ICMAG Administration endorses The Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010

[BigBudBill]

Before anyone gets anymore excited over that article that was posted yesterday. Take a look at the entire thing.

http://www.rhdefense.com/blog/marijuana-law/blowing-smoke-proposition-19-medical-marijuana/

Here's the funny part. The dick that posted this yesterday only posted the part that fit his agenda. It was from a blog by Rick Horowitz, who is a friend of, you guessed it, the dragonfly, lol.....

If the dick that posted this would have posted the entire thing, even he admits that he could be wrong in his interpretation. Surprise huh? And he just happens to represent patients under 215, lol...... Seems everyone has an agenda. In my opinion that blog was done for the sole purpose of hoping he could fool people into not being sure so they'd vote no...... When one of the bloggers asked him to stand firm on what it meant, he wouldn't do it.....

Some of the people posting in his blog ripped his ass and that's when he backpeddled. Dragonfly stepped in but most people have made an opinion regarding her.....

Here's what we're going to do. I'm asking that everyone reads this, and if you think that the OP of this article posted this in a way to be sneaky and manipulative, we'll do something to him for wasting all of our time......

of course he did...the end sentence: "I guess another way to see how this plays out is to vote “yes” on Proposition 19. And then just wait until the smoke clears.

evokes images of problems(smoke clears) if you vote yes and his "another way to see to see how this plays out is to vote yes" is an attempt to call a yes vote a gamble.

 

[localhero]

I dump mine AAA+ meds at clubs for 200oz, Feel free to peep my quality on the farm. Ive dropped my prices a $1000 a lb in the last year, yet richard lee's prices stay the same, its only and extra $15,000 a day for richard, that dude truly gives a fuck about sick people

no way, i call bullshit on 1000lbs unless you were hit with some serious blight. and there were mites stuck to your trichs.

ok nevermind i just realized you dropped 1000, not dropped lbs at 1000 dur.

 

[dagnabit]

I dump mine AAA+ meds at clubs for 200oz, Feel free to peep my quality on the farm. Ive dropped my prices a $1000 a lb in the last year, yet richard lee's prices stay the same, its only and extra $15,000 a day for richard, that dude truly gives a fuck about sick people

This category does not contain any images.

i think im clicking the wrong thing?

 

[JJScorpio]

I'm not betting my kids life on it, but I believe the statement "except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9." leaves 215 untouched and in it's current state.

If it were to go to Court for clarification, a Judge would be unable to ignore "except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9." , as it's stated numerous times....

And I believe Richard Lee did this intentionally to protect his interests in medical Cannabis....

 

[BigBudBill]

I'm not betting my kids life on it, but I believe the statement "except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9." leaves 215 untouched and in it's current state.

If it were to go to Court for clarification, a Judge would be unable to ignore "except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9." , as it's stated numerous times....

And I believe Richard Lee did this intentionally to protect his interests in medical Cannabis....

We HAVE a WINNA! Pick a prize, any prize sir!

 

[johnnyla]

"And I believe Richard Lee did this intentionally to protect his interests in medical Cannabis...."

ZING!!!!

he wins either way

 

[localhero]

I'm not betting my kids life on it, but I believe the statement "except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9." leaves 215 untouched and in it's current state.

If it were to go to Court for clarification, a Judge would be unable to ignore "except as permitted under Health and Safety Sections 11362.5 and 11362.7 through 11362.9." , as it's stated numerous times....

And I believe Richard Lee did this intentionally to protect his interests in medical Cannabis....

jj, thats what the lawyer was refering to:

With respect to some parts of Proposition 19, this is not necessarily a problem. In particular — and I think this is what Mr. Lee & Co. focus upon (too much) — the proposed addition of section 11300 to Article 5 of Chapter 5 of Division 10 of the Health & Safety Code probably does not encroach upon the rights of medical marijuana users. The reason for this depends not upon the “notwithstanding” language to which Mr. Lee & Co. tried to point me, but because the words following say, “it is lawful and shall not be a public offense under California law….”
In other words, section 11300 essentially says, “Here are some things that will be legal.” The “notwithstanding” language has the effect of adding, “regardless of what any other law might state.” So, take Health & Safety Code § 11357 which says,

