lack of good discussion about (guerilla) soil

[Tiami]

I don't know maybe you all already have prepared your holes and watching organic metter decomposing, or is it that oudoor season is still far away..but I'm surprised how quiet the OD forums is lately. or everyone is sticking to Tom Hills thread and his methods? I can't see any discussion in Organics thread either which would be to much worth to guerilla.

so what's up you guerilla farmers?! ICM is a nice place but sometimes it feels like people are afraid to talk. I learned a lot from reading and discussing this metter on forums. I went through Tom Hills thread (or Butte's) and there's plenty of good info and you can learn a lot but many of his methods are impossible in guerilla farming. how can we learn from those guys and transfere thier knowledge for guerilla.. you still think a pound is impossible?

 

[Nunsacred]

Tiami, it might be that getting fussy about soil
is inappropriate in guerilla grows.

This is how I see it, anyway.
I had a nice half pound plant last year with no soil prep at all.
I just make sure the ones growing successfully get some top dressing with fish blood bone powder and that's about all.

For me and many other experienced GGers, site prep is often wasted work and effort, better spent putting more plants in different places.

I know this isn't what you want to hear but it's the truth.

 

[offthehook]

Guerilla spots just happen to get better in time with proper management.

Eg. doing a PH/EC mesurement every once a while and adjust it to the right standard of what's needed for the next season.

Furthermore I am with Nunsacred.

 

[Littleleaf]

Cow pies have allways done me very well. Just about every were you go,there they are.Just laying there ripe for the picking. The older the better. Mix them in and plant away.

Allso I look for abandoned farms with pens and bermuda grass growing. For reasions I don't realy know cannabis and bermuda grass like the same soil type.

 

[Tiami]

Tiami, it might be that getting fussy about soil
is inappropriate in guerilla grows.

This is how I see it, anyway.
I had a nice half pound plant last year with no soil prep at all.
I just make sure the ones growing successfully get some top dressing with fish blood bone powder and that's about all.

For me and many other experienced GGers, site prep is often wasted work and effort, better spent putting more plants in different places.

I know this isn't what you want to hear but it's the truth.

yes I know what you're saying. that's what I plan to do this spring too, more plants in different places.

but that being the absolute truth..there is no such thing. it might be the truth for you and your situation and your location. for example in my location, (tiny island with very few people (but big bastards) where I have vinyards) I'm very limited to where I could plant. there are perfect spots around but no way I wouldn't catch attention from my neighburs. that leaves me with spots around my house, where I'm feeling comfortable to grow. then I'm not planting in spots where the soil is shallow, no metter how secure and sunny they are. which further limits my choices. my situation, for sure, isn't die hard guerilla, I'm pretty much able to visit my spots on daily basis but it's still guerilla for me. and if I will risk my ass, I rather risk it for more. a couple of days or a week of work doesn't meen much to me, as a metter of fact I enjoy it.

 

[Tiami]

Guerilla spots just happen to get better in time with proper management.

Eg. doing a PH/EC mesurement every once a while and adjust it to the right standard of what's needed for the next season.

Furthermore I am with Nunsacred.

I don't do pH tests. but that's probably because I know local soil is in acceptable range (slightly sweet). also I don't use lime in my mix.

I keep things simple. for me the most important thing is to enrich unfertile (but great medium for air/drainage) sandy soils with organic metter. weed groes like crazy in sands from my experience. this year I'm planning to push it a little further with my soilmix.

 

[Tiami]

Cow pies have allways done me very well. Just about every were you go,there they are.Just laying there ripe for the picking. The older the better. Mix them in and plant away.

Allso I look for abandoned farms with pens and bermuda grass growing. For reasions I don't realy know cannabis and bermuda grass like the same soil type.

no cows at least 100 miles around me.

but donky, goat and sheep shit works also..

 

[Littleleaf]

As long it's very old and their grass fed.

