Donald Sterling owner of LA Clippers

[Hydrosun]

Bingo.

This is the exactly why the ACLU has become active in gun rights lawsuits. Although I'm sure that the whole 2nd Amendment concept is anathema to most of their members, it is a right that needs protection from people who consider their own path to be the only correct one for society.

There is no freedom of speech protections EXCEPT as against the government. This has been pointed out in this thread already, but to have a drum beat about freedom of speech on a PRIVATE site that SPECIFICALLY censors / disallows even NON COMMERCIAL speech from US (its membership) in these vary forums seems laughable.

If someone around here doesn't follow the PRIVATE rules of the site, they are banned. Why shouldn't the NBA have the same right of SELECTIVE association that ICMAG enjoys?

 

[gaiusmarius]

was there a signed contract? i thought it was a secret contract that has only just been revealed for the first time?

to me the fact that he was recorded while having a private discussion makes that discussion nobodies business.

either way i'm not trying to say which side is right in this, just saying that this whole thing has a precedent setting potential.

i do see both sides, just wish their reason for taking action against him wasn't a private convo.

 

[mojave green]

There is no freedom of speech protections EXCEPT as against the government. This has been pointed out in this thread already, but to have a drum beat about freedom of speech on a PRIVATE site that SPECIFICALLY censors / disallows even NON COMMERCIAL speech from US (its membership) in these vary forums seems laughable.

If someone around here doesn't follow the PRIVATE rules of the site, they are banned. Why shouldn't the NBA have the same right of SELECTIVE association that ICMAG enjoys?

that about sums that up, lol!

 

[festerous]

What did Donald Sterling say that was racist in this conversation?

 

[rives]

There is no freedom of speech protections EXCEPT as against the government. This has been pointed out in this thread already, but to have a drum beat about freedom of speech on a PRIVATE site that SPECIFICALLY censors / disallows even NON COMMERCIAL speech from US (its membership) in these vary forums seems laughable.

If someone around here doesn't follow the PRIVATE rules of the site, they are banned. Why shouldn't the NBA have the same right of SELECTIVE association that ICMAG enjoys?

I think that you are misinterpreting the first amendment a bit - the wording is actually "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech.....", but no, I said before that it isn't a freedom of speech issue. I was agreeing with GM's point that it is not the things that we agree with that need protecting - hence my example of the ACLU and the 2nd amendment. Also, in your ICMAG example, the ban should result from someone recording us extolling the virtues of a commercial product in a private coversation, sending it in to Skip, and having it result in our being banned. Seems a little ridiculous, doesn't it?

Again, as I said before, after the NBA released their formerly secret agreement, it became obvious that they had the legal right to these actions. Morally, however, I think they come up a bit short - it is a thought crime, where someone had no expectation of their words becoming public. The only real crime here was committed by Sterling's girlfriend. There is no defending his words, and that's not what I'm doing - he's an offensive old bastard. There is a very dangerous precedent being set in the US, like with the Mozilla exec who made a private donation to a legal cause and was forced out of his job for it years later. It's simply wrong.

 

[festerous]

Donald Sterling is a philanderer but I'm not at all convinced he is racist.

In brief a married man says to his mistress..

" I don't care who you fuck but please don't flaunt it in public or at my place of business , I have a reputation to protect.

Why because they are black?

What??? "

Nothing but a case of premeditated blackmail

 

[buttbrain]

It's a generation that has contributed SO much to the world.. unfortunately racism is one of those things..

 

[G.O. Joe]

She said she does not feel Sterling is racist, despite hearing him say derogatory things about minorities. "No," she said. "I don't believe that in my heart."

"I think the things he says are not what he feels. Anybody can say anything in the heat of the moment," she said. "I think Mr. Sterling is from a different generation than I am. I think he was brought up to believe those things. Segregation. Whites and blacks."

Still, she said, "Through his actions, he's shown he's not a racist. Through his actions, he's shown to be a generous and kind man."
http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/...geles-clippers-says-wishes-had-paid-woman-off

So this isn't about racism for her.

 

[bombadil.360]

Donald Sterling is a philanderer but I'm not at all convinced he is racist.

In brief a married man says to his mistress..

" I don't care who you fuck but please don't flaunt it in public or at my place of business , I have a reputation to protect.

Why because they are black?

What??? "

Nothing but a case of premeditated blackmail

I hear what you are saying, but nonetheless, he did say some pretty racist things.

for example, when he tried to profile her as "a light skinned Latina" or something like that; or when he said that her public association with black men was disrespectful to him and to the whole world that's pretty messed up if you asked me.

but yes, your point is also obvious, as imo, he was trying to get rid of her, and was using the whole instagram pic as an excuse to kick her to the curb; and in doing so, his racism came out, without him even noticing imo; she is not dumb either, and knew she was getting kicked to the curb, and tried to lead the conversation in a way where more of his racism would come out; that's why the guy was like "wtf" each time she tried to make the argument about race when in fact, in his head, the argument was about trying to break up with her; shit, even the scapegoat he used to break up with her was pretty racist: "I'm gonna break up with you because you uploaded a pic of yourself with a black man".

maybe he thought that was less insulting to her than telling her that she was annoying the living hell out of him...

 

[gaiusmarius]

There is no freedom of speech protections EXCEPT as against the government. This has been pointed out in this thread already, but to have a drum beat about freedom of speech on a PRIVATE site that SPECIFICALLY censors / disallows even NON COMMERCIAL speech from US (its membership) in these vary forums seems laughable.

If someone around here doesn't follow the PRIVATE rules of the site, they are banned. Why shouldn't the NBA have the same right of SELECTIVE association that ICMAG enjoys?

this argument would be valid except that the nba rules were secret!

should we have a secret set of rules too? would you like to be held to a set of rules you never saw or read? maybe we should start implementing the rules in your private life too?