Except as authorized by law, every person who possesses not more than 28.5 grams of marijuana, other than concentrated cannabis, is guilty of a misdemeanor and shall be punished by a fine of not more than one hundred dollars ($100).
​

If Proposition 19 passes, this would no longer be true, because Proposition 19 says,

Notwithstanding any other provision of law, it is lawful and shall not be a public offense…to possess, process, share or transport not more than one ounce of cannabis solely for that individual’s personal consumption, and not for sale.
​

Assuming it passes, Proposition 19, being the newer law, trumps 11357 on this issue. That’s a good thing, because that’s what we want it to do. Additionally, Proposition 19′s proposed section 11300 addition does not trump the medical marijuana laws because while 11300 basically says “regardless of what any other law says, these things are legal,” it does not say, “only these things are legal.” In other words, 11300 provides a list of some things that are legal, regardless of whether some other law says they are not. But it’s not necessarily the only way that things can be legal. Lots of other things, including things allowed by the medical marijuana laws, can be legal, too.

 

[dagnabit]

In other words, 11300 provides a list of some things that are legal, regardless of whether some other law says they are not. But it’s not necessarily the only way that things can be legal. Lots of other things, including things allowed by the medical marijuana laws, can be legal, too.

exactly!

and this is supported by the intent statement's limit enforcement clause.

 

[mule420]

Before anyone gets anymore excited over that article that was posted yesterday. Take a look at the entire thing.

http://www.rhdefense.com/blog/marijuana-law/blowing-smoke-proposition-19-medical-marijuana/

Here's the funny part. The dick that posted this yesterday only posted the part that fit his agenda. It was from a blog by Rick Horowitz, who is a friend of, you guessed it, the dragonfly, lol.....

If the dick that posted this would have posted the entire thing, even he admits that he could be wrong in his interpretation. Surprise huh? And he just happens to represent patients under 215, lol...... Seems everyone has an agenda. In my opinion that blog was done for the sole purpose of hoping he could fool people into not being sure so they'd vote no...... When one of the bloggers asked him to stand firm on what it meant, he wouldn't do it.....

Some of the people posting in his blog ripped his ass and that's when he backpeddled. Dragonfly stepped in but most people have made an opinion regarding her.....

Here's what we're going to do. I'm asking that everyone reads this, and if you think that the OP of this article posted this in a way to be sneaky and manipulative, we'll do something to him for wasting all of our time......

I for one kinda wished he would have added rick's comments after they railed him

 

[gaiusmarius]

well it took 182 pages, but i'm starting to believe that it really will not change anything for the med scene in Cali. till now i thought this aspect might be fought out in courts after 19's passing. it's really helpful of every one to take the time to explain what meaning they take from any part of 19 but also how they got to that conclusion. this is what's gonna help those still unsure to vote yes.

looking at the bigger picture is all very well for an outsider to do, but for those directly involved it's much easier to see the big picture if they don't have to fear a loss of their rights. this makes voting yes for those guys much easier.

just a quick side note though for those saying richard wouldn't shoot his own foot, that's logical, but consider it wouldn't be a foot shot, IF (hypothetically) all med growers are all of a sudden limited to 25sf grows, while they are still allowed to buy more and be sold more and carry more. will they still be allowed to cultivate more? if not, then that means more have to end up buying through the official channels.

dagnabit explained it well though, that not every aspect has to be mentioned for it to be included. this lawyer guy rick was saying some thing similar. in a round about way.

it's great to see this thread getting more analytical and civil, it really raises the whole level of the discussion.

man oh man this is actually quite a historic time to be here. after more then 70 years of lies and demonizing of cannabis, the US has a state about to rebel and declare it legal! pretty incredible really.

