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HLG QB 550 v2 R-spec VS Migro 400+

M

MowgliAndBaloo

Member
As the topic says. Im going to do a side by side grow where I compare the two diffrent fixtures.


Each fixture will be in a 120x120cm tent, that is a 4x4ft tent.

The system used for each tent is Atami Wilma 9 pot hydroponic system.


The HLG r-spec has a max wattage draw of 480 watts. conversionfactor / efficiency at 2.6-umol/watt.
Full info of the R-spec can be found here:

https://hlg-uk-europe.com/product/n...ed-grow-light-replaces-1000w-hid-grow-lights/




The Migro400+ has a max wattage draw of 470 watts.
conversionfactor / efficiency at 2.48-umol/watt.

Full info of the migro system can be found here:

https://www.migrolight.com/product/migro-400/





by only looking at the specs they should perform similar to eachother.
As for now, none of the fixuters has arrived or the atami wilma system. A full unboxing will be posted on each item once they arrive.



So how will the test look like?
A total of 18 clones from the same mother will be taken. Once they root they will be transplantet in to the wilma system. They will be given 4 weeks in 24h full light full intensity before making the flip to 12/12.

No training will be done, no pruning and no lollipopping. This way no one can say I treated one side better than the other.
Same amount of nutrients will be given and the PH will be set within recomended range.


Please keep this thread clean. Im totally fine with people giving tips and recomendations but please dont type " thats not how to do it" instead tell me how it should be done.

Feel fre to ask questions im open for discussions. one thing ive learned during my years is that you can alwas learn more.
 
indabonga

indabonga

Cannabis ****
Veteran
Hi, very interesting thread, I use a migro 600 from 2 years and I'm very happy with the results... Some plants respond better under led than others.. But all want a diet different instead hps.. You have grow yet your mother/cut with led?
 
M

MowgliAndBaloo

Member
The mother is growing under migro. Still havent decided wich one i should go with.

Barneysfarm "Bad Azz kush"

Or

Royal queen seeds "Critical"

Maybe we should have a poll :)
 
J

Johncannaseed

New member
Hello everyone,

I was pointed toward this thread, it looks like a nice even test, I am very interested to see the outcome of this experiment, may the best light win.

And to the OP what is the name of the strain you'll be growing?

Many thanks for running this test :))
 
J

Johncannaseed

New member
My Bad just seen you named the strains, I like the look of Royal queen seeds "Critical" it looks like it is a fast finisher as well?
 
M

MowgliAndBaloo

Member
Ok sorry for not posting for a while. Recieved the R-spec fixture yesterday. It arrived with coverd in black film wich ensures that the White box with the stamp horticulture lightning group cant be seen.

Just the box itself oozez high qualite as it has a handle to carry it. Easy to open.

The fixture itself has quality written all over it. Everything is steardy mounted. Really enjoyed it

Im going to get the first tent up this weekend. And I will take som par readings.

I have an Apoge quantom sensor, it should do the work.

Now to some bad news. I placed an order for the wilma system from abroad but they cancelled my order as the courier couldnt ship.

My local dealer has a smaller version but it wont be ideal.
My thought was soil and The tropf blumat system

What do you think?

Pictures will Come up soon.
 
hayday

hayday

Well-known member
Veteran
I'm going to tag along and watch if you dont mind...just in case I need a qb or the like in the future.
Good luck with your vendors getting your stuff for you:tiphat:
 
M

MowgliAndBaloo

Member
Ok so I managed to get the tent up and the fixture in place. This light is Bright and I mean Really really bright. Sunglasses are recommended.

