Eating, shitting, shelter, and breeding. Anything outside of that is extra points.
What is life really all about?
- Thread starter southflorida
- Start date
Thanks for the replies folks 
Imagine if you could suddenly let go of your beliefs and assumptions and would have zero motivation to maintain these beliefs (have them survive as they do currently)...
...then it wouldn't matter at all to you if they were right or wrong, remained or disappeared, would it?
You would no longer suffer any of the struggles that currently accompany your attachments to these beliefs and assumptions like defending them, promoting them, or fearing their loss.
This by the way - is true of every emotion, thought, self-image, possession, perception, idea, or anything else you consider you or yours.
If BEING is inherently free of any attachment, since it simply and absolutely already IS - and doesn't have to persist as the self that IS-NOT, - then it doesn't really matter if any aspect of a self persists or if the entire self fails to survive altogether.
As long as we are surviving as a self - happiness will continue to elude us, no matter how hard we try running after it.
Various forms of suffering seem to follow and find us no matter where we try to hide from it.
The cause of our suffering is the attachment to and identification with the "self."
Let go of the self and you let go of suffering.
No self = No suffering!
Imagine if you could suddenly let go of your beliefs and assumptions and would have zero motivation to maintain these beliefs (have them survive as they do currently)...
...then it wouldn't matter at all to you if they were right or wrong, remained or disappeared, would it?
You would no longer suffer any of the struggles that currently accompany your attachments to these beliefs and assumptions like defending them, promoting them, or fearing their loss.
This by the way - is true of every emotion, thought, self-image, possession, perception, idea, or anything else you consider you or yours.
If BEING is inherently free of any attachment, since it simply and absolutely already IS - and doesn't have to persist as the self that IS-NOT, - then it doesn't really matter if any aspect of a self persists or if the entire self fails to survive altogether.
As long as we are surviving as a self - happiness will continue to elude us, no matter how hard we try running after it.
Various forms of suffering seem to follow and find us no matter where we try to hide from it.
The cause of our suffering is the attachment to and identification with the "self."
Let go of the self and you let go of suffering.
No self = No suffering!
This is a good point. The brain or what I've been calling self-mind is what creates our reality, so there is no way the conceptual self can think outside itself.
This is why the first step is to simply notice that we are living our lives as 100% conceptual-selves and that all of our perceptions have been designed in order to help us survive physically and socially.
Surviving as the self that we believe we are is ALL we ever do, there is nothing outside of it for the false-conceptual-self.
But this doesn't mean we can't become directly conscious of reality without our perceptions, after all we are Consciousness itself.
consciousness seeks one thing, pleasure.
the greatest pleasure can be had in love. (positive emotions. companionable contact or sexual.partners or fellowship. family.)
creating something and good food.
without reality, the consciousness would be both nothing and something. (but an unformed something, like water without gravity.)
without pain (f.e hunger.) and death, consciousness would not learn. it would just bumble about seeking pleasure, if it allready had great pleasure, it would not move much.
if it had never known pleasure it would never move at all (without pain or death.)
without reality, there would not even be a concept of existing.
intellect is formed by avoiding pain and seeking gratification.
the purpose of this reality is advancing intelligence, its like a giant egg of sorts, cosmic egg.
another great motivator aside from pain and comfortseeking, is laziness.
we like pleasure and comfort and doing the least work to get the most.
which is ironic, because it has caused us to become like stressed out ratz in a maze.
constantly working, just so we can relax and have comfort later.
if we had any sense at all we´d come together and ask ourselves, "what do we really need?"
and decide everyone wanted food and housing and an opportunity to play with the world, relax and have fun in comfort.
then set about creating not sentient robotsto do all the menial work,after having set our best minds to work on creating a paradise for ourselves and everything living on the planet.
and then we´d do everything, do the stars, the universe, whatever we wanted.
we have the capability , there is nothing stopping us but ourselves.
if we stopped arguing.
we´d realise, that we are all wonderful warm beings,
and that our only limits, is our imagination and that it grows, all the time.
the greatest pleasure can be had in love. (positive emotions. companionable contact or sexual.partners or fellowship. family.)
creating something and good food.
without reality, the consciousness would be both nothing and something. (but an unformed something, like water without gravity.)
without pain (f.e hunger.) and death, consciousness would not learn. it would just bumble about seeking pleasure, if it allready had great pleasure, it would not move much.
if it had never known pleasure it would never move at all (without pain or death.)
without reality, there would not even be a concept of existing.
intellect is formed by avoiding pain and seeking gratification.
the purpose of this reality is advancing intelligence, its like a giant egg of sorts, cosmic egg.
another great motivator aside from pain and comfortseeking, is laziness.
we like pleasure and comfort and doing the least work to get the most.
which is ironic, because it has caused us to become like stressed out ratz in a maze.
constantly working, just so we can relax and have comfort later.
if we had any sense at all we´d come together and ask ourselves, "what do we really need?"
and decide everyone wanted food and housing and an opportunity to play with the world, relax and have fun in comfort.
then set about creating not sentient robots
to do all the menial work,after having set our best minds to work on creating a paradise for ourselves and everything living on the planet.and then we´d do everything, do the stars, the universe, whatever we wanted.
we have the capability , there is nothing stopping us but ourselves.
if we stopped arguing.
we´d realise, that we are all wonderful warm beings,
and that our only limits, is our imagination and that it grows, all the time.