So I guess no cow tipping

no cows at least 100 miles around me.

but donky, goat and sheep shit works also..

 

[crfhonda]

The key to guerilla growing is slow release fertilizers mixed in with the soil and lime. I use advanced nutes spring, summer, and fall slow release blends. I do not have the option of visiting my sites a lot so this is the most effective method for me. I can easily get 2-3 ounces per plant guerilla style.

 

[offthehook]

If it's so easy for you to maintain your plants than better forget about all guerilla growing methodes T.

Get yourselves the Bio bizz line: bio grow, bio bloom algea-mac & top max.

You will have to feed them once a week.

Consider it like doing an indoor grow and you will get best results.

Guerilla is something completely different Tiami.

Guerilla to me means; Remote locations only to be reached by helicoper or on foot, resembling a kind of 'trap line' to look after.
In there you got to be clever about ones energy resources yanno,

Vinyards, sweet ph, sandy soil, own property ... Ma man. your settled to rock n roll with just some bio nutes imvoh .


Your other option would be to make compost from all the different types of animal dung you got laying around by mixing it in with about 80% to 90% potting soil*, let it sit for one year or longer while keeping it moist before use.

You then fill your holes with alternating shovels of this stuff and some of the local soil from the hill besides your pit.

Bigger hole = better.

You said something about 'shallow soil'? you mean you got big rocks everywhere ?
In that case, plastic lining dug in untill you hit the rocks and all around your raised beds work best.
You can let the plastic go over the rocky 'floor' but leave a large, uncovered patch in the centre for drain.
Most of the roots will remain inside your prime quality soil this way.




*percentage depending on strain and amount of seeds to start from.

 

[Tiami]

hey offthehook I hope you're not mad at me.

I wouldn't go into what's the real guerilla discussion. I said I don't consider my grow to be a die hard GG. but it's far from being common gardening too. sometimes it would be easier for my nerves if I had plants far from my house. and those spots are not on my property anyway. not too much space for mistakes believe me. apart from that and the fact that the island is in the midle of nowhere, ganja eating rats and three months of total drought, pure rock'n'roll..

back to the topic. good advice there especially about compost but why mix it with potting soil? I'm not sure if bio nutes is the way to go. impossible to feed the amount I'm planning on weekly basis. unfortunatly larger quantities of potting soil is no go

 

[offthehook]

hey offthehook I hope you're not mad at me.

OTH > Offcourse not. Just trying to help out.
You're just putting up some data to wich I try to respond in accordence.
My imagination tries to get a grip on your peticular situation and all the little bits you show on top allow me to peek into your situation more accuratly.
S'all good ma man, no need to define Guerilla per se.
I use to go by the mojo: Whatever works!

I may be a die hard Guerilly by my fruits, but on a social level I'm a total softy actually, lol (not weak, just largely understanding and cool with y'all)

In order to get shit done, my peticular situation calls for kicking my own ass at times, but it doesn't mean I 'd be urged doing the same towards ppl that can have it more easy. In fact, better to them!
Besides, carrying cubic meters of soil on ones back deep down into the forest can be as challenging as doing a guerilla right under the nose of some wacky neighbours.
I sure get your drift, no worries, lol

T > I wouldn't go into what's the real guerilla discussion. I said I don't consider my grow to be a die hard GG. but it's far from being common gardening too.

OTH > I noticed that ^^ In here, Some young guys are in a similar situation & will only do their jobs at night because of fear that their parents or neighbours might find out, lol

T > sometimes it would be easier for my nerves if I had plants far from my house. and those spots are not on my property anyway. not too much space for mistakes believe me. apart from that and the fact that the island is in the midle of nowhere, ganja eating rats and three months of total drought, pure rock'n'roll..

back to the topic. good advice there especially about compost but why mix it with potting soil?

