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Old 12-13-2017, 10:59 PM #301
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I wish we could get some true libertarians in office. It's way past time to get this out of control government under the control of the people, not the other way around. This country would make very founding fathers scream what the fuck are you doing from the tallest mountain.
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Old 12-14-2017, 12:17 AM #302
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modern american libertarianism is just another big business ploy. look into it's roots. it's john birchers and ayn randian nutjobs and austrian economists who were funded by big money.
the koch family founded the john birch society and the cato institute for instance and here is their original 1980 libertarian platform.
notice the languange in the libertarian platform today is different compared to the 1980 platform because if they were still using the same language no one would even consider them as a viable option, they'd be called what they are. hint: starts with an f

Quote:
Originally Posted by david koch's 1980 libertarian party platform
“We urge the repeal of federal campaign finance laws, and the immediate abolition of the despotic Federal Election Commission.”

“We favor the abolition of Medicare and Medicaid programs.”

“We oppose any compulsory insurance or tax-supported plan to provide health services, including those which finance abortion services.”

“We also favor the deregulation of the medical insurance industry.”

“We favor the repeal of the fraudulent, virtually bankrupt, and increasingly oppressive Social Security system. Pending that repeal, participation in Social Security should be made voluntary.”

“We propose the abolition of the governmental Postal Service. The present system, in addition to being inefficient, encourages governmental surveillance of private correspondence. Pending abolition, we call for an end to the monopoly system and for allowing free competition in all aspects of postal service.”

“We oppose all personal and corporate income taxation, including capital gains taxes.”

“We support the eventual repeal of all taxation.”

“As an interim measure, all criminal and civil sanctions against tax evasion should be terminated immediately.”

“We support repeal of all law which impede the ability of any person to find employment, such as minimum wage laws.”

“We advocate the complete separation of education and State. Government schools lead to the indoctrination of children and interfere with the free choice of individuals. Government ownership, operation, regulation, and subsidy of schools and colleges should be ended.”

“We condemn compulsory education laws … and we call for the immediate repeal of such laws.”

“We support the repeal of all taxes on the income or property of private schools, whether profit or non-profit.”

“We support the abolition of the Environmental Protection Agency.”

“We support abolition of the Department of Energy.”

“We call for the dissolution of all government agencies concerned with transportation, including the Department of Transportation.”

“We demand the return of America's railroad system to private ownership. We call for the privatization of the public roads and national highway system.”

“We specifically oppose laws requiring an individual to buy or use so-called "self-protection" equipment such as safety belts, air bags, or crash helmets.”

“We advocate the abolition of the Federal Aviation Administration.”

“We advocate the abolition of the Food and Drug Administration.”

“We support an end to all subsidies for child-bearing built into our present laws, including all welfare plans and the provision of tax-supported services for children.”

“We oppose all government welfare, relief projects, and ‘aid to the poor’ programs. All these government programs are privacy-invading, paternalistic, demeaning, and inefficient. The proper source of help for such persons is the voluntary efforts of private groups and individuals.”

“We call for the privatization of the inland waterways, and of the distribution system that brings water to industry, agriculture and households.”

“We call for the repeal of the Occupational Safety and Health Act.”

“We call for the abolition of the Consumer Product Safety Commission.”

“We support the repeal of all state usury laws.”


"It's way past time to get this out of control government under the control of the people, not the other way around."

you got this part right though.


but how does opening the markets to laissez-faire capitalism in the time of rampant corruption, fraud, and oligarchy going to solve anything? all that'd be doing is handing the people who are fucking every one over the keys to the castle.
we'd be turning the US into a science fiction movie like Equilibrium or the one with Matt Damon where the elites live on an artificial thing that orbits the Earth.


american libertarianism and anarcho capitalism (ancap) is just as stupid as communism. none of it is practical.
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Old 12-14-2017, 12:48 AM #303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannavore View Post
modern american libertarianism is just another big business ploy. look into it's roots. it's john birchers and ayn randian nutjobs and austrian economists who were funded by big money.
the koch family founded the john birch society and the cato institute for instance and here is their original 1980 libertarian platform.
notice the languange in the libertarian platform today is different compared to the 1980 platform because if they were still using the same language no one would even consider them as a viable option, they'd be called what they are. hint: starts with an f





"It's way past time to get this out of control government under the control of the people, not the other way around."

you got this part right though.


but how does opening the markets to laissez-faire capitalism in the time of rampant corruption, fraud, and oligarchy going to solve anything? all that'd be doing is handing the people who are fucking every one over the keys to the castle.
we'd be turning the US into a science fiction movie like Equilibrium or the one with Matt Damon where the elites live on an artificial thing that orbits the Earth.


american libertarianism and anarcho capitalism (ancap) is just as stupid as communism. none of it is practical.
Well cannavore, I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I am a capitalist through and through. Get the government out of everything. Government should handle national security, police, fire and infrastructure. As for the rest of it they can suck an egg.