Mia
Active member
Our idiotic work ethic worship is a hand me down from the ever fun loving protestant masochists that came over on their boats. Those people were real pleasure party poopers.
The Ancient Greeks on the other hand believed that work wasn't the point, leisure and pursuit of one's passions was, work was simply life's necessities and a means to that end. I guess some things don't change.
I learned that in a recreation and leisure class I took in college.
Well most of it.
The Ancient Greeks on the other hand believed that work wasn't the point, leisure and pursuit of one's passions was, work was simply life's necessities and a means to that end. I guess some things don't change.
I learned that in a recreation and leisure class I took in college.
Well most of it.
True. But, what I'm pointing at is that there are two aspects to us, the human being (or animal, as you wrote) and the unknownable aspect we call Consciousness, or awareness, or whatever.
These two aspects obviously exist simultaneously, but one is the real thing, or Being that does not need to persist, since it is already what it IS...
...and the other, the false-self, the human being with a self-mind that does need to persist, and move toward what it is NOT, or remember what was in the past, which is also what is NOT.
Being lives in the present moment, and ONLY in the present moment, self-mind lives in the past and future, ignoring the present completely.
a part of us, what I'm calling Consciousness and Being in this thread already exists in the unconditioned thread.
we obviously don't perceive it, since it is outside of our perception, and plus there is NOTHING there, since Being is infinitely nothing
We can't lose the ego, we can only notice it and stop attaching and identifying ourselves with most of the BS beliefs and assumptions.
Get rid of all beliefs and assumption, and poof we're gone...lol
breeding, as in sex with other human beings?...or cannabis breeding?
probably you mean both...lol
I agree, enjoying life is better than not enjoying it.
But, I mean fundamentally.
Self-survival includes enjoyment, and non-enjoyment, and everything else that we perceive while we are alive.
there is some good insights in your post, but they are all about our "self" - identity, and NOT Consciousness per se.
Consciousness is what IS, it is-itself, so it does not need to persist.
We, as human beings, on the other hand do need to persist, because we believe and assume that there is no other way.
In the Big Picture, Consciousness is our "self" also, meaning that we ARE Consciousness ourselves, but from the perspective of the human being, we are a separate, isolated entity.
There is nothing wrong with thinking that, as long as we are aware that these are simply thoughts and not the truth.
The truth is that we are nothing and everything simultaneously.
We are all elements of ONE STRUCTURE that I'm calling Concsiousness / Being in this thread.
well, consciousness could be thought of as water.
fitting the mold that the circumstances give us.
that consciousness is like a sea and your self a ship on its waves, a focal point.
sure the mind is limitless and possibilities endless.
but here and now, i am a being who enjoys doing this and that.
i cant escape this reality, except in the mind, but even then, i still have to deal with reality. a landscape thats only more than a picture when it has people in it.beings akin to ourselves, whether simpler or more complex..
through dealing with reality, i create my identity, both to myself and others, through my preferences and experience.
having an identity makes things easier in society. this is me, here i am, this is what i like doing.
its not a stable configuration, its fluid.
same as preferences and wisdom and intelligence.
but yeah, i agree, there is no inherent difference between anything living, except experience and preferences and skills created by that experience.
see, if i take myself out of time, out of reality,out of every existing connection to it as it never existed, then yes, fundamentally i am nothing and everything.
potentially every being that ever existed.
there are no true differences.
but in time, in reality, i am a specific person, created by experience.
a single cell that grew into a tree.
the tree of life
existing is not very complex, this is what i need, this is what i want, this is what i like and what i dont like.
from moment to moment there is no thought of that, just what im occupied with at the moment. thoughts of that maybe, but mostly the focus broken by spurs of invention or satisfaction of things going right or frustration at things going wrong and then silent focus on making it right.
simple.
its people that make things complex and interesting.
and im not so fond of being surrounded by identical looking people in robes, usually shaved in some preferred way.
that is the way of losing one selves identity.
because you can only lose your identity , by conforming to another.
its a good thing, you learn about other identities through doing this, but its only good if you expand your own identity , what makes you unique, because even though we are all one and the same.
