Passive butane extraction and recovery

[Gray Wolf]

I am impressed with the results QTS demonstrated with his Tamisium extraction and recovery unit, but the sticker shock cuts to the very soul of a cheap bastard like Moi, so I began to think about how one might put together a more affordable system, operating on the same principles of hot and cold.

A storage tank can be simply made from a propane torch tank, by changing out the valve assembly. Since I've seen several pictures of that solution on line, I focused instead on the extraction unit itself. I've played with a couple different sizes and designs, but here is a conceptual design for simple one, that holds around an ounce and can be built for under a couple of hundred dollars.

Here is also another larger one, that uses borosilicate column and collection tank, so that you can watch it operate:

I will build the first to prove out the concept, and the glass and stainless unit, if the all stainless one pans out.

 

[bloyd]

This is exactly what I need! Another great project gray wolf look forward to updates.

 

[Bullfrog44]

I don't get it.....What is "passive" butane extraction as appose to BHO.

 

[Chunkypigs]

hey there GW, I've been mulling over a getto Tamisium set up also.

Am I correct in assuming that the pressure developed in this system is quite low and it is not mandatory to use stainless fittings that are as beefy as used on the Tamisium?
I'm thinking that teflon tape and pipe fitting should work to hold the pressures that could develop?

can you provide any links to the propane tank mod you mention? that seems like a great choice for storage. I was thinking that an extraction column could be fabricated from pvc or copper plumbing products from a big box store, likewise source ball valves and quick release air fittings.

I also gave some thought to using supplies from nitrous oxide systems that racers use,
perhaps for the hose used to reclaim the butane at the end.

I was thinking of using a stainless coffee travel mug or wide mouth thermos type
container with a screw on lid for the recovery tank.

like I said just trying to figure a way to test it out without needing any machine shop
tools to rig the thing up. I'm not set up to weld stainless at home, but I have access to drilling and tapping tools, etc.

whatcha think?

 

[JColtrane]

Didn't foaf have a post about this? As I remember it costed about $200 less to make one, than the small unit ... coming in around $1k. I'm about to process 10lb of material. I'd love to have some system like this.

Does anyone have an Airgas account? I'd like to use n-butane, but don't know the deal at Airgas ... info please???

 

[Chunkypigs]

yeah, I'd like the info on how to buy at airgas or similar without attracting attention if that's possible, anyone with 1st hand exp?

 

[Gray Wolf]

I don't get it.....What is "passive" butane extraction as appose to BHO.

By a passive system for extracting Butane Honey Oil from cannabis, I mean one that doesn't use pumps, like the one attached, that I have already build.

 

[JColtrane]

Could you explain this flow chart a little more sir ....

 

[Gray Wolf]

Could you explain this flow chart a little more sir ....

Here is a link that better explains the system:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=203067

In short, the material is loaded in the upper column and a vacuum pulled on the system. Butane is then push pulled into the column using a refrigerant recovery pump.

About every two to three minutes, for thirty minutes, the butane is flushed out and down into the lower recovery vessel, where it is pumped off as a gas, leaving the oil behind in the lower vessel.

The butane pumped off is recompressed back in the original tank for reuse.

 

[QTS]

Excellent Gray Wolf, I'm glad that my experimentation has been a source of inspiration for you! I guess the energy is just coming full circle, as you and others like HMK, foaf, Double Kindness, and jump have definitely inspired me to try new ideas and expand what I am capable of achieving. I look forward very much to seeing how this all turns out. I know I'd love to add more working units to my setup, and if this turns out to be as efficient and safe as well as cheaper, it'd be a great alternate to a Tami.

Chunkypigs- When the Tamisium is all full, no single chamber holding the pressurized solvent has been over 55 psi.

 

[JColtrane]

Thanks ... The thread seems pretty deep, so I'll have to take some time to read it. I did breeze through the pages, and looked at the photos. I think I get it ... anyways how easy is it for you to collect all the extraction? I guess I'm asking how easy is it to scrape?

 

[Trichgnomes]

Impressive work , GW, as always! I think it's great that you are working on a more affordable DIY passive unit that what exists commercially.

A storage tank can be simply made from a propane torch tank, by changing out the valve assembly

I'm curious though, what type of steel are these made from? I doubt it is stainless. Not that it wouldn't work perfectly fine, as N-butane is sold in steel cylinders, but the price point of the tami lies heavily in the amount of SS, and the precision machining. Some may argue the amount of stainless steel is overkill, but it definitely makes me feel very safe using the system.

As you know from your pump design. Stainless ain't cheap!

Kudos, nonetheless!

 

[Gray Wolf]

Thanks ... The thread seems pretty deep, so I'll have to take some time to read it. I did breeze through the pages, and looked at the photos. I think I get it ... anyways how easy is it for you to collect all the extraction? I guess I'm asking how easy is it to scrape?

If we are talking about the passive system, the lid opens to a 4" unobstructed cylinder, 6" deep, so not easily scrapable without a long scraper.

My first design for a quarter pound was more open, with 6" lower pipe section, as does currently the stainless and glass version design.

I switched to the smaller unit after considering the needs of most of our local patients, some of whom would like their own plant material extracted and have more time and patience than money.

Many of them never have more than a couple of ounces of bud in their hand at any given time and the shortest column I made for our pumped unit is 12", which holds around 110 grams.

