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List of secret ingredients for Rhizotonic and other popular additives.

BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
Hi, I've been re-learning organic growing and have started making my own teas and fermented brews lately and out of curiosity I was wondering what some of the ingredients are for some of these Natural additives to see if I could make some of these myself. One product I get really good results from is Canna Rhizotonic and have been wanting to make my own root stimulating concoction.. I often see posts of people asking what's in there and why does it smell like something died in the bottle? All I know is for foliar feeds it works wonders and the roots go crazy. I did a simple search for Rhizotonic secret ingredients and the first link brings me to one of our sponsors. Check out the link and keep reading they name a few popular brands and list the main ingredients.. http://www.mbferts.com/Hormone-Vitamin-Booster-Canna-Boost-Rhizotonic-Alternative-116.htm Though maybe some of you who are wondering whats in there would like to know. I'll keep looking maybe there's better info..
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
This is a statement from Canna on their website. "One ingredient in CANNA® RHIZOTONIC that separates it from most other competing products on the market is the root-strengthening and science-endorsed hormone "Oligosaccharide "

What's that you might be wondering? Here's a description: oligosaccharides are carbohydrates which have 3-10 simple sugars linked together. They are found naturally, at least in small amounts, in many plants. Plants with large amounts of oligosaccharides include chicory root, from which most commercial inulin is extracted, and so-called Jerusalem artichokes (the root of a member of the sunflower family). They are also found in onions (and the rest of the "onion family", including leeks and garlic), legumes, wheat, asparagus, jicama, and other plant foods.

Here's the wiki link, keep reading you'll get to the part how it is used to bind cells and how it works on plants. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligosaccharide
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
So in back of the Canna bottle it says it's made from marine seaweed and on their site it says it contains 60 microbiological substances, MB ferts says that the main ingredient is indole-3-butyric acid is the main ingredient and to not believe the company claims that there so called secret ingredients aren't the ones giving you the results you get and they also say that these substances can be purchased for almost nothing to make your own and even list what appears to be suppliers for it.

So can someone enlighten me on this.?! Is it the sea weed extract containing vitamin b1 etc, or is it the indole-3-butyric acid or is it the Oligosaccharide? Or possibly all 3 together? Canna claims that rhizotonic is all natural, what is the indole-3-butyric acid derived from or is that a synthetic hormone?
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
Statement from Mb ferts site:
Canna®, House and Gardens®, Advance nutrients®, Dutch Masters®, and Botanicare®,use these ingredients to make their high quality plant nutrients and additives. Please don’t believe any of their bullshit (hype) when they tell you they use special ingredients, or that they developed these ingredients. These are the same ingredients, bought from the same companies, that farmers, colleges and commercial greenhouses have been using for many years. To name a few of these companies supplying these ingredients: Yara®, AkzoNobel® Dissolvine®, Haifa®, Kelpak®, Jh Biotech® etc.
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
And now when you search for Rhizotonic secret ingredients a link to this thread appears lol. If it's as easy to make with the ingredients available in bulk I don't see any reason to overpay for diluted rhizotonic that requires 40ml / 10 L. That's a lot and obviously been over diluted so the company can make some money.. It's one of the most available and popular rooting products and it's very effective but way overpriced.
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
Here's a link containing info on the benefits of Oligosaccharide from brown seaweed.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00344-012-9309-1


Which is what Canna basically lists in back of the bottle..
So maybe that's the main ingredient but they also add indole-3 - butyric acid which I finally figured is actually IBA (duh) the main ingredient in rooting gels and powders, it's a growth hormone.. So there must be a natural source of IBA if Canna states that rhizotonic is natural ?
 
Gry

Gry

Well-known member
Veteran
from wiki: This chemical (IBA) may also be extracted from any of the Salix (Willow) genus.
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
Thanks for the link Absolem , I didn't know about micro teas, I've heard of trichoderma and bacillus, that's an interesting article, but it's much more complicated and costly to set up for that than brewing a simple batch of aact, I will probably eventually look into it, it's very similar process to mushroom cultivation. You are trying to avoid contaminants and are basically using tissue culture in petri dishes to innoculate a sterile substrate or liquid to culture with a specific spore strains.

