starting a 250 watt cab and need feed back please help!!

[hotboxes]

Ok I am about to start making a cab using a 250 watt HPS ballast in a cab I am still in the process of building but am having problems of the logistics of the cab and the specs.

First off the cabinet is an old chest that is 3' 4" in height, 1' 4.5" in depth and 1' 1.5" in depth. I was planning on making a cool tube from a pyrex bake a round tube, but am thinking that it might not fit in the space that I have after I connect the ducting and my D.I.Y. carbon filter. I cannot find the specs on the bake a round tube to figure out if I am going to have enough room to fit it all into the top of the cab with out having to install it in a diagonal position.

I was thinking about hanging the light bare bulbed, but am worried if the light will emit to much heat inside the cab once the door is closed. I really don't want to have to cut any of the intake and exhaust holes If the cool tube idea will not work. I am not able to cool with an A/C unit nor do I want too. That will arouse more attention than I am willing to risk, plus IMO I think it would be over kill and more head aches trying to exhaust an A/C unit inside a closet.

I plan on using 4" duct booster fans for my intake and exhaust because on the back of the cab there is a space that is about 6" in depth with the same height and width as the main cavity of the cab and planned on using that area to hide my ballast, power cords, intake and exhaust ducting, and also constructing a drying rack also so everything is out of sight and out of mind in case we have any unwanted visitors. Mind you this cab is strictly for flowering use only. I have another micro cab I will be using for my mother and clone box that I have already been using as a growth and flowering unit, but would like to start more of a perpetual garden.

I was thinking if I use a bigger duct booster for my exhaust and just use a bare bulb method with a fan directly across from the bulb too cool it and suck it out through my filter and out the back of the cab through the back cavity of the cab, but If I go with this method I could loose vertical growth and/or more yield than if I was to use a cool tube method.

This perpetual garden is strictly for personal use for 2 people. I am about 2 weeks from being able to put my clones in and start putting in a clone every 2 weeks so I am able to harvest one every 2 weeks. I have taken the specs and feel I can fit 4 plants inside at once comfortably and the breed I am growing that I have been growing for the past year now is an 8 week flower strain. I am about 1 week away from ordering the equipment that I need, and would like to get some feed back before I do order so I don't have to order things I will not need. As like many other personal growers I am on a budget and can't afford to order things I don't need so any and all feed back is wanted and needed so please help me out. Thank you in advance for any and all info you can provide me with.

P.S. I posted this in the 250 watt club thread and had no replies I am about to start building and need some advice any one please help.

 

[Strangely]

Rule 1 dude. Picture us up at least!

 

[hotboxes]

there is nothing to take a picture of at this moment I have not started constructing the box yet 1.) Because I do not have all of the equipment yet.
2.) is because I'm not to sure of my heat issue if the light will be to hot in the cab. of those spec's with out a cool tube and if I can even fit one in there.

Sorry if you feel you need a pic. of an empty chest to tell me if you think it will be to small of a space to run a 250 watt HPS in with a bare bulb. I just need a little direction from some one that knows about smaller cabs. I had a 10'x8'x6' room before this and figuring out the ventilation was a lot easier to control especially using an A/C. The only interesting thing I could possibly take a pic. of would be my plant out side, but I will not be out to see her till the beginning of the week. Please any one with some positive feed back please chime in . 26 views and only one window shopper wanting to look at pics............

 

[StupidBoy]

tell me if you think it will be to small of a space to run a 250 watt HPS in with a bare bulb. I just need a little direction from some one that knows about smaller cabs.

Yes, that's a pretty tight space to be running a 250 watt bulb in. You should give serious thought to finding a cab with a larger foot print, or maybe running with smaller watt bulb(s).
A duct booster fan is not strong enough to pull or push through a carbon filter. I'm a bit stoned, and got a bit lost in your post, so maybe that's not what you meant.
There's a good read around here about choosing the right PC fan by a dude called catman. Another dude called redgreenerie has a good read on ventilation. And there are pleanty of grow threads to explore and get ideas from. You mentioned stealth. There are pleanty of great examples of stealth grows around here, but stealth done wrong is either dangerous or it isn't stealthy.
Keep it green, but stay safe and

 

[Scrogerman]

That works out to 162wpsf(watts per square foot-if my crap math is right), you'll only need around 50wpsf, could go a little higher, but a 250w HPS is far too much in such a little cab. 1.55 square feet youve got, if im reading that right. a 70w hps would give you 45wpsf, a 150w would give you 97wpsf, which is overkill imo. aim on the smaller side i would, or get/make a bigger cab!
G'Luck!

