If you live in a Legal Cannabis State and are unhappy post here!

[budtang]

LOL...you see no point in bitching...since when? What you do...aka whine constantly about the LAWS here that were voted on BY THE PEOPLE.

They weren't voted on by the people. People voted for legal weed. Not residential restrictions on growing. This notion you have your head that residents of Colorado voted to restrict residential growing is myth. That's not what people specifically voted on. People voted on legal weed and the restrictions on residential growers were the small print that nobody read before voting. Why don't you run a vote specifically on that aspect of legalization and see what the results turn out to be? I guarantee you CO residents would support residential growers voluntarily helping out with schools. As opposed to doing it under the table and helping only themselves the way you're advising me to do.

It's all about the $$$$$$$$$ with you and Jhhnnn. If I were interested in $$$$$$$ I wouldn't be on this thread. You don't think about the schools, safety issues, taxes, violence surrounding illegal grows, etc. Those are the concerns that adults have.

 

[monsoon]

It's unfair and unrealistic to ask Sam WHERE he started..in the fuckin 70's for christsake when there were NO protections in place whatsoever. Yeah..it probably WAS a house... that's because there wasn't ANYONE growing in a warehouse then...

Sam had balls...like many others back then. You truly have no clue. you can't even see that all of this IS being handed to you on a plate. You just need to shut up long enough to step in the ring. guarantee if you came here...or to CA..your "game" and your 'expert' opinion will be knocked down a few levels by those who actually know what they are talking about.

Like Sam.

 

[monsoon]

How does that help out underfunded schools?

We voted for retail, which has been putting MILLIONS into the school fund every month via sales to folks like you who only talk of growing pot. That's how.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

You still didn't answer the question, Sam.

Did you first start growing weed in a residence, or a commercial operation in warehouse?

The first seeds I planted was in a flower box at a record shop in Hollywood 1965. They got stolen after a few months.
I do not grow under lights, it is wrong in my mind if I have a choice. I use greenhouses, real big ones. With the sun in the soil. That is how I started and still do it, 50 years later.
You can't be a real plant breeder with just a few plants, Cannabis needs selection when you breed.
-SamS

 

[Jellyfish]

The year you joined the forum is the year my grow was raided newbie.

Should have been more careful, newbie.

 

[budtang]

The first seeds I planted was in a flower box at a record shop in Hollywood 1965. They got stolen after a few months.

Well, there you go. Did you plant more than 6 seeds? Are you aware of the fact that that's illegal and you violated CO and WA policies by doing so?

I do not grow under lights, it is wrong in my mind if I have a choice. I use greenhouses, real big ones. With the sun in the soil. That is how I started and still do it, 50 years later.

Yea, but you didn't START in big greenhouses, Sam.

Were any of these greenhouses ever located on property that you lived in? Because that's illegal, too. You can't grow for retail on residential property that you own/rent in CO and WA.You would go to prison under CO and WA system. The entire process you used to get into this industry won't be possible under CO and WA models.

This has been point of this entire discussion. Guys like you won't exist under CO and WA system. The traditions of cannabis breeding and the processes that breeders like you used to get involved in the industry won't be allowed to exist in the coming legal cannabis industry. Small scale breeders will be forced out of business with laws and restrictions. Either that, or they'll have to pick up and relocate to a foreign country if they want to continue on in the process. There is no place for people like you in the coming U.S. cannabis industry, Sam.

You can't be a real plant breeder with just a few plants, Cannabis needs selection when you breed.
-SamS

Keep telling yourself that while people are buying great genetics from residential breeders. I'm sorry, but when I see residential breeders consistently produce genetics that's on par with anything large scale breeders do it makes me think everything you're claiming is totally false and you have no idea what you're talking about. There are well documented genetics coming from small scale breeders and you're sitting here saying,"It's not possible."

Either, you don't know what you're talking about, or you're lying? Which is it?

 

[monsoon]

They weren't voted on by the people. People voted for legal weed. Not residential restrictions on growing. This notion you have your head that residents of Colorado voted to restrict residential growing is myth. That's not what people specifically voted on. People voted on legal weed and the restrictions on residential growers were the small print that nobody read before voting. Why don't you run a vote specifically on that aspect of legalization and see what the results turn out to be? I guarantee you CO residents would support residential growers voluntarily helping out with schools. As opposed to doing it under the table and helping only themselves the way you're advising me to do.

