Can we talk about Calcium?
- Thread starter mostnonymouse
- Start date
This is a calcium thread. Cal is important.
And yes it is possible to run low on cal. Especially those who use rain water or RO water, and have little lime, or other sources in their mix.
I for one am using less and less lime, so 'i need to keep up on cal and mag. Plants need cal in the stretch period, so if your running short it will most likley show up then or shortly there after.
What i am wondering is how much is too much, and how much can plants tolerate..........scrappy
Can we talk about Calcium?
sounds like you are over-liming.
the lime is there to balance the peat. only add more lime when you add more peat.
sounds like you are over-liming.
the lime is there to balance the peat. only add more lime when you add more peat.
Can we talk about Calcium?
if you rely on Ewc you never run out of calcium. Worms can not process their food without calcium that comes out the calciferous glands.
if you have castings, you have calcium. if your bin runs out of calcium, you will get no castings.
I also see no reason to give extra Ca during stretch, extra N during veg, or extra p during flower. If the soil is right it is right for the whole life cycle If you are running out of Ca you probably need a bigger pot.
if you rely on Ewc you never run out of calcium. Worms can not process their food without calcium that comes out the calciferous glands.
if you have castings, you have calcium. if your bin runs out of calcium, you will get no castings.
I also see no reason to give extra Ca during stretch, extra N during veg, or extra p during flower. If the soil is right it is right for the whole life cycle If you are running out of Ca you probably need a bigger pot.
I tried d lime and it was fine. I was fine without it, throwing in a pinch of
epsom when it seemed to need it. Using EWC might be why though I really don't use much as I presently buy it.
I think the question is not how much will the plants tolerate but rather how little do we need. Isn't it really there mostly to buffer any acids generated in the soil with the plant actually using much less than the soil does?
epsom when it seemed to need it. Using EWC might be why though I really don't use much as I presently buy it.
I think the question is not how much will the plants tolerate but rather how little do we need. Isn't it really there mostly to buffer any acids generated in the soil with the plant actually using much less than the soil does?
GoneRooty
Member
Yeah, I know this is a Calcium thread, and that it is important. But it also isn't one of the more commonly deficient elements indoors. I mean really is anyone in this thread having Cal deficiencies in their indoor gardens?
C
CC_2U
Careful - the 'Cal-Mag Lockout' is a cornerstone of grow store profit margins.
Try finding that term at Google Scholar sometime if you get really bored.
CC
mostnonymouse
Member
I didn't realize this was an indoor forum.
I have nothing to back this up, but I imagine that just because a plant isn't showing deficiencies doesn't mean it doesn't have them to some extent. Most Americans are malnourished but they still go to work all day and function. I'm just trying to cover all my bases and from what I understand, calcium is huge in preventing disease and fungal infection. I dealt with MASSIVE amounts of botrytis last year and I'm trying to control it as much as possible by making sure my soil has all the calcium it needs.
big_daddy
Member
Hiya mostnonymouse,
I thought this link might be helpful to those that are liming their mixes. I got it from http://www.acresusa.com which is a great site for organic growers. They also send out a magazine that is well worth the 27 dollar subscription.
cheers,
b_d
mostnonymouse
Member
Appreciated! I didn't lime this year but my outdoor "holes" are actually last years swamp tubes that have been re-amended with a concentrated super-soil mix. I'm hoping There's enough microbial life out there to take care of any PH issues that may have resulted from the swamp water saturation all winter....only time will tell, but so far so good.
I currently receive Mother Earth News but I've been given a few copies of Acres from some organic farmer friends of mine. Definitely an AWESOME publication. I've been meaning to subscribe...
I currently receive Mother Earth News but I've been given a few copies of Acres from some organic farmer friends of mine. Definitely an AWESOME publication. I've been meaning to subscribe...
that it is, it also has Mg, and what I think to be way to much iron
GoneRooty
Member
Oops, for some reason I thought this was in the indoor soil forum, my mistake.
And I wasn't in anyway trying to take anything away from your thread. I was just trying to make the point that with so many already good sources of calcium that most of us are using, I wouldn't think calcium would be an issue. I wasn't aware that you were interested in using it to help prevent botrytis, I just thought you were concerned about deficiencies.
So that being said, here's what I found about calcium and botrytis
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/load/roses/msg091230419214.html
Granted this is from a forum and is dealing with botrytis on roses, but the idea of a gypsum spray seems like it might work.
I know Mg is a "byproduct" of alot of things. But I have witnessed this with just pro-mix ( limed ) and with nothing mixed in but using bottled nutes ( specifically bio-canna, which I once asked a question to them asking if there bottles have cal/Mg in them, they didn't say yes or no.. they said you better have lime in your peat if using bio-canna, which I would assume is a good enough answer that the bottle alone cannot provide adequate levels of cal or mg.. ) which would lead me to believe, even if there was trace amounts in the bio canna ( which has been talked about being that we are not sure if molasses is in there mix.. ), I am not feeding enough for there to be adequate levels I would assume, being as I feed 2-4ml a gallon, which you would need Mg levels very high to sustain Mg deficiencies in pot plants.
just my experience when thinking about Mg in lime..
calcium is usually not deficient, high levels can be tolerated as seen by chemical users and known there Ca value. As CC states above, there is alot of Ca from many sources if your using many sources
Ca from what I have read, is "sucked" up by plant roots so the Ca level in plants is dependent on transpiration , so is boron. so most people that have a Ca problem is not from ca deficiency
I also have heard Ca plays a role with Mg, and K more then other nutrients, and Ca affecting Mg more then Mg affecting Ca
I amend with various calcium sources that break down over different periods of time. Dolomite,oyster shell,gypsum,diotomacious earth,EWC,crab shell. If I add more peat I add more lime mix. I never have deficiencies in the realm of calcium symptoms,but often wonder why the hydro-store culture has determined that cannabis is a cal/mag hog plant when the thing did fine for thousands of years.
Build a crappy mix and then you'll see some lockout.
Build a crappy mix and then you'll see some lockout.
I know what your saying Rooty. But i have seen super soil type recipes where they add a lot of bonemeal, and then the outdoor types where they add bone and things like gypsum so that gives me reason to believe there is something up worth investigating. And i think that is where the OP was going.......scrappy
That's what I do, usually 2TBS/G of new peat, which I add to renew or increase my soil mix. So if I add 2G screened peat to 10G used soil, I add 4TBSP 80-100 mesh DL. I also have had some blossom end rot on tomatoes in this same batch, which is why I thought it was calcium related, and aragonite would be a good addition.
^^^^word
compost,casting and letting properly designed soil sit/cure; stabilizes the soil CEC & cycles all those elements as a living orchestra....
part on base saturation % goes into cal/mag
http://www.soilminerals.com/Cation_Exchange_Simplified.htm
ime the cal/mag problems only happen when water is pretty out of wack and constantly poored on soil or we start adding things like bottled nutrients that effect both plant and soil nutrient interactions...
C
CC_2U
big_daddy
Member