 

[Sgt.Stedenko]

Bigger cab, smaller bulb, duct boosters suck, remote ballast, pics help

 

[heady blunts]

very good advice from SM and sgt

if i had a similar space to work with, i'd probably do a horizontal 150. they don't have much penetration (neither does a 250) so i'd also use a screen and train my plants scrog-style.

 

[Sgt.Stedenko]

Sorry if you feel you need a pic. of an empty chest to tell me if you think it will be to small of a space to run a 250 watt HPS in with a bare bulb. I just need a little direction from some one that knows about smaller cabs. I had a 10'x8'x6' room before this and figuring out the ventilation was a lot easier to control especially using an A/C. The only interesting thing I could possibly take a pic. of would be my plant out side, but I will not be out to see her till the beginning of the week. Please any one with some positive feed back please chime in . 26 views and only one window shopper wanting to look at pics............

You will get more flies with honey than your piss and vinegar method.

You want help, quit bitching.

Point two, provide good information.

First off the cabinet is an old chest that is 3' 4" in height, 1' 4.5" in depth and 1' 1.5" in depth.

How are we supposed to know which is the depth and which is the width?

That's why they say a picture is worth a thousand words.

People are very happy to help, but coming here with a poor attitude and providing poor information in a rambling post will get you nothing.

Perhaps the people in the 250 club saw this as well.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Ok I am about to start making a cab using a 250 watt HPS ballast in a cab I am still in the process of building but am having problems of the logistics of the cab and the specs.

If you don't mind the suggestion, draw it on paper before cutting.

First off the cabinet is an old chest that is 3' 4" in height, 1' 4.5" in depth and 1' 1.5" in depth.

Scrogerman is right. Your footprint is too small for a 250. A 250 will cover up to 5 square feet. Consider another cab or another bulb size.

I was planning on making a cool tube from a pyrex bake a round tube, but am thinking that it might not fit in the space that I have after I connect the ducting and my D.I.Y. carbon filter. I cannot find the specs on the bake a round tube to figure out if I am going to have enough room to fit it all into the top of the cab with out having to install it in a diagonal position.

I've got one, I think it's 14" long. You're right, you'd have a tough time with ducting, might be impossible. You could get a Coleman lantern globe for ~$6, they're ~5" long.

I found out after the fact I didn't need the tube. Small bulbs run as cool or cooler with a computer fan blowing on em. The tube is nice to keep from accidentally touching the bulb. Leaves may still burn if they rest against the tube.

I was thinking about hanging the light bare bulbed, but am worried if the light will emit to much heat inside the cab once the door is closed. I really don't want to have to cut any of the intake and exhaust holes If the cool tube idea will not work. I am not able to cool with an A/C unit nor do I want too. That will arouse more attention than I am willing to risk, plus IMO I think it would be over kill and more head aches trying to exhaust an A/C unit inside a closet.

A bare bulb would be no problem, as long as it's sized accordingly and the exhaust fan is sufficient. The bare bulb will make a hot spot but the overall temp in the cab shouldn't be any higher. A pc fan blowing on the bulb or between the bulb and canopy really helps.

It's always a good idea to get things worked out on paper before cutting.

If the ac would arouse attention, the fan necessary to cool a 250 in your chest would arouse the dead, lol. Really, you wouldn't be able to sleep at night. A 250 will cover up to 5 sq feet but it won't penetrate that far. If you're planning to grow for 2, you need a bigger grow area.

I plan on using 4" duct booster fans for my intake and exhaust because on the back of the cab there is a space that is about 6" in depth with the same height and width as the main cavity of the cab and planned on using that area to hide my ballast, power cords, intake and exhaust ducting, and also constructing a drying rack also so everything is out of sight and out of mind in case we have any unwanted visitors. Mind you this cab is strictly for flowering use only. I have another micro cab I will be using for my mother and clone box that I have already been using as a growth and flowering unit, but would like to start more of a perpetual garden.

I wouldn't use an intake fan, it'll blow stink out of the cracks. You need 2x passive intake (no fan). If you have a 4" exhaust fan, you'll need two 4" holes as intake, or any configuration that approaches 25 square inches.

