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Fungus gnats or WINGED ROOT APHIDS???
- Thread starter spleebale
- Start date
FunkJungle
Member
Pretty sure those are hypoaspis mites. If so, they're on your side. But they could point to another issue with your soil. Might be some other bug in there with them.
Not RA or springtails, soil mites yes,... which kind?
well, not an entomologist either......
well, not an entomologist either......
Harmless soil mite, if you want to be an entomologist there are resources on the web that will help you ID but it requires an expensive microscope and lots of time.
I assume you care more about your plant so my suggestion is that if you have lots of these soil mites, consider these questions:
Do you have fungus gnats?
Have you seen fungus gnat larvae in soil?
Do you have brown roots?
Are your leaves not as healthy as they should be, maybe a cal-mag looking problem?
Are your buds finishing smaller, and maybe a bit quicker?
These questions indicate if the soil mites are your canary in the coal mine...
I assume you care more about your plant so my suggestion is that if you have lots of these soil mites, consider these questions:
Do you have fungus gnats?
Have you seen fungus gnat larvae in soil?
Do you have brown roots?
Are your leaves not as healthy as they should be, maybe a cal-mag looking problem?
Are your buds finishing smaller, and maybe a bit quicker?
These questions indicate if the soil mites are your canary in the coal mine...
In response to Bigbux82
Hey guys
I think I need some help. Recent grows have come down with some "phantom" deficiencies which only hits a select few plants. However...I have noticed that in that bad tent...the buds are finishing quicker....it is destroying the fan leaves...it even just up and killed a plant like 40 days in flower...it was dried up and just dead on the stalk....none of the other plants died. However...most of them had this yellowing/necrotic def going on.
I guess my question is...how do I go about diagnosing what issue I have? I run in tents in flood and drain. I was seeing a lot of dead black flying bugs dead on the bottom of my trays...I also noticed little pin sized floating worms in the water left on my tray after flood. Very tiny wiggly worms.
How do I go about diagnosing my problem? Do I need a special microscope? I have had a thrip problem in the past...and do use spinosad on vegging plants....I also have azamax...but I don't use it that much.
Any suggestions?
Thanks
TpM
I think I need some help. Recent grows have come down with some "phantom" deficiencies which only hits a select few plants. However...I have noticed that in that bad tent...the buds are finishing quicker....it is destroying the fan leaves...it even just up and killed a plant like 40 days in flower...it was dried up and just dead on the stalk....none of the other plants died. However...most of them had this yellowing/necrotic def going on.
I guess my question is...how do I go about diagnosing what issue I have? I run in tents in flood and drain. I was seeing a lot of dead black flying bugs dead on the bottom of my trays...I also noticed little pin sized floating worms in the water left on my tray after flood. Very tiny wiggly worms.
How do I go about diagnosing my problem? Do I need a special microscope? I have had a thrip problem in the past...and do use spinosad on vegging plants....I also have azamax...but I don't use it that much.
Any suggestions?
Thanks
TpM
Sounds like fungus gnat larvae and either dead fungus mats or root aphid flyers. Read this thread from start to finish or pick your poison and save yourself months of agony start as soon as the store opens that sells the poison you prefer. Skip the organics and go with either granger a method or depending on your medium go with eclipse 420. To be honest I would just use the thread search and read those two members posts from beginning to end. They are fundamentally opposed but both methods can work. They both have Thier pros and cons and both have instances where they would be a poor fit compared to the other. If it were me and I was running hydro I would go with tree and shrub if you were in coco I'd suggest considering acephate. I would also repeat whatever method you choose or alternate for the next several rounds at minimum whether you think they're gone or not. Storm shadow suggests kontos. I would say that would be effective to add on to what ever you choose. Any other advice you read on here will make you life hell. I was plagued and now I'm not. Don't go organic on these things. It's a waste of time. If you don't want the poisons shut your grow down and get rid of every plant in your house and start sanitizing and heat treating your room. Don't try to save your moms. That's the only organic method that works and you'll need to wait em out. I pulled all the carpet out of my house and house plants too. I think I would have stopped growing if I hadn't found this thread.
you shouldt let any insect in your room that bites plants. i use to let fungus gnat do thier thing unconcerned. that is a really good way to spread pathogens. youll really have a hard time figuring shit out if you add viral and other pathogens to the puzzle. never let any thing bite an indoor plant period. good luck. read the dud thread when youre done with this one. that could be your next issue. especially if you let things continue. maybe. that one is a mystery as of yet, but there are reasons to consider it a problem associated with biting pests by some very smart growers, although some equally astute folks disagree. i say zero bug tolerance.
So there's no need to freak out and go crazy with drastic measures. What you have, and I am saying this from experience with the same problem, is a very bad fungus gnat infection. Depending on your view of pesticides and what stage, veg or flwr, here's what will fix the problem:
Non organic (but still safe imho):
1. Drench all veg plants with imidicloprid (bayer fruit & veggie). This is the same ingredient that xxxstr8edgexxx is talking about in tree and shrub. Both by Bayer, tree and shrub is I think 10x stronger. I prefer the weaker since easier to mix the batch size I need.
