ICMAG Administration endorses The Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010

[ReelBusy1]

You guys are funny. Looks like you cant read very well:

"5. A physician who is not the primary treating physician
may still recommend medical marijuana for a patient’s
symptoms. However, it is incumbent upon that physician
to consult with the patient’s primary treating physician or
obtain the appropriate patient records to confirm the
patient’s underlying diagnosis and prior
treatment history."

They obtained the records from me. They used that to justify their recomendation. They are not required to tell my primary that I got the recomendation, at all.

LOL

Many times people do miss little words like "or" that define the true legal meaning of the law.

It's why lawyers get paid so much for their time.

Let's try to avoid so many people having to pay that lawyer ok?

Doing that requires a Yes vote.

 

[dagnabit]

Apparently you if you think you need to register.
This copied and pasted form you posted has nothing to do with my situation as I am not a "caregiver", I am a patient and I certainly dont need to register to protect myself further. The law is plain on that issue.

I. It is not incumbent on a police officer to inquire whether the individual cultivating, possessing, or using marijuana is doing so for medicinal purposes. It is the responsibility of an individual to claim that he/she has an affirmative defense under Proposition 215 as either a "patient" or "caregiver." If an officer does choose to inquire, he/she should use the questions set out under II(B) or II(D). Some prosecutors may favor the approach that an officer always make these inquiries in situations where the circumstances suggest the defense might be used. The officer should check to determine the local prosecutor's policy.

Should the suspect make the claim that he/she has an affirmative defense to criminal sanctions as a patient or caregiver, the officer should detain the person for the purpose of making those inquires necessary to determine whether there is a legitimate affirmative defense. If the individual refuses to provide information, the officer should note that refusal and should proceed with the arrest (or, if the quantity is less than 28.5 grams, citation and confiscation). If the individual agrees to provide information, some suggested questions to be asked are discussed in subparts B and D. In cases where an individual has been taken into custody and the officer wishes to interrogate, Miranda warnings should be given to ensure that any statements produced by interrogation can be used in the prosecution's case-in-chief. DLE 126 (Rev 10/93)

B. Patient Questions

1. What is the nature of your serious illness? How long ago was it diagnosed and by whom?

2. Do you use marijuana to provide relief from this illness? Have you tried other drugs? If so, what drugs? Have you tried Marinol?

3. How many marijuana cigarettes do you smoke per day because of your condition?

4. Do you have written recommendation from a licensed California physician in your possession? May I see it? Do I have your permission to contact the physician to verify this recommendation?

---- [1] Obviously, the number of plants will depend on the circumstances. Typically, , a controlled, indoor grow will result in fewer plants lost as well as better, more uniform quality plants. The other extreme would be an infrequently tended outdoor grow.

5. Have you received an oral recommendation from a physician? Who? When did you obtain permission and what exactly did the doctor say? What is his/her address and telephone number? Do I have your permission to contact him/her to verify this recommendation?

6. Did the physician conduct an examination and make a determination that marijuana would be beneficial?

7. How long have you been seeing the doctor? Has he/she done any follow-up examination to monitor your condition? How often are you examined by the physician?

8. Are you willing to sign an authorization allowing an examination of your medical records? Will you give permission to examine your medical records?
A. If, considering the guidelines and questions set out in section II, the officer still thinks, based on the amount, packaging, circumstances, and the answers to the questions, that he/she has probable cause to believe that the individual has cultivated, possessed, or used marijuana for other than medical purposes, the officer may arrest and book the suspect (or, if appropriate, cite and confiscate).

the form does not effect patients?


please stop trying?

if you want protection from search,seizure,arrest and publication of said arrest in the news YOU MUST HAVE A CARD!

or just vote yes on 19 and dont register with anyone.

please be so kind as to SHOW me where 215 prevents arrest seizure and financial devastation at the hands of LEO?

 

[dagnabit]

LOL _ I really didnt come in here for a fight... but you guys are on the attack... looks like Im wearing teflon today cause you guys havent overcome a single point Ive made. not one.. LOL

other than the fact you DO HAVE TO REGISTER WITH THE STATE TO BE PROTECTED FROM ARREST.

which was proven with internal memos from the cali AG as opposed to you stomping your foot and saying "uh uh not true"

ask steve kubby what happens when you dont register

Please be advised that I am amending my original complaint to include addition information and individuals whom I hold responsible for the treatment my wife and I received while in Placer County custody:
---The two Placer officers who transported us from Tahoe to Auburn.
---The Auburn Jail nurse
---The Auburn Jail medical staff
Placer County Investigator Michael Lyke was physically present at the raid and saw large posters which repeatedly warned that I was a medically disabled cancer patient and that I could die if deprived of my medicine. Those same large posters promised that I would hold anyone who violated my medical rights morally and financially responsible.