Ive tried to do a par map or atleast so you can get a Hum of how the intensity looks like.
The fixture was hung at 75cm wich gives aprox 1000par in center. As ive heard everything above 500 par grows good at 800 par it grows alot better and you still can get a increase in yield if you go to 1000 par but somewhere here is the limit. Above 1000 its recomended to use Co2. however at 1000par you need to consider the extra wattage use vs yield output.

at center 1000 Par
20cm from the center we have aprox 925 Par
In the inner corner where there is mylar we have 450 PAR and in the open side 320 PAR
wich indicates that mylar helps reflect additional 130 PAR.
From the corners 30cm towards center we have an avreage of 700 PAR

At the same hight in with the dimmer set to the lowest i had aprox 457 PAR



the Aluminum heatsink has an avreage temp of 39 degree C but around 45 degree C around the Meanwell driver.


Ok i might forgotten something but if theres anything else you want to know just dont hesitate to ask


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Tony21

Tony21

Member
MowgliAndBaloo said:
Ok so I managed to get the tent up and the fixture in place. This light is Bright and I mean Really really bright. Sunglasses are recommended.

Ive tried to do a par map or atleast so you can get a Hum of how the intensity looks like.
The fixture was hung at 75cm wich gives aprox 1000par in center. As ive heard everything above 500 par grows good at 800 par it grows alot better and you still can get a increase in yield if you go to 1000 par but somewhere here is the limit. Above 1000 its recomended to use Co2. however at 1000par you need to consider the extra wattage use vs yield output.

at center 1000 Par
20cm from the center we have aprox 925 Par
In the inner corner where there is mylar we have 450 PAR and in the open side 320 PAR
wich indicates that mylar helps reflect additional 130 PAR.
From the corners 30cm towards center we have an avreage of 700 PAR

At the same hight in with the dimmer set to the lowest i had aprox 457 PAR



the Aluminum heatsink has an avreage temp of 39 degree C but around 45 degree C around the Meanwell driver.


Ok i might forgotten something but if theres anything else you want to know just dont hesitate to ask


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Click to expand...
Very, very cool.

But why are you focusing on PAR instead of DLI(Daily Light Integral)?

If it's an Apogee MQ-500, it can measure DLI received during lights on. Any amount of light above optimal DLI is wasted.
 
M

MowgliAndBaloo

Member
Tony21, Im not so into DLI at the moment but I will read on and come back to you.
Meanwhile can you please give me a hint on what DLI is and what the optimal DLI for cannabis is? And I want a trusted source, so we can discuss the subject.

As far as I understood the DLI is the amount of PAR recieved in m2 each second. As we are growing indoors the par amount wont change as it will do in a outside enviroment.

Lets say cannabis optimal for 24h is 40 000 000 Par. The HLG 550 v2 R-spec t distributes 1000par per m2 per second. this means that over a 24h period it will give the plant
86 400 000 Par. So what you are saying is that 46 400 000Par is just waste of eletricity? Im getting this right?


OK the migro 400+ is now on its way :D
We are all here to learn.
 
GMT

GMT

The Tri Guy
Veteran
So many different ways of measuring output of lights. Its like choosing a mobile phone contract. Tagging along to learn more.
 
Tony21

Tony21

Member
MowgliAndBaloo said:
Tony21, Im not so into DLI at the moment but I will read on and come back to you.
Meanwhile can you please give me a hint on what DLI is and what the optimal DLI for cannabis is? And I want a trusted source, so we can discuss the subject.

As far as I understood the DLI is the amount of PAR recieved in m2 each second. As we are growing indoors the par amount wont change as it will do in a outside enviroment.

Lets say cannabis optimal for 24h is 40 000 000 Par. The HLG 550 v2 R-spec t distributes 1000par per m2 per second. this means that over a 24h period it will give the plant
86 400 000 Par. So what you are saying is that 46 400 000Par is just waste of eletricity? Im getting this right?


OK the migro 400+ is now on its way :D
We are all here to learn.
Click to expand...
Probably the best place for the basics is to start here https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daily_light_integral?wprov=sfla1
The concensus seems to be anywhere between 30-50 mol per day is optimal for cannabis, depending on source, take you pick

This is a good explainer article https://gpnmag.com/article/what-to-know-about-lighting-cannabis-from-a-former-greenhouse-cultivator/ google "dli cannabis " and there's info galore, read at your own DISCRETION.

