General Hydroponic vs Advanced. How different would PPMs be?

[Snype]

Sounds like you understand that 400 PPM is a problem now that you are using GH. I used to use 4" cubes for years (you know that) and I hate them. I'd much rather use 3x3x4" cubes instead and put them in 8" pots of hydroton. I also did that for years and it was pretty great but adds slightly more work because you have to transplant into pots and wash hydroton but your plants will be much better.

I have ChemDD plants right now in 2x4' Ebb and Flow Trays in VEG. There are 15 plants per tray in 5" net pots which are very small. They barely fit any hydroton and they are getting over 1.5 EC / 750 TDS and are mad healthy and grow real fast. The point is that I am using much smaller lights and they can still handle 750 TDS and I flood every hour which they really love. Hopefully you figure out what your problems are.

 

[TREE KING]

Sounds like you understand that 400 PPM is a problem now that you are using GH. I used to use 4" cubes for years (you know that) and I hate them. I'd much rather use 3x3x4" cubes instead and put them in 8" pots of hydroton. I also did that for years and it was pretty great but adds slightly more work because you have to transplant into pots and wash hydroton but your plants will be much better.

I have ChemDD plants right now in 2x4' Ebb and Flow Trays in VEG. There are 15 plants per tray in 5" net pots which are very small. They barely fit any hydroton and they are getting over 1.5 EC / 750 TDS and are mad healthy and grow real fast. The point is that I am using much smaller lights and they can still handle 750 TDS and I flood every hour which they really love. Hopefully you figure out what your problems are.

yeah when it comes to gh i think your right but i still think the ph perfect sensi 2 part can be used at a much lower ec. you seen it with your own eyes on the nag champa it had tip burn while cloning at 150 ppm. now that im tryin out gh im gonna have to dial in everything all over again so thanks for the help. it seems easy to use so far though its harder to burn the plants which is the reason i wanted to try it in the first place. what ppm are you running in your cloner?

 

[Snype]

yeah when it comes to gh i think your right but i still think the ph perfect sensi 2 part can be used at a much lower ec. you seen it with your own eyes on the nag champa it had tip burn while cloning at 150 ppm. now that im tryin out gh im gonna have to dial in everything all over again so thanks for the help. it seems easy to use so far though its harder to burn the plants which is the reason i wanted to try it in the first place. what ppm are you running in your cloner?

I can't come to a conclusion that the plants were burned in the cloner personally. But to answer your question, I run 20 mL Micro and 30 mL Bloom in the cloner. On top of that I also use 3 mL SuperThrive. Not sure what the PPM of the solution is but I would estimate it at 250 TDS / 0.5 EC.

 

[Coconutz]

Ive had some tips burn/brown while cloning with just tap water with some rooting powder on the stem.
I doubt any base nute could cause nute burn at 150ppm.
When they are trying to root they are eating stored nutrients in the leaves.
Were you using the powerclone solution at 150ppm or base?
Its all about tap water.

 

[TREE KING]

Ive had some tips burn/brown while cloning with just tap water with some rooting powder on the stem.
I doubt any base nute could cause nute burn at 150ppm.
When they are trying to root they are eating stored nutrients in the leaves.
Were you using the powerclone solution at 150ppm or base?
Its all about tap water.

50 ppm of powerclone and 100 ppm of sensi 2 part. as the res got depleted it could of ended up at 175. snype can you ever admit to anything anyone could see those tips were burned. heres a pic you just posted of the same clone in your farm thread and theres burnt tips everywhere that clone is sensitive to nutes.
everytime i tell you a clone is sensitive to nutes you never believe me. people in your thread even told you to lighten up on the nutes after you posted this pic. appreciate the info on the ppm

 

[Snype]

50 ppm of powerclone and 100 ppm of sensi 2 part. snype can you ever admit to anything anyone could see those tips were burned. heres a pic you just posted of the same clone in your farm thread and theres burnt tips everywhere that clone is sensitive to nutes.
everytime i tell you a clone is sensitive to nutes you never believe me. appreciate the info on the ppm

Just because a plant looks burt to you from nutrients doesn't actually mean that is actually the case. A "tip burn" on a plant can mean many other things besides nutrient burn. I can't look at a plant like that and come to a conclusion so fast. There are too many other variables to look at in combination. If I look at my Illuminati's right now you will see what looks like slight burn on some leaves but it is not a burn from nutrients, it is a slight pH problem. Like stated before from coconuts, 150 PPM isn't going to burn anything.

