Dissolving hash in ethanol (pure drinking alcohol)

[kuk]

Hi guys, I've been trying to come up with a way, looking mainly on the net, how to make something similar to sativex.

Sativex is now available to some in the UK, im not sure of its medicinal legal status in the US and canada, but i think it is available in canada.

For those of you who dont know whats sativex, its refined (specific) thc into a bottle of what I think is some kind of solvent, possibly similar to ethanol

People then take a "dose" by drawing it up into a dripper which measures in ml, and they squeeze that under their tungue and it gives them some relief

Now after researching for several days I came up with alot of ideas how to make a similar DIY sativex where i could get my hands on 99% drinkable alcohol.

Well after discovering there are several types of 99% alcohol (isopropyl most common and cheap! - but 250ml can kill you!) the only one that you can drink is ethanol

not only "can" you drink it, its exactly the same stuff thats in all our booze anyway, this is the same alcohol in them, so its safe to drink

It is not cheap to buy because duty is paid from even the chemical suppliers where you can find supply it (there are some in the uk, £40 for 500ml - 99% ethanol)

So considering weed is only soluble in alcohol and fat if I was to chop up my hash into really small pieces and drop them into this solution, left for a few weeks for all the THC to dissolve? (anyone know a timescale for that?) and i would have pure drinking alchohol laced with the THC of 25g of hash?

and i could then mix that with coke and it would be like a coke-vodka laced with thc that would get me high for a good few hours almost instantly (unlike eating!? as its liquid?)

and it could also turn out to be very potent. thats what you'd be hoping for, so you only needed to take a very small amount of alcohol for good effect.

so would this work?

I'l just edit here, ive had a look on wikipedia about sativex and its actually a spray not a dropper like i thought it was

cheers guys

 

[Gray Wolf]

Hi guys, I've been trying to come up with a way, looking mainly on the net, how to make something similar to sativex.

Sativex is now available to some in the UK, im not sure of its medicinal legal status in the US and canada, but i think it is available in canada.

For those of you who dont know whats sativex, its refined (specific) thc into a bottle of what I think is some kind of solvent, possibly similar to ethanol

People then take a "dose" by drawing it up into a dripper which measures in ml, and they squeeze that under their tungue and it gives them some relief

Now after researching for several days I came up with alot of ideas how to make a similar DIY sativex where i could get my hands on 99% drinkable alcohol.

Well after discovering there are several types of 99% alcohol (isopropyl most common and cheap! - but 250ml can kill you!) the only one that you can drink is ethanol

not only "can" you drink it, its exactly the same stuff thats in all our booze anyway, this is the same alcohol in them, so its safe to drink

It is not cheap to buy because duty is paid from even the chemical suppliers where you can find supply it (there are some in the uk, £40 for 500ml - 99% ethanol)

So considering weed is only soluble in alcohol and fat if I was to chop up my hash into really small pieces and drop them into this solution, left for a few weeks for all the THC to dissolve? (anyone know a timescale for that?) and i would have pure drinking alchohol laced with the THC of 25g of hash?

and i could then mix that with coke and it would be like a coke-vodka laced with thc that would get me high for a good few hours almost instantly (unlike eating!? as its liquid?)

and it could also turn out to be very potent. thats what you'd be hoping for, so you only needed to take a very small amount of alcohol for good effect.

so would this work?

I'l just edit here, ive had a look on wikipedia about sativex and its actually a spray not a dropper like i thought it was

cheers guys

Haven’t tried it cold, but I routinely cook hash in ethanol to extract the cannabis oil, to make cannacaps out of the extract. I mix in about 3 grams of coconut oil per 10 grams of cannabis oil and add enough corn starch to turn it into silly putty, that can be stuffed into caps.

Still experimenting with adding perpercine, capsicum, and other enhancers, but just the bare formula works well.

 

[Babbabud]

Its called a tincture. Been around a long time ... check out google.

 

[kuk]

Haven’t tried it cold, but I routinely cook hash in ethanol to extract the cannabis oil, to make cannacaps out of the extract. I mix in about 3 grams of coconut oil per 10 grams of cannabis oil and add enough corn starch to turn it into silly putty, that can be stuffed into caps.

