Living organic soil from start through recycling

[heady blunts]

george it's interesting that you bring that up.

i think neem seed meal is a wonderful soil amendment, but i am not a fan of neem oil foliar. i never had a good reason, it just doesn't "feel" right.

this is purely anecdotal, but i have been extremely satisfied with the observed effectiveness of my lavender FPE. i do a long fermentation (linalool be damned! jk CC!) of mostly blooms and use the final product in homeopathic dilutions (like 1:500).

that said, i am about to start a short fermentation of mint to experiment with coot's suggested method on an affected tomato plant in my container veggie garden.

i'm excited!

 

[IncredibowlBoss]

Alright... About to go to fucking war - good news is they cannot have been in my garden since before 8/21 - 1 week's a long time for bugs, but most folks don't really catch these microscopic fuckers til WAY later

 

[Microbeman]

If you are into it at a later date/grow. Try investigating rove beetles. I found an indigenous subspecies/genera which I brought indoors and had a great working relationship with for years. They ate, bred, multiplied and kept thrips, gnats and mites at bay. They did bite me once in a while but these were just brief domestic disturbances. You can purchase a species now but they prefer a wet environ. Better to find your own locally.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I almost hate to admit this...but if I get a clone from CO (and that is where I get all my clones) I let it root then use Forbid on it...just in case. Then I grow it two more generations before I cut clones for a grow. Fuckin Russet mites are everywhere.

 

[GeorgeSmiley]

george it's interesting that you bring that up.

i think neem seed meal is a wonderful soil amendment, but i am not a fan of neem oil foliar. i never had a good reason, it just doesn't "feel" right.

this is purely anecdotal, but i have been extremely satisfied with the observed effectiveness of my lavender FPE. i do a long fermentation (linalool be damned! jk CC!) of mostly blooms and use the final product in homeopathic dilutions (like 1:500).

that said, i am about to start a short fermentation of mint to experiment with coot's suggested method on an affected tomato plant in my container veggie garden.

i'm excited!

Ive had the neem seed meal in every mix for the last couple years. I even made some neem seed meal teas to do drenches for root aphids in a patients garden, no love..... took evergreen drenches. Getting to the point with neem where its not even close to effective compared to the stink of it.

Looking forward to seeing what you come up with the mint.

Alright... About to go to fucking war - good news is they cannot have been in my garden since before 8/21 - 1 week's a long time for bugs, but most folks don't really catch these microscopic fuckers til WAY later

Yes exactly, if a growers isnt accustomed to looking at his garden with a 30x+ (really 60X) scope or loupe, its is very hard to see these until youre a couple times through their growth cycle.


GS

Iphone has made my spelling so bad when I'm on a computer..... I have to punctuate myself

 

[Gascanastan]

One of my rare rants.....

Sometimes I feel the automatic, blanket response of neem oil sprays on this forum have to stop...... search through a couple thousand studies on greenhouse pest management, like I have and you'll see neem is rarely considered "control" of anything. Show me efficacy on TSSM, broad mites, russet mites, root aphids, hell fungus gnat, thrips, whiteflys, root nematodes, bulb mites, caterpillars,....... lately My reading has centered around how much it doesnt work against fungal and bacterial pathogens.

Show me the control in a 4-6K grow not just a commercial greenhouse. I use neem every 3 days. If it gave any sort of *actual control, I wouldn;t needed to try a dozen other products. Gnatrol or microbelift for gnats, rosemary, cottonseed oil sprays for mites, spinosad for thrips, a dozen things for PM, fuarium, verticillium. Botanigard, mycotrol, ecotec,

I use neem like a MOFO and to what end...... a leaf shine..... and botanigard does a better job at that.

On the clone trading circuit Ive been exposed to a lot of things in the last few years, and seen even more in friends gardens its amazing that nearly every garden that had big problems were ALREADY every 2-3 day neem users.