 

[TREE KING]

i give up i can never win lol we'll just agree to disagree

 

[Coconutz]

Tap water in coco, not nute burn... Just eating the leaves until it roots I guess...
Once the leaves started to yellow I knew it had roots and hit full strength and they turned green.

 

[TREE KING]

[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=49720&pictureid=1161962&thumb=1]View Image[/URL]

Tap water in coco, not nute burn... Just eating the leaves until it roots I guess...
Once the leaves started to yellow I knew it had roots and hit full strength and they turned green.

every time i notice this tip burn in the cloner the same thing happens real easily in veg after transplant. that is why snype has that tip burn in veg. also that clone is sensitive to nutes. ive had alot of strains get tip burn in my cloner at 200 ppm and then on the next run i try 150 ppm and then the burning never happens. i think the only way you'l understand is if you try the ph perfect. im about to try floranova for the first time in the cloner im curious to see how everything turns out. im guessing i can go alot higher with the ppm like snype does. i suggest you read homebrewers thread too that i posted you dont have to read the whole shit you can skip to the part before the chop. the conni totally fried the plants at 1.2 ec when the other crop was healthy with dyna grow

 

[Coconutz]

Ive read homebrewers thread.
Like I said urea will burn more easily and con is higher in N to begin with.
Really trashy product!
Ever tried just tap water?

 

[TREE KING]

Ive read homebrewers thread.
Like I said urea will burn more easily and con is higher in N to begin with.
Really trashy product!
Ever tried just tap water?

you could be right Coconutz but than you would admit that you would use a lower ppm with conni right?

thats what this thread is about im just tryin to make a point that you dont keep the same ppm with all nutes. even if you call advanced nutes customer service they will tell you that when using conni you should use it at 25% lower ppm than the regular sensi. i gotta say though ive seen some crazy ill colas with people using conni so there is some people that arent having problems with it i just think homebrewer didnt wanna lower the conni in the side by side. your making alot of good points i just cant wait to do a side by side with the ph perfect and floranova. i really want FN to win to be honest cause its easier to use plus its a one part

 

[Coconutz]

I wouldnt use it even if it was given to me for free.
I would just go buy cheap bottles of GH & feed my plants 6/9 in coco and be done with it.
Its really the easiest thing in the world as long as you keep the coco moist!

 

[TREE KING]

I wouldnt use it even if it was given to me for free.
I would just go buy cheap bottles of GH & feed my plants 6/9 in coco and be done with it.
Its really the easiest thing in the world as long as you keep the coco moist!

coconutz work with me here this isnt about what you personally would or wouldnt use. to ask the question in a different way would you admit that if homebrewer used the conni in his side by side at a lower ppm than his plants would be less fried which means he would of gotten better results/yields?

 

[Coconutz]

coconutz work with me here this isnt about what you would or wouldnt use. to ask the question in a different way would you admit that if homebrewer used the conni in his side by side at a lower ppm than his plants would be less fried which means he would of gotten better results/yields?

I dont know... Its quite possible had he lowered his solution he may have had deficiencies of other minerals.
Homebrewer is a good grower. Im sure if he felt it would be best to back off he would have.
He didnt make enough posts for me to have any idea what all he was seeing, but the thread was good to show that Con gives your plant too much of one element, from what I could see, and like I said, it could have been lacking specific elements that left him with no other choice but to leave it at that concentration.
What I do know for certain is there is no reason to mess around with that stuff. There are so many cheaper alternatives on the market that have been proven over time. Its just not worth the hassle to buy into the cute labels and hype.
Im telling you we get it done with 6/9 and a $30 gallon of silica that lasts forever, thats it. I hit them with kabloom once every couple of weeks.
With the cost of electricity Im thinking about going even cheaper just to cut costs wherever possible.