Apparently Lyke didn't believe that I was disabled or that I required my medical marijuana. Lyke failed to warn the Auburn jail medical staff of my life-threatening condition and no one at the jail would take my condition seriously.

What Lyke and the Auburn jailers did, by denying me the only medicine that keeps me alive, is no different than depriving a diabetic of their insulin, according to my doctors. Dr. Vincent DeQuattro from USC Medical Center, even told my wife I would probably be dead if I had stayed a fourth day in the Auburn Jail.

The physical and verbal abuse that my wife and I were subjected to by the Placer County Sheriff's officers was willful, malicious and clearly the result of our being medical marijuana patients. Both of us were shocked by the transformation of otherwise well mannered officers into hostile soldiers who barked orders and seemed to go out of their way to make us miserable.

My wife and I were placed into freezing cells, with minimal jail clothing. We repeatedly asked for blankets or clothing, but were told to stop bothering the officers. After several hours of shivering, we were transported to the Auburn Jail, about an hour and half away. One officer drove us from the Tahoe Sheriff's station to about halfway and then transferred us to another officer and vehicle. At the time, there was a raging blizzard, but my wife and I were only allowed lightweight jail clothes and tennis shoes. We were forced to walk in the raging blizzard out to a cold sheriff's van, handcuffed and shivering. We were not allowed to have any blankets and were sternly rebuked when we asked for blankets. Instead we were told that the van would heat up soon and to stop complaining.

When I told the officer I was a terminal cancer patient, he told me something similar to "Don't give me that disabled crap, or you'll really be sorry." That was the same attitude of the officer who transported us on the second leg of our journey to the Auburn Jail. That officer even told me as I was delivered to the jail, "Let me give you some advice, we don't like complainers around here and we have ways of dealing with people like you."

I don't know the names of either of these two officers, but I certainly remember their statements with chilling clarity. I also noticed that another disabled medical marijuana patient reported a similar experience in a recent Sacramento News and Review story entitled, "Did Placer County cops lie under oath to get marijuana convictions?"

Here is the Sacramento News and Review's disturbing account of how Placer officers treat disabled medical marijuana patients:
One of the medical marijuana patients who was helping Baldwin research Grant and Goodpaster's activities was Amy Breeze, a Sacramento resident who had been seriously disabled in a horrendous industrial accident years before. Breeze said in an interview with the SN&R that smoking marijuana had helped her to wean herself off an excessive regimen of pain killers prescribed by doctors. But Tracy Grant and the other members of his narcotics unit didn't seem too interested in hearing about the alleged benefits of medical marijuana when they burst into Breeze's home on Folsom Boulevard early in the morning of Dec. 4, 1998, according to Breeze's account of the raid.

"I asked him not to handcuff me behind my back,' said Breeze. "He said, 'Don't give that disabled bullshit. We've seen you walk. If you keep claiming disability, things will get really bad for you'."

Deputies confiscated 55 marijuana plants and arrested Breeze and her fiancé for cultivation for sale of marijuana, a felony. In a civil suit filed against Grant on Dec. 6 in Sacramento County Superior Court, Breeze alleged "that defendant Grant committed a battery upon her person on Dec. 4, 1998, when in the course of arresting [Breeze], Grant offensively struck, battered, pushed and shoved her in such a manner as to constitute an unreasonable or excessive use of force in effectuating [Breeze's] arrest." In April, the Sacramento County District Attorney's Office dismissed charges against the 38-year-old Breeze for reasons of "medical necessity."

 

[blancorasta]

look at pg 4 regarding Cannabis and it #5 that i want you to look at.

"5. A physician who is not the primary treating physician
may still recommend medical marijuana for a patient’s
symptoms. However, it is incumbent upon that physician
to consult with the patient’s primary treating physician or
obtain the appropriate patient records to confirm the
patient’s underlying diagnosis and prior
treatment history."

http://www.mbc.ca.gov/publications/action_report_2004_07.pdf


you really should educate yourself before you post.

it looks like YOU ARE WRONG!

smokebuddy is not wrong

read you own post,
or
obtain the appropriate patient records to confirm the
patient’s underlying diagnosis and prior
treatment history."

i took a copy of my medical records from my primary doc to a mmj doc without my primary docs knowledge of what for.