It's all about the $$$$$$$$$ with you and Jhhnnn. If I were interested in $$$$$$$ I wouldn't be on this thread. You don't think about the schools, safety issues, taxes, violence surrounding illegal grows, etc. Those are the concerns that adults have.

We can do NOTHING to help folks like you who do not read the Amendment. It said plainly and unequivocally that residential grows would not be allowed for profit and that a STATE operated and taxed system would be the ONLY legal way to operate.

It wasn't hidden in there. you just had to be smart enough to read it and understand that the law wasn't set up JUST FOR YOU. Same thing with the restrictions that property OWNERS can place upon renters...like you...who own nothing regarding cannbis use/growing on their property. Basic rights of ownership, plainly stated. Nothing more. Only those who don't have their shit together enough to own property fail to understand such basic rights. Like you, evidently.

Co RESIDENTS spoke via A64. What is it that you don't understand about votes/laws to see that? Nothing has been changed. The laws reflect the will of the people and the people said " we don't want you here growing next door, Mr. Expert."

CO has more to offer than weed and the laws will always reflect that...as well as the RIGHTS of property owners. Thankfully.

 

[monsoon]

Sam started BEFORE anyone EXPECTED someone to HOLD THEIR HAND....like you seem to need. Laws? Fuck off. The laws were ALL against what Sam and his peers were doing.

The seeds were distributed all over the US. SKUNK #1 pot was everywhere. Then it went across the pond....ILLEGALLY MAILED THERE...oh my...cry FOUL baby boy!

NOTHING was legal then. Chiding anyone for breaking laws just SHOWS you had no involvement/were not around then. Your "expert' stance.....nor anyone else's "expert" stance was present then because folks were ALL learning as they went. there was no Internet to pour over to become an INSTANT expert like you.

Sam and the guys who played the game were on the radar...in a way that you couldn't fathom...and certainly couldn't HANDLE. Guaranteed. Yet..here you are...trying to SCHOOL him?

Sam..ya got more patience than I do. Pass that fatty over here, please.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Well, there you go. Did you plant more than 6 seeds? Are you aware of the fact that that's illegal and you violated CO and WA policies by doing so?




Yea, but you didn't START in big greenhouses, Sam.

Were any of these greenhouses ever located on property that you lived in? Because that's illegal, too. You can't grow for retail on residential property that you own/rent in CO and WA.You would go to prison under CO and WA system. The entire process you used to get into this industry won't be possible under CO and WA models.

This has been point of this entire discussion. Guys like you won't exist under CO and WA system. The traditions of cannabis breeding and the processes that breeders like you used to get involved in the industry won't be allowed to exist in the coming legal cannabis industry. Small scale breeders will be forced out of business with laws and restrictions. Either that, or they'll have to pick up and relocate to a foreign country if they want to continue on in the process. There is no place for people like you in the coming U.S. cannabis industry, Sam.



Keep telling yourself that while people are buying great genetics from residential breeders. I'm sorry, but when I see residential breeders consistently produce genetics that's on par with anything large scale breeders do it makes me think everything you're claiming is totally false and you have no idea what you're talking about. There are well documented genetics coming from small scale breeders and you're sitting here saying,"It's not possible."

Either, you don't know what you're talking about, or you're lying? Which is it?

What I will do is neither, I consider talking to you a waste of my time, I get real tired of people that put words in my mouth so they can try a destroy a straw man. I am sure you know much more then me about genetics and will allow you to spew your knowledge to anyone interested, but not me I will put you on ignore.
-Sams

 

[budtang]

We can do NOTHING to help folks like you who do not read the Amendment. It said plainly and unequivocally that residential grows would not be allowed for profit and that a STATE operated and taxed system would be the ONLY legal way to operate.

It wasn't hidden in there. you just had to be smart enough to read it and understand that the law wasn't set up JUST FOR YOU.

NOBODY read it. Senators and Congressmen don't read bills they vote on. Are you claiming most of CO residents took the time to read every aspect of it? No way. Most CO residents had no idea what was voted on.

They heard "legal weed" and they were sold.

Co RESIDENTS spoke via A64. What is it that you don't understand about votes/laws to see that?

Last time I checked weed was illegal for the past 80 years. Now, it's not. What don't you understand about that? The stipulations of the bill are in no way concrete. Just as laws prohibiting cannabis altogether. weren't concrete.