Still experimenting with adding perpercine, capsicum, and other enhancers, but just the bare formula works well.

interesting grey wolf, how do you mean you cook it? do you mean you warm it in a plastic bowl over boiling water on an electric oven?

how would adding those ingredients you specify enhance it?

Its likely to be cold over several weeks maybe? should i leave it longer? i would be looking to make it into a tincture exactly as babbabud has mentioned, btw babba, you dont happen to know where there is a thread on making a tincture this way do you? as i coulnt find one in several weed sites

main thing im not sure on is how much hash to add to half a litre, any ideas?

 

[jump117]

In warmed ethanol resin of hash dissolves faster.

Read Gunnaknow's post on solubility of THC in ethanol (click)

Quote

I've read technical data stating that the solubility of THC and CBD in ethanol is 50 mM and 75 mM, respectively. ISO is slightly less polar than ethanol, so the level of solubility is likely to be slightly greater in ISO. However, let's use the figures for ethanol just to be on the safe side. THC and CBD have a molar mass of 314, which means that 1 mole of each weighs 314 grams. A millimole (mM) is 1000th of a mole per litre. So, that's 314/1000 = 0.314g per litre. THC has a solubility in ethanol of 50 mM, so that's 0.314 x 50 = 15.7g per litre of ethanol. CBD has a solubility of 75 mM, which is 50% more, so that's 23.55g per litre of ethanol. Another source states that the solubility for CBD in ethanol is 36mg/ml (36g/litre), which is 53% more than the first source states. This could be partly down to different extraction temperatures being used. It would probably be safer to go with the lower figure though and just use slightly more solvent.

Let's just imagine for a moment that your trim contained somewhere in the region of 10% THC and that it was a fairly low CBD strain, as most are these days. If we used the first figure of 15.7g per litre, then 1 litre would be enough to dissolve all of the THC in 157g of trim containing 10% THC. However, other substances that were extracted would likely lower this figure. On the other hand, you're never going to extract all of the THC present with a quick wash anyway, so these two factors should cancel eachother out somewhat. The good news is that even fairly compacted trim (dried) only weighs about 50g per litre, let alone 157g. So 1 litre ethanol/ISO would be more than enough for a litre of fine trim, containing 10% THC. Due to the fact that most of the volume of trim is taken up by air, just covering the trim should be enough for a good ratio of trim to ISO. I hope that this helps.

gunna

End of Quote

 

[Gray Wolf]

What Jump said well.

The coconut helps speed the absorption and the corn starch is an inert ingredient to stabalize it in the cap.

If you want a sublingual that works well, you might consider my Holy Shit recipe. It is a 62% cannabis oil solution with no alcohol in it and is my primary pain med.

10 grams BHO, QWET, or QWISO oil
3 grams coconut oil
.7grams cinnamon leaf oil from Newdirectionsaromatics.com.
.7grams cinnamon bark oil "
.3 grams gum myrrh "
1 gram cinnamon candy flavoring oil from Loranneoils.com

 

[kuk]

how much do you know how to put in one capsual, ie pricise measuring witgh capsules? capsules would be ideal, but would they be absorbed as quickly into blood stream as a liquid? probably not, but gelcaps definitely would be more convenient and you could have lots in your pocket at any time unlike a bottle of dropper.

by the way, do you think i am paying far too much on £40 for 500ml of ethanol? I think i am but couldnt find it anywhere else. I could have got 2,5 litres denaturing alcohol for about £15

is there any difference - i mean can you drink denatured alcohol, or does it have toxins in it so you cant drink it? says its 94/95, but there was also only 94/95 ethanol couple of quid cheaper than the 99 percent

basically is there places for anyone off the street to find cheap pure ethanol

and i read that thread babba of interest it is, they were making iso hash though, it not about how to make a tincture.

also, something that did concern me a bit, gunnaknow mentions several times about the trim/bud having its whole area exposed to the iso..... this hash wont crumble and it'l be thrown in in tiny sticky lumps... thats not giving good exposure at al cos theres alot of thc in the middle of each sticky ball - maybe absorbtion rate would be very uneconomin considering potency of the tincture and the hash being unsmokeable (maybe edible?) after brewing in alcohol for weeks

cheers

 