It's much more of a proven science than throwing in a bunch of shit and thinking you'll get just ben. bacteria each and every time... I have been using natural maple leaf compost with literally thousands of living organisms such as b. bacteria, spores and fungi and tiny insects like centipedes and worms lol, so far so good but I am blindly throwing in stuff that I don't know about when you think about it!! I would like to get a good microscope someday to actually learn this stuff for real.
I have done a little bit of mushroom cultivating a while back and it's not like growing plants, success depends on the sterility of the work area and the substrate must be sterilized in an autoclave or more commonly a pressure cooker. Yeah that brings back memories, sterilize everything with a bleach solution, then wipe scalpels and syringes with isopropyl alcohol and then just to be sure spray a whole bottle of Lysol disinfectant to kill everything else, and even after all that disinfecting you still manage to get green mold on those damn brown rice/vermiculite jars oops I said too much!
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
Here's a good link about the properties of willow branches :

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=268803

Quote:

The way that it works can be attributed to two substances that can be found within the Salix (Willow) species, namely, indolebutyric acid (IBA) and Salicylic acid (SA).

LOL, so I guess I'll have to get more of these tomorrow


picture.php


branches from the huge weeping willow in back of my house, funny coincidence I cut those today after reading on the willow water for soaking and watering clones. I forgot it was IBA in there I thought it was just salicylic acid. So we have a natural source of IBA that's good, we just need some of that brown seaweed to have all 60 microbiological substances and the Oligosaccharide's necessary for the plant cell division and bonding and the natural b vitamins they contain.. Throw in the extra b vitamins missing according to Mb ferts and you have a homemade version of rhizotonic for a fraction of the price... Anything else important we haven't discovered?? What gives rhizo that lovely smell of a rednecks ass?
Or maybe they put it in there to make you think there's a secret proprietary patented substance only known and manufactured by the good folks at Canna to fool us fools into thinking it can't be as simple as seaweed extracts and growth hormones that literally grow on tree's..

There's got to be more to it
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
SA , salicylic acid is also the ingredient of the popular Dr Scholes wart remover and very similar to the active ingredient in aspirin ! Damn this willow tree does it all !!
 
Absolem

Absolem

Active member
Hey BlackMarketMic.

Cultivating mushrooms sounds very interesting. i never know the sterile environment one needed. Sounds like you would be the perfect guy to mix those micro teas up and try it. Lol. The author on that site knows his stuff. He has been working in the nutrient business a long time. I trust his methods and his formulas.

Just my 2cents. I would keep the organics and IBA hormone as separate entities. Shaggyballs in the advanced section has a whole thread on hormones. I think mixing the IBA with the organics will cause you trouble keeping it in supension. It requires a couple of preservatives and I'm not sure the ratios on those. So I would break it down to 2 solutions. One organic and one with the IBA hormone. You can spray IBA to to the plants leaves. Cheers
 
BlackMarketMic

BlackMarketMic

Member
Kelp+ liquid earth worm castings + willow water + roots excularator = very good foliage spray solution, so far all the plants I sprayed with this homemade solution I made absolutely loved it. I know it's not the same as rhizotonic but from the products I had laying around here this is the foliage solution I came up with.

Works wonders all the leaves turned to a darker shade of green, even the plants I have in a experimental organic mix responded to the foliage feeds. I took willow branches mostly fresh growth and peeled the bark and ripped the leaves off and threw everything in a 1 gal bucket and put in airstones with a good air pump and bubbled the branches in ro water for over a week and stirred it on a daily basis to make sure the IBA is released.

I have a batch of freshly rooted cuttings and I will water them in a few days with this solution that is still bubbling with the other ferts. I will keep you posted on the results. And soon I will get one of the Oligosaccharide sources named and use it in a similar solution without the roots excularator... Obviously the roots excularator is going to have results of it's own but interesting to see with the willow water.
 
R

Rondon

Member
Mic..you and i are on the same track. Lately been searching all over for a homemade Rhizotonic alternative. Cannas base nutes are reasonable. Its the few supplements they make and that they get you on ($$$). They know what they are doing. Rhizo is awesome for early rooted clones and transplants. Foliar spraying in veg as well. I honestly believe Rhizo is cold extracted and pressed brown sea kelps (ascophyllum nodosum) and algae for the auxins and cytokinins. And more IBA plus salicylic acid and oligosaccharides extracted from willow bark and branches. Plus a b vitamin complex with maybe fulvic acid and amino acids derived from soy plant protein hydrolysate. Maybe a tad of yucca thrown in. Cannazyme absolutely has yucca in it. Anyone that has uses Aptus Fasilitor (salicylic acid) has noticed how that pricey stuff temporarliy clouds up a rez with a blue/grey thick cloud. Rhizotonic does the same thing. Whatever is in those supplements..they arent telling. They are watered down. They are pricey. And they most definitely work very very well.
 
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