DIY led questions

Hey fellow people

Im on the edge of starting a new Led project

therefore i'm wondering if this heatsink ; L:500mm; W:124mm; H:35mm;
(http://www.tme.eu/en/details/rad-a5724_500/radiators/#) combined with 1 120 mm fan for active cooling pr panel, would be sufficient cooling?

The panel is suppost to run 4 vero 10 and a string of colored 3 watts, we are talking about a panel of about 50 watt.

Futhermore i do have a question about drivers,
would i be able to power the 4 vero 10 with Mean Well PLD-40-350B
which have the following details:
LED Drivers Power Supplies 37.8W 70-108V 350mA CC LED PS.
Four vero10 should be drawing 36,4W and around 106,8 V.

Feel free to ask any questions, thank you for your time

That heatsink is double as big as necessary and sounds also right according to your figures.

Rilla.

There will be some variations in the cobs. The voltage on the driver is awful close.
Could give it a try....

hi, i see a lot of questions around the forums about drivers, i just wanna say choosing the driver is super simple.

take total volts(not watts, volts) of your leds
e.g. 12v led, 4 of them= 4x12=48

then decide the current you want based on what the manufacturers suggest

e.g. 640mA(thats .64 amps)

ok so i need a driver that will push 48 v at 650mA

the driver's amps will change to whatever your leds need as long as it is within range
so here we could use a 36-52v driver @649mA(or a 32-70v@640mA or...etc)

the current needs to be constant voltage is a bit more flexible, your led spec sheet shoudl also indicate what voltage the led will consume at what mA

eg 36v@1400mA 41v@2000mA etc cree lists these, most companies you can just figure it out if it says "10-11v 500-600mA then at 580mA you will pull aprox 10.8v)

basically totall voltage of all the leds you want to run off the driver and the ampage is all you need to know

let me know if i need to explain that better

dunno how to edit, sorry

the drivers VOLTS will change to whatver you need, not amps, amps will pop your leds VOLTS

VOLTS

oh man, i must have been so high when i typed that lol sorry,
here is what it should have said

hi, i see a lot of questions around the forums about drivers, i just wanna say choosing the driver is super simple.

take total volts(not watts, volts) of your leds
e.g. 12v led, 4 of them= 4x12=48

then decide the current you want based on what the manufacturers suggest

e.g. 640mA(thats .64 amps)

ok so i need a driver that will push 48 v at 640mA(usually the higher the amps the more volts the led will use, so check the spec sheet)

the driver's volts will change within listed range to whatever your leds need as long as it is within listed range
so here we could use a 36-52v driver @640mA(or a 32-70v@640mA or...etc) notice the current is "constant current"-VERY IMPORTANT

the current needs to be constant, voltage is a bit more flexible, your led spec sheet shoudl also indicate what voltage the led will consume at what mA

eg 36v@1400mA 41v@2000mA etc cree lists these, most companies you can just figure it out if it says "10-11v 500-600mA then at 580mA you will pull aprox 10.8v)

basically totall voltage of all the leds you want to run off the driver and the ampage is all you need to know

let me know if i need to explain that better

So how do you make a driver run the leds at less power? Because a lot of cobs I see are way more efficient at about half their max power. And can you use one driver to power them variously? Would be interesting to be able to cut some power for veg or end of flowering for example.

So basically with a cob, a heatsink, a driver and a power supply for that driver you've got everything you need?

sprinkl said:

So how do you make a driver run the leds at less power? Because a lot of cobs I see are way more efficient at about half their max power. And can you use one driver to power them variously? Would be interesting to be able to cut some power for veg or end of flowering for example.

So basically with a cob, a heatsink, a driver and a power supply for that driver you've got everything you need?

Click to expand...

yes basically, a cob a heat sink and a driver(the drivers i am refering to are ac to dc converters, it is infact a power supply) thats all you need(plus TIM to attach chip, tools and wires to rig it up ect)

leds require constant current drivers, so to power them variously as you say you would need either a dimmable driver or you could switch out the driver when you want more current(probably the cheaper option)
there is another way but it involves computer programming, controlls and way more expensive equipment(honestly i looked into it for a while and decided due to cost and how fooking complicated it was id give it a pass, search the salt water aquarium forums for that info)

however if you mean powering dif leds at dif currents from the same driver than no, not possible. you would have multiple drivers one for each current, ie your reds woudl run of one driver and the whites off another.


if lumens per watt is what you are casing then yeah lower ampage = better efficiency, however penetration may suffer

so here we see the specs for(i think its the cxa 2540) a cree cob
(lower amps will give even higher effeciencies but just for the sake of understanding lets pretend this is the max and min range for this chip listed by the manufacturer)


so if we plan to run 1 chip off 1 driver we are looking for a

1.4A/1400mA driver that's voltage range includes 37.42v ie 30-40v etc
this will give us 118.1lumens per what

but then lets say come flower we wanna crank it up to max lumens/fuck the power bill

now we are looking for a driver at 1.95A/1950mA pushing a volatge that includes 39.13v eg 36-42v etc

so imagine it in dumb dumb terms as the voltage is what the chip eats, the amps is how fast you feed it, feed it too fast it blows up(high amps), feed it the wrong food it wont work (low voltage)

the efficiency is up to you, i like to drive my leds as hard as i can as long as im getting better efficency that hps/mh/cfl s( i aim for about 120lm per watt) seen as the cost of building these is cheaper(yes cheaper) than buying a hps/mh/cfl rig from the store thats fine for me

but also you should read up about binning(basically better binning=more lumens total/more lumens per what/higher price)

Thanks that's good info.