I was thinking if I use a bigger duct booster for my exhaust and just use a bare bulb method with a fan directly across from the bulb too cool it and suck it out through my filter and out the back of the cab through the back cavity of the cab, but If I go with this method I could loose vertical growth and/or more yield than if I was to use a cool tube method.

A booster won't suck through a filter very well. You could make a filter the fan would accommodate but stinky strains would blow it out.

It's always best to pull through a scrubber but you can push through it if you get all the leaks sealed. The fan will be less efficient and it's harder than it sounds to plug the stink holes. Kolorblind made a nice mini-fridge that pushes through the filter so it is possible, just not easy.

This perpetual garden is strictly for personal use for 2 people. I am about 2 weeks from being able to put my clones in and start putting in a clone every 2 weeks so I am able to harvest one every 2 weeks. I have taken the specs and feel I can fit 4 plants inside at once comfortably and the breed I am growing that I have been growing for the past year now is an 8 week flower strain. I am about 1 week away from ordering the equipment that I need, and would like to get some feed back before I do order so I don't have to order things I will not need. As like many other personal growers I am on a budget and can't afford to order things I don't need so any and all feed back is wanted and needed so please help me out. Thank you in advance for any and all info you can provide me with.

P.S. I posted this in the 250 watt club thread and had no replies I am about to start building and need some advice any one please help.

Your initial idea would work but it would be very noisy. And you'd have to pull off some serious venting to get it to work at all.

A duct booster might work if you didn't have anybody around to smell it. You're gonna get somewhat used to the smell and neighbors would smell it quick with no scrubber.

IMO you might have to consider a smaller bulb or a bigger grow area. I'm not sure what you'll end up doing but Scroggerman's suggestion of 70w is a working option. A 150 would be tough to cool w/o making noise. 70w hps and a couple of CFLs might do the trick.

This won't yield enough for 2 people. Have you considered a tent? You could get a 2' x 2' tent and cool a 250 w/o lots of noise. A fan speed controller would be handy. You'd need ~125 to 150 CFM to vent and scrub. S&P is a good brand for in-line fans. They're quiet and reliable.







A 250w hps is a pretty big heat source. With the right fan and grow area, you can pull it off. Reducing the grow space just makes tweaking the results tougher. IMO, you'd need a centrifugal fan to cool a 250 in your chest. That would sound like a very large hair dryer running 24/7.

If you have the cash to get a fan and scrubber rated for your bulb, it'll be much easier with the appropriate sized grow area.

 

[hotboxes]

Thank you all for all the responses. My initial post was kind of thrown together and I did lable the width wrong it is 1'4.5" in width. My mother cab that I will be using Is quite a bit smaller that is being run with CFL's 8 in all and I have run a few s.c.r.o.g.'s in it with no problems, and I used a 4" booster fan with a D.I.Y. filter with no smell at all leaking from it I have had my land lord right next to it with out alarming her with smell.

I can see how the light might be too much but I have no other alternatives on a cab. It is a 60 yr old cedar cab (very well built) and thick walls I don't believe there would be any problems with smell leaking out.

you all have been great in chiming in with all of this info I am very greatfull for that and believe me I was not getting an attitude with the first reply of the person asking for pics. I just have clones getting ready for this thing and it isn't even built yet, I guess I am just an a little bit of a rush. This all gives me some things to think about. thanks again

 

[hotboxes]

very good advice from SM and sgt

if i had a similar space to work with, i'd probably do a horizontal 150. they don't have much penetration (neither does a 250) so i'd also use a screen and train my plants scrog-style.

My cab is probably as big as yours is heady, but set on end and your using a 400. I had a veg. room set up before all of this with near 900 watts 2 x 250 and 1-400 all over a 2.5 sq.' with about 1.5 to 2 ' of clearance with out a problem. With no active exhaust and open bulb's nothing but fans blowing around. It was open and I can see how this 250 in this cab might be a problem sealed. I am just going to have to work everything out on paper before I get into it. thanks for the advice

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Thank you all for all the responses. My initial post was kind of thrown together and I did lable the width wrong it is 1'4.5" in width. My mother cab that I will be using Is quite a bit smaller that is being run with CFL's 8 in all and I have run a few s.c.r.o.g.'s in it with no problems, and I used a 4" booster fan with a D.I.Y. filter with no smell at all leaking from it I have had my land lord right next to it with out alarming her with smell.