Nothing has been changed. The laws reflect the will of the people and the people

I don't believe they do. I believe they reflect the will of corporations. Like I said, you're going to need more proof than a bill that contained restrictions on weed growing. Nobody in the USA reads bills... Not Congressmen, not Senators, not presidents, and sure as hell not CO and WA residents.

If you want to prove that Colorado residents specifically don't want residential growers paying taxes you're going to need more than a massive bill containing a few regulations that most voters didn't read. People voted on legal weed, not restrictions on residential growing.

 

[budtang]

NOTHING was legal then.

And, nothing revolving around what he did is legal now, either. So, you effectively accomplished NOTHING.

Not to mention, every time you criticize someone like me you're essentially criticizing him, too. This guy didn't start out breeding in massive greenhouses. He started in a residential operation by his own admission. Every time you talk shit about me wanting to grow in residence you're indirectly insulting him, too. Plus, every other breeder on this forum, as well. So...

You hear that Sam? Monsoon and Jhhnnn are claiming that you're an asshole who just got into the industry to make money. They've been talking about it for 2 threads now. What do you have to say about that? He thinks you're an asshole for growing in rented property that you didn't own.

 

[budtang]

What I will do is neither, I consider talking to you a waste of my time, I get real tired of people that put words in my mouth so they can try a destroy a straw man. I am sure you know much more then me about genetics and will allow you to spew your knowledge to anyone interested, but not me I will put you on ignore.
-Sams

Don't get mad because smaller breeders can compete with you.

Every time they sell a seed to a satisfied customer they're proving that everything you said about breeding is totally false and you clearly can't handle it.

 

[budtang]

We voted for retail, which has been putting MILLIONS into the school fund every month via sales to folks like you who only talk of growing pot. That's how.

What? Growing illegally doesn't help out schools, monsoon. You're losing millions. Not gaining millions.

Weed sales in CO are about HALF of what was projected because of the black market that you're advising me to get involved in. Double those "MILLIONS" and that's how much more schools would be helped out if residential operations were approved for retail.

 

[paladin420]

Wow?
I don't think the people who have been huntin n houndin us all our lives should get a slice of the pie. I don't care what 'good' they say it is for.
Shoot my dog, take my kids, put me in jail? And now you want me to slice you in for a third?

F.U.C.K. T. H. A. T

They believed the Federal Fairy Tale.....

 

[budtang]

Sam started BEFORE anyone EXPECTED someone to HOLD THEIR HAND....like you seem to need. Laws? Fuck off. The laws were ALL against what Sam and his peers were doing.

The seeds were distributed all over the US. SKUNK #1 pot was everywhere. Then it went across the pond....ILLEGALLY MAILED THERE...oh my...cry FOUL baby boy!

NOTHING was legal then. Chiding anyone for breaking laws just SHOWS you had no involvement/were not around then. Your "expert' stance.....nor anyone else's "expert" stance was present then because folks were ALL learning as they went. there was no Internet to pour over to become an INSTANT expert like you.

Sam and the guys who played the game were on the radar...in a way that you couldn't fathom...and certainly couldn't HANDLE. Guaranteed. Yet..here you are...trying to SCHOOL him?

Sam..ya got more patience than I do. Pass that fatty over here, please.

That's rich. When I was trying to grow residentially I was a mass profiteering asshole. SamtheSkunkman did it and he magically is a hero in your eyes.

Funny how that works. Why don't you try taking your nose out of Sam's ass?

 

[budtang]

Wow?
I don't think the people who have been huntin n houndin us all our lives should get a slice of the pie. I don't care what 'good' they say it is for.
Shoot my dog, take my kids, put me in jail? And now you want me to slice you in for a third?

F.U.C.K. T. H. A. T

They believed the Federal Fairy Tale.....

Do you really think taxes are going directly into the pockets of politicians? Seriously?

"Fuck those kids in schools. They don't get a slice of the pie."

Amazing.

 

[paladin420]

Do you really think taxes are going directly into the pockets of politicians? Seriously?

"Fuck those kids in schools. They don't get a slice of the pie."

Amazing.

Really? Where did I say that?

You think those kids see that coin?? Wow go look at your local school.
See how much of your money gets eaten by admin before the doors ever open. You ever see the retirement condos for union teachers?