Also check out manufacturerof the sites that like Lumigrow, Fluence, etc., sign up to newsletters, there's plenty DLI chatter. DLI controllers are in their infancy, how to use them too lol

Generally talking about optimal light cycles, for auto's and some photo sativas, is a complete waste of time without knowing the DLI delivered during the lights on period, it's like sticking a wet finger up in the air and yet I see endless debates about "best light cycle", oh well!

Many spectrometers can measure DLI, but where exactly to measure, a few centimeters in distance and/or angle of the sensor and numbers change significantly.

I've been using 3 of these here thingies as indicators for awhile , repeat indicators, nothing fancy and no idea how accurate they really are, but they're not far off, plus/minus a bit, the Apogee MQ-500. I stick them on a pvc pipe or hang them in a little harness, but again, positioning is anybody's guess https://www.specmeters.com/lightmeters/dli100/


All this is just for starters.....but just a thought .... Why is not a single breeder mentioning optimal DLI for their strain creations, are they just releasing genetics helter skelter with their fingers up in the air lol


Aye, me thinks so.... Anyone who thinks differently??? .... :dance013:
 
Koondense

Koondense

Well-known member
Veteran
Tony21 said:
...but just a thought .... Why is not a single breeder mentioning optimal DLI for their strain creations, are they just releasing genetics helter skelter with their fingers up in the air lol


Aye, me thinks so.... Anyone who thinks differently??? .... :dance013:
Click to expand...

That's great food for thought.
I would urge breeders to first inform the buyers under which light type they are selecting and making seeds, DLI needs for their varieties is a step further and I guess they really never thought about it.
But let's be more realistic, most "breeders" are just seed production and packaging companies with more to hide than to show, at least that's my impression.

I figured my DLI(spec sheet numbers + calculator) sits somewhere around 40 for my 11h20min daylight schedule. Planning to increase it by adding another 200W of cob leds soon, probably going over 50 so I can shorten the daylight to 11h without problems.

Thanks for bringing it up Tony!

Cheers
 
Tony21

Tony21

Member
Yep, what you say, only goes to show there's more to being a breeder than having a brush, some pollen and great ideas!

Tha would never cut the mustard with the veggie and fruit growers, but that happens to be legal of cours, and way less glamorous lol..... Whoever ever heard of Neville Tomatomaker, Jorge Cilantro aka George van Pumpkin and Sam the Cucumberman ��
 
Green Devil

Green Devil

Member
My first thought was why would anyone compare a lamp made for commercial growing with a lamp that's made for home growing but when I noticed that the price range of these lamps are the same I changed my opinion.

On DLI / PAR, one must look at the Cannabis Sativa plant (since that's what we're talking about here).

In other cases, however, a more direct effect of photoperiod on leaf chlorophyll has been postulated.Sironval (1958) found that transfers of soybean, lupin,strawberry and hemp (Cannabis sativa) from SD to LD increased leaf chlorophyll content. However, it is not clear whether increases in day length in this study were also accompanied by increases in daily light integral. It is also not certain whether the changed concentrations were maintained after transfer since, in subsequent work with soybean, it appeared that it was the transfer event itself rather than the final day length that determined the response (Sironval et al., 1961).

And since we're on the topic of science, is no one going to comment on the photosynthesis glitch that could increase production by 40% :yay:

I will give MITRA a go myself but will def tune in to see how this turns out.
How often will you keep us updated with photos where we can follow the progress?
The best diary's are the ones with pictures :dance013:
 
M

MowgliAndBaloo

Member
Certnaly Greendevil, I i accidently ssaw this in an artcile and found it very intresteng.

However the article mensioned that the implamantaion is far from reaching the agriculture for now. Further resaerch will in time be able to adopt / fix this glitch.

And as are discussing can anyone explain the Emerson effect as well ? and why this doesnt happen natually.
 
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