Proper maturity for an Ace sativa - ignore the trichomes?

[k-s-p]

Great thread and I'm grateful for everyone's information. Does anyone look for what motaco calls mirror trichomes? I use the development of these along with other classic signs of flower maturation in sativas, although I don't like as much amber as motaco does. Obviously will vary between strains and individuals. Seems useful especially for those that don't have a microscope.

Ultimate Sativa Grow Thread Post #3

HARVESTING- CURING- AGING

Wait until she's ripe. It's really silly to grow a plant that flowers so long and harvest it when the stone is mild and undeveloped. Contrary to what you may have heard sativas should be harvested with the same amount of red hairs and color trichs as they look on any of your other plants. My personal harvest time is this. I am in love with what I call "mirror head" trichomes. When they turn from clear to amber there is a transition where they reflect sunlight like a mirror. When as many of them as possible are mirror I catch them before they decay to amber. They layout tends to be about 1/4 amber. half mirror, and 1/4 still semi clear. Thats when I like them.

 

[mayan]

Hey...thanks, Zandar, Terpene, and Pinkus...and k-s-p. Very helpful and will follow your advice. Respect!

 

[RandyCalifornia]

I don't wait for amber myself. I remember looking real close at the first and best Thai Sticks I saw in the early 70's, the resin was very amber. I also thought about how much handeling it had and how long that Thai stick was bundled up in a huge bale crossing the Pacific Ocean in a slow boat. I don't think it was amber when it was harvested, but it ambered up in alll that time it took till I was inspecting it.

Here's what I use to see my trich's Pentax 8.5 X 21 mm Papilio Binoculars http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-PTX62216-8-5-Papilio-Binoculars/dp/B0007TSYCK
They are great for seeing everything that's going on on your plants, mold, hermi, mites and trichomb opacity. I HIGHly recommend them.

 

[k-s-p]

I don't wait for amber myself. I remember looking real close at the first and best Thai Sticks I saw in the early 70's, the resin was very amber. I also thought about how much handeling it had and how long that Thai stick was bundled up in a huge bale crossing the Pacific Ocean in a slow boat. I don't think it was amber when it was harvested, but it ambered up in alll that time it took till I was inspecting it.

Here's what I use to see my trich's Pentax 8.5 X 21 mm Papilio Binoculars http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-PTX62216-8-5-Papilio-Binoculars/dp/B0007TSYCK
They are great for seeing everything that's going on on your plants, mold, hermi, mites and trichomb opacity. I HIGHly recommend them.

Hunh. I've got several pairs of nice binocs and never even considered that. Usually grab some leaf from a floral cluster with trics and throw it under a Leica MZ8.

As for the amber, I mean just beginning to pick up some gold but not dark; if I had to estimate I'd guess about 2% +/- when I cut. I like those to be at a minimum also.

 

[RandyCalifornia]

Hey k-s-p, the nice thing about the close focusing scopes is you can leave what you're looking at on the plant and watch it grow. I usually light up a joint and hang with my plants and scope em all the time to look for herms and bugs because my eyes just are not as good as they used to be. Once you get the hang of using these scopes you can see everything as it's going on. They've been a really great tool for me since I found out about them.

 

[Ranger]

I don't wait for amber myself. I remember looking real close at the first and best Thai Sticks I saw in the early 70's, the resin was very amber. I also thought about how much handeling it had and how long that Thai stick was bundled up in a huge bale crossing the Pacific Ocean in a slow boat. I don't think it was amber when it was harvested, but it ambered up in alll that time it took till I was inspecting it.

Here's what I use to see my trich's Pentax 8.5 X 21 mm Papilio Binoculars http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-PTX62216-8-5-Papilio-Binoculars/dp/B0007TSYCK
They are great for seeing everything that's going on on your plants, mold, hermi, mites and trichomb opacity. I HIGHly recommend them.

probably a good idea not going to too much amber. i have read of peer reviewed studies stating that if the trichomes go amber they have lost potency because amber color indicates degradation of THC-a. dunno what to think of that.

i let mine go clear and cloudy with sometimes just a couple amber but hopefully none amber is my goal.

 

[mayan]

Excellent suggestion, Randy CA. I'm gonna check 'em out. I've been using the classic 60-100 Radio Shack -effective but frustrating. I got four sats that are looking fat and happy and I would not be surprised to see 'em all down over the next three or so weeks. I'm going to try to use the synergistic approach - bud appearance, terpenes, leaf health, pistil production and resin glands. Sounds like these 'nocs will be a big plus.

 

[zachrockbadenof]

I don't wait for amber myself. I remember looking real close at the first and best Thai Sticks I saw in the early 70's, the resin was very amber. .

I tooo was smoking thai stick in the late 60's/ear 70's, but I never checked out a bud under a mic... I was too busy stuffing em into a bong...

 

[mayan]

I admit to being lazy but I have never charted the progress of resin glands from chop to dry to cure. Maybe once I get the above 'nocs, I will check out a well-cured bud to see predominant gland color.

 

[sanjuan]

Thanks for the Pentax link, RandyCA.
I just ordered a belated Xmas present to myself.

 

[pinkus]

Yeah RC those binocs look like a sight for my sore eyes... literally.

 

[MostlyMe]

probably a good idea not going to too much amber. i have read of peer reviewed studies stating that if the trichomes go amber they have lost potency because amber color indicates degradation of THC-a. dunno what to think of that.

i let mine go clear and cloudy with sometimes just a couple amber but hopefully none amber is my goal.