I assume the warm light colour is the best as it has a better red:blue ratio?

I've been looking at these cobs I've just got to get around to crunching the numbers to see if it's worth my time.
Philips 400W greenpower I use is 48000 mean lumens. That is 120 lumen/watt just as the cobs I've been looking at. Replace once/year = €30 max. 400W cob = initial cost of at least 400 euro. 13 years using that LED before it payed itself back as its no more efficient than the HPS. Am I missing something here?
Even if the numbers favor the LED I would still like to see some actual growing done with cobs and results... Numbers on paper are just that. However I'm confident it's somehow more efficient as I've seen a few grows with 1gpw and these were with deepred/red/blue/white leds...

sprinkl said:

Thanks that's good info.

I assume the warm light colour is the best as it has a better red:blue ratio?

I've been looking at these cobs I've just got to get around to crunching the numbers to see if it's worth my time.
Philips 400W greenpower I use is 48000 mean lumens. That is 120 lumen/watt just as the cobs I've been looking at. Replace once/year = €30 max. 400W cob = initial cost of at least 400 euro. 13 years using that LED before it payed itself back as its no more efficient than the HPS. Am I missing something here?
Even if the numbers favor the LED I would still like to see some actual growing done with cobs and results... Numbers on paper are just that. However I'm confident it's somehow more efficient as I've seen a few grows with 1gpw and these were with deepred/red/blue/white leds...

Click to expand...

im sure some more knowledgeable/ bias peeps will blast me for saying this, but the effeicieency in led isnt all it was hyped up to be, i mean at first we were told that because led could isolate only the exact nm plants need than we didnt need to waste all the energy producing other(green/yellow) light... then they said the effeciency of energy use was better, ie less wasted power/energy put out as heat vs light then they said it runs cooler lol

in reality(imho) it depends on what size you are going for, but basic advantages would be:
1better spectrum than hps(i think we should all agree hps spectrum is not ideal although it does a great job because it does have a LOT of light, the leds can be more customized and certian wavelenths like more red etc can be added during flower)
2 the same effeciency (aprox, i mean led is still a few % more effeceint in the energy to light conversion than hps but its connected to the next piont)
3 less need for heat removal(this is where the power is saved really, although leds do produce heat its not so much coming out of the light (IR) but off the back, so the entire space can be a few degrees warmer beacuse its not so hot under the bulb, plus they are a few % cooler than hps(id guess around 15-20% depending on how hard you drive them)

so for a massive space because of the innitial cost def not smth to consider, although using red leds as bloom booster may be considered

but for smaller spaces i.e. 70-400w hps users, its a winner


please feel free to disagree, this is my current opinion based on following the led hype from the beggining until now.

what i am doing now is running 60w of horticultural led chipsets (surexi) and 150w of cobs from cree

this is a total of 4 light fixtures that work for me and only use 210w in a 3x3 total space(ie veg room and flower) ventilation is a non-issue so that adds stealth(as in no super noisy fans)

i dunno whats best for you buddy, but after buying a few overpriced led panels that didnt do magic, using cfls and T8s and T5s and a brief hps run i would def say this works for me

i hope other come along to wiegh in

check out bueno time he is using cobs with supiments as well

forgot to mention a bulb puts out light at 360 degrees, so you loose some of those lumens to a reflector, most led diy peeps myself included dont use secondary optics or anything on teh leds, they shoot light out at about 100 degrees

Dion said:

...if you mean powering dif leds at dif currents from the same driver than no, not possible. you would have multiple drivers one for each current, ie your reds woudl run of one driver and the whites off another.

Click to expand...

Just want to add to that point that if you have 16 red leds for example and a 700mA driver, you could use that 700mA driver to power all 16 red leds at 350mA if you want, assuming that 8 red LEDs aren't to much froward voltage for the driver. you'd connect each set of 8 red LEDs in a series, as in


+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-

then connect the positive and negative from the driver to both sets of 8 LEDs and you'd only have to worry about the forward voltage of the 8 LEDs, not all 16, but the current would be split. Of course, if something breaks your parallel circuit all that power will wind up in the one set of 8 or the other.


+|700mA Driver-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| -
|
|
|+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |- |
|
|
|+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |- |

OGmolton said:

Just want to add to that point that if you have 16 red leds for example and a 700mA driver, you could use that 700mA driver to power all 16 red leds at 350mA if you want, assuming that 8 red LEDs aren't to much froward voltage for the driver. you'd connect each set of 8 red LEDs in a series, as in


+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-

then connect the positive and negative from the driver to both sets of 8 LEDs and you'd only have to worry about the forward voltage of the 8 LEDs, not all 16, but the current would be split. Of course, if something breaks your parallel circuit all that power will wind up in the one set of 8 or the other.