2. Use SNS 209 on flowering plant, and on the veg plants starting with next watering after the imid drench and continue with every watering until no FG fliers.
3. Put up yellow sticky cards to monitor for pests. Cards are not effective treatment! Only an indicator of pests in room.
4. Optional, but effective, put a 1/4-1/2 inch layer of clean sand or other similar product(gnatnix, pricey tho) on top of media. This keeps out the fliers.
4. You can also use predatory nematodes once you discontinue SNS 209, but may be a waste of $
Organic:
1. Skip step 1 above and start w sns 209
SNS 209 is a rosemary based product and rosemary was recommended as the best by my friend who works in a commercial greenhouse with over a million sq ft under glass. I told him about a pervasive FG problem and that the azamax and other things weren't working.
SNS 209 is specifically made for soil applications not foliar.
I would say medicalmj has very very good advice if these are fungus gnats. However, the yellowing and problems are leaving me more than skeptical. It is not that unlikely that he is right but that would mean you have some other issue. Wouldn't be that odd. If you want to be treating in a way that ensures relief of the symptoms you need to discern the cause accurately. The flyer must be positively identified. I'm not going to go headlong into the descriptions of a gnat versus the several different varieties of aphids that this likey is as there are volumes written on here with pics to match. What I will say is if it does prove to be r. A. There is no reason to keep growing until you have a SOLID PROVEN PLAN OF ERADICATION IN PLAY!! I'm not talking about piecing this and that together and kind of making your own method up. I'm talking about doing exactly what has worked for more than a few people and copying it. It takes a couple months sometimes to know and a few missteps puts it at eight months you still having r. A.s it took me a few rounds. 6 months. Fuck that. Don't do that.
G. R. O. I. N. GET RID OF IT NOW!!!!! Identify that shit and act.
G. R. O. I. N. GET RID OF IT NOW!!!!! Identify that shit and act.
Double post
Thanks guys!
I just got the Bayer Tree and Shrub....
Maybe some Botaniguard?
I just realized that I have not had this problem in straight coco....only with the coco plugs in hydroton.
either way I will read on...and try some things mentioned here.
tpM
I just got the Bayer Tree and Shrub....
Maybe some Botaniguard?
I just realized that I have not had this problem in straight coco....only with the coco plugs in hydroton.
either way I will read on...and try some things mentioned here.
tpM
Had them bitches bad couple years ago along with bad case fungus gnats. Imicolprid will not solve your problem , been there done that. Also there's a reason for Bayer fruit & vegetable and Bayer tree & shrub. I wouldn't go with the later because if you read carefully I believe it will tell you foliar not for drench. It also contains something forgot exactly that your plants will not like, fucks them up with retarded growth and next to impossible to get back. What worked for me was to treat the aphids first with met52 then treat gnats with fruit and vegetable, not together I believe it will kill the bacteria in the met52.
I have to say I've never heard of that except you. A lot of folks use bayer t&s and report no I'll effect. I'd be willing to bet your odd growth was unrelated to the poison.
INTRODUCING Sarcclash's 3 Point Gnat Control.
(It should be noted that this is a "Full Spectrum" Insect control and will kill any organism that uses respiration for life. Beneficial insects will perish as well as the bad guys.)
As a grower of indoor plants these past 3 years, I have been battling these critters to no avail until this past winter when I found an acceptable, low toxicity method.
Dawn Ultra dishwashing liquid.
Be sure NOT to use any soaps that contain or include in their description "antibacterial" agents.
2 tsp's (up to 2 tbsp.)of this to 32 oz of water for the (1st point)mister bottle or 8 tsp's/ gal for (2nd point)whole pot root soak has eliminated the bastards from my home.
It is not possible to simply spray these vermin, one must completely submerge the root vessel, pot or container in this solution 5 minutes to overnight for this treatment to work.
The third point is yellow sticky traps.
Again. this alone does not guarantee FG/RA elimination but does round up many adults and hopefully prevents them from mating.
I started with the hugely expensive sticky traps you can buy at the hydro shop but settled on yellow beer cups ($2 for 50 at Big Lots) and shmear them up with Tanglefoot as a low cost sub.
The downside to any sticky trap is avoiding contact ( plants, tent, cab, lights, materials, clothes, YOU...) with it.
So the method is as follows:
1. Spray your plants with a mister bottle filled with 32 oz. of water and 2 tsp's(up to 2 tbsp.) of Dawn Ultra dishwashing liquid. Lemon Joy (manufactured by Dawn) has the added beni of repelling aphids.
This treatment will kill any adult, larval, pupa or egg of any insect out there since its action upon them is suffocation by drowning.
Caveat!
Depending upon plant sensitivity, insect development stage and species, you may wish to follow this treatment, after 5 min or so, with a pure water spray to wash off the soap.
Any spraying must be thorough, lots of insects hang out on the undersides of leaves so be sure to soak the entire plant.
