cover crop/raised bed help

[mefistyou]

I have SOOOO much to learn, and so much more to read, that I thought I would get some opinions from the "experts" while I continue my education.

I am going to build a raised bed garden in my yard (and a diy hoop row cover to extend my growing season here at 39 deg north).
Along with veggies next year (tomatoes, green peppers, lettuce ect) I was gonna try an early season auto flower run, and then a late season "mini" run (to keep them small). I am going to build the raised beds today, and was wanting to know what sort of cover crop/green manure I could plant now that would be the most beneficial for my needs next year?
My native soil is decent (I have not had it tested). I planned on adding bales of peat, my compost, vermiculite, and worm poo, and some teas, then planting the cover crop. Any help for this complete newb would be greatly appreciated. I dont have much of a budget at all and would rather start getting away from store bought ferts altogether by using green manure, and teas (compost, worm, nettle ect.).

thanks for any help.....now back to learning.

 

[ixnay007]

You're going to plow (shovel, whatever) the cover crop back in?

You could go with the classic nitrogen fixing crops like legumes, something off a list like this:

http://www.groworganic.com/cgy_358.html?welcome=T&theses=7781262

 

[theinkman26]

if you live in a place where mj is illegal then do not
plant there in the ground because if they are found
the police will sees your land just dig holes and put the pot
in the hole do not plant in the ground

 

[jaykush]

what is your climate? weather? winter? each cover crop grows best in a different environemnt. you should choose what would grow best in your area and produce the most biomass.

 

[ngen]

i use to have the most useful cover crop guide, hairy vetch is where it's at if i recall correctly....
but these are decent, many options for different settings:
http://www.mofga.org/Portals/2/Reports/MOFGA FS 10 Green Manures.pdf
http://calshort-lamp.cit.cornell.edu/bjorkman/covercrops/fall.php

if i find the other one i'll post it up, my bookmarks just got messed up.
peace, ngen.

 

[mefistyou]

Thanks for the list Ixnay. Yes, I plan on growing a fall crop, then either chopping it real low and composting, or tilling it in. I like the idea of legumes as one of my option because I can also eat them lol

Jaykush, I am in the midwest at 39 deg north. Great farming all around, but the winters can be a bit rough at times.

Thanks Ngen....looks like I have some reading to do (great, even MORE reading....lol)

I appreciate all the info guys

 

[jaykush]

i am at 38 deg too. up in the sierra nevadas so we get pretty cold winters as well. i use ryegrass as my covercrop. it grows very thick and blocks out any weeds, as well as deep roots and cold hardy. on top of that it produces quite a bit of biomass. oh yea its also very cheap, at the local feed store i can get 2 lbs of seed for 2$. that covers about a 10x20 area really thick. or an even bigger area not as thick but acceptable.

 

[mefistyou]

thanks man....I'll be looking into ryegrass. I have a couple 4'X10'X8" boxes I just built (plus this years traditional garden that's approx. 15'X8'). At the moment I am kind of leaning towards using about 3 or so different cover crops to add some diversity and cover more of my needs......I'm a total newbie tho, and am still very early on in the learning process... not only organics, but all of it. So thanks for taking the time to get me started in the right direction.

So now that these raised beds are built, do you recommend that I till, or not??....I've read conflicting reports. Right now I am leaning towards just getting rid of the sod (maybe tilling a bit and adding perlite/vermiculite), adding the amendments, and being ready to plant the cover crops and letting them do the work.....but I am completely open to suggestions at this stage.

 

[fishheadbob]

I like legume based green manures, but I kill them with weed killer which doesn't fit well into being organic. An annual ryegrass should die off in the cold, but fall seeded oats will definitely die once a few hard frosts hit it. Definitely till your green manure back into the soil. You add lots of organic matter that way, improve soil tilth, and whatever nutrients the cover crop ate are returned to the soil when you do that,
If your new garden is presently grass, that can be hard to till in and expect it to stay away. Scalping it off is probably a better way to go; use it for compost material.

 

[jaykush]

So now that these raised beds are built, do you recommend that I till, or not??....I've read conflicting reports. Right now I am leaning towards just getting rid of the sod (maybe tilling a bit and adding perlite/vermiculite), adding the amendments, and being ready to plant the cover crops and letting them do the work.....but I am completely open to suggestions at this stage.

i personally am all for tilling in the beginning of the soil building process. then once things are going i tend to stop and start top dressing and use soil building plants. as for your lawn sheet mulching thick works well. if your outside i suggest sand and small lavarock in place of perlite and vermiculite. lasts longer, gives you better soil properties.

i am a bit confused though? with the beds built, are they not filled in and the bottom is just grass?

 

[mefistyou]

Jaykush.....right now the beds are just framed in (2"X8"'s) with 4"X4" post's in 2' holes at the corners. I just built a fence and wanted to use the lumber scraps and thought a raised bed was a good way to put them to use. I am now about half way done with removing the sod from inside the frames and adding it to my compost pile. I picked up vermiculite and sand yesterday to add my native soil (its really compact) and will fill in the remainder of the beds with compost, more native soil from the million post holes I dug for the fence, and probably pro-mix (totally open to suggestions here). Hope this helps clarify things......and lava rock huh. never thought of that. interesting. Your full of good info Jay.

Fishheadbob....thanks for the legume recommendation....I am thinking I am going to incorporate them along with some rye-grass and maybe something else. both in my existing garden, and the new beds once they are done.

 

[Microbeman]

If you turn in your first green manure crop for soil mass, you could then seed some red clover thinly and leave it as a companion to your plants. It injects N into the soil (similar to Alfalfa; but doesn't bulk out as much). If it grows too tall or is in the way just cut it back. It makes good tea and is a good anti-cancer herb and immune system booster.

A agree with what I think Jay recommended to till the one time to build the mass of your soil, then topdress, allowing it to mature. The life cycle of soil is very long.

 

[mefistyou]

Thanks microbeman, red clover sounds interesting.

Just an update (in case I am going about something wrong). Sod is removed and composting. I skipped the gym today so decided swinging and axe to break up this dry/hard earth was going to count as my workout.....its kicking my arse! lol but I've gotten down about 1.5 feet. My tiller sucks, so I am just going to use it to break up the smaller stuff and as a mixer. I added stuff I had laying around. so 2 big bags of vermiculite, and 1 bag of play sand. After I till all this together, should I level it and then add my top 6" of pro-mix/compost, or should I mix the compost/pro-mix with the native soil all the way to the bottom (does that make sense?).

thanks

 

[jaykush]

i would personally mix the native soil with the compost/peat mix. and dont feel afraid to go overboard on the compost, you can never have too much.

 

[mefistyou]

so could I just add my compost to peat moss and mix it with my native soil (as opposed to buying pro-mix or something similar)? I am trying to use what I have on hand for the most part, but am going to have to add something to help fill the bed, and I'd like to go as cheap as possible but still get the most bang for my buck. Im worried about peat and it effecting ph.... I do have dol. lime on hand. I have about 40 gallons of compost that is done (i made a 55 gal tumbler a while back)....is that going to be enough for my 4'X10" needs? I started a large compost bin but its not near being ready yet.

I was reading some of your post on teas jaykush....found me some yarrow last night in a field next to my GF house even....still looking for many other weeds that you recommend. I just wanted to say thanks for sharing with the community, and thanks for letting me pick your brain in regards to my new garden.

 

[jaykush]

40 gallons wont be enough for a bed that big, at least for my tastes. you might want to look into the lasagna bed gardening. by far the cheapest way to fill a bed, and with the right materials you will have beautiful black soil full of life in no time.

yarrow makes a great soil stimulant along with lasagna method. fill the beds with material, top with compost/soil. then water in with yarrow extract. get that stuff broken down fast.

 

[mefistyou]

Thanks man.....that is looking like the best method for my needs.

 

[jaykush]

if you end up doing that method along with the soil you have, when doing the "layers" sprinkle some char powder( read terra preta thread) and rock dusts( read soil remineralization thread ) this will increase the fertility and end results of your beds BY FAR.

 

[JackTheGrower]

Alfalfa can improve soil tilth if you have compacted soil. A looser soil helps seedlings extend roots easier.

The basic thing to do is to mix soil amendments into your soil mix and compost. This can advance your soil's biological cycle. Get some microbes processing stuff.

Cover crops are generally a no till thing. So top dressing is what most do with a cover crop.
Top dressing micronized materials is very helpful in establishing a soil food cycle.

So I would compost my base soil with materials. I would top dress with finely ground materials and perhaps plants too.

I did an alfalfa grow here https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=66420&highlight=green+manure

And there is the Flour Thread ( micronizing ) in this forum but I don't see it come up on search atm.

 

[mefistyou]

here is where I stand. I had started digging up the bottom of my bed and adding some amendments (such as worm poo, green-sand, vermiculite, sand, and compost) when I decided to go the layered method to fill the last 8" of my bed. So I lightly tossed all that stuff, put down a layer of cardboard, then alternated layers of green and browns from my newly started compost pile (at a rate of about 2 to 1 browns/greens), along with some more finished compost. I then watered with my yarrow mixture, along with some leftover compost tea for my veggies. How does this sound so far?

I still am considering planting a green manure. Figure I can add a top layer of compost/top soil and plant a mix of different cover crops/green manure. Right now my bed is to the top, but it is all loosely packed in there and will sink as stuff breaks down (I am assuming anyway). please critique and let me know how far off base I am (hopefully I havent messed anything up lol)

Thanks everyone