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Feds Finally State Their Position On Guns And MMJ

B

BrnCow

Sep 28, 6:27 PM EDT


ATF: Illegal to sell guns to med marijuana users
By MATT VOLZ
Associated Press



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HELENA, Mont. (AP) -- Firearms dealers in states that allow medical marijuana can't sell guns or ammunition to registered users of the drug, a policy that marijuana and gun-rights groups say denies Second Amendment rights to individuals who are following state law.
Federal law already makes it illegal for someone to possess a gun if he or she is "an unlawful user of, or addicted to" marijuana or other controlled substances. A Sept. 21 letter from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, issued in response to numerous inquiries from gun dealers, clarifies that medical marijuana patients are included in that definition.
"There are no exceptions in federal law for marijuana purportedly used for medicinal purposes, even if such use is sanctioned by state law," said the letter by Arthur Herbert, the ATF's assistant director for enforcement programs and services.
Federal firearm licensees, or FFLs, can't sell a gun to someone who answers "yes" when a required form asks whether the buyer is a controlled substance user. Last week's letter also says that licensed dealers can't sell a gun or ammunition if they have "reasonable cause to believe" the buyer is using a controlled substance.
That includes if the buyer presents a medical marijuana card as identification, or if the buyer talks about drug use, having a medical marijuana card or a recent drug conviction, ATF spokesman Drew Wade said Wednesday.
But there are no new obligations for gun dealers outlined in the letter, Wade said.
"We received lots of queries from the industry from various states of how to deal with state legislation and the federal law," he said. "It's our responsibility to provide advice and guidance."
The clash between state and federal drug laws has led to lawsuits and criminal cases in some of the 16 states that have legalized medical marijuana use.
Officials in two Oregon counties have said they'll appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court after state judges said sheriffs couldn't deny concealed handgun licenses for medical marijuana patients.
The Oregon Court of Appeals and the Oregon Supreme Court said the state law that authorizes concealed handgun permits is separate from the federal law that outlaws gun possession by drug users, and the state gun law doesn't address medical marijuana use.
Federal authorities also raided dozens of medical marijuana operations across Montana this spring, chilling a once-booming pot industry and leading to sweeping changes in Montana law.
The Department of Justice followed up with a warning letter to political leaders in many states that federal prosecutors will pursue marijuana distributors but not individual patients who are following state law.
The letter the ATF sent to gun dealers last week was first reported by Lee Newspapers of Montana.
Pro-marijuana and gun groups said the policy clarification amounts to rescinding the gun rights for the thousands of people licensed to use medical marijuana laws. And it appears to contradict a 2009 Department of Justice memo that said the Obama administration would not pursue prosecution of individual medical marijuana users who obey state laws.
Besides that, the government is putting an additional burden on gun dealers to police their customers, said Montana Shooting Sports Association Gary Marbut.
"Their business is to be merchants, not to be cops. Unfortunately, the federal licensing scheme complicates that," Marbut said. "It sounds as if the (ATF) is expecting them to drift further into the cop role."
Wade said both the 2009 memo and last week's letter were approved by the Justice Department and he does not believe there is a contradiction in the two messages. He also that the dealers are in a good position to help prevent firearms from getting into the wrong hands.
"The FFLs aren't cops but they are at the front line of protecting America from criminals or people who are prohibited from possessing firearms," Wade said.
A salesman at one licensed firearms dealer, Montana Outdoor Sports in Helena, said he doesn't expect much to change as a result of the letter because it's largely up to the buyer to reveal whether he or she is a medical marijuana user.
"Who's going to say yes to that?" asked Damon Peters, a sales associate for the store and a licensed hunting guide.
"A lot of users of medical marijuana aren't really shooting sports enthusiasts, anyway. I think we may see a sale or two lost, but I don't see anything dramatic that's going to affect us," he said.



http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...ALES?SITE=TXABI&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT
 
B

BrnCow

Another step to annul the 2nd amendment IMHO. But we can agree to disagree if we need to....
 

supermanlives

Active member
Veteran
what weed. hell no i dont do any drugs,drink or see a shrink . now gimme my damn gun.too late suckers . i loaded up in az years ago. altho i still want a 50 cal
 

Duplicate

Member
Hmmmmm, we may start to see some interesting alliances here.

You have to laugh to keep from crying when they have no issues whatsoever with anyone taking Rx mixed amphetamine salts and handling/owning a gun (not that I think there is anything wrong with that, just sayin).
 