OTH > Sorry for this shaggy answer: Because it works best! lol

(Prolly because it contains more air while the fibres in potting soil hold and spread the moist better. There's carbonic particles that offers an anchor for soil life to attach to, and prolly some more stuff that's bio chemicly related like for instance PH regulation)

T > I'm not sure if bio nutes is the way to go. impossible to feed the amount I'm planning on weekly basis. unfortunatly larger quantities of potting soil is no go

OTH > That will leave you with no other options left as to be growing rather compromised imo.

If you are on havily draining, sandy soil; with bio nutes you would be growing similar as one would do hydro on soil less media, but only with less frequent waterings.

With 4 x 5 liter packages, I doubt your argument will still be standing tho. That's a whole lot of plants you would be able to cover with that.^^

EG. If you look inside large greenhouse complexes like in spain, You'll notice plants beeing grown right into the poorest soil with just a nutes dripper besideds them.

So, if you can't get potting soil then that leaves you with no other option left as to mix your dung straight into your local soil.
It works to some extend, definatly not optimal, and takes at least one year to settle too.
After years & years of growing the same old plots, the old roots from your plants will turn it into 'potting soil' quality eventually all by itself

 

[Tiami]

thanks for a nice response man.

here's what I can use:
-worm castings
-dried manure pellets (3/3/2+Ca,Mg)
-high N guano
-high P guano
-a little of well rotten sheep manure probably 5 years old
-fresh chicken, sheep, donkey shit (which I wouldn't want to use)
-top soil, decomposed leaves, ashes etc..
-water cristals

this is similar what I used last year. this year I'd like to push it further nutrient wise. last year I dig huge holes but probably to deep. this year I will dig some 30 to 40cm deep but much wider. I'm planning a couple of big holes (2x2m) and some smallar too.

I don't think I can over do that mix, maybe with guano. holes will have two to three months to cool which is not ideal imo but probably enough. I plan to stick with manufactures aplication rates based on 1m square (maybe 10/20% more due to poor sandy soil). I won't have enough of worm castings, for sure, since it's recommended in 10 to 20% rates I believe. some 5 liters per 1m square is realistic. but with top soil and other organic metter it needs to be enough. what you think?

the seedling mix is giving me far more headaches, I don't have a clue about rates yet. last year I started in 1l pots, mix of sand, wc and some peat. they started well but after transplanting them into soil they exploded in growth. imo my starting mix was too light. this year I plan to start them in bigger pots, 3-5 liters, and transplant them directly into soil. this year I'd like them to grow faster so they would have developed root system once comes june and all drought. I plan to inoculate them with micorizhae as seedlings. but like I said this seedling mix is a bit more complicated to me.

 

[Buddah Watcha]

Nice thread!

Last year I did a more hardcore mix, that ended up being a bit too light. I guess I got too high before mixing the soil!

This year I'll be taking an easier approach.

Dig big holes, 25+ gal and use the following:
33% peat moss,
33% perlite,
33% compost, ill try to source free composted manure, otherwise i'll have to buy bagged.

With that i'll grab a box of Dr.Earth, or Plant tone product, which comes real cheap, use by the recommendations on the box and also some Rock Dust and Mycohizzae fungi to the mix.

Let it that sit on the holes for a few weeks before transplanting the plants out!

I'll top dress with guanos during the season to keep things looking good!

If anyone have any tips or recommendation please let me know!

Peace!

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

Sounds a lot like an indoor organic soil mix. Have you considered botanical teas?

 

[offthehook]

The ingredients in your mix sound totally allright by me Tiami.

Now, If you only would have acces to an EC meter you could do a soil probe test.

For indica's and hybrids you'd be better off keeping it rather high, like 3.0 to 4.0 Ms

For pure Sativa's & verrry Sativa dominant strains I'd rather stay between 1.5 and 2.0 Ms.

Without this meter there would be no way of knowing your ratio's to be correct so you'd have to rely on experience.

 

[Tiami]

Nice thread!