The 10" pot on the pumped unit has easier access, but what I do is wash the oil out of the pot with hot 190 proof ethanol and stick the tincture in the freezer for filtering after the waxes have coagulated.

With the passive unit, like the Tamisium, you could start out with alcohol in the system and just pour out the tincture later.

Since part of the way this system works, is for you to be able to turn it upside down and re-flood the column for soaking the material as long as you like. That would mean also soaking in polar alcohol, so I can't predict the results.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Impressive work , GW, as always! I think it's great that you are working on a more affordable DIY passive unit that what exists commercially.



I'm curious though, what type of steel are these made from? I doubt it is stainless. Not that it wouldn't work perfectly fine, as N-butane is sold in steel cylinders, but the price point of the tami lies heavily in the amount of SS, and the precision machining. Some may argue the amount of stainless steel is overkill, but it definitely makes me feel very safe using the system.

As you know from your pump design. Stainless ain't cheap!

Kudos, nonetheless!

Thank ya'll for the good thoughts bro!

You are absolutely right about the stainless and machining adding to the cost of the Tami. It is a gorgeous piece of equipment, albeit a little expensive for most of our local patients.

Most fuel tanks are made from carbon steel, as is the tank on my current pumped system. Since only butane will ever be in it, it work fine, though with time, the paint may fail and some corrosion may start on the outside.

The key point, is that the extraction never touch anything that isn't stainless, or in the case of the valve packing, Teflon.

I found a picture of one of the tank conversions that saw on one of the forums, but alas I can't tell from my copy and paste of the article, which one. A salute to that fine and ingenuous fellow for working out the details and posting the picture.

http://*********.com/forums/gallery/data/500/beginnings.jpg

 

[Trichgnomes]

You are absolutely right about the stainless and machining adding to the cost of the Tami. It is a gorgeous piece of equipment, albeit a little expensive for most of our local patients.

Yeah, the cost is definitely up there! They components all have some serious weight to them, too. The recovery tank of the smaller unit weighs ~ 2000 grams with cap, fittings and ball valve. The column maxes out my 4000 gram scale, so...I dunno, it's quite heavy to say the least.

The key point, is that the extraction never touch anything that isn't stainless, or in the case of the valve packing, Teflon.

Ahhhhhh. Gotcha. Makes total sense.

Cool pic! Thanks for sharing. I have some friends that may be interested in something of the like.

 

[Gray Wolf]

Excellent Gray Wolf, I'm glad that my experimentation has been a source of inspiration for you! I guess the energy is just coming full circle, as you and others like HMK, foaf, Double Kindness, and jump have definitely inspired me to try new ideas and expand what I am capable of achieving. I look forward very much to seeing how this all turns out. I know I'd love to add more working units to my setup, and if this turns out to be as efficient and safe as well as cheaper, it'd be a great alternate to a Tami.

Chunkypigs- When the Tamisium is all full, no single chamber holding the pressurized solvent has been over 55 psi.

Thanks bro! Your posting was indeed the inspiration that led me to look for an affordable way for maw and pa to do butane extraction with recycle.

I've been experimenting with more heat on my extraction unit and got a brief spike to 55 psi as well, after dumping two column volumns of butane into the lower chamber, with it sitting in a 200F water bath.

By adding more heat to the pot and heat taping the column for final purge, I have been able to improve the cycle time, but I now nominally operate at around 45 psi, instead of 30 during pressure cycles.

 

[eloquentsoution]

Thanks bro! Your posting was indeed the inspiration that led me to look for an affordable way for maw and pa to do butane extraction with recycle.

I've been experimenting with more heat on my extraction unit and got a brief spike to 55 psi as well, after dumping two column volumns of butane into the lower chamber, with it sitting in a 200F water bath.

By adding more heat to the pot and heat taping the column for final purge, I have been able to improve the cycle time, but I now nominally operate at around 45 psi, instead of 30 during pressure cycles.

the great advantage to this change is the dramatic reduction in time to pull a vacuum. improving the heat portion of the cycle, reduced the entire extraction cycle to 45 minutes, cutting a good half hour off the processing time as well as increasing the number of washes per cycle.

i don't know that it is possible to improve upon the 22.2% return, as the spent material appeared pretty clean under scope, but we will be watching.

 

[Rickys bong]

I meant to ask QTS in his thread but I'll ask it here.

I'm wondering if there is any adsorbent material in the recovery/storage tank. The surface area seems low to be able to condense gas as fast as it does but I'm too lazy to do the calculations.

 

[foaf]

Didn't foaf have a post about this?

I have used my setup without the pump. I put the butane recovery tank in an ice bath and the vessel with the butane/oil in a hot water bath. There is about 3 liters of butane to evaporate, and it worked overnight to completion. So it takes less than abouit 18 hours. I didn't check it frequently enough to know exactly how long it takes.

 

[Double Kindness]

I know that when making my unit that the 2 bottom pieces took forever to find and were large thick steel rounds, which we then used our milling lathe to cut for our purposes on the design. Alas mine uses a vacuum pump for the recovery method. Recently the vacuum pump burnt out and we luckily were able to fix it with some bearings and seals thank god because the vacuum pump was very hard to find. Hats off GW, I bow before you. Let me know how the passive unit works out, because I can see myself and DM making one, especially because the vacuum pump in my unit can and probably will burn out again one day, possibly not able to be fixed.

And my unit also weighs like 80 lbs of metal. So something smaller but will do as much or more material would be great.