Malaysian airliner crashes in E. Ukraine

[stoned-trout]

I like the vodka tho

 

[RetroGrow]

The media has reported that the plane must have been shot down by Russian forces or Russian-backed separatists, because the missile that reportedly brought down the plane was Russian made. But they will not report that the Ukrainian government also uses the exact same Russian-made weapons.

They will not report that the missile that apparently shot down the plane was from a sophisticated surface-to-air missile system that requires a good deal of training that the separatists do not have.

Ummmm....actually, they most certainly DID report those things, so now, even Ron Paul is lying. Sad. Who can you trust? It was probably their lack of skill/training that caused the fuck-up. They thought they were shooting down another cargo plane, as they had done days earlier. I think Ron Paul spoke too soon, before HE had all the facts.

 

[watts]

The truth is what those in power want it to be

 

[RetroGrow]

Putin's face should be there too......

 

[Bulldog420]

 

[gaiusmarius]

how can you not include the US in the list of war mongers? they are fighting more wars then all other countries added together. don't just believe it because you read it, tell me which wars, which drone assassinations, has Putin been involved in? but yeah Putin is the war monger. not the country fighting in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, Somalia, Syria and not long ago Iraq. how many deaths has all that caused?

the recording is also being dissected now and a number of issues have come up. for 1 thing the video was made 1 day early, lol. lies, distortion and manipulation, just like the weapons of mass destruction that were supposedly in Iraq according to all these same talking heads now blaming Putin, lol.

anyway why not give the evidence? why is it we have to be inundated with talking heads outdoing each other to insult the president of a nuclear power and accuse him of war crimes without a shred of evidence to back up said accusation, oh wait some audio off social media, 2 guys talking, who knows who they are, lol. yep no satellite pics, no radar data, no radio com recordings, just words, hearsay.

 

[RetroGrow]

how can you not include the US in the list of war mongers? they are fighting more wars then all other countries added together. recordings, just words, hearsay.

Did you see the picture I posted? Most of the war mongers are Americans. I have no love for them. Obama is a criminal, IMO. He should be impeached, tried for treason, and executed.
It all goes back to President Eisenhower's speech warning of the growing menace of the military industrial complex. He was spot on, and everything he warned about has come to pass, only worse.

Here is that speech:

"We . . . must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for our own ease and convenience the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.

Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense. We have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on military security alone more than the net income of all United States corporations.

Now this conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every Statehouse, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet, we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources, and livelihood are all involved. So is the very structure of our society.

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.

The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocation, and the power of money is ever present and is gravely to be regarded.
Yet in holding scientific discovery in respect, as we should, we must also be alert to the equal and opposite danger that public policy could itself become the captive of a scientific-technological elite.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eisenhower's_farewell_address

Note: This speech was made in 1961, before computers or the tech revolution even began, yet President Eisenhower was acutely aware of the future pitfalls. Amazing man.....

 

[armedoldhippy]

part of the problem in the US is that our politicians get picked for us by the parties. big money controls who gets nominated, & we are forced to pick between two evils, hoping that we pick the lesser. but voting for the lesser of two evils is still picking evil. "America- not yet so far gone to need bloodshed to restore her, but way out of range of the ballot box." we truly DO need another Eisenhower in these times that we live in...

 

[gaiusmarius]

check this out, it's late and i can't search for the source Watson is referring to right now, but this might explain why no satellite images are forthcoming from the US statedepartment.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/whistle...show-ukrainian-troops-shooting-down-mh17.html

[YOUTUBEIF]CR5HtzbMy-E[/YOUTUBEIF]

Whistleblower: U.S. Satellite Images Show Ukrainian Troops Shooting Down MH17

Print The Alex Jones Channel Alex Jones Show podcast Prison Planet TV Infowars.com Twitter Alex Jones' Facebook Infowars store

Source tells award winning reporter Washington lying about responsibility for tragedy

Paul Joseph Watson
Prison Planet.com
July 21, 2014

Whistleblower: U.S. Satellite Images Show Ukrainian Troops Shooting Down MH17 210714buk

Award winning former Associated Press reporter Robert Parry has been told by an intelligence source that the United States is in possession of satellite imagery which shows that Ukrainian troops were responsible for the shoot down of Malaysian Airlines Flight 17.

In the absence of any proper investigation, media rhetoric over the last few days has firmly pointed the finger of blame for the downing of the aircraft on Russian-backed Ukrainian rebels, but Parry’s source tells a different story.

What I’ve been told by one source, who has provided accurate information on similar matters in the past, is that U.S. intelligence agencies do have detailed satellite images of the likely missile battery that launched the fateful missile, but the battery appears to have been under the control of Ukrainian government troops dressed in what look like Ukrainian uniforms.

The source said CIA analysts were still not ruling out the possibility that the troops were actually eastern Ukrainian rebels in similar uniforms but the initial assessment was that the troops were Ukrainian soldiers. There also was the suggestion that the soldiers involved were undisciplined and possibly drunk, since the imagery showed what looked like beer bottles scattered around the site, the source said.

