Commercial outdoor organic soil mixes for 2016

TheOutlawTree · Nov 28, 2015

I would love to know what everyone's opinion's are on the different organic options we have for our outdoor soil mixes.

Some people seem to be all about low cost, or cheaper mixes that you can top dress and feed throughout the year when the nutrients in the soil run out. While others are into spending more and having a soil mix like the cootz that will have all the nutrients in it for the whole year.

Me personally, I really like the idea of having a soil like the cootz style mix, that has the nutrients my plant will need for most or all of the year. However, it seems very pricey, especially if your ordering hundreds of yards. Does anyone know how much the Tom Hill mix comes out to per yard?

I didn't have the best luck this year with vermifire- The plants still grew and produced but they were not optimal. I got some soil test's back in june and found out there was 18-20% base saturation of K in each pot. I know others that did well with vermifire, but my batch was apparently not ideal.

Any help or insight on mixes that will provide nutrients the whole season, are appreciated.

WoodFired Pizza · Nov 28, 2015

they don't sell smart pots by the yard. think its like 310$ + per plant with th's mix.

EssentialGround · Dec 2, 2015

...available in Oregon...Radiant Light blend is Albrecht balanced cation/ anion and has 59% plant available calcium before its ever even been wet. 69% Ca base saturation, grows mold and pest immune plants, when watered properly. Ill see if I can get you the ingredient list...

TheOutlawTree · Dec 2, 2015

Sounds good essential, thank you for sharing!

As of now I am eyeing the cootz mix from Rare earth, but i would like to know how much i could order all of the amendments for on my own or from other sources to compare. I am obviously all about the most bang for my buck! Here is something that another member on the forums shared about the cootz from buildasoil

"A member did take each component into consideration and here is what they came up with:

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxx

I will post up the price list I came up with. I priced most of the material off Build-a-soil, so I am sure some prices can be beat. All prices were taken off the largest product size for cheapest sourcing. For example, the kelp came in 1, 5, 10, 15, 50 lb bags. I went off the 50lb bag for cheapest results.

Build a soil mix

1 part worm power 300-500$ a yard Lets say 500 on the high side
1 part sphagnum Peat Moss ($85-$112 a yard) Lets say 100 for easy math
2/3 part pumice (about $55 a yard)
1/3 part rice hulls (about $55 a yard)
$216.50 per yard for base

Nutrients included in the soil:
Acadian Kelp Meal @ ½ cup per cubic foot ($18.27 a yard)
Neem Cake and Karanja Cake 50/50 mix @ ½ cup per cubic foot ($17.50 a yard)
Crustacean Meal @ ½ cup per cubic foot ($13.50 a yard)
Gypsum Dust @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($14.71 a yard)
Brix Blend Basalt @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($24.87 a yard)
Glacial Rock Dust @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($15.23 a yard)
Oyster Flour @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($22.50 a yard)

$126.58 for the additives per yard

216.50 + 126.58 = $343.08 per yard"

TheOutlawTree · Dec 2, 2015

I am testing out the cootz from rare earth right now, On my first ever 100% organic indoor run, and i am very happy so far! I'm curious to see if there's enough amendments in the 15g geopots to last until harvest.

I had heard from a friend that rare earth is using super expensive castings and that's whats driving the price up to 370 a yard. I was hoping to substitute some cheaper unco castings that i was quoted 450 per ton- every (2 yards) from Unco. I wondered what peoples thoughts where on that? Theres a chance it could drive the price down below 3 unless my math is wrong.

I understand the way the worms are fed can be important to whats actually in the castings for nutrient values, but is it really worth all the extra money? I suppose until there are experiments and values tested from each casting we only have opinions.

Here are some indoor plants thriving in south fork cootz mix.

BAKED_BEANZ · Dec 2, 2015

i found out never skimp on soil, its what gets you your results . lessoned learnt here while back . end of the day ,what you get in return whats few extra bucks .get what you want and be happy knowing you got the best. even if it hurt a little .lol i,ll be sorting my soil issues this year .

nice set up too......

xmobotx · Dec 3, 2015

thanks for the recipe in yard amounts

EssentialGround · Dec 3, 2015

Oregon and Cali

Oregon and Cali

Radiant Light Blend
575 a 2yd tote
300$ a yard
30$ for 1.5 cu ft bags

Peat
Earth worm castings
perlite
pumice
Alfalfa meal
Fishbone meal
kelp meal
cottonseed meal
feathermeal
Soft rock phosphate
crustacean meal
Azomite
Kmag
cascade minerals
Biochar
Fine powdered gypsum
microna Ag lime
paramagnetic rock
fulvic Acid Powder

Bokashi/microbial Ignition package 50$

This stuff is awesome, no burning, plant clones right in and go full season with this stuff. ... Each batch comes with testing analysis from two different labs to guarantee the contents are balanced. If its not within Albrecht ratios it doesnt get sold..

50YardLine · Dec 3, 2015

TheOutlawTree said:
Sounds good essential, thank you for sharing!