 

[TREE KING]

I dont know... Its quite possible had he lowered his solution he may have had deficiencies of other minerals.
Homebrewer is a good grower. Im sure if he felt it would be best to back off he would have.
He didnt make enough posts for me to have any idea what all he was seeing, but the thread was good to show that Con gives your plant too much of one element, from what I could see, and like I said, it could have been lacking specific elements that left him with no other choice but to leave it at that concentration.
What I do know for certain is there is no reason to mess around with that stuff. There are so many cheaper alternatives on the market that have been proven over time. Its just not worth the hassle to buy into the cute labels and hype.
Im telling you we get it done with 6/9 and a $30 gallon of silica that lasts forever, thats it.
With the cost of electricity Im thinking about going even cheaper just to cut costs wherever possible.

i dont wanna mess with it im just tryin to make a point. theres alot of people that use conni with fabulous results but they need to be very carefull or the plants will get burned to a crisp. im just tryin to say you have to run it lower than other nutes. if you research it you will hear other people say the same thing. if we can just come to an agreement on this we wont have to talk about it anymore. im not sayin its better than gh

 

[Coconutz]

The people who get good results probably use all sorts of supplements they wouldnt need if they used a complete base
I suggest you dont waste your time with a side by side. Just cut your losses and throw that shit waya.
Go with what works without the hassle.

 

[TREE KING]

your missin the point forget it

 

[Snype]

your missin the point forget it

I can see what you are saying about having to use less because of the Urea or whatever it's called but comparing 700+ with GH and 300-400 TDS with AN still doesn't make sense. So maybe you are the one missing the point. Just because you may have to use a little less PPM of AN compared to GH but not half the amount.

You said you still had to lower the PPM with GH as well. The point is why does Tree King have to use a lower PPM than every other grower esp when he is using multiple 1,000 watts lights? And that's the real problem to me. You are not going to get everything out of the plant at 400 PPM unless you are talking about some real sensitive sativa but you are growing heavy feeding Chemdawg varieties.

If I put clones in a cloner with no nutes and I see tip burn, it's not from too much nutes. That's one other thing you seem to be missing is not all problems look the same.

Just because you may be right about having to use a lower PPM with AN doesn't mean that you have to add half strength or less. You see every other AN grower using more PPM than you and not having your problems. You also said that you had to lower your PPM with GH as well so that show's that the problem is with you and your conditions. So you may be right about having to use less PPM with AN but not as low as you go. You can't say you have to use less with AN and then turn around and use the same PPM with GH.

 

[TREE KING]

i dont know if its the urea or not id have to run tests to find out i was just tryin to make a point and homebrewers thread proves it as far as im concerned. if it is though it makes sense ive always had problems with seeing tip burn very easily and its real fuckin annoying. if i can run AN 25% less than GH and get the same yields il have my answer. ive ran 300 ppm in flower with sensi and had 4-5 oz of dense buds on 1 plant in the same cubes before and the weed was good. also i know what i see in the cloner ive had plenty of strains get tip burn at 200-225 ppm with sensi. its just annoying cause you seen it with your own eyes. keep in mind all these numbers dont include the water which is an extra 95 ppm. your right though i had problems with gh being too low im just not sure if it was the same problem. really wanna do a side by side and figure this out. not really much more to talk about il let you know how the gh goes. im liking what i see so far as soon as i raised the ppm the plnts looks better with buds developing faster. love the ease of it. next time im gonna raise the nutes alot faster from the beginning

 

[reg24]

I just mixed my cano3 with 1 L of water and geT ec 1.2 1.4
That was .71 grams total elemental 235 ppm

Then I mixed .46 grams of mkp with 1 L of water and get ec 0.6 0.8
.46 g of mkp is also total elemental of 235 ppm

So me tinks it ratios of metals to others on periodic table

Reg