 

[Hydrosun]

this argument would be valid except that the nba rules were secret!

should we have a secret set of rules too? would you like to be held to a set of rules you never saw or read? maybe we should start implementing the rules in your private life too?

The NBA rules were in no way secret. They were know to all members. Like many clubs with secret hand shakes, songs, and dances. Just because the clubs bylaws aren't public doesn't mean the 30 NBA owners where unaware of them. In point of fact the 30 NBA owners wrote, amend, and enforce the rules AGREED to by ALL owners. Just like ICmag if you don't follow the rules you can get kicked out of the club.

Again Sterling is not being held to a secret standard. He is being subjected to the terms of membership that HE AGREED to.

No I don't think that secret, arbitrary, or capricious rules have any place in a free society; but that is not the case here or with the NBA.

Now a question for all who would allow Sterling to retain ownership. If you are one of the other 29 owners and Mr. Sterling's actions are going to cause the value of your franchise to fall $100 million dollars, and cost you tens of millions of dollars in annual ticket sales and sponsorship and lower TV revenue, would you vote to kick him out and protect your investment?

 

[Stoner4Life]

the finger of discrimination and bias would forever be pointed @ Sterling, trades, draft choices, and especially the advancement or lack thereof of minorities working w/in his organization.

He might have a very valid reason for promoting a white guy ahead of a black man even though the black man might be in line for that promotion first, accusations and lawsuits would be the result, a continuous black eye for the nba.

 

[gaiusmarius]

many good points brought up and if he truly knew that the commisioner could do what he did for anything he considers to be detrimental to the league, he probably should have been more careful, on the other hand are we at the point now where every private word we speak is fair game to be recorded and used against one? this still bothers me, there should be a difference between private conversation and public speech.

but as Storm said, Karma is a bitch and this guy seems to have had it coming. i just wish it had been for his public actions and not for a private phone call secretly recorded. we will see, but he might actually be able to sue her for damages depending on what the laws are on recording a phone convo where it happened.

 

[shithawk420]

What gaiusmarius said.nail on head

 

[Hydrosun]

many good points brought up and if he truly knew that the commisioner could do what he did for anything he considers to be detrimental to the league, he probably should have been more careful, on the other hand are we at the point now where every private word we speak is fair game to be recorded and used against one? this still bothers me, there should be a difference between private conversation and public speech.

but as Storm said, Karma is a bitch and this guy seems to have had it coming. i just wish it had been for his public actions and not for a private phone call secretly recorded. we will see, but he might actually be able to sue her for damages depending on what the laws are on recording a phone convo where it happened.

The NFL suspended Jim Irsay for 30 days and fined him $100K because of alleged intoxicated driving. Irsay hurt no one and has been convicted of nothing, but the NFL code of conduct can still touch his wallet because he agreed to the membership agreement.

http://mmqb.si.com/2014/03/18/jim-irsay-roger-goodell/

This is a freedom of association issue (see 1st amendment of the US Constitution). The other 29 owners of the NBA have a vested interest in associating or not with Mr. Sterling. Donald Silver the commissioner of the NBA has no authority to force a sale, BUT if 75% of the ownership wants him out of their club, that is their right.

Augusta National Golf Club used to allow membership to white males ONLY. Public scrutiny forced the club to change its restrictions or face public humiliation and loss of TV revenues. The GA country club folded and now Condoleezza Rice, a black female, is a member.

I don't believe that private clubs should be forced to admit or revoke membership based on public opinion, however the economics of modern day Politically Correct society makes it very difficult to be openly discriminating.

The MLB forced Marge Schott to sell the Cincinnati Reds. She was never convicted of a crime, she was never recorded as a racist ****, but the damage she did to the MLB's image was enough for the rest of the league to force her out. All of Ms. Schott's racist comments were made in PRIVATE conversations.

To me it appears that what was good for the Goose, should be good for the Gander......

Now if Sterling and a few of his friends want to start the KKK of basketball leagues let them have at it, but he should not be able to devalue the net worth of 29 other individuals WITHOUT their consent.

Let him start an all male all Jewish country club for all I care, but don't argue that he has the RIGHT to be a member of ANY and ALL clubs in the world just because he can afford to pay the entry fee.

Management reserves the right to refuse service to ANYONE....

 

[Hydrosun]

PS. The law breaker is already being sued by the Sterling family for 1.8 Million dollars. In fact the Sterling law suite against a pennyless whore most likely lead the the release of the tapes (which her attorney CLAIMS were made by mutual consent, i.e. Sterling knew he was being recorded). Live by the sword die by the sword.

As Bomonte Jones said, this was a love triangle where they were all playing dirty. I have NO sympathy for any of the actors in this play.

PPS. We can't type out C.U.N.T. without it being censored (see above), so before freedom of unpopular speech is exteded to a billionaire, I would like to see it afforded to the membership of ICmag.

 

[gaiusmarius]

 

[Hydrosun]

True, but seeing both sides isn't always enough. Sometimes you are forced to pick a side and make a ruling, as a moderator you know this better than most.

How do you come down on the Sterling v NBA?

(A) Shall Sterling be able to maintain his ownership because ALL his actions were PRIVATE in the eyes of the LAW inadmissible.

(B) The NBA holds the RIGHT to revoke and reassign the Clipper's franchise, at fair market value.

(C) Pick your own reasoning, but please make a ruling; the players of the NBA are expressing an intent to boycott / strike in the case of non action.

 

[gaiusmarius]

i already said that he had this coming from what i've read recently about him, but i still wish it hadn't been a private phone call that lead to this instead of some of the more public things hes said and done.

 

[shithawk420]

Now that I know more of the story its obvious she manipulated him.sloots gonna sloot