As of now I am eyeing the cootz mix from Rare earth, but i would like to know how much i could order all of the amendments for on my own or from other sources to compare. I am obviously all about the most bang for my buck! Here is something that another member on the forums shared about the cootz from buildasoil

"A member did take each component into consideration and here is what they came up with:

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxx

I will post up the price list I came up with. I priced most of the material off Build-a-soil, so I am sure some prices can be beat. All prices were taken off the largest product size for cheapest sourcing. For example, the kelp came in 1, 5, 10, 15, 50 lb bags. I went off the 50lb bag for cheapest results.

Build a soil mix

1 part worm power 300-500$ a yard Lets say 500 on the high side
1 part sphagnum Peat Moss ($85-$112 a yard) Lets say 100 for easy math
2/3 part pumice (about $55 a yard)
1/3 part rice hulls (about $55 a yard)
$216.50 per yard for base

Nutrients included in the soil:
Acadian Kelp Meal @ ½ cup per cubic foot ($18.27 a yard)
Neem Cake and Karanja Cake 50/50 mix @ ½ cup per cubic foot ($17.50 a yard)
Crustacean Meal @ ½ cup per cubic foot ($13.50 a yard)
Gypsum Dust @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($14.71 a yard)
Brix Blend Basalt @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($24.87 a yard)
Glacial Rock Dust @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($15.23 a yard)
Oyster Flour @ 1 cup per cubic foot ($22.50 a yard)

$126.58 for the additives per yard

216.50 + 126.58 = $343.08 per yard"

I posted this mix up on the farm, looks like a strait copy and paste.

I will tell you, this soil is the best you can buy, period. I have now ran two crops through my coots and it performs amazing. Didn't amend after the second run, and I just planted my cover crop, which I will turn in, but I don't think I will amend it just yet. So if you consider that, the cost seems less. 360 a yard, however that's only 130 a yard over three years. Great soil.

TheOutlawTree · Dec 3, 2015

^ Damn, thats awsome- How big are your planters / pots?

trichrider · Dec 3, 2015

50YardLine said:
I posted this mix up on the farm, looks like a strait copy and paste.

I will tell you, this soil is the best you can buy, period. I have now ran two crops through my coots and it performs amazing. Didn't amend after the second run, and I just planted my cover crop, which I will turn in, but I don't think I will amend it just yet. So if you consider that, the cost seems less. 360 a yard, however that's only 130 a yard over three years. Great soil.

who gets the extra $30?

milkyjoe · Dec 4, 2015

EssentialGround said:
Radiant Light Blend
575 a 2yd tote
300$ a yard
30$ for 1.5 cu ft bags

Peat
Earth worm castings
perlite
pumice
Alfalfa meal
Fishbone meal
kelp meal
cottonseed meal
feathermeal
Soft rock phosphate
crustacean meal
Azomite
Kmag
cascade minerals
Biochar
Fine powdered gypsum
microna Ag lime
paramagnetic rock
fulvic Acid Powder

Bokashi/microbial Ignition package 50$

This stuff is awesome, no burning, plant clones right in and go full season with this stuff. ... Each batch comes with testing analysis from two different labs to guarantee the contents are balanced. If its not within Albrecht ratios it doesnt get sold..

Whatvis the P and K on that mix? I would argue 70% Ca don't mean much for mold resistace if K is outcompeting it and P is tying up micros

If I were a soil company and committed to a lightwight mix I would use peat with just enough compost to hit the P and K numbers I wanted. Nova Crop Controls work makes it clear...far more shortages are caused by too much of a competing mineral than by a shortage

Plus high photosynthesis = lower mineral content = higher secondary metabolite production. You ain't getting max photosynthesis with K blocking Mg and P locking out Fe and Mn.

Much easier to achieve balance with top soil

EssentialGround · Dec 4, 2015

P is 200lbs an acre with that mix...

milkyjoe · Dec 4, 2015

P or P2O5? What is the K?

EssentialGround · Dec 4, 2015

K is 3-5% of the base sat.

EssentialGround · Dec 4, 2015

Ill try and get an analysis posted....

milkyjoe · Dec 4, 2015

I would be curious how much worm casting. What is H...like 15-20?

I am amazed with ewc, soft rock and fbm P isn't higher

TheOutlawTree · Dec 13, 2015

Regardless if no one wants to debate.... I did well today, I have lots of good mixes to think about, and more beans to start this spring!

EssentialGround · Dec 14, 2015

Nice round of genetics for spring,

Here is the Radiant light mix tested at logan labs....

TheOutlawTree · Dec 14, 2015

Wow, that's an impressive lab test.. Thank you essential. I was bummed I did not get a chance to catch up with you at the cup...I didn't get that message until I was back in my hotel, and by than I was pretty lit...probably wouldn't have absorbed the most knowledge.

I am interested In that mix for sure, would like to find out what the trucking would cost, coming all the way from Oregon.

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