Read back this thread, you might get convinced to avoid even cloudy.

 

[k-s-p]

I don't wait for amber myself. I remember looking real close at the first and best Thai Sticks I saw in the early 70's, the resin was very amber. I also thought about how much handeling it had and how long that Thai stick was bundled up in a huge bale crossing the Pacific Ocean in a slow boat. I don't think it was amber when it was harvested, but it ambered up in alll that time it took till I was inspecting it.

Here's what I use to see my trich's Pentax 8.5 X 21 mm Papilio Binoculars http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-PTX62216-8-5-Papilio-Binoculars/dp/B0007TSYCK
They are great for seeing everything that's going on on your plants, mold, hermi, mites and trichomb opacity. I HIGHly recommend them.

Thanks Randy, those are great and I'm getting a pair. Great idea. They're like the love child of my Leica and Swifts Best vibes!

 

[Claude Hopper]

I love this thread. I've not played with sub 12 hour days before but after this thread I kicked my cycle to 11-13 for my Golden Tigers.

 

[chappie]

What a great thread! (Thanks Mayan, for calling it to my attention)

I had not even realized that I had also been struggling with this... I've had some sativa-heavy strains that just would not amber up, and I kept thinking I was doing something wrong. However, I do know the "mirroring" that motaco means. I am relieved to hear so many apparently wizened growers throwing the conventional mythology to the wind and doing what works.

I've been focussing on the DJ genes and threads, but looks like this is a nice new home.

 

[chappie]

I read this whole thread and didn't see reference to this (though I could have easily missed it given how dense this thread is):

I was never able to get a Juicy Fruit Highland Thai to "over mature". I took one to almost twenty weeks into its flower cycle and she just kept pumping it out. Outdoors, one was taken in early-mid December from a greenhouse. The only difference was that the later harvest was a more stony, body high.

-- DJ Short, in this article

http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/1511.html

Just thought it was worth noting.

 

[de145]

I read this whole thread and didn't see reference to this (though I could have easily missed it given how dense this thread is):



-- DJ Short, in this article

http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/1511.html

Just thought it was worth noting.

Thanks Chappie, nice article!

 

[Riddleme]

Found this thread while doing a bit of research, I'm working on a book to detail things that I have discovered in the last 5 years of some serious experimenting and a lot of the stuff I do or have found to work applies to this thread so I thought I would share some of with you for your consideration?

I guess that you could call me the early amber guy LOL as that is the quest I have been on for all these years and I have it down pretty good as I have brought it out in several strains, 3 of my own, yes I breed, Pineapple Express and Durban Poison both showed in week 6 of flower.

I recently acquired several landrace selections including Dalat, Zamal, Komaoni as well as ACE Zamaldelica and Golden Tiger which I have not grown yet but if I am able to bring out early amber in any of them I will share that here when it happens.

I read the DJ Short stuff about playing with light timings and did just that and landed on 11:20/12:40 as the best light timing to bring out Sat features in hybrids (naturally your mileage may vary) The other thing I do that most don't (or won't) is I use T5's to flower, I have a 1000 watts (16 bulbs x 54 watts) in a setup I call the Tanning Booth that has a mix of several different bulbs which is why I went this way in the first place because I wanted to be able to tweak the spectrum.

I have 4 Plantmax 6500K bulbs, 8 GE 4100K bulbs, 3 ATI True Actinic (UVB) bulbs, and 3 ATI Coral Plus bulbs. It was the addition of the UVB bulbs that that brought out the early amber, the Coral bulbs have a bit of UVB at the bottom but basically offer up a deep blue that simply increased tric production (a lot).

The final ingredient is sulfur !!! I grow in peat with a 50/50 mix of calcined clay (Tapla's gritty mix) and I use chem nutes from JR Peters. I started years ago using his 20-10-20 Peat Lite Special and about 2 years ago he introduced a new nute that was 20-10-20 Citrus FeED, it was identical to the peat lite with one addition 4.9% sulfur. I started seeing early amber as soon as I made the switch and I started playin with it. In my research I found that Sulfates are readily available to the plant and have no toxicity problems. So instead of a Cal/Mag supplement, I use gypsum (calcium sulfate) and epsom (magnesium sulfate) in very small quantity (1/8 teaspoon to a gallon) I also use potassium sulfate in the last few weeks of flower. A couple of months ago Jack introduced a new nute called Aquagold Finisher that has 9% sulfur and the plants are loving it !!! (note: currently the only way to get it is to order from JR Peters direct, it is $28 + shipping for a 25 lb bag ).

I realize that this thread is about ignoring the trics in ACE sats but my thing was knowing that a rare trait exist in Sats for the early amber gene that is only found in very high potent variety's (some speculate that it is a sign of more THCV the trippy cannabinoid). For plants that show this trait the amber is a sign of peak THC and they turn red when starting to decay, like I said it is a rare trait.

The high from these plants is incredible, slow creep, no ceiling, no tolerance issues, very up, energetic, trippy, some racy, no couchlock.

First pic is my Colorado Thunderfuck (no relation to Alaska) it is my Namaste X Pineapple Express in week 5 of flower showing over 50% amber. Second pic is same plant in week 8 of flower (I harvest it after 9 weeks)

 

[Riddleme]

I'll share a few more pics here to show other strains, 1st pic is a Pineapple Express in week 6 of flower and 2nd pic is a Durban Poison in week 6 of flower

 

[Riddleme]

I have made up a pic that details how the trics go from amber to red so there is no confusion