StealthDragon

Recovering UO addict.
Veteran
I'm seriously considering buying a gun today because of this. They take away our rights little by little, hoping that we won't notice...
 

dddaver

Active member
Veteran
This point apparently is a non-issue but my thing about this all is that the pigs are evaluating and dictating policy while stepping on the toes of both the legislature and the judiciary. Is it really any surprise to anyone them assholes would lean that way? But I would imagine that the judiciary might slam down them assholes hard just for doing that. And I usually stand more with anti-guns too. I just think all these inroads against the American system need to be dealt with harshly. It's already way out of hand. :moon:
 

Scrappy4

senior member
Veteran
As state after state goes for medical marijuana the writing is on the wall but as usual politicians will be the very last to get it. With something like 90% of all drug arrests for simple mj possession, legalization will cost LEO jobs. They know it and are fighting like the mad dogs they are. Fook them, the pols, and the bat shit crazy drug war they rode in on....scrappy
 
B

BrnCow

It just seems the same old anti hippie brow beaters and rich fat cats have never stopped attacking and abusing cannabis users and growers. I had hoped as a kid that they had of died off by now but they must have bred another generation or two of the redneck fuckers. Hell, they used to catch longhairs hitch hiking through their areas and hold them down and use sheep shears on them. Now they are after the med licensees and their supplier chain. We need to vote these fuckers out of office this time no matter what party they claim to be a member of. I think the parties have simulated into one big fucked up deal. Have you ever noticed how every third party has some stupid bullshit that marks them as a half bubble off ? They have all their ducks in a row but then add legalizing goat fucking as one of their agendas. Isn't there a just plain run of the mill honest politician left? Hell, one that isn't lying if their mouth is moving? Someone that isn't fucking the paiges or robbing social security or hot for off shore deaths and blood letting? Damn...
 
L

LouDog420

Just means our MMJ smokers need to hit up the 'fast and furious' gun stores like the rest of the drug dealers ya???

Listen to good old Tommy J...

Tommy J... said:
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
 

dddaver

Active member
Veteran
I myself say screw all that "movement" shit. After all this time and EVERYBODY knowing the harmlessness and economic stupidity of this prohibition, the powers that be are just going to hang on to every last vestige they can to pinch their fucking pennies. Can you say BIG ASS PHARMA? "I knew you could."When one thing is put down another just pops up. I say just lay low, don't drive with any unless you absolutely have to. Fuck getting on ANY list. Above all, deny, deny, deny. :ying:
 

Scrappy4

senior member
Veteran
A lot of this anti medical marijuana bs is coming from middle aged guys around my age. They were the losers who never got laid or invited to a party and had small penis syndrome. Now there alcoholics, in failed marriages and trying to take out there life long frustrations on the poor, sick, and disabled. Guess what? There still losers.....scrappy
 

fukndenny

Member
This is the same old retarded stuff.

Buy as many guns as you want, infact, I recommend it.

Who the fuk is going to tell me I cant own a firearm? Nobody.

Fuk em.

I don't care if I was a regsitered Felon or w/e, I would still own at least a dozen firearms.

They will never stop me from protecting myself.
 
Guns and MMJ

Guns and MMJ

It's all pretty simple. The firearms application form 4473, question 11.e., asks if you are an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance.
It's a federal form. Marijuana is not federally legal for any reason.
HOWEVER, I called a few ATF agencies and asked some questions (I got many different opinions/answers). One of the agents told me you cannot be addicted to many prescription drugs (true). I asked him, what if you're taking them as prescribed and you're addicted? Do you have to answer yes? He snickered and said, "Like someone is going to answer that question right." So apparently, it's acceptable to lie on that form?
I finally ended up finding the exact laws online. Basically, they need to be changed. Or, like everyone else, you can just lie on the form.
 

mrcreosote

Active member
Veteran
If you ever get busted for weed and they try to get you for lying on the form when they grab your guns, just explain that you're not culpable because you were on prescription drugs when you filled out the form.

Tah Dah, problem solved.
 

fuzzymuffin

Active member
If you ever get busted for weed and they try to get you for lying on the form when they grab your guns, just explain that you're not culpable because you were on prescription drugs when you filled out the form.

Tah Dah, problem solved.

They would simply invoke "federal supremacy" and take the guns anyway.
 
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