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scai
Yeah! That's about worst that can happen to you.... 
Tutorial Organics for Beginners
- Thread starter BurnOne
- Start date
I have been using that same mix except with peat moss and have noticed severe drying out if I don't stay on top of the watering late into flower. I'm switching over to coir because I found it in a local nursery and hoped that this would mitigate the drying issues I have had; it is a royal pain in the ass to be held hostage by your plants, not being able to leave them for even 24 hours alone.
I will try a modified mix. I grow only Indica/Indica dominant hybrids and I know they are lighter feeders that require less drainage than their Sativa counterparts so I am thinking a 5 coir : 3 casting : 2 perlite, any thoughts? I also had the idea to incorporate those water absorbing crystals (http://watergelcrystals.com/) right into my soil mix at the beginning of the cycle. This with a decent layer of mulch I'm hoping to cut down on the plants watering needs.
Has anybody used these before with marijuana? Thanks for all your reading and help. This forum is really above and beyond others of similar subject matter.
J
jaded1
Tamjee,my mix is 40 coco,25 ewc,15 top-soil and 20 perlite and still need to water at longest every day and a half.With the warmer summer temps,they have to be watered every day.
Haven't used those crystals but cant see anything wrong with them,would go easy with though,just till you can gauge how they work.
Haven't used those crystals but cant see anything wrong with them,would go easy with though,just till you can gauge how they work.
Outdoor, guerilla growers frequently use the water crystals. I assume they'd work fine indoors.
When I was growing w/chems I used coco because it tended to dry faster than peat so I'd water it more, more like a hydro-type grow. I'm surprised your peat mix is drying out so fast. How big are your pots? Do you live in an area of low RH?
When I was growing w/chems I used coco because it tended to dry faster than peat so I'd water it more, more like a hydro-type grow. I'm surprised your peat mix is drying out so fast. How big are your pots? Do you live in an area of low RH?
make sure your peat is properly wetted all the way through as it is often hard to re-wet thoroughly after its dried out , stand the container in a deep saucer of water for an hour or so.
i would go light on the crystals, they expand a lot and can turn your soil into something like frog spawn if you add too many especially in a pot. something like calcined clay or pumice might be a better aeration amendment for you than perlite for you as it holds more water. topsoil also holds water better than peat so that should help. 20% is what i use too.
personally i would use peat over coco any day for a 'mixed' organic soil, other like the coco so you may too. coco is a great medium for chem grows like john says but i dont think its just interchangeable for peat in an organic mixed soil because it does different things to the nutrient availability etc.
VG
i would go light on the crystals, they expand a lot and can turn your soil into something like frog spawn if you add too many especially in a pot. something like calcined clay or pumice might be a better aeration amendment for you than perlite for you as it holds more water. topsoil also holds water better than peat so that should help. 20% is what i use too.
personally i would use peat over coco any day for a 'mixed' organic soil, other like the coco so you may too. coco is a great medium for chem grows like john says but i dont think its just interchangeable for peat in an organic mixed soil because it does different things to the nutrient availability etc.
VG
I see people using coco as a direct switch in organics and I cringe.
The Cation Exchange Capacity is much lower and it also messes with nutrient availability....
Anyways, here is an interesting read with photo's
http://www.usu.edu/cpl/PDF/CoconutCoirPaper.pdf
J
jaded1
Why is it so cringe worthy?Cant people have a different way of doing things?
Having grown both in peat(still use it outside)and coir,i get better results in coir mixes.
Having grown both in peat(still use it outside)and coir,i get better results in coir mixes.
It's just an opinion, jaded1. Try not to take them too seriously.
What is better about your coir mixes compared to your peat mix? How do you define better? I've used both so I'm curious what you noticed that made you side with coco.
There's nothing wrong with a different way of doing things... but what if the different way isn't as productive or effective? Then what?
If this was the hydro forum, you'd have a much better case. But in the organic soil forum, for our purposes, peat > coco.
As MHG mentioned, the CEC is largely the deciding factor in this instance.
What is better about your coir mixes compared to your peat mix? How do you define better? I've used both so I'm curious what you noticed that made you side with coco.
There's nothing wrong with a different way of doing things... but what if the different way isn't as productive or effective? Then what?
If this was the hydro forum, you'd have a much better case. But in the organic soil forum, for our purposes, peat > coco.
As MHG mentioned, the CEC is largely the deciding factor in this instance.
Grown both full organic? I was a huge coco fan when I was using chems but it doesn't transfer to organic. Gotta go with peat as the primary but I do toss a bit of coco into my mixes. Old habits die hard I guess plus I've got a big brick to use up.
Best of luck.
jaded, as i said some people prefer coco, but the point was that i dont think you can take exactly the same mix/amendments thats got say 50% peat and then use 50% coco instead. a coco mix has to be built with the coco and its properties in mind imo.
basically i feel the coco tries to compost itself in a 'live' soil. it does make for a good light texture though.
would love to hear more about organic coco mixes that have worked well for people
VG
edit, its also worth noting that Peat is not certified for organics in the UK
basically i feel the coco tries to compost itself in a 'live' soil. it does make for a good light texture though.
would love to hear more about organic coco mixes that have worked well for people
VG
edit, its also worth noting that Peat is not certified for organics in the UK
G
greenmatter
^^^^^^ word!!!!
i don't think that anybody has really done an unbiased paper on anything EVER. i would like to read a paper where the best coco and the best peat growers went head to head with the same,but several different methods and/or nutes and see how things shake out
IMHO no grow media can ever or will ever be the best grow media for any and every situation. there are NO absolutes in this game (or any other game)
J
jaded1
What verdant said was right,in that you cant treat coir the same but there's not any drastic difference.Also when he said about the coir breaking down in the mix,this is true.