Although the establishment press has attempted to deride any questioning of the official narrative that Ukrainian rebels were responsible for the incident by invoking the tired “conspiracy theory” pejorative, Parry can hardly be dismissed as a crank given his key role in covering the Iran-Contra scandal for the Associated Press and Newsweek. Indeed, Parry’s investigative work on intelligence matters, for which he was awarded the George Polk Award, suggests that the information provided by his source is worthy of serious attention.

U.S. and Ukrainian authorities continue to insist that Moscow-backed separatists were responsible for the tragedy, asserting that a BUK missile system was used to bring down the airliner. However, this was contradicted by Ukraine’s Prosecutor General Vitaliy Yarema, who stated, “The military told the president after the passenger plane had been shot down that the terrorists did not possess our Buk missile systems.”

In a related development, audio experts who conducted a study into the authenticity of a recording released by Ukrainian authorities which implicated Russian-backed rebels as being responsible for the missile attack on MH17 concluded that the tape was fabricated.

“The tape’s second fragment consists of three pieces but was presented as a single audio recording. However, a spectral and time analysis has showed that the dialog was cut into pieces and then assembled. Short pauses in the tape are very indicative: the audio file has preserved time marks which show that the dialog was assembled from various episodes, the expert said,” reports ITAR-TASS.

 

[armedoldhippy]

the mere fact that you even attempt to foist Alex Jones as a credible ANYTHING only confirms my suspicions about you. a man that has never seen a conspiracy theory so wild that he won't swear on the Bible by it, and possibly the only person in the world that makes Fox News commentators look sane by comparison. good Lord! you need more aluminum foil.....

 

[resinryder]

But what if he's right? I like to chew tin foil like bubble gum sometimes, lol

 

[RetroGrow]

The latest, 4.05 PM today:

MH17 crash: FT photo shows signs of damage from missile strike:
The first apparent hard evidence that Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 was brought down by a surface-to-air missile is emerging from the crash site in eastern Ukraine, after experts confirmed on Monday there were signs of shrapnel damage to the aircraft.

The photograph above, first published by the Financial Times over the weekend, shows a piece of the downed Boeing 777 about a metre square with a gaping hole in the middle, surrounded by smaller holes and apparent burn marks.
The wreckage was recovered by the people of Petropavlovka from a villager’s back yard last Thursday and moved to the roadside because it was believed to be important.

Two defence analysts in London and a former military pilot who have studied the picture corroborated the claim by a local man, who said he had served in the military, that much of the damage was consistent with a missile strike.

Over the weekend, western intelligence agencies pointed to mounting evidence that backs Ukraine’s claim that the aircraft with 298 people on board was shot down by mistake by pro-Russian separatists and Russian military personnel with an SA-11 missile launched from a Buk-M1 SAM battery.

Justin Bronk, an analyst at the Royal United Services Institute in London, said: “The size of the shrapnel holes is consistent with what one might expect to see from an SA-11 hit. However, it is difficult to assess the total blast pattern with such a small fragment of fuselage.”

Another analyst, Douglas Barrie of the International Institute for Strategic Studies, said the photographic evidence “was consistent with the kind of damage you would expect to see from the detonation of a high explosive fragmentation warhead of the type commonly used in a SAM system”.

Both analysts cautioned, however, that further work would be needed to ascertain exactly what had happened, including chemical testing for explosive residue.
High quality global journalism requires investment.

One former senior Royal Air Force officer who was shown the picture said he had seen similar damage on aircraft that had been hit by flying shrapnel from rocket attacks on airbases.

All three experts agreed that the large hole in the middle of the fragment was likely to have been punched from the inside out as the aircraft rapidly depressurised when it was hit at a height of 33,000ft last Thursday afternoon.

All three confirmed the part of the aircraft in the photograph was the port side of the Boeing 777’s cockpit. The former RAF officer, who flew fast jets, said that based on the evidence it would appear that the missile exploded in front and to the left of the aircraft.

Anti-aircraft missiles are not designed to score a direct hit as they are targeted to destroy fast, agile fighter jets. Instead, they are designed to explode within about 20m of their target, sending out a cloud of red hot metal to increase the chances of inflicting as much damage as possible.

The former RAF pilot said an explosion in front of the aircraft would be consistent with the interception course a SAM would be expected to follow. “The last thing a ground-launched missile wants to do is play catch-up with an aircraft, it would look to get ahead of its target,” he said.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/1d6a9ac2-10e3-11e4-b116-00144feabdc0.html#axzz38AFonTAV

 

[Harry Gypsna]

Man, I'm quitting reading all this conspiracy woo at page 5, although I've already seen the last page.
It's pretty obvious what happened.
Commander gung-hoski posting bragging about shooting down a ukranian military plane...then reports of a downed airliner... gung-hoski's posts are deleted quickly.
Fucks sake.