 

[localhero]

nice post gaius,

heres my question, after 19 passes:

how many growers or activists here would pledge money to put up a prop that:

1- decriminalized
2- released prisoners currently serving time for marijuana crimes (can you even do this?)
3- allowed possession, without stating how much.
4- overide 19s cultivation limits, setting a maximum unalterable limit of 1 acre, even commercial.
5- set a tax ceiling of 12% on sales.
6- prohibited dry counties.

i know people are reading this thread and not posting, please chime in. this relates heavily to 19 passing and no votes having confidence in the community to not stop at 19.

if you would put money to this, how much?


im askin this also because 19 came from a commercial growers interest. its allowing us a few freedoms in the process, but the money was without a doubt supplied from a special interest foccussing on opening the commercial market.

so, where would the next petition come from? after 19, the big dogs got theirs, they wont be putting up a new one. the money would have to come from in large part, cali growers. so if none of you guys has the balls to put up or shut up, my confidence that there will something better than 19 in our future is totally shot.

 

[BigBudBill]

nice post gaius,

heres my question, after 19 passes:

how many growers or activists here would pledge money to put up a prop that:

1- decriminalized
2- released prisoners currently serving time for marijuana crimes (can you even do this?)
3- allowed possession, without stating how much.
4- overide 19s cultivation limits, setting a maximum unalterable limit of 1 acre, even commercial.
5- set a tax ceiling of 12% on sales.
6- prohibited dry counties.

i know people are reading this thread and not posting, please chime in. this relates heavily to 19 passing and no votes having confidence in the community to not stop at 19.

if you would put money to this, how much?

It will be a matter of a lawyer for a defendant to go in front of a judge and explain that the law for which the defendant is imprisoned no longer valid and petition for release. It will be a case by case situation

 

[subrob]

2- released prisoners currently serving time for marijuana crimes (can you even do this?)

i believe this cannot be done...im not sure, but ive always been under the impression that when a law is changed it does not go retro active

 

[igrowone]

just a quick side note though for those saying richard wouldn't shoot his own foot, that's logical, but consider it wouldn't be a foot shot, IF (hypothetically) all med growers are all of a sudden limited to 25sf grows, while they are still allowed to buy more and be sold more and carry more. will they still be allowed to cultivate more? if not, then that means more have to end up buying through the official channels.

the impression i get of where Lee operates(Oakland and nearby?) are probably the most likely to increase personal growing limits
you'd think Lee would likely anticipate that anyways, very shaky deal to stake a lot of money on(which he has with 19)
and thanks for the good tone post, kind of quiets the air a bit(for a while)

 

[vta]

Another reason to legalize. This guy is a valid med user and needed help from the police, when they arrived they harass the guy that just had a gun to his head...all because he uses cannabis. If cannabis was legal...the cop would of focused on the 'real' crime.



MEDICAL MARIJUANA USER RIPS VALLEJO POLICE INVESTIGATION

A Vallejo man claims he is "the only detective on the case" of his stolen credit card and marijuana-infused brownie, reportedly taken at gunpoint outside a bar early Sunday morning.

The man, who asked that his name not be published, said he and two friends were held up by two armed assailants in a parking lot near the My Office bar on Sacramento Street at about 1:40 a.m.

Vallejo police arriving to retrieve information about the holdup allegedly required proof that the man was legally permitted to possess marijuana. He said he had willingly offered information to a 911 dispatcher that his medical marijuana edible, needed to counteract his insomnia, had been stolen.

"That's the whole reason why they treated me like a criminal, because of the marijuana," the man said. "I just felt like when the cops came out, they threatened to arrest everyone around me when we did nothing."

Vallejo police Lt. Abel Tenorio said he was unfamiliar with the details of the holdup investigation, but said asking for proof of eligibility to carry marijuana is standard procedure.

"Seeing as how it's not covered in the report, I don't know the circumstances of that," Tenorio said. "It looks to me that the officer focused on the robbery."

The man said he tracked the purchases made on his credit card to businesses around his home. In fact, he said he willingly gave the suspects his card's PIN code just so he could track them. When he asked bank and gas station officials to share their surveillance footage of the people making the credit car purchases, however, he was told that only police officers were allowed access.