its more like the cells of a human body, each same in essence, but through preferences and needs have structured themselves into unique but essential pieces of the whole structure.
its like human society.
except human society is more complex, potentially so anyway, our combined "human body" is probably limitless.
consciousness is like the ocean, but you cant become the ocean. not without becoming nothing.
and if you became the ocean, what then?
what do oceans do? and do you want to?
personally i like doing specific stuff, like making love and music.
i am a being, cause i be. im being now.
fitting the mold that the circumstances give us.
that consciousness is like a sea and your self a ship on its waves, a focal point.
sure the mind is limitless and possibilities endless.
but here and now, i am a being who enjoys doing this and that.
i cant escape this reality, except in the mind, but even then, i still have to deal with reality. a landscape thats only more than a picture when it has people in it.beings akin to ourselves, whether simpler or more complex..
through dealing with reality, i create my identity, both to myself and others, through my preferences and experience.
having an identity makes things easier in society. this is me, here i am, this is what i like doing.
its not a stable configuration, its fluid.
same as preferences and wisdom and intelligence.
but yeah, i agree, there is no inherent difference between anything living, except experience and preferences and skills created by that experience.
see, if i take myself out of time, out of reality,out of every existing connection to it as it never existed, then yes, fundamentally i am nothing and everything.
potentially every being that ever existed.
there are no true differences.
but in time, in reality, i am a specific person, created by experience.
a single cell that grew into a tree.
the tree of life
existing is not very complex, this is what i need, this is what i want, this is what i like and what i dont like.
from moment to moment there is no thought of that, just what im occupied with at the moment. thoughts of that maybe, but mostly the focus broken by spurs of invention or satisfaction of things going right or frustration at things going wrong and then silent focus on making it right.
simple.
its people that make things complex and interesting.
and im not so fond of being surrounded by identical looking people in robes, usually shaved in some preferred way.
that is the way of losing one selves identity.
because you can only lose your identity , by conforming to another.
its a good thing, you learn about other identities through doing this, but its only good if you expand your own identity , what makes you unique, because even though we are all one and the same.
its more like the cells of a human body, each same in essence, but through preferences and needs have structured themselves into unique but essential pieces of the whole structure.
its like human society.
except human society is more complex, potentially so anyway, our combined "human body" is probably limitless.
consciousness is like the ocean, but you cant become the ocean. not without becoming nothing.
and if you became the ocean, what then?
what do oceans do? and do you want to?
personally i like doing specific stuff, like making love and music.
i am a being, cause i be. im being now.
life aka temporary conscientiousness due to chemical reactions is a blessing and a curse at the same time. to me the thought of eternal nothingness sucks balls. I am thankful for everyday, but the thought of life being the final stage of consciousness, and then after death there is nothing, just as if you never were. Complete insignificance, like a tiny peice of a skin cell. This torturous thought sometimes makes me think why the fuck couldn't I just stay star dust. It is depressing and bleak and it sucks because it is probably true.
I hope there is a next level of consciousness though. Life level 2, your a planet some where now. then level 3 your a star, then level 5 your a galaxy, etc.
One thing I do know is when you die your brain releases a large amount of dmt, which produces a personal heaven or hell for everyone right before they go to take the scary out. Maybe your consciousness stays in that place frozen for eternity. The life you live will provide your eternity. Karma is played out then. If you live a good life with no regrets or shame, and have a good mind then your eternity will be filled with those good things your life was made from. If you were evil and have regrets and shame then you will have to live with that for eternity. Or at least what will feel like eternity because a tiny amount of dmt makes you feel like you were gone for months sometimes. the amount your brain releases when you die is enough to give you an eternity possibly. Since time is not real though how do you rate eternity. Our minds perceives time based on chemical reactions in our brain. We rate a certain perception of time as normal because that is the normal chemical reactions of the human brain making us interpret time that way most of the time. How ever a 45 second dream can feel like a day to a month, and the brain only releases a pinch of dmt for a dream. what it releases for death could easily give you another life. How do I know I am not dead now living out my after life and this is a perception of that? I dont know, nor do I care enough to let it bother me. I just wanna go skiing.
hopefully my dmt heaven will be bit like Peter Pan's never land mixed with Hugh Hefner's Playboy Mansion. I could fly. Have endless girls, in a magic grotto, imagine up what ever food I wanted, powder ski all day and ski down to tropical beach where everybody lives. only about 100 people per village. Just endless coast lines of these places to explore. endless natural terrain. Also there would be pirates to fight and I would always win. Also there would be a giant mountain valley dedicated just to the production of the world's finest ganja and beer.
I hope there is a next level of consciousness though. Life level 2, your a planet some where now. then level 3 your a star, then level 5 your a galaxy, etc.
