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Design brainstorm!

BagseedSamurai

Active member
Hello! It's your boy Bagseed again, getting back at it for a half-year grow. I'm setting up to stock a dispensary, so shit's getting serious! I am running through some calculations in an attempt to figure out watts and space. Due to a lower plant count, I have to maximize health, environment and grow time in order to yield the most that a plant can give. And, once again, I'm looking to my awesome ICMAG peers to figure out my plan. Or to at least work the kinks out.

First of all, my plant count should be somewhere around thirty. They will be all female. I will be giving them four months of veg time before kickstarting flower. I will be using the soilless method (coco is the most likely culprit), unless convinced otherwise by strong strong evidence. Yes, I know hydro can yield more but my experience lies with soil/less. Exhaust and heat may be an issue, as it usually is, when it gets closer to spring which is also when I will need the most watts so I'm looking to illuminate properly using the fewest number of hot bulbs and ballasts as I can. I will likely be using an area about 300 sq. ft. to 500 sq. ft. For nutrients, I plan on using a simple organic method, or perhaps trying out one of the biggest name-brand ferts.

Let's see, is there anything I'm missing?

So the plan is to veg for minimum four months and try to grow out using the "tree" method. What my connundrum is, is how many plants per bulb (I was thinking 3ft x 3ft using four plants per 600 - 1000w HPS but that doesn't seem feasible for some reason). My main concerns are heat in flowering time, keeping plants properly illuminated and, of course, getting the biggest g/w yield as I can. Oh, and cost-efficiency both now and long-term is big, too, but I figure that goes without saying! Ha! :blowbubbles:

I am working on this heavily right now, working out the best methods I can think of for lumen efficiency and heat eradication. I was even considering CO2 supplements.

So let me know what you think! Constructive criticism is encouraged, and suggestions or tips are also greatly apreciated.

:thank you:
 

Sam87

Member
Minimum 4 month veg, you'll probably be wanting to plan on 1k for each plant. At least. Why is the plant count so low if you're partnering up with a MMC? I thought you guys were open to higher plant counts nowadays. If you've got the cash to grease the state's palm, anyway.

But if you're definitely stuck rocking out trees, I would be looking at vertical lighting. Seriously the way to go. That, or run a mixed setup. Have you seen the space yet? How much headroom? If you're in a decent warehouse, you should be able to handle the heat from bare bulbs fine. What's the cooling, if any, look like? How much juice can you play with? Do you have a maximum number of lights?
 

BagseedSamurai

Active member
Minimum 4 month veg, you'll probably be wanting to plan on 1k for each plant.

Noted! I was debating the higher wattage bulb, too.


Why is the plant count so low if you're partnering up with a MMC? I thought you guys were open to higher plant counts nowadays. If you've got the cash to grease the state's palm, anyway.

My residency is ready for my application to the MMED in July, so I am trying to basically prep myself to put stock on the shelves when we're ready to open. So for right now, I'm working based on my caregiver status but once harvest comes, I'm timing it so that we'll be stocking our shelves with our own product right off the bat. Basically pre-planning.

But if you're definitely stuck rocking out trees, I would be looking at vertical lighting. Seriously the way to go. That, or run a mixed setup.

Vertical setups are a bit expensive. I've also never run one before, but I've checked it out and they seem awesome!


Have you seen the space yet? How much headroom? If you're in a decent warehouse, you should be able to handle the heat from bare bulbs fine. What's the cooling, if any, look like? How much juice can you play with? Do you have a maximum number of lights?

I haven't seen the space yet. I have realtors looking for me. I want some headroom but with a multi-room setup (half flower half veg at any given time) might force me to deal with a slightly lower ceiling. I will be looking and preferring something with a higher ceiling for the heat. The problem is that most warehouses are uncooled, but most multi room sites have air conditioning but lower ceilings. So it's a give and take. I'll be hiring an electrician to make sure electric is good, and I have no "limit" for my number of bulbs, except to attempt to minimize heat. I was looking into, at first, doing a 10KW grow. Possibly more, possibly less, depending on the demands.
 

Ichabod Crane

Well-known member
Veteran
you can section a room off pretty cheap.
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This room has 7 sheets of foil foam, 2 sheets OSB, a piece of black plastic and a zipper door. It is 7X8 minus walls. Rooms are cheap it's the mechanicals that cost the most. I think vert is a lot cheaper than buying a bunch of hoods.
 

dansbuds

Retired from the workforce Bullshit
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I'm no where near experianced enough to hep you design a room of that magnitude ... but I am experianced in is flowering plants in a 3 x3 space . & no matter what wattage you go with ... A 4 month veg will never work in a space that small , hell even a 4' x4' space , 1 plant vegged for 4 months will never get to its full potential in that small space . I run 4 plants per 3 x3 , with a 3 week to 1 month veg in a scrog net & some times thats to many plants (strain dependant ) . my last run was just 2 plants in my space & had to do some serious trimming in order for the plants to get all light .