I let my guard down for a very short period of time with everything except neem..... and paid a huge price for it.

/Rant

I still use it as nothing more than a maintenance tool...every 5 days or so regardless if I see destructive pests or not. It seems about the mildest thing I can spray on the underside of leaves that 'controls' population explosions of unseen invaders...or things I've not seen that have set up camp.
It works....but I'd rather spray karanja oil since that oil really seems higher quality in comparison.

I have noticed that I don't have complete aphid or fungus gnat cycles...meaning they try and go through a generational cycle thing but just fail. Some make it out but very few...and then if they make it around to breed again the next generation seems to get kicked around again...and even less the next cycle...
In other words I do have less issues with gnats and root aphids since crab shell and neem seed meals have been making the rounds through recycling.

 

[Gascanastan]

Once youve harvested out of your recycled soil, what is the amending list of ingredients look like? And is that supposed to sit for a while or is it pretty much ready to plant.

Ty

I say it all the time.....

it depends on what the plants looked like as they finished the cycle...did they look as if there were any deficiencies?

If not to 1 cubic foot of recycled soil I'd add the following...

1 to 1 1/2 cups fish meal
1 cup fish bone meal
1 1/2 cups kelp meal

..if there were deficiencies add a bit more of the fish meal and kelp.

...and it is at this point one might consider adding the other goodies such as crab shell meal,neem seed meal,azomite,etc.

Typically 1 cup per cubic foot depending on what other amendments were added....

Did the fish meal and bone meal have any nitrogen worth mentioning..??? .....probably,so take into account that crab shell and neem seed meals have nitrogen as well...then adjust quantities to relate to the original nitrogen content you'd like to see replaced from the first cycle.

Also take into consideration that you just don't need as much of any one amendment to replace the original amount you added in the base mix. The biological processes that move nitrogen around are now running more efficiently in established colonies of organisms and some N is actually becoming stored in carbon.

 

[heady blunts]

my approach to recycling my old soil that originated with bagged mixes (FFOF and gardener & bloom) a few years ago was to keep diversifying with every amendment. one time i added char, another time i timed it right and had really amazing thermal compost from my veggie garden, another time i added a good amount of azomite.

every time i'd add more EWC, any other good compost i come by, and kelp meal.

now that i've had the opportunity to build my own soil from scratch, my approach is: start with a mix that includes short term amendments to get me through my first cannabis cycle (fish meal for example) and long term amendments that will benefit my future crops. depending how my plants finish, i will be happy to plant new seedlings right in the soil with no downtime. top dress with ewc and a diverse mulch of weeds/garden scraps/leaf mold.

all i really need is a nice 3 or 4k room to move into for the winter

 

[Gascanastan]

my approach to recycling my old soil that originated with bagged mixes (FFOF and gardener & bloom) a few years ago was to keep diversifying with every amendment. one time i added char, another time i timed it right and had really amazing thermal compost from my veggie garden, another time i added a good amount of azomite.

every time i'd add more EWC, any other good compost i come by, and kelp meal.

now that i've had the opportunity to build my own soil from scratch, my approach is: start with a mix that includes short term amendments to get me through my first cannabis cycle (fish meal for example) and long term amendments that will benefit my future crops. depending how my plants finish, i will be happy to plant new seedlings right in the soil with no downtime. top dress with ewc and a diverse mulch of weeds/garden scraps/leaf mold.

all i really need is a nice 3 or 4k room to move into for the winter

Once a guy gets his hands dirty with running a few no-tills and recycling soil it becomes much more user friendly and the personalized individual recycling/no-till approach often reaches this level....

 

[DARC MIND]

Bodhi is the most under rated, and frequently out of stock breeder out there. I got this clone from a friend, and every time I see a release I end up missing it.

i hear nothing but good from bodhi
i snaged me his big sur holy offering !

