DIY LED panel problem - Flashing

[Rouxdy]

Hiya:

As everyone else is saying here, you've got too much power in that driver,,, either get a driver with a lower forward voltage or add some more leds which in the end isn't a bad idea...more light is always good but.........I seen the layout you got there and I do not know how you attached them to the heat sink so....the driver should be changed.....sorry to be the bearer of the bad news but....well......that's only my opinion.. Maybe someone else can give you a better way out of this situation...

Also,, I don't care where you live but please tell me you're using 220V....the input for that driver is AC 185-265V....

Good Luck

Good catch on the 220V... crap...

so, since I need a new driver, and I don't have any room for more led's, what size driver do I need?

 

[Rouxdy]

hi Rouxy

all Leds in one String(series) right?

then i think you underdrive the Power-supply.

to check this out do some simple Math

multiply all blue and white Leds by 3
multiply all red Leds by 2
add this 2 Values

if this sum stays below 85 than i´m right and you need more Leds.

I'm thinking I'm at 72...

 

[vukman]

if they are all 3W then:
red is 2.4V @ ~630mA x # of chips= W
blue is 3.4V@ ~630mA x # of chips= W

You might be better off running 2 drivers instead of all on one....just a thought............

 

[Rouxdy]

I'm going to try one with these specs.

- 30 watt high power waterproof LED driver
- Input voltage: 85-265V
- Output voltage: 60-98V
- Output current: 320mA

Hope it works!

Thanks for the help!

 

[vukman]

I'm going to try one with these specs.

- 30 watt high power waterproof LED driver
- Input voltage: 85-265V
- Output voltage: 60-98V
- Output current: 320mA

Hope it works!

Thanks for the help!

hehe, at least your input is gonna be on target now..LOL...as for the rest...I will let someone else who is better what that answer you.
Guvoo and rives have that math thing down when it comes to electricity...sorry guys, not meaning to name drop but I do want to give credit where credit is due.. I'm sure there are tons of others as well..........tenthirty being another as well....

One question I do have for the more learned about amps and voltage is this......I heard from one of the LED wholesalers that if you used 700mA to run the chips, it greatly decreases their lifespan. Is there any truth to this? That is the reason I mentioned the 630mA instead of 700mA........thank you

 

[rives]

One question I do have for the more learned about amps and voltage is this......I heard from one of the LED wholesalers that if you used 700mA to run the chips, it greatly decreases their lifespan. Is there any truth to this? That is the reason I mentioned the 630mA instead of 700mA........thank you

The big issue with the lifespan of any electronic device is the ability to deal with the heat being generated. If you can effectively keep the temperature at the same level, I don't think that you will see any significant difference in the life of the component at different power levels. Most commercial fixtures do a very poor job with cooling (it's expensive), and drive their leds much softer as a result.

 

[guvoo]

- 30 watt high power waterproof LED driver
- Input voltage: 85-265V
- Output voltage: 60-98V
- Output current: 320mA

that Driver is OK.

I'm thinking I'm at 72...

72 and that is more than the min Voltage of your Driver(60V)

more then 60V of DC gives also a good kick if you touch it.

 

[vukman]

The big issue with the lifespan of any electronic device is the ability to deal with the heat being generated. If you can effectively keep the temperature at the same level, I don't think that you will see any significant difference in the life of the component at different power levels. Most commercial fixtures do a very poor job with cooling (it's expensive), and drive their leds much softer as a result.

I understand your point and to be honest, I've wondered about some of the 'cheaper' models which use a flat piece of aluminium as opposed to one with fins. Even then, the spacing between the individual chips is so close together.

I'm having an issue with locating a finned piece of aluminium large enough for the amount of chips I would like to use. Ideally, I would like to have one 12"x24" although even with heatsinks.com, I think their widest is 10.5" which ultimately just might have to do. Either that or there is a local place up here where I can get finned pieces for car amplifiers. Any thoughts on getting a few of them and then joining them with something like a 'JB Weld' type product? I mean I could always get a flat piece and have it bigger. A few more fans on it and should be okay too.....no??

Any suggestions would be appreciated....thank you...

 

[salamandra]

flashing can be occurring either because one or more leds have failed or you need one or two more leds added. Your psu spec says minimum 85v. I'd say you are a bit marginal here.
A dirty way to check/fix this since you don't want to add more leds is to add a few (Si)diodes or a 5w 10ohms(ceramic) resistor in series. Add 10ohms for every added led you want to "simulate".

If by adding your dummy loads the flickering is still there then you need to find witch led is faulty.