One thing I do know is when you die your brain releases a large amount of dmt, which produces a personal heaven or hell for everyone right before they go to take the scary out. Maybe your consciousness stays in that place frozen for eternity. The life you live will provide your eternity. Karma is played out then. If you live a good life with no regrets or shame, and have a good mind then your eternity will be filled with those good things your life was made from. If you were evil and have regrets and shame then you will have to live with that for eternity. Or at least what will feel like eternity because a tiny amount of dmt makes you feel like you were gone for months sometimes. the amount your brain releases when you die is enough to give you an eternity possibly. Since time is not real though how do you rate eternity. Our minds perceives time based on chemical reactions in our brain. We rate a certain perception of time as normal because that is the normal chemical reactions of the human brain making us interpret time that way most of the time. How ever a 45 second dream can feel like a day to a month, and the brain only releases a pinch of dmt for a dream. what it releases for death could easily give you another life. How do I know I am not dead now living out my after life and this is a perception of that? I dont know, nor do I care enough to let it bother me. I just wanna go skiing.
hopefully my dmt heaven will be bit like Peter Pan's never land mixed with Hugh Hefner's Playboy Mansion. I could fly. Have endless girls, in a magic grotto, imagine up what ever food I wanted, powder ski all day and ski down to tropical beach where everybody lives. only about 100 people per village. Just endless coast lines of these places to explore. endless natural terrain. Also there would be pirates to fight and I would always win. Also there would be a giant mountain valley dedicated just to the production of the world's finest ganja and beer.
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Liza
Member
What you are saying about creating your own personal heaven or hell in your dying moments is a bit like what Swedenborg described. The thing is I don't believe a lot of evil people think they are evil or have regrets. Maybe Hitler was convinced he was doing good. If that is the case good people can go to hell if they have regrets or shame and evil people can go to heaven. I too hope there is a next level. Death in life and life in death.
Mia
Active member
Near death experiences and out of body experiences interest me. I am not that well versed in the areas but I do remember reading that the DMT hypothesis has holes in it.
My mom had three out of body experiences when she was a child. The third one freaked her out so bad she asked god for it to never happen again, and it didn't.
She's also had other strange events happen to her.
Me, I went to jail a couple of times....
The quote referred to is actually from an IBM marketing add that perverted the original text from Descartes. He was pondering whether his existence was actually separate from a conscious God's mind; as per the teachings of Berkley.
I've been wearing the title that perverts the IBM campaign myself for a long time now. I felt it only fair.
The answer to life is 42.
Self-Survival, which IS the purpose of our life as human beings - leads to never-ending SUFFERING.
Within the fact of BEING, there is no need to pursue what IS-NOT, something that is currently NOT-PRESENT.
Yet, when we are serving our self-interests we ARE in fact pursuing what isn't rather than what simply IS.
Self-survival is an activity directed toward the pursuit of things that are not.
When something pursued is attained, survival demands protection and maintenance of that thing, continuing to pursue what IS NOT.
Most of our attention proceeds to whatever "isn't" that's deemed necessary to maintain or further our selves and our survival.
This IS NOT an experience of BEING.
It is an experience of a SELF struggling to survive.
And, suffering is an inherent aspect of this self-survival.
Struggling is how we attempt to live with this NEVER-ENDING SUFFERING.
If you don't notice this in every moment of your life or you think this is a normal part of life, you are basically hypnotized by your cultural beliefs and assumptions, and are perceiving everything in your life through a filter made up of these beliefs and assumptions.
We are all in this TRAP. So, I'm not saying I'm unique and different or better than anyone else. I simply notice the distinction between Being and Self.
Within the fact of BEING, there is no need to pursue what IS-NOT, something that is currently NOT-PRESENT.
Yet, when we are serving our self-interests we ARE in fact pursuing what isn't rather than what simply IS.
Self-survival is an activity directed toward the pursuit of things that are not.
When something pursued is attained, survival demands protection and maintenance of that thing, continuing to pursue what IS NOT.
Most of our attention proceeds to whatever "isn't" that's deemed necessary to maintain or further our selves and our survival.
This IS NOT an experience of BEING.
It is an experience of a SELF struggling to survive.
And, suffering is an inherent aspect of this self-survival.
Struggling is how we attempt to live with this NEVER-ENDING SUFFERING.
If you don't notice this in every moment of your life or you think this is a normal part of life, you are basically hypnotized by your cultural beliefs and assumptions, and are perceiving everything in your life through a filter made up of these beliefs and assumptions.
We are all in this TRAP. So, I'm not saying I'm unique and different or better than anyone else. I simply notice the distinction between Being and Self.
and in this thread you find the crypto-nihilistic ideologies...