 

[gaiusmarius]

deleted info? have you heard and seen the twiter posts of the air traffic controller Carlos?

what investigators? i thought Obama said the rebels were not letting any investigators to the site? anyway no one is saying that it wasn't a missile hit.

sorry oldhippy, i knew what your response would be as i posted that article by Watson. he is actually a really good investigative journalist/activist. attack the messenger to try and get people to ignore the sense of the message.

further more i wonder why the Ukranian army deployed their own buk systems to the conflict zone a few days earlier when the rebels have no air power. further why did they quickly move them out again the day after the event?

let the USA share their satellite images, that will clear it all up as they had a satellite pointed at the area. them not sharing their satellite images seems suspicious in it's self.

i do want to repeat, i'm not saying it was one way or another, i'm saying it is too early to know for sure.

 

[SativaBreather]

the mere fact that you even attempt to foist Alex Jones as a credible ANYTHING only confirms my suspicions about you. a man that has never seen a conspiracy theory so wild that he won't swear on the Bible by it, and possibly the only person in the world that makes Fox News commentators look sane by comparison. good Lord! you need more aluminum foil.....

given the effect of aluminIum on the brain, I reckon you been wearing a tin foil hat for a good while yaself

 

[gaiusmarius]

well the plot thickens, check this out. again im not saying it's one way or another, just food for thought. i read my news from all over, chinese, russian, iranian, guardian, bbc, german news and so on and yes i pop in to prison planet too once in a while, same with fox and the rest of the media whores.

Video Shows Ukrainian Rebels Were ‘Surprised’ Doomed Aircraft Was Commercial Airliner

http://www.prisonplanet.com/video-s...-doomed-aircraft-was-commercial-airliner.html

[YOUTUBEIF]kX-VI-NKZMI[/YOUTUBEIF]

“Who allowed them to fly over here?”

Paul Joseph Watson
Prison Planet.com
July 22, 2014

A video obtained by BBC News shows Ukrainian rebels expressing surprise at the discovery that the downed Malaysia Airlines flight was a commercial airliner, suggesting there was no deliberate plot to target the plane.

The clip shows rebels examining the scene of the crash for the first time. According to BBC reporter Fergal Keane, the video “gives a picture of surprise.”

“They’re foreigners, who allowed them to fly over here?,” asks one man.

Contrary to media reports which accused rebels of attempting to hide or cover-up evidence, the men in the clip seem very keen to recover the black boxes from the crash site.

While the video doesn’t prove whether rebels shot down the aircraft or not, it does clearly indicate that local militia in the immediate area were not part of a plot to deliberately target the plane, as Kiev has insinuated.

Within 12 hours of the crash being reported, Ukrainian authorities released a YouTube video of a conversation between a separatist leader and a Russian military commander which purported to show rebels accepting responsibility for shooting down the airliner.

A group of audio experts who analyzed the tape concluded that it was a fabrication made up of numerous unrelated recordings stitched together.

In the absence of a full investigation, Kiev’s evidence has largely rested on YouTube clips, social media posts and unsubstantiated accusations. Yesterday Russia presented satellite pictures and radar information from the Donetsk region which it claimed proved there was a second aircraft, likely a Ukrainian fighter jet, in the vicinity of MH17. Moscow also claims that Buk missile launchers controlled by Kiev were moved into the region before the incident.

One of Kiev’s central pieces of evidence – video of a Buk missile launcher apparently crossing the border back to Russia after the plane was shot down - has since been debunked. The clip is actually shot in the Ukrainian of town of Krasnoarmeisk, which has been controlled by Kiev since May.

As we reported yesterday, award winning former Associated Press reporter Robert Parry was told by an intelligence source that the United States is in possession of satellite imagery which shows that Ukrainian troops were responsible for the shoot down of Malaysian Airlines Flight 17.


*********************

Paul Joseph Watson is the editor at large of Infowars.com and Prison Planet.com.

 

[SativaBreather]

its so obvious to all except the asleep sheep what is going on here.
When all global news networks carry the same narrative despite no evidence ITS ALWAYS a false flag.
Voice recordings in this day and age mean precisely jack shit.

 

[armedoldhippy]

I never attacked the messenger. I merely stated the obvious. when your sources are as ridiculed worldwide except for conspiracy nuts (both right & left) then no one with any intelligence will take you seriously. I don't believe in rabid conspiracy nutjobs, you don't believe any mainstream media because they don't go for idiotic conspiracy theories. all we can do is wait for the results of the international investigators inquiries & then listen to your proclamations of how they conspired to make Russia look bad. at this point, with your attitude, Putin could come on TV and admit that the separatist shot the plane down on his orders, & you would say "SEE! the Zionist running dog imperialists have drugged him & forced him into a false confession!". tell you what- IF there is a complete investigation, & no parts of the jet are missing & radar tracks show that the rebels DID NOT shoot it down, I will come back on here & apologize. if it shows that they DID shoot the jetliner down, whether deliberarately or by accident, YOU do the same. sound good?

 

[armedoldhippy]

it would not be a surprise to anyone, I think, if it was shot down by accident. it has never been a contention of mine that they deliberately shot down a commercial jet liner, compared to the Soviet pilot that knowingly shot down Korea 007 in spite of being in visual contact & seeing the double rows of windows identifying it as a passenger plane...

 

[armedoldhippy]

given the effect of aluminIum on the brain, I reckon you been wearing a tin foil hat for a good while yaself

no, I still have hair unlike the picture of you on your posts...