 

[Jhhnn]

NOBODY read it. Senators and Congressmen don't read bills they vote on. Are you claiming most of CO residents took the time to read every aspect of it? No way. Most CO residents had no idea what was voted on.

They heard "legal weed" and they were sold.

Not at all. The citizens' initiative isn't large at all, only a few pages. It was widely analyzed, discussed, & commented on in the Media. Might want to read it yourself, just to know what you're talking about-

http://www.regulatemarijuana.org/s/regulate-marijuana-alcohol-act-2012

Last time I checked weed was illegal for the past 80 years. Now, it's not. What don't you understand about that? The stipulations of the bill are in no way concrete. Just as laws prohibiting cannabis altogether. weren't concrete.

A64 is not a bill. It is not a product of the Legislature. It is a citizens' initiative to alter the state constitution, the very framework of the law. Only a vote of the people can alter the CO state constitution. In that, Amendment 64 is quite specific in many respects.

It establishes the right of citizens to possess, buy, share & grow cannabis in enumerated quantities anywhere in the state.

It establishes the right & responsibility of state & local authorities to license & regulate retail marijuana facilities as businesses. It was well understood that your basement grow would not be considered to be a business, for a variety of reasons. One is zoning, a local rather than a state realm. Others include tax collection, health & safety, product diversion & security. You can't meet the requirements in your basement, quite by design. Proper regulation of your grow would be a serious PITA for the State, and nobody expected they'd do it. We realized that regulatory compliance isn't your forte. OTOH, compliance by legit businessmen having sizable investment is highly likely particularly in secure & frequently inspected facilities.

We realized that we'd need a strong regulatory structure if the Feds would allow retail to proceed at all.

I don't believe they do. I believe they reflect the will of corporations. Like I said, you're going to need more proof than a bill that contained restrictions on weed growing. Nobody in the USA reads bills... Not Congressmen, not Senators, not presidents, and sure as hell not CO and WA residents.

If you want to prove that Colorado residents specifically don't want residential growers paying taxes you're going to need more than a massive bill containing a few regulations that most voters didn't read. People voted on legal weed, not restrictions on residential growing.

I am a nobody, apparently, having read A64 more than once, before its passage & several times since. I'm sure I'm not alone. Colorado residents realized that properly regulating basement growers is impossible, as we learned with MMJ. When we changed the structure of that, we obtained something that can be regulated, which was our intent with A64. Yeh, we cut you out, Budtang, intentionally, because we wanted to move the whole thing up a level. It's how we got CO business on our side to help pass the measure, and how we keep the Feds out of our business, too.

Unlike CA MMJ, which supplies an enormous amount of product to their own black market & the rest of the country with a very leaky system, we're creating a tight pipeline from seed to consumer. Under their new enforcement guidelines, the Feds are consequently not an issue for CO legal suppliers. Meanwhile, the DEA is doing their usual shark attacks against state legal businesses in CA.

Figure out that this is the end of an era, a historical tipping point, a new paradigm, a different way of dealing with cannabis consumption. It's an enormous cultural & institutional shift, and it's a shift away from where you want to go. The old model is being dumped, and some of the players along with it. New players are entering the game. It moves up a level or few, requiring sizable investment & true horticultural expertise to compete at all. It is what it is, and it serves much broader public interests than the relics of the past.

 

[monsoon]

When I was trying to grow residentially I was a mass profiteering asshole.

Spoken like a true expert. At least you know yourself even if you know nothing else.

 

[shaggyballs]

I hate to say this but when people are defending Monsato something just is not right...this has turned into a defend monsanto thread.

I wish the best of luck to those who think big commercial grows are in the best interest of our fellow man and future generations.

I still say Jhhnn has a personal agenda he is not stating!He is really well informed and has the debate skills of a politician....seems strange to me???
A person is not usually this passionate about a subject that they stand to gain nothing from.... but spend many hours trying to convince people that what they know is true is just their imagination!
Or that believing what they can see happening with their own eyes is foolish.
When you refuse to lie down and accept their side of things.....
You are then ridiculed and told you believe in the boogie man or you are just starting a conspiracy theory.

This thread has become a real joke!!

To(sam) and to all I apologize for my writing style....it is just my style..ya know!
Condemn me for it if you will...I am not perfect and I accept that I am flawed in many ways!

I keep saying this do not believe my words or the words of anyone else!
You have a moral obligation to yourself and others to seek the real truth for yourself!

You decide what is truth and what is hot air!