You have confused capitalism with, government sponsored corrupt capitalism. Let the market work and the best will rise. I don't understand how us growers who make a living selling a product, can be anti capitalism.
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Old 12-14-2017, 10:01 AM #304
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Originally Posted by gaiusmarius View Post

That's another trick we should be getting wise to, they pretend that it makes a difference which party you vote for, when all that changes is the narrative, when it comes to war, both parties are all for it. They might some times have different enemies, but none of them ever seem to want a world at peace or at least a world not being attacked by the US some where or other. they both seem to agree that most of the money needs to go to the interest on the national debt and the rest for the military. then if some thing is left maybe fix some roads and bridges.

The police nearly finances it's self with all the stealing and running prisons for profit and of course the fines, hospitals are not free, education isn't free either, so what exactly are people getting for the huge amount of money they pay in taxes every year?

Ahh yes, the social security programs, that's another big chunk I wasn't thinking about. still, wasting so much on 180 military bases spread around the world so the share holders in the military industrial complex can get even richer seems idiotic and not in the interest of the masses.

Does the US really need to spend 10 times more than the next biggest spender China, to stay safe? It seems ridiculous to waste that much of the nations resources on the military, unless you really want to enslave the rest of the planet?
Post tidied up (punctuation/grammar/spelling)...And I totally agree with it!
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Old 12-14-2017, 02:51 PM #305
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Originally Posted by packerfan79 View Post
Well cannavore, I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I am a capitalist through and through. Get the government out of everything. Government should handle national security, police, fire and infrastructure. As for the rest of it they can suck an egg.

You have confused capitalism with, government sponsored corrupt capitalism. Let the market work and the best will rise. I don't understand how us growers who make a living selling a product, can be anti capitalism.
And look were pure capitalism has brought us..
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Old 12-14-2017, 03:39 PM #306
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QUOTE=dragongrower;8140838]And look were pure capitalism has brought us..[/quote]

This is perhaps the most ignorant post in this entire thread. I blame the Education Oligarchy, which has hijacked almost all education and turned it into indoctrination in a successful attempt to brainwash everyone to believe that Government knows better, has altruistic intentions , and will protect you and make you whole.

It is Government that spends deliriously on the MIC, conjuring up enemies and bogeymen out of thin air. It is Government that writes laws favoring big business, squeezing more and more out of Main Street using zoning, fees, regulations, labor laws, insurance, utility rates, taxes upon taxes. Just try and get a commercial lease and open a small business and follow your dream. You will be crushed. Only well capitalized politically connected will get a dispensary license. Or open a sandwich shop, with all the safety and health requirements, inspections, equipment costs, insurance, rent, taxes. It's to the point where Government officials drive around looking for lemonade stands run by little girls so they can shut them down and hopefully levy some fines and generate some revenue. Hell maybe even do some asset forfeiture on your sorry asses.

It is Government that has enacted the Deep State surveillance apparatus that monitors your every word, movement, every dollar that you make , and where it is spent. It is Government that hires goons to stop you on the street, demands your papers, and has license to shoot you, or your kids, or your dog, because they feel like it.

It is Government that has debased our money, driving down living standards for decades, backfilling the hole with ever more debt that WE have to repay WITH interest attatched. All the while the Government itself, as well as its preferred crony insider class has access to ZERO percent credit to buy real things, driving up the costs to us out here on the street.

I would like to go on but I have to go to work for the privilege of paying close to half my income to pay for the State, which you obviously adore and wish to make bigger. I don't get it. Pot growers embracing the entity that will imprison and make you destitute.

In a few more years the penalties for growing non compliant weed in a "legal" state will be worse than in my illegal state. There's your Government right there. Lunacy.
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Old 12-14-2017, 04:39 PM #307
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Originally Posted by dragongrower View Post
And look were pure capitalism has brought us..
Capitalism has raised the standard of living for billions of people. Without capitalism you wouldn't have the computer, iPhone, car, flat screen tv, internet. people don't innovate, when the government confiscated and redisributes the product of your labor. People don't work hard, when you get no reward for it. Besides it's truly immoral to steal the product of my work.

If you want socialism, let me know next time you harvest. I will come take it and give it to people, who didn't take the risk or put the effort into it. Then you will be a good little socialist.
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Old 12-14-2017, 05:10 PM #308
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Hahaha you guys crack me up!!
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Old 12-14-2017, 06:11 PM #309
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Social security and Medicare are both socialist programs, and among the most cherished American institutions. Y'all have your work cut out for you.
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Old 12-14-2017, 08:51 PM #310
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Well cannavore, I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I am a capitalist through and through. Get the government out of everything. Government should handle national security, police, fire and infrastructure. As for the rest of it they can suck an egg.

You have confused capitalism with, government sponsored corrupt capitalism. Let the market work and the best will rise. I don't understand how us growers who make a living selling a product, can be anti capitalism.
Point to a time in American history where the free market worked without government intervention that isn't named the gilded age.

Who do you think sponsors the "govt sponsored corrupt capitalism?" ....... the capitalists lol. I love how libertarians think all will be fine and dandy once you free the shackles of government from the altruistic capitalist. Again its a pipe dream no different than the people who think communism can work.
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