 

[Smoke Buddy]

the form does not effect patients?


please stop trying?

if you want protection from search,seizure,arrest and publication of said arrest in the news YOU MUST HAVE A CARD!

or just vote yes on 19 and dont register with anyone.

please be so kind as to SHOW me where 215 prevents arrest seizure and financial devastation at the hands of LEO?

Oh my...
I have a "card" also known as a recomendation. When you get a recomendation, you have complied as far as you need to in order to be a legal patient.
You do NOT NEED A STATE OR COUNTY CARD.
Your posted proof says nothing about an additional card from the state or the county so WTF are you "posting" about?
LOL
This is getting ridiculous.

 

[Rednick]

not really his fault (i know right im defending a prohibitionist) most folks just believe 215 makes them legal.
no one takes the time to talk to leo.
they are given "marching orders" from the AG and those are public record!
they are where the real law lies not in the bills. in the enforcement!

i advise everyone to read the California Attorney General guidelines for the enforcement of state marijuana laws in context of the Compassionate Use Act of 1996 (Proposition 215)

it will scare your pants off how much control they really have!

Exactly,
Now how many cabinet growers get busted in California??? If you are scared to grow in a closet or cabinet in California because you are worried about LEO, then I can't help you, you are just a real pussy. Now if the reason you don't do it is 'cause you are scared of getting robbed and hurt, the law won't change that.

Really Dagnabit,
You are using the same FEAR tactics to get people to vote 'yes', that LEO uses to convince soccer moms that Marijuana is a gateway drug.

Oh, those greedy Prohibisionist fuckers! How about the greedy fuckers that bitch and moan about price, yet don't grow their own. Plenty of people make more money than me in other Proffesional jobs, and they still bitch and moan about price. Just as I bitch and moan about their Hourly Rate. This law will not change that! Niether price, nor bitching about price. They shall both continue indefinately.

It is basic economics. Supply and Demand. The price of anything is what someone is willing to pay for it. Just because YOU think that it is overpriced doesn't make it so.

If you can't afford it, then you should grow it. If you can't grow or afford it, you should probably not smoke it. You probably have bigger problems in life that you should deal with.

People always say they CAN'T, when they really mean they WON'T.
Just as people say they NEED, when they really mean they WANT.

I understand the argument that this is the start of a Domino Effect.
You must understand that you are asking people to risk their livelihood to feed your greed, greed for high quality cannabis with a lower price because you WON'T do it yourself.

{END|SOAPBOX}

 

[CrazyCooter]

First of all, you didnt even bother to answer my first question, which is how can 215 be so great when its taxed, yet 19 is so horrible because its taxed?

Secondly, how foolish are you to believe you are running a "legitimate business" by growing and selling weed out of your house?

Third, how would 19 effect you? Your already growing and selling illegaly under 215, so really what difference would it make?

Oh wait I see the writing on the wall, your just afraid of competition.

Because you know the people who grow on a large scale are intelligent enough to form a truly legitimate business and recieve the liscensing through the localaties to produce cannabis.

So your right, lets keep it illegal and lets keep the large growers going to jail so that YOU can sit with your thumb in your ass watching plants grow while making absoutely no contributions to a country that has given you so god damned much.

Your argument is pathetic and you look like a fool for trying convince us of your view.

Thank god that consumers outnumber producers 100:1. Because if it were for you greedy ignorant micro mini growers, we probably wouldnt even have 215...

So I supppose my advice to you when 19 passes, either step up your game or get the fuck outta dodge.

As for me, I will be more than happy to pay taxes and form a business that is in compliance with 19. Doing what ive always loved, growing high grade cannabis and sharing my love of the plant with others around me in a completly legal atmosphere.

Being able to open up amsterdam style coffeeshops for people to socially interact and share this wonderful plant.

Opening a resort for MJ tourists who want to come and enjoy all the wonderful strides weve made in California.

Working with doctors and scientist to further explore the cannabis genus and all forms of its consumption and production.


Sounds like a peace of heaven to me. And it may just be wishful thinking, but the outcome of CA with 19 sure looks to be more positive than CA without 19....

I did answer your question but let me do it again. If you can lay all your "morality" and "honesty" aside and look at the bottom line you will see that the market currently cornered by the average joe will be taken over by government and big business, also known as fascists. 215 places political power and economic power in the hands of the individual worker in California, keeps corporate competition out, and protects the small time grower from fear of prosecution.

I don't believe that Californians can afford to give any more money to the state, a tax in any form, so it can be passed on to corporations and individuals not in the state. It is a corporate grab at the biggest cash crop in the state dominated by the average Joe. Any fascist knows this is intolerable. Lets just sugar coat the prop with worlds like "legalization" and catch phrases like "end the 800,000 arrests" and see how they react after a lifetime of fascist propaganda.

