/14 would this be a good one for my nute regimine ?

was wondering about the 2 gallon buckets being kinda small too but the 4 sativas i have are in 1 gallon & showing no signs of def's at all . but i am switching to 4 gallon square on my next run anyway so ......

TB Gardens · Apr 3, 2011

hey i had the same prob, or very similar atleast. mine was definitely a N def tho, i think DB is right (as usual), its probably a K problem from lock out. or a lil bit of everything ;-) right after the stretch your babies have used up alot of N from the medium, so they mighta been def in some, which got compounded by pH/Mg/K probs. still, yours looked much better than mine. my girls just started losing all chloro and dropping old fans, but honestly it didn't seem to hurt the quality of the buds at all.. maybe the overall yield, but resin production and calyx formation are still 100% fine.

quick question tho, as another OverDrive user I am curious as to why you feed it to your girls so early? i have never used it earlier than weeks 5/6 on a 8wk finisher and weeks 6/7 on a 9-10wk finisher. i believe one of your original posts on here said you used it right after the stretch or maybe even during? can you elaborate if you found out this works well for some reason? thanks and good luck buddy!

yellowing leaves 25 days into flowering ???

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