+|700mA Driver-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| -
|
|
|+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |- |
|
|
|+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |-____+| LED |- |

Click to expand...

way too complicated dude, plus you can run as many of these hypothetical reds as you wanted without splitting the ampage. seen as this hypothetical driver doesnt have a stated voltage

dont mean to troll but I dont want to confuse the guy

this is what you are refereing too i assume
https://reefledlights.com/wiring-diagrams/

yes, you can chop the ampage in half...but for a noob like myself, why bother? especially seen as we are talking about cobs not those pussy 1-3w indicator lights

Drivers always have a maximum amount of volts they support, 40V I think is pretty typical.

Those COB leds are simply a bunch of "pussy" LED's all on one board together pretty much.

That diagram is pretty good, yeah, that's what I'm talking about.

Hi and sorry if this is hijacking your thread but it seems like you and the others here know and have tested a fair bit of diy.
Im planning on building my own panel/panels and ive deceided to not use anythung from epistar or epileds because im very disappointed with them and want the very best.
Now to the big question.
Say i want to build a panel with cree cxb 3050 or another cree cob model surrounded by some socalled 3w chips from osram gold chips (like budmaster god)or luxeon rebel and cree.
Im wondering if anyone knows what brand of leds are best in the various nm specs. Also i dont understand what Bin actually means and so on.
Is it somewhat correct that cree for warm white and natural white and bright white is preferable and that osram golden dragon or gold deluxe or whatever is osrams best lines(not ssl) for the 610-660nm range i think as i read they are similar efficianct as epistar.
I read alot over and over and think i want to mix luxeon rebel cree and osram to get maximum efficiancy, is there any problems to do that other than time and cost???
I was thinking cree cobs for 5500-6400kelvin somewhere and 2700-3200kelvin and osram or luxeon rebel for 660nm and ir740nm.
If i use enough bright white cree would that make blue nm targeting unneccacery or ?
Can anyone suggest to me a complete list of what brand i should uae for what nm and idk if i need a solo driver for each brand but would love it if they can be mixed in same modules on a driver on each module.
I would like to build something similar to amaretech solar eclipse but with even better parts if possible? I really belive in osram and luxeon rebel over chuna epistar and epileds.
Thanx in advance.
@moderator please move post if it does better somewhere else.

lightworker31 said:

Hi and sorry if this is hijacking your thread but it seems like you and the others here know and have tested a fair bit of diy.
Im planning on building my own panel/panels and ive deceided to not use anythung from epistar or epileds because im very disappointed with them and want the very best.
Now to the big question.
Say i want to build a panel with cree cxb 3050 or another cree cob model surrounded by some socalled 3w chips from osram gold chips (like budmaster god)or luxeon rebel and cree.
Im wondering if anyone knows what brand of leds are best in the various nm specs. Also i dont understand what Bin actually means and so on.
Is it somewhat correct that cree for warm white and natural white and bright white is preferable and that osram golden dragon or gold deluxe or whatever is osrams best lines(not ssl) for the 610-660nm range i think as i read they are similar efficianct as epistar.
I read alot over and over and think i want to mix luxeon rebel cree and osram to get maximum efficiancy, is there any problems to do that other than time and cost???
I was thinking cree cobs for 5500-6400kelvin somewhere and 2700-3200kelvin and osram or luxeon rebel for 660nm and ir740nm.
If i use enough bright white cree would that make blue nm targeting unneccacery or ?
Can anyone suggest to me a complete list of what brand i should uae for what nm and idk if i need a solo driver for each brand but would love it if they can be mixed in same modules on a driver on each module.
I would like to build something similar to amaretech solar eclipse but with even better parts if possible? I really belive in osram and luxeon rebel over chuna epistar and epileds.
Thanx in advance.
@moderator please move post if it does better somewhere else.

Click to expand...

NICHIA Led's are the most efficient i've found. 156 Lumen per watt. They are also cheap, and the plants love them. I mix cold and warm white...

Now i stick the led's on the sink and solder them, it's way more simple...

But now all my tents are led's lighted so what will i do next ? For friends ? (joke)

John LOQUE said:

NICHIA Led's are the most efficient i've found. 156 Lumen per watt. They are also cheap, and the plants love them. I mix cold and warm white...

Now i stick the led's on the sink and solder them, it's way more simple...

But now all my tents are led's lighted so what will i do next ? For friends ? (joke)

Click to expand...

Did you grow a full grow with them yet?

Rilla.

GoeRilla said:

Did you grow a full grow with them yet?

Rilla.

Click to expand...

Not yet, but i had seedlings suffering hot water (root rot) under a 150 w CFL, i put them under 150 W actual led power ( NICHIA ) and the day after they were doing the "V". Less heat and more light ...

I added a 40 w nichia led in a flower room where they were already 240 w of cree led's, and the plant just under the NICHIA drinks double of water and nutes and smell incredible...FLO + 35 days