I'm just saying dude .... you might wanna rethink the 4 month veg thing unless your outside & have 3' between plants so they can grow out . :)
 
G

growingcrazy

Why not just look at some of the larger grows here in the grow diary section. There are plenty of people here that are doing or have done something similar to what your looking at. Bare bulb vertical would be your most economical option it seems.
 

Sam87

Member
Noted! I was debating the higher wattage bulb, too.

You're running some big plants dude. I would forget about the 6's right now. I love my 600s, but they have their purposes. Growing big gals is not one of those purposes.


My residency is ready for my application to the MMED in July, so I am trying to basically prep myself to put stock on the shelves when we're ready to open. So for right now, I'm working based on my caregiver status but once harvest comes, I'm timing it so that we'll be stocking our shelves with our own product right off the bat. Basically pre-planning.

Gotcha. Good luck bringing it legit bro. This maze of regulatory bullshit is too much for me to jump into. Sticking with my bedrooms and basements for sure, just not worth trying to go bigger legally right now imo. Glad someone is willing to fight for it though.
Vertical setups are a bit expensive. I've also never run one before, but I've checked it out and they seem awesome!

Vertical is going to run you a lot cheaper than trying to deal with hoods. Just get enough airflow in there, and you'll be good. Not to mention the major GPW hike. It just doesn't make sense not to do it, flat gardens can't even touch open hung lamps when you're doing the big gals. Way less trimming, lollypopping, training and so forth too, depending on how you set up your room.


I haven't seen the space yet. I have realtors looking for me. I want some headroom but with a multi-room setup (half flower half veg at any given time) might force me to deal with a slightly lower ceiling. I will be looking and preferring something with a higher ceiling for the heat. The problem is that most warehouses are uncooled, but most multi room sites have air conditioning but lower ceilings. So it's a give and take. I'll be hiring an electrician to make sure electric is good, and I have no "limit" for my number of bulbs, except to attempt to minimize heat. I was looking into, at first, doing a 10KW grow. Possibly more, possibly less, depending on the demands.
Yup. You are looking at substantially more than 10k to run 30 girls with 4 months veg. That's pretty much just your veg room's wattage taken care of. I would plan for at least 15k, whether you're running flat or vert. And if it were me, and I had the room, I would be running a minimum of 1k per plant. 2k if I wanted to mix the system up and deal with the bitch work of hanging hoods. Somewhere in between if running a straight vert setup. Unless you're growing Deep Chunk or some slow ass shit, those are going to be some very big girls.

Good luck, and have fun with it bro.
 

Granger2

Active member
Veteran
Bagseed,

http://www.prosourceworldwide.com/default.asp
testimonial by commercial med grower
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxPvN9ke2Xg

I want more info on these, but it appears that this mfgr has gotten the LED thing down. The med grower in the video says he's cut energy consumption in half without losing quality or quantity.
I'm strongly considering making this conversion in 6-12 months.

I don't really understand why you want such a long veg time. Shorter veg time means more crops per year, and lower cost per crop. You can probably save money on initial set up for growing more crops in less time. Good luck. -granger
 

BagseedSamurai

Active member
I don't really understand why you want such a long veg time. Shorter veg time means more crops per year, and lower cost per crop. You can probably save money on initial set up for growing more crops in less time. Good luck. -granger

1. Time constrains of my residency.
2. More bud per plant. (Bigger plant = More Initial Yield)
 
2. More bud per plant. (Bigger plant = More Initial Yield)

Not always true, it took me a long time to realize that there is definatly a prime time to flip, just becasue you veg for 4 months doesn't mean you're going to get a p out of a plant. You have to get the light to the buds or else youre just going to grow a huge plant of leaves. I'd look into defoliation, I wouldn't go too extreme if you want plants that size because they need some food sites but if you get more light to your buds and have your envirmoent controlled you're going to get more bang for your buck and you can squeeze in an extra harvest which is going to bring you more prime buds vs more little bottom buds. IMO. I don't want to argue with you but I went with that philosiphy for a while just make big huge plants and expect to get lbs but I'd be dissapointed and get 4-5 oz max, now I flip them at about 30-36" and I'm steadily getting 5-9oz some times I'll snag 11 or 12 off a plant that finishes at around 5' with many colas and large dense buds with very little popcorn at the bottom thanks to defoliation and vertical lights helping fill out the bottom.

I'd look into a combo vertical/horizontal if I were you, pending on the dimensions you could even use a light mover or two to utilize more light and save some money. I have 2 hoods and 2 cool tubes dropped vertical and that is giving me a nice even canopy and the vert is adding quite a bit to my yield

Good luck my friend
 

BagseedSamurai

Active member
So. I'm giving serious consideration to vertical grows but they seem kind of weird still. I suppose I could do a few different columns in the room.
 
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