2. Root soak.
Be sure to immerse the entire pot in a container filled with your soap solution for 5 min up to 8 hrs. (Again, this is dependent upon the caveat above).
3. Despite being a pain in the ass, sticky traps tend to "vacuum" the air around your plants.
I'm not sure if yellow is the best color but it works acceptably.
Experimentation is in order but please post your results.
To clear any misconceptions I may have unwittingly introduced, here is what works for me:
Typical indoor cab grow, cfl's, peat, perlite, vermiculite, etc...
2 tbsp./32 oz. H2O spray NO clear water follow up spray
8 hr soak, same soap/water ratio, clear water rinse.
Using Jobe's Science and Nature fert to restore healthy organic biozone AFTER treatment.
YMMV
That's all I have, dishwashing liquid is hardly organic I know, but seems much milder than outright chemical controls IMO.
(Hat tip to LDS Prepper on youtube for this tip)
Apologies to the international community here if this item is not available to you.
If you try to attempt this method using another brand of dishwashing soap, please avoid antibacterial soaps or agents other than surfactants, since the action employed is mechanical.
(It should be noted that this is a "Full Spectrum" Insect control and will kill any organism that uses respiration for life. Beneficial insects will perish as well as the bad guys.)
As a grower of indoor plants these past 3 years, I have been battling these critters to no avail until this past winter when I found an acceptable, low toxicity method.
Dawn Ultra dishwashing liquid.
Be sure NOT to use any soaps that contain or include in their description "antibacterial" agents.
2 tsp's (up to 2 tbsp.)of this to 32 oz of water for the (1st point)mister bottle or 8 tsp's/ gal for (2nd point)whole pot root soak has eliminated the bastards from my home.
It is not possible to simply spray these vermin, one must completely submerge the root vessel, pot or container in this solution 5 minutes to overnight for this treatment to work.
The third point is yellow sticky traps.
Again. this alone does not guarantee FG/RA elimination but does round up many adults and hopefully prevents them from mating.
I started with the hugely expensive sticky traps you can buy at the hydro shop but settled on yellow beer cups ($2 for 50 at Big Lots) and shmear them up with Tanglefoot as a low cost sub.
The downside to any sticky trap is avoiding contact ( plants, tent, cab, lights, materials, clothes, YOU...) with it.
So the method is as follows:
1. Spray your plants with a mister bottle filled with 32 oz. of water and 2 tsp's(up to 2 tbsp.) of Dawn Ultra dishwashing liquid. Lemon Joy (manufactured by Dawn) has the added beni of repelling aphids.
This treatment will kill any adult, larval, pupa or egg of any insect out there since its action upon them is suffocation by drowning.
Caveat!
Depending upon plant sensitivity, insect development stage and species, you may wish to follow this treatment, after 5 min or so, with a pure water spray to wash off the soap.
Any spraying must be thorough, lots of insects hang out on the undersides of leaves so be sure to soak the entire plant.
2. Root soak.
Be sure to immerse the entire pot in a container filled with your soap solution for 5 min up to 8 hrs. (Again, this is dependent upon the caveat above).
3. Despite being a pain in the ass, sticky traps tend to "vacuum" the air around your plants.
I'm not sure if yellow is the best color but it works acceptably.
Experimentation is in order but please post your results.
To clear any misconceptions I may have unwittingly introduced, here is what works for me:
Typical indoor cab grow, cfl's, peat, perlite, vermiculite, etc...
2 tbsp./32 oz. H2O spray NO clear water follow up spray
8 hr soak, same soap/water ratio, clear water rinse.
Using Jobe's Science and Nature fert to restore healthy organic biozone AFTER treatment.
YMMV
That's all I have, dishwashing liquid is hardly organic I know, but seems much milder than outright chemical controls IMO.
(Hat tip to LDS Prepper on youtube for this tip)
Apologies to the international community here if this item is not available to you.
If you try to attempt this method using another brand of dishwashing soap, please avoid antibacterial soaps or agents other than surfactants, since the action employed is mechanical.
its in here. try the search this thread function.
also read the msds itll answer your question. never use a chemical like this without reading the msds. alkalinity is your enemy. rockwool perlite gypsum lime etc.
you could really hurt yourself or someone else if you dont read all the safety materials prior to opening the package.answer questions like what do i do if i spill the bucket . get it on my skin eyes nose etc. what do symptoms of toxicity look like. do i need a respirator. the msds takes five minutes to read.so do manufacturers instructions. forums can take hours and are filled with wrong or misleading info. this chemical is very dangerous in certain scenarios please make an effort to know why.
good luck
also read the msds itll answer your question. never use a chemical like this without reading the msds. alkalinity is your enemy. rockwool perlite gypsum lime etc.
you could really hurt yourself or someone else if you dont read all the safety materials prior to opening the package.answer questions like what do i do if i spill the bucket . get it on my skin eyes nose etc. what do symptoms of toxicity look like. do i need a respirator. the msds takes five minutes to read.so do manufacturers instructions. forums can take hours and are filled with wrong or misleading info. this chemical is very dangerous in certain scenarios please make an effort to know why.
good luck