How to locate the faulty led:
make sure you have your dummy load(diodes or resistor) in series with your dc line and then start at the first led by shortening it with a copper wire. That led will go dark and the rest brighter! If you still have flicker remove the short and move the next led. Repeat the proses until flicker stops! If flicker do stop, the led you just shorted is the one to replace. Providing it is one faulty led. If you suspect multiple leds are at fault then each led individually needs to bee tested with a 3-4v source making sure no power is applied to your circuit.

If you think you are reading "Greek" right now, let me know and I'll make an effort to simplify things for you even further

Good Luck!

P.S.
LED drivers are "constant Current sources" witch means voltage will be changing according to the load. Current will always be the same, in this case 300mA, no mater what!

 

[salamandra]

The big issue with the lifespan of any electronic device is the ability to deal with the heat being generated. If you can effectively keep the temperature at the same level, I don't think that you will see any significant difference in the life of the component at different power levels.

For semiconductors this is not entirely true. Semiconductors and electronics in generally do age! If you over-voltage a semiconductor you will effectively also speed up the aging process even if youre temps are under control!


please forgive me for being an asshole my intentions are only good

 

[rives]

I'm having an issue with locating a finned piece of aluminium large enough for the amount of chips I would like to use. Ideally, I would like to have one 12"x24" although even with heatsinks.com, I think their widest is 10.5" which ultimately just might have to do. Either that or there is a local place up here where I can get finned pieces for car amplifiers. Any thoughts on getting a few of them and then joining them with something like a 'JB Weld' type product? I mean I could always get a flat piece and have it bigger. A few more fans on it and should be okay too.....no??

Any suggestions would be appreciated....thank you...

I don't know what kind of an "envelope" you have in mind for this, but it would be relatively simple to build something that would rack a couple of 6"+/- extrusions together. If you want just the bare sinks, you should be able to find a local machine shop or specialty welding operation that could TIG weld (heliarc) a couple of them together - a couple of bar tacks on the ends should be plenty. I would not use JB weld! As far as a flat plate goes, it would quickly get unmanageably large if you tried to meet the same area as a finned sink.

 

[vukman]

I don't know what kind of an "envelope" you have in mind for this, but it would be relatively simple to build something that would rack a couple of 6"+/- extrusions together. If you want just the bare sinks, you should be able to find a local machine shop or specialty welding operation that could TIG weld (heliarc) a couple of them together - a couple of bar tacks on the ends should be plenty. I would not use JB weld! As far as a flat plate goes, it would quickly get unmanageably large if you tried to meet the same area as a finned sink.

As always....thank you for your insight, input and knowledge.....I wasn't sure about slapping a few together but your suggestion about going to a shop and getting them 'tacked' together is a great idea....
DAMN I LOVE THIS PLACE!!! ....

 

[vukman]

For semiconductors this is not entirely true. Semiconductors and electronics in generally do age! If you over-voltage a semiconductor you will effectively also speed up the aging process even if youre temps are under control!


please forgive me for being an asshole my intentions are only good

why would you even think you are being an asshole.?? The only thing here that is like assholes...is opinions....we all have them and they all stink to everyone else except your own to yourself...ahahahahhaha.........

 

[rives]

For semiconductors this is not entirely true. Semiconductors and electronics in generally do age! If you over-voltage a semiconductor you will effectively also speed up the aging process even if youre temps are under control!


please forgive me for being an asshole my intentions are only good

Certainly if the equipment is operated outside of it's voltage/current parameters there will be an negative impact on it's longevity. LEDs are considered to have a finite lifespan, but they are the only semiconductor that I can think of offhand that would fall into that category. If you keep the junction temperature below it's rated level, you should come close to achieving the rated life of the component regardless of the current level it is being driven at (staying within design parameters, of course).

 

[Rouxdy]

As to the JB weld question. I used it to combine the two sinks in the picture. It's a very strong bind. I did that a year ago.

Now, how it holds up under the heat, no idea yet.

 

[tenthirty]

JBweld is probably an insulator. (probably a bad idea) Thermal adhesive would be better.

If your going to weld aluminum, it's going to have to be 6061 or some other weldable alloy.

For the one of DYI, my bet is on screws and nuts or rivets and thermal compound.
At least you can take it apart at a later date.

Remember, heatsinks are forever, diodes can come and go.

 

[tenthirty]

Sorry double post

 

[Rouxdy]

Just wanted to update, it was I assume a voltage issue... there is no flashing with the new controller.

Thanks for the help!