What i like about coir is the amount of roots i can fit in a pot without them being root bound and the speed at which those roots grow.It can be a little slow in veg as they seem to put more energy into the rootzone that above it but really shines in flower.
I will put up my mix but i wouldn't recommend anyone using it as it is made with the hard tap water i use in mind.
My mix is 40/25/15/20,coir,ewc,topsoil,perlite
To 40 litres of mix i add 1 cup neemseed meal,the same of kelp,100 grams of comfrey pellets,6 cups of rock dust,2 tbsp calcium carbonate,the same of epsom salts and a tbsp of high p guano.
Having grown in coir with chems,peat based organic mixes and coir mixes,i get better results than both the other methods with my coir mix.Am not trying to say that it will work for anyone else but it works for me!
What i like about coir is the amount of roots i can fit in a pot without them being root bound and the speed at which those roots grow.It can be a little slow in veg as they seem to put more energy into the rootzone that above it but really shines in flower.
I will put up my mix but i wouldn't recommend anyone using it as it is made with the hard tap water i use in mind.
My mix is 40/25/15/20,coir,ewc,topsoil,perlite
To 40 litres of mix i add 1 cup neemseed meal,the same of kelp,100 grams of comfrey pellets,6 cups of rock dust,2 tbsp calcium carbonate,the same of epsom salts and a tbsp of high p guano.
Having grown in coir with chems,peat based organic mixes and coir mixes,i get better results than both the other methods with my coir mix.Am not trying to say that it will work for anyone else but it works for me!
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J
jaded1
As you can see,all healthy,non deficient plants!
nice pics jaded1,
i also use an organic mix with coco base. at the moment my mix is like this:
55% coco
20% perlite
25% compost / earth worm castings mix
added talbourne organics 2-3-2 bonemeal mix with trace elements
added turbogrow trace elements
added diatomic earth
added dolomite lime
seems to be working fine for a few weeks and then when i start to see N drop i feed with biobizz grow or fish mix, in flower i use biobizz bloom + some grow if its early in flowering still. sometimes i top feed with some bat guano for strains that like a lot of phosphorous.
i have been doing this for quite a while now, about 5 years with no problems, changing the mix slightly each time. i used to have a problem with magnesium very early on but since i started adding the turbo grow i have not had any major deficiencies.
what i like about this method is that as the nitrogen starts to become depleted and im feeding with liquid nutrients the control over the starvation period at the end of flower becomes quite easy. i just feed water no nutrients and the plants yellow out nicely. when i was using a subcool super soil recipe i found that at the end of flower there were still too many available nutrients and a starvation period was more under the plants control and less in my control. some plants starve themselves easily at the end of flower and its not a problem but there are those couple of plants always that will just keep trying to make more bud and continue flowering - mostly the sativa dominant ones.
i also use an organic mix with coco base. at the moment my mix is like this:
55% coco
20% perlite
25% compost / earth worm castings mix
added talbourne organics 2-3-2 bonemeal mix with trace elements
added turbogrow trace elements
added diatomic earth
added dolomite lime
seems to be working fine for a few weeks and then when i start to see N drop i feed with biobizz grow or fish mix, in flower i use biobizz bloom + some grow if its early in flowering still. sometimes i top feed with some bat guano for strains that like a lot of phosphorous.
i have been doing this for quite a while now, about 5 years with no problems, changing the mix slightly each time. i used to have a problem with magnesium very early on but since i started adding the turbo grow i have not had any major deficiencies.
what i like about this method is that as the nitrogen starts to become depleted and im feeding with liquid nutrients the control over the starvation period at the end of flower becomes quite easy. i just feed water no nutrients and the plants yellow out nicely. when i was using a subcool super soil recipe i found that at the end of flower there were still too many available nutrients and a starvation period was more under the plants control and less in my control. some plants starve themselves easily at the end of flower and its not a problem but there are those couple of plants always that will just keep trying to make more bud and continue flowering - mostly the sativa dominant ones.
My tent has six 3gal pots. All of the plants started in Big city hydro mix(washed Coco with lava rock and perlite) in 1-2 gal pots fed with dr earth nitro big. 4 were transplanted into Lc's mix #2(promix hp) while 2 were planted in more big city hydro mix with a bottom layer of Lc's mix #2. Since then they have been fed with recipe #3. I can't really tell if the 2 with coco are doing better or worse
maybe being a little more specific might help get an answer?
if it's finished compost; it's compost & can sub for 50% of the EWC component in a mix
if you feed it to worms; when they are done, it can be your EWC
afroman25
Member
sorry for the vague discription, but yes its finished compost. the bag says it organic. i would just go with the mushroom compost, but this stuff is on sale at my local nursery
hey guys, my next grow will be 100% organic and I want to eventually stop buying branded nutrients and use what nature has to offer.
I am a complete newbie to the organic nutrients way so pls bare with my questions. and here comes the first one
The other day i was walking on the beach and collected some sea shells and washed up sea weed of different types. I have soaked them in cold water for 5 days now to remove the salt.
Do you think its a good idea to use these in the soil? if yes, which is the best practice?
I am a complete newbie to the organic nutrients way so pls bare with my questions. and here comes the first one
The other day i was walking on the beach and collected some sea shells and washed up sea weed of different types. I have soaked them in cold water for 5 days now to remove the salt.
Do you think its a good idea to use these in the soil? if yes, which is the best practice?