[Shred42O]

why dont you just go buy some everclear or Bacardi 151
it dosnt have to be pure alcohol just alot of it

 

[kuk]

the lower the alcohol level the less dissolvable the hash comes. it will work better as a tincture with pure alchohol i can evaporate leaving 10% of the initial alcohol having a very powerful (in a thc sense) brew, where only a few ml would bring very fast effects

would that work, to make a strong thc tincture, at the end should i be evaporating the alcohol, and add something (water?) to make the alcohol content much lower, at leat 60% down so you could take some with a dropper, without needing to mix pure alcohol wich obviously drinking would be agony to your throat

grey wolf, how do you warm the ethanol in the way you speak of, when you cook your hash in there? whats the safe way, i dont want it to blow up in my face

i think warming it would be the best idea, but not the safest,

so no-one knows the results of chopping sticky hash up into very small fiene pieces, shaking bottle every day, for 2 weeks, for a month?

how long should it take, and are the hash balls likely to dissolve in the pure alcohol due to its solvent nature? (abrasive)

also good to know how soluble thc actually is, im not sure how to undertake this ethanol extraction. hot or cold.

cheers

 

[Gray Wolf]

the lower the alcohol level the less dissolvable the hash comes. it will work better as a tincture with pure alchohol i can evaporate leaving 10% of the initial alcohol having a very powerful (in a thc sense) brew, where only a few ml would bring very fast effects

would that work, to make a strong thc tincture, at the end should i be evaporating the alcohol, and add something (water?) to make the alcohol content much lower, at leat 60% down so you could take some with a dropper, without needing to mix pure alcohol wich obviously drinking would be agony to your throat

grey wolf, how do you warm the ethanol in the way you speak of, when you cook your hash in there? whats the safe way, i dont want it to blow up in my face

i think warming it would be the best idea, but not the safest,

so no-one knows the results of chopping sticky hash up into very small fiene pieces, shaking bottle every day, for 2 weeks, for a month?

how long should it take, and are the hash balls likely to dissolve in the pure alcohol due to its solvent nature? (abrasive)

also good to know how soluble thc actually is, im not sure how to undertake this ethanol extraction. hot or cold.

cheers

I boil it in ethanol for about 30 minutes. If it is going to be used orally, it will need to be decarboxylated anyway.

After straining it, I set it in an oil bath at 250F and cook off the alcohol intil the alcohol is gone and the small CO2 bubbles from the decarboxylation subside.

As far as the caps go, I use an amunition scale that weighs in grains. One grain of the capsule mix that I posted is aproximately one dose for a light weight and three grains gives pain relief for high tolerance users. Onset is 30/45 minutes.

Some head effect within moments with the sublingual, and full effects within about 30 minutes.

 

[kuk]

hi grey wolf, boiling ethanol for 30 minutes- how much volume of ethanol are you using?
can you find it (being a non scientist) for alot less than 65 dollars per 500ml??

i cant buy loads at that price

also, could i decarboxylate my hash, by putting it into a plastic boil/cooking plastic bag and boil it for 40 minutes (boiling water bath)

would that decarboxylate it to an extent i could eat bits of hash and get high off it (as ive turned thrc into thc? by the water bath?)
cheers

 

[Gray Wolf]

hi grey wolf, boiling ethanol for 30 minutes- how much volume of ethanol are you using?
can you find it (being a non scientist) for alot less than 65 dollars per 500ml??

i cant buy loads at that price

also, could i decarboxylate my hash, by putting it into a plastic boil/cooking plastic bag and boil it for 40 minutes (boiling water bath)

would that decarboxylate it to an extent i could eat bits of hash and get high off it (as ive turned thrc into thc? by the water bath?)
cheers

I just cover the hash with an inch or two of alcohol.

I think the price and availability is a location thing. Here we use 190 proof drinking alcohol at about $21 a liter.

Depending on how old the hash is, it is already partially decarboxylated. Check out the graph I just posted on the decarboxylation thread, which shows the time and temperature relationship to THC levels achieved.

If I were not decarboxylating in the oil bath later, I would be inclined to put the hash on a cookie sheet and bake it at 290F for 7 minutes or 252F for 27.