I can see how the light might be too much but I have no other alternatives on a cab. It is a 60 yr old cedar cab (very well built) and thick walls I don't believe there would be any problems with smell leaking out.

you all have been great in chiming in with all of this info I am very greatfull for that and believe me I was not getting an attitude with the first reply of the person asking for pics. I just have clones getting ready for this thing and it isn't even built yet, I guess I am just an a little bit of a rush. This all gives me some things to think about. thanks again

IMO, it's actually better to ask before the fact. An intake fan may produce positive pressure in the cab. This means that stink can be forced through cracks and crevices. Around the door and etc.

Passive intake (no fan) produces negative pressure. Those same cracks and crevices will be inhaling, not exhaling and leaking stink. If your exhaust is mounted properly, all air leaving the cab has to go through the scrubber.

1'4.5" square or 16.5" square is about ~1.9 sq feet. IMO, a 150w hps might not be so hard to cool and it'll be far less noisy.

 

[hotboxes]

IMO, it's actually better to ask before the fact. An intake fan may produce positive pressure in the cab. This means that stink can be forced through cracks and crevices. Around the door and etc.

Passive intake (no fan) produces negative pressure. Those same cracks and crevices will be inhaling, not exhaling and leaking stink. If your exhaust is mounted properly, all air leaving the cab has to go through the scrubber.

1'4.5" square or 16.5" square is about ~1.9 sq feet. IMO, a 150w hps might not be so hard to cool and it'll be far less noisy.

I see what you mean but the cab is also 42" in height.I know the height really has nothing to do with this besides the penetration and the foot print would be bigger.

I always suck threw the scrubber. I have another micro box I will be using as a clone an mother box that is smaller but I have it using a 4 inch booster fan, and the scrubber is connected directly to the fan and it has no problems sucking threw the scrubber that there is a good pressure of air coming from the duct on the other end.

I think I am just going to have to hold off on using this cab. and just build something custom to my needs. so I will be able to build around my equipment. I can then get the cooling tube and duct work for it and maybe jump up to a 400, I could get the footprint that I would need along with the penetration I would get from a 400 instead of the 250 and its only a few cents more a day to run. I was just thinking of the money I could save bu using this chest I already had.

Like you said you have to throw an idea around to work the bugs out and most of the time you need more than one person to bounce your ideas off of. I had a 1800 watt flower room and a 900 watt veg. area before this and it was easier IMO to figure out than this has been so far. I will just have to slow my clones down and wait another week till I can get everything situated. Thanks again guys for the input!!!

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Sounds like a plan. Best wishes.

 

[heady blunts]

My cab is probably as big as yours is heady, but set on end and your using a 400. I had a veg. room set up before all of this with near 900 watts 2 x 250 and 1-400 all over a 2.5 sq.' with about 1.5 to 2 ' of clearance with out a problem. With no active exhaust and open bulb's nothing but fans blowing around. It was open and I can see how this 250 in this cab might be a problem sealed. I am just going to have to work everything out on paper before I get into it. thanks for the advice

i've got a bit more space (22.5" x 23.5" x ~8'), and regardless, the heat this summer was a problem.

the reason i used the 400 was because since i went with the vert design, i ended up with twice the square footage (roughly 4 square feet on both sides of the light). so 400w divided by 8 sqft is 50w/sqft.

even if you ran a 150 you'll be getting around 75w/sqft. that's more then enough.

if you move up you're going to run into diminishing returns as the heat burns up your plants and kills your yield. also it'll just be a huge headache, and the 6" vortex you'd need to cool that thing will ruin your stealth goals.

go with a 150w, brush up on your scrogging techniques, and you'll get a nice harvest with less headaches.

or just say fuck it and appropriate your closet for a 400w

 

[GP73LPC]

check the link in my sig for a cab with 2 - 150's, passive intake, built in exhaust box (o3+carbon scrubber). yielded 5-6 ozs every 60 days...

very stealth too with a big noisy fish tank on top...

 

[thinkin]

.02
150 will make you work hard for yeild (learn a ton)

250 will have more heat issues

pick your demon.

i went 250 with cooltube- 20"X20"X28"

dont waste time horizontal. hang bulb vertically.

 

[e_24]

dont waste time horizontal. hang bulb vertically.

prove it. not being an ass, but you have no proof to back up that statement

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Check out his journal pics, looks pretty good.

 

[e_24]

just sayin. thats not "thinkin"