Definitelty looks like the CB with some BO frost improvement.....cherryish taste proly huh? Cool stuff bro.....how's the yield? Cherry Bomb is a 30 year Maui Wowie IBL from Mr. Greengenes.....the same Cherry Bomb he gave to Reeferman who robbed the name and released a different version... the CB male used to pollenate BO was from the original Cherry Bomb.... Maui Wowie is half Afghani and half Mexican from BOEL adventures in the regions......crossed and grown in Hawaii in the 1970's...I also thought BO had a south American in her as well???

more of a deep musky then cherry,thers a few sweet chancla wood girls found but all are complex in aroma & flavor.highs a bit different aswell,some come a little slow while others have that instant stimulation. high kind for day time smoke
"I like herb that opens me up, that brightens my day, that makes me think and feel in a more positive way. "
DJshort

 

[IncredibowlBoss]

CC (and/or others) - for these botanicals, are essential oils pref to live herbs?

What are rec'd application/dilution rates?

 

[BlueJayWay]

I have to go to a friends garden to play with mites, the most fun I get is fungus gnats.

Since I started spraying with aloe & botanical teas, I find I use less neem oil, maybe it's the simple fact I have more types of foliar's to choose from, or that neem oil stinks the most LOL so it's easily avoidable, the worst is where it can sit and collect on the floor unless you clean it up, phewy - although nothing makes my hands feel softer than a good foliar with neem oil.

 

[Neo 420]

Nice topic seeing I am starting to amend my soil in a week or two after my final cut. Already got the crab and neem meals. Need to evaluate minerals and what ever else I may need.
Carry on please.....

 

[heady blunts]

fwiw i never use any essential oil in the garden.

on my body i like to use jojoba and tea tree

 

[Gascanastan]

Seeds germinatin' today.....ten of each.
After they are cracked will be planted in oasis cubes embedded in the same recycled living organic soil as everything else....then placed under 24 hr mh light.
The oasis cubes will keep the percentage of surviving seedlings higher since the tender yummy new taproots are easy game for hungry soil organisms. The oasis cubes prevent insects from reaching the tiny little taproot until it's old enough to break through the cube material..by that time it's pretty much time to grow past microscopic hungry guys......IME

The One x Cherry Bomb
The One x Burmese/Cherry Bomb
Kali Mist x Burmese Cherry Bomb
Blue Orca x NL#5/Haze
The One x Blue Moon Rocks Bx1
Cheesequake x Spacecheese/Blue Moon Rocks F2

 

[heady blunts]

i hear nothing but good from bodhi
i snaged me his big sur holy offering !

keep us updated when you grow this out. i'm very curious.

 

[heady blunts]

l..by that time it's pretty much time to grow past microscopic hungry guys......IME

by that time the microscopic hungry guys are going to work for those roots

makes sense! and you can skip all that transplanting crap

 

[Neo 420]

Once a guy gets his hands dirty with running a few no-tills and recycling soil it becomes much more user friendly and the personalized individual recycling/no-till approach often reaches this level....

My veggie garden is recycled soil (it's a half ass soil job) but I had a fantastic year with my harvest. I must also say the second year run had almost zero pests compared with last year when aphids ruined my sunflowers and greens (I didn't get to eat one leaf of my greens last year...I was pissed)

 

[ClackamasCootz]

The One x Cherry Bomb
The One x Burmese/Cherry Bomb
Kali Mist x Burmese Cherry Bomb
Blue Orca x NL#5/Haze
The One x Blue Moon Rocks Bx1
Cheesequake x Spacecheese/Blue Moon Rocks F2

I have a TO x NL#5 running now - definitely pursue that one

 

[Gascanastan]

The smoke from the 3 small tester BO x NLH females was great....sweet lemon smell....like that lemon fruit loop smell..sativa dominant effect...frost galore. Preferred the smoke over many of my faves....including NL#5/Haze herself.

Super curious about TO x Burmese/Cherry Bomb....I think these will be great.