 

[kuk]

hey grey wolf

I put a 2g lump of my lowest quality hash (still quite nice) in the oven (electric fan, but not sure how accurate) at 120 (around 252F for around 18 minutes, a bit less than you suggested but i think the oven was a bit hotter

the end product was of a highly shiny "coin" of hash, that didnt smell that much during or after cooking (although obviously a bit) and instead of being sticky, non crumbly, pre cook.

when chopped up with a knife it crumbled up into a semi dust which stank of "fuity pine", not as pleasant as pre cook.

anyway ive just sprinkled that 2g in a coffee il report back in an hour

 

[Gray Wolf]

hey grey wolf

I put a 2g lump of my lowest quality hash (still quite nice) in the oven (electric fan, but not sure how accurate) at 120 (around 252F for around 18 minutes, a bit less than you suggested but i think the oven was a bit hotter

the end product was of a highly shiny "coin" of hash, that didnt smell that much during or after cooking (although obviously a bit) and instead of being sticky, non crumbly, pre cook.

when chopped up with a knife it crumbled up into a semi dust which stank of "fuity pine", not as pleasant as pre cook.

anyway ive just sprinkled that 2g in a coffee il report back in an hour

Hee, hee, hee, good lad! I wait with the smell of bait on my breath!

 

[kuk]

well around 1 and half hours in i am very very stoned, i am not really tired stoned but its a but trippy time warped stoned,

very very stoned, but its so different from smoking

i prefer smoking, but i know that this way far healthier (lungs)

should i just lut a smaller lump in coffe next time? 2 g of hash in that coffee, decarboxylated for about 20 mins at supposet 120 fan assisted oven (non digital) temp

im well stgoned here

 

[Gray Wolf]

well around 1 and half hours in i am very very stoned, i am not really tired stoned but its a but trippy time warped stoned,

very very stoned, but its so different from smoking

i prefer smoking, but i know that this way far healthier (lungs)

should i just lut a smaller lump in coffe next time? 2 g of hash in that coffee, decarboxylated for about 20 mins at supposet 120 fan assisted oven (non digital) temp

im well stgoned here

Probably a quarter to half a gram might be a good starting dosage to titrate up. At two grams, I'll bet you have experienced some of the upper limits and have experiences to share.

You must also be a high tolerance patient, or you would have been seriously discobobulated at that dosage.

As you just noted, an ingestion experience is different that a smoking or vaporizing experience.

Way less heady, and at suitable dosage, more of a general feeling of well being, replete with pain relief and muscle relaxiation.

Sounds like you have managed to prep your meds adequately, and I hope you will share more of your experience at a lower dosage. Given your tolerance, I would start with half a gram and work up.

Good lad! Congratulations on experimenting instead of just intellectualizing and talking about it! Ahwooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!1

 

[Fleur]

An easy way to do (but not exactly a tincture) is weed, ethanol and soja lecithin as an emulgator.

 

[kuk]

but you must remember to decarboxylate the weed,

None of me or my friends ever decarboxylated out hash before we sprinkled it in yogurts, cups of tea, or pizzas and it rarely got you stoned enough for it to be anywhere near economical, decarboxylation is crucial and i (and i suspect many others) had no idea this was necessary

grey wolf, I did it again today, this time i ate about a gram (half gram 1 and half hours ago (pretty stoned now) ate 0.5g in some hot milk 10 minutes ago)
still experimenting, however this time the hash didnt come out quite as dry as the last time, and didnt change colour as much, maybe because i turned it down just a touch, to less than 120 for 20 minutes, but its not a digital oven

I will be smoking far less regularly now, which is a great thing, this way lasts way longer and at a lower dose (1/4 of what i had yesterday) is very longlasting, nice high feeling, and you dont get tired for about 5 hours after it, il be really stoned shortly, experimenting downward from 2g lol

grey wolf, il tell you what, even though my oven is very scientific, it means putting hash in an oven for 20 mins at almost its lowest temp significantly increases potency, also it dris it out which makes sticky hash break up far more easily which is far better for solubility in fat or alcohol. so its goot on every account,

in the oven, 252 for 25 minutes, it works

ps thats for hash