Last year I did a more hardcore mix, that ended up being a bit too light. I guess I got too high before mixing the soil!

This year I'll be taking an easier approach.

Dig big holes, 25+ gal and use the following:
33% peat moss,
33% perlite,
33% compost, ill try to source free composted manure, otherwise i'll have to buy bagged.

With that i'll grab a box of Dr.Earth, or Plant tone product, which comes real cheap, use by the recommendations on the box and also some Rock Dust and Mycohizzae fungi to the mix.

Let it that sit on the holes for a few weeks before transplanting the plants out!

I'll top dress with guanos during the season to keep things looking good!

If anyone have any tips or recommendation please let me know!

Peace!

hi BW. this is my 2cents.

your mix does sound much like indoor. I guess many would disagree and it depends on type of soil but I wouldn't use that much peat ,if any and perlite in GG. peat offers nothing but water holding ability and with 33% of compost you have more than enough of organic metter for good dreinage and water holding ability (plus nutrients and beneficial microbes). I would consider water cristals. I would use perlite to loosen your soil if it's really hard clay or loam. again with high amounts of organic metter like compost you have already improved water holding ability for loose soils and soil texture/dreinage for clay soils. if the soil is light (sandy,rocky..) you don't need any perlite. good compost does both things when mixed with native soil. in poting mixes perlite offers dreinage for peat which has tendancy to get compact.

basicly I would make bigger holes (25gal is not a big hole imo) if you want bigger plants. and spend that peat (and perlite) money on good compost or worm castings even better. imo even 10-20% of compost is more than enough for any hole. oh and epsoma plant tone already includes micorizhae.

 

[idiit]

i wasted 20+ years of my life trying to amend shit soil, i've had great success growing in fertile soil.

the way i tell the difference is by the lushness of the indigenous vegetation in the specific grow area.

for fertile soil i use lots of pure calcium lime augmented with sul-po-mg and some dolomite lime. i use the usual other supplements as well (chicken manure,trace minerals, kelp, bone meal etc.) i don't need to add as much since the soil is already fertile.

for shit soil i've given up on amending techniques and dug a large hole and replaced the shit soil with a high grade potting mix medium ( i use fafard #2). i then augment this nutrient free medium with the usual amendments but in higher dosages depending on the nute requirements of the strains i'm running in this garden.

plastic covered with dirt and then mulch placed over the hole to make the hole ( mini garden) drought resistant. this also works well to disguise the grow area and help deter aerial surveillance. i let weeds and native grass grow up under the plant to make it look natural.

good drainage is essential.

i don't grow from seed planted od any more. i lose way too many plants to rabbits, mice, bugs. i transplant well established plants into the mini garden holes. the timing of when to transplant determines on the earliness of the strain i'm growing. fast flowering plants go in late ( past may) and late flowering plants ( late oct., november northern latitiude) go in starting may 15th (seed started indoors, clones planted later).

i add a good micro herd with sea-crop to the hole before planting and i use this as a spray before flowering and in early flowering to pro-actively treat for pestilence such as bud rot. it works much better than not spraying.

grow outdoor strains outdoors. they are much hardier from my experience. i'm a landrace grower now for many reasons. some landraces benefit greatly from an extended cure ( 3-6 months).

i always have multiple gardens. i've lost tons of guerilla gardens. lots of baskets, lots of eggs.

passion. this is a tough go. passion for this enterprise drives me thru the tough times.

 

[bajangreen]

I am watching this tread, hope i could add to the discussion, been doing organic gorilla for the last 11 months, in 5/3 gall buckets, i know i can do better but running some indica so don't need big holes, my largest problem has been how the soil reacts to wet/dry season.

 

[paladin420]

I am retired from the GG game. For now at least. I dig a hole and add potting soil. I always stay away from any thing like fish blood bonemeal anything that would attract raccoons.
I have amended hole with fish, but that needs to be done the fall prior.

Have fun!! watch for the bears n beasties !!