Tenorio said that four of the department's investigators are investigating two homicides -- one reported the day before and the day of the holdup.

The man, who is not allowed to own a gun because of a recent marijuana possession charge, said he fears for his life.

"They only stole about $40 from me, but my point is if these people don't get off the street, they're going to end up shooting somebody, if they haven't already," the man said.

URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v10/n648/a04.html
Source: Times-Herald, The (Vallejo, CA)
Author: Jessica A. York

 

[localhero]

the timing of a new prop would be critical. if (IF) the current cash holders in the cali cultivation scene are ejected from the game in a few years, there will be almost no hope of funding a new petition and campaign, then it would have to come from dispensary owners who are unsatisfied.

if (IF) the big dogs make it through the fed onslaught, they will be making enough money to mount a fairly severe anti campaign. if it were to take place it would have to during the immediate year or two following 19, im thinking 2012. that way the medium sized growers will be backed up against a wall facing elimination, and still moneyed enough to act.

 

[dagnabit]

nice post gaius,

heres my question, after 19 passes:

how many growers or activists here would pledge money to put up a prop that:

1- decriminalized
2- released prisoners currently serving time for marijuana crimes (can you even do this?)
3- allowed possession, without stating how much.
4- overide 19s cultivation limits, setting a maximum unalterable limit of 1 acre, even commercial.
5- set a tax ceiling of 12% on sales.
6- prohibited dry counties.

i know people are reading this thread and not posting, please chime in. this relates heavily to 19 passing and no votes having confidence in the community to not stop at 19.

if you would put money to this, how much?


im askin this also because 19 came from a commercial growers interest. its allowing us a few freedoms in the process, but the money was without a doubt supplied from a special interest foccussing on opening the commercial market.

so, where would the next petition come from? after 19, the big dogs got theirs, they wont be putting up a new one. the money would have to come from in large part, cali growers. so if none of you guys has the balls to put up or shut up, my confidence that there will something better than 19 in our future is totally shot.

#'s 4 and 6 i cant get with.

4= never maximum limits

6=i appreciate the need for dry counties.

 

[blancorasta]

hey localhero,
i chime in cause you ask,
i think that after prop 19 passes your average pot head is going to become complacent, figure "its legal the fights over" and rest on ones laurels instead of pushing to achieve the objectives you laid out, which if those objectives were accomplished by prop 19 i dont think anyone (except maybe the small % of people who do take advantage of the mmj laws and sell their wares in the black market) would even have any hesitation.

my two pennies

peace

 

[blancorasta]

#'s 4 and 6 i cant get with.

4= never maximum limits

6=i appreciate the need for dry counties.

4 sure
maximum limits are garbage , yet an acre is more than enough to justify personal consumption. (im not argueing)

and yeah if you live in a dry county and dont like it your free to move to another county.

peace

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

nice post gaius,

heres my question, after 19 passes:

how many growers or activists here would pledge money to put up a prop that:

1- decriminalized
2- released prisoners currently serving time for marijuana crimes (can you even do this?)
3- allowed possession, without stating how much.
4- overide 19s cultivation limits, setting a maximum unalterable limit of 1 acre, even commercial.
5- set a tax ceiling of 12% on sales.
6- prohibited dry counties.

i know people are reading this thread and not posting, please chime in. this relates heavily to 19 passing and no votes having confidence in the community to not stop at 19.

if you would put money to this, how much?


im askin this also because 19 came from a commercial growers interest. its allowing us a few freedoms in the process, but the money was without a doubt supplied from a special interest foccussing on opening the commercial market.

so, where would the next petition come from? after 19, the big dogs got theirs, they wont be putting up a new one. the money would have to come from in large part, cali growers. so if none of you guys has the balls to put up or shut up, my confidence that there will something better than 19 in our future is totally shot.

Cali growers all chipping in to come up with almost 2 mil to get another prop passed? Never will happend. Jack Herer couldn't even get em to chip $100k to get his iniative on the ballot...

Not to mention with guidelines like that it would be hugely opposed. Best shot is passing 19 then working to make it better...