"If the public becomes more intelligent in its commercial demands, commercial firms will meet the new standards. If it becomes weary of the old methods used to persuade it to accept a given idea or commodity, its leaders will present their appeals more intelligently." Bernays

While I am one up on the fascists in Sacramento I would hold out for a better prop and legalize myself through 215. Patting yourself on the back for taking the "moral" stance of denying medicine to only the sickest of people is a Hollywood story that has trained you to react in positive manner while reinforcing your own slavery.

One last thing, while spelling and using big words don't necessarily make me right, poor grammar and simple sentences are not helping you much. Here is one you might understand.

Piece out!!!

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Yeah were just a bunch of big meany jerks. Its the illegal growers and dealers who are the saints....

Funny how so many of the NOs act like nobody goes to jail for growing a few plants.

Why dont you tell that to my buddy Steve McWilliams who was given 20-to-life for growing 20 plants and commited suicide because he did not want to waste the rest of his precious time on earth behind bars...

Why dont you tell that to my buddy Joe Shmoe whos doing 8 years for running a 3 light op.

or the thousands of other people whos lives and families have been destroyed so people like you can make a few extra dollars.


Heres something, if you want to keep making that money, move out of california. There are plenty of states that thrive on blackmarket and underground sales, but unforunatly for you CALIFORNIA WILL NOT BE ONE OF THEM.

Oh and if the price of cannabis is going to fall to 30/oz or whatever ridiculous ass claim you NOs keep saying, why would the evil mr. richard lee put up over $2,000,000 to get this to pass.

Some people are just too blinded to even see the big picture. Not only will there be plenty of room for r.lee's cheap garbage commercial weed, but there will be room for all growers.

Over 1,000,000lbs of marijuana is consumed in california every year. Once you factor in all the people who have been afraid to smoke or get their 215 card for fear of persecution as well as the huge tourist boom that california will see from the passing of 19 and that 1mil a year is easily going to double, maybe even triple.

Supply and demand my good friends, and i promise you r.lee will not be able to satisfy these numbers even if he was 100 lbs a day.

 

[JJScorpio]

You made a post that ANYONE could go to a doc and be just like you. And then they could be legal and tax free.

That's exactly what you said.

The biggest group of scammers living off the system are the corporate owners and lawmakers. More taxes in any form are not going to help California when the spending goes to corporate profits. Ever hear about Enron?

How do you know how sick I am? Cannabis relieves my condition and I am legal. Period. Sorry to disappoint you JJ but I don't have to lie to anyone to be legal.

Being louder and calling people out only makes your point more valid to you.

Do you know what a fascist or fascism is? It is the union of corporations and government that extracts wealth from the workers of a community through government policy and taxation and transfers the wealth to individuals through corporations and government contracts.

I helped pay for the roads I drive on and Granite Construction takes a huge chunk of what I pay as profit. I called the police when I had a home invasion and they showed up the next day to file a report and said there was nothing they could do. I worked at a school before my job was cut and all the tax dollars I pay go to special education, administration, etc, little to nothing for the kids or teachers.

 

[blancorasta]

Subrob is the only one here making a valid pro prop 19 arguement. most everyone else seems to be a bunch of misinformed out of towners that know nothing of how weed is here in CALI.

i dont care if you can pull 50 lbs a year from 25 square feet. thats a personal consumption limit and you will be unfairly taxed when you consume more.

anyone in CALI who grows weed and gets arrested in an IDIOT. they didnt follow the law, any CALI resident can leagally grow and use cannibis. no one is taking advantage of 215 it was written in a way that allows all to benefit. if people were familiar with CALI and our mmj laws alot of this useless bickering could be avoided.


good luck to all of you guys trying to pass prop 19 through your keyboards, LOL.

why dont you guys leave it to rational arguements between CALIFORNIA residents.

this is the last post i will make in this thread due to the childish behavoir of the members and administrators here.

p.s. i dont take anything said here personally as this is not real life, none of you know who i am. and everyones an online tough guy LOL

peace

 

[dagnabit]

Oh my...
I have a "card" also known as a recomendation. When you get a recomendation, you have complied as far as you need to in order to be a legal patient.
You do NOT NEED A STATE OR COUNTY CARD.
Your posted proof says nothing about an additional card from the state or the county so WTF are you "posting" about?
LOL
This is getting ridiculous.

you obviously did not read the link..

this is getting redonkