205w LED vs 400w HID Let the battle begin!

[blazeoneup]

Very nice thread Blaze! You did such a great job on this test! It's nice to see that these lights can work but I see what you are saying about the LED's being efficiant on a smaller scale. I would personally like to see the test done with a HPS but that's just me. In my personal experience, I've found it difficult to get 1 GPW with a 400 HPS but I've put a lot more focus on 1000's instead of 400's and I found it a lot easier to get over 1 GPW with 1000's as opposed to 400's. Verdant stated that his 400 watt uses 500 watts of power which would be 25% more power being used which is pretty high. I don't know if that is true but if it is, it shows that small HID's are less efficiant than 1000 watt HID's. My 1000 Watt HPS only uses 1050 watts so it is using 5% more power. Here are the pictures to show that:



If I had a micro grow, I would be using LED's to maximize my yields for the price but anything over 600 watts, I would use HID's because of how efficiant they can be and for how much space they can use to fill canopies. You have shown that LED's can compete with HID's but to me it seems pretty similar. It has been said in the past that the 205W LED will yield the same as a 400 HID but we can all see that it wasn't true, at least in this test. It's nice to see that you can get a GPW with LED's though, so I'm sure people will be happy about that.

After reading your thread, I see that you are using 30" x 30" for each space. That would be 6.25 square feet of growing space per light. In my opinion, there were too many watts used for the HID space because you used 64 watts per square foot and that is a little much for me. Personally, I don't like to go over 50 Watts per square foot of HID's cause it doesn't translate into more bud weight and it's just throwing extra electricity out the window. I'm sure some of you know what I mean. To have to spend $2,700 for 1000 watts of LED to get 1000 grams is just crazy. It was a great test though!

Actually 30x30 was the intended canopy space, However I ended up over vegging them a little and used the full space, Which was 32"x40"

I done the math early on, The led side was recieving like 26wpsf and the hid side was getting 47wpsf...

I completely agree that LEDS work and work well, I disagree that this 205w lights comparable to a 400w HID. So my findings is LEDS do work and work well, However the stated ratings that a 205w led is comparable to a 400w HID is off base and incorrect....

As it stands LEDS best value and use is for micro setups and smaller headstash grows, Right now the tech is still to expensive to be running any significant rooms with 100% led...

 

[Snype]

Actually 30x30 was the intended canopy space, However I ended up over vegging them a little and used the full space, Which was 32"x40"

I done the math early on, The led side was recieving like 26wpsf and the hid side was getting 47wpsf...

I completely agree that LEDS work and work well, I disagree that this 205w lights comparable to a 400w HID. So my findings is LEDS do work and work well, However the stated ratings that a 205w led is comparable to a 400w HID is off base and incorrect....

As it stands LEDS best value and use is for micro setups and smaller headstash grows, Right now the tech is still to expensive to be running any significant rooms with 100% led...

My apologies on not seeing the rest of your information about your square feet. Really nice thread though and good information. I'm considering getting a few for my VEG room. Good luck with your future grows!

 

[VerdantGreen]

...... Verdant stated that his 400 watt uses 500 watts of power which would be 25% more power being used which is pretty high. I don't know if that is true but if it is,....

hi snype, just to be clear, i didnt say my 400 used 500w, but the two readings i have seen of actual power usage for a 400w hps are 512w from one and 480watts from another (which i think was hazy's).
i have a 250w with the best magnetic ballast and that uses 302w.

VG

 

[Carl Carlson]

re: Q about your previous soil mix

re: Q about your previous soil mix

Hi B1,

Was there any reason in particular that you used the Miracle Gro Organic Garden Soil and not the Organic Potting Mix?

 

[blazeoneup]

Hi B1,

Was there any reason in particular that you used the Miracle Gro Organic Garden Soil and not the Organic Potting Mix?

Well I dont use it anymore, However yeah there was a reason why I used it as apposed to the potting soil, The organic garden soil is heavier and provides much better support and makes the overall mix heavier....

I prefer a mediocre middle with soil, Not to light such as a plain peat moss based mix (soiless type), Not to heavy such as miracle grow organic garden soil, Ones to light and ones to heavy when you mix them together you get a not to light not to heavy mix that is flawless for supporting heavy cola's and plants.

 

[Carl Carlson]

ok thanks. I've got an idea.

 

[Weedsa]

This was an amazing show! Results are very close to what I expected.

 

[alfie moon]

I must say thanks very much for this thread Blaze, its been a brilliant read, I am a complete newbie and was considering the led for stealth but now i can make a decision, Must say it wont be much longer before the tech is much better, but for now i gonna go with the hids.

Cheers

 

[verdecielo]

great thread you are the man Blaze
i learned a lot thanks

 

[epicseeds]

Is anyone familiar with how much savings you would get running a 400w HPS equivalent LED system vs a 400w HPS? Was this ever mentioned in this thread, it was so long!

 

[AOD2012]

yea the 400 hps uses more than 400 watts, while the 205 watt led uses like 180 watts if i remember correctly. feel free to correct me if i am wrong

 

[Guest 107167]

Nice suggestion..a 400W LED vs a 400W CMH.

CMH would win, in my estimation.

I don't think so at all

 

[treefrog]

I agree.. watt for watt LED wins, easily. Even when compared to HID's BULB wattage, which is not the actual wattage at all. So, even if you were to spot HID the eight ball, so to speak, the LED still wins.

 

[fourandtwenty]

i would like to see what the 345watt led would do in the same footprint which would give around 50w/sq ft....

 

[Irie_Lion]

i would like to see what the 345watt led would do in the same footprint which would give around 50w/sq ft....

There is a thread in the grow diaries by a member named The Herbalizor who is currently using the 345w panel in a DR80? 4 plant scrog....check it out!

 

[Centrum]

Good job blaze.

I think your right about the veg part it almost compares to what you see hydro do to a veg plant after seeing soil your whole life.

I dont see big production set ups with leds anytime soon.

I would like to run 4 X 126 on a table to compare along side my 600's, but im not ready to drop $475 a peice for them.
Right now it costs about $0.25 cents per watt to buy an HID light and about $ 3.35 - $3.75 a watt to buy a LED.

I think the idea has been lost somewhere that growers are rich, when most are growing in closets to support there habit or at best to support themselves. Fert, light, and seed companies are really exploiting the wallets and credit of these folk.

Leds are marked up like mad crazy right now, otherwise giving them away for people to show off the results would be unproductive, but we know thats not the case;ledgirl is giving these things away like candy,shes on multiple sites and even having contests to give them away.
So when the greed has been replaced with rational pricing on a competitive level, then we will see what leds are really capable of.

And if we are lucky some truly gifted minds will have a whack at engineering these to better suit and outproduce.

Take it easy Blaze.

 

[Skunk Hound]

nice postings. my brains filling up rather full. how was the light pentration of the leds? how far were they being kept over the plants?

 

[terry the trich]

Well done with the grow.

Well done with the grow.

I'd just like to thank all the people who have bought LEDgirls lights and funded all of the lights she has given away to people. You are all very generous. Imagine how much cheaper those lights could have been if all those freebies hadnt been given away to people for testing/side by side grows. We wouldnt want that now!! lol. It seems that the general conclusion people have come to is that they would have LED for veg and HID for flowering, which is basically what ive been reading for at least a year and a half. I believe we still have a long way to go before led's take over. As for LEDgirl calling herself a scientist, somehow i do not see her as the next Nikola Tesla, but maybe she is.

We would all like to see LED's take over from HID but where the real money is spent on lights, is by people growing for profit. Personal growers grow for their own weed, not for making £10,000 per grow cycle. LEDgirl, seriously i think if you want to make it big you need to make lighting for profit growers as well as personal growers. This must make sense to you. YOU MAKE GROW LIGHTS FOR PROFIT GROWERS, AND YOU WILL THEN BE MAKING B I G M O N E Y. Also attitude has no place in business, and for sure you are alienating people against you and your proucts by having an attitude problem. People can be forgiving, and if you are more light hearted and dont bite at the opinions of some you will have many more customers, and perhaps people will not be alienated by you in the future.
It's better to let people say their opinion and not get all defensive each time. There is no need for being upset by peoples criticism as it gets you nowhere. Surely you are confident in your lighting, so others will be confident too right? Being defensive just makes people think that you are hiding something, and loses you credibility.

Your lights do have good results. We can see that. Look, your lights will sell themselves. You dont need to. Attitude just loses you potential customers, and there is no need for lost customers.
Please please please just read what i am saying here and dont reply to it, just take it in. I am not your enemy. It's better if people warm to you. My comment about freebies was just sarcasm so dont take that seriously. I think a lot of the hostility/drama on here and other forums is due to people feeling offended, ITS JUST WORDS ON A SCREEN. Everyone is entitled to their opinions about things. If you are confident in your product you dont need to defend it. Defending it constantly, makes people think that you arent confident in it or conning people and that will affect sales. If you dont defend it, people will see that it doesnt need defending because it works.

I dont like salesmen or sales bullshit. I buy based on the product itself, and not based on a salesman trying to talk me into buying it. Anway good luck with everything.

 

[VerdantGreen]

terry - just in case you think LEDgirl has taken your advice - you should know that her forum was locked and she hasnt posted since then.

VG

 

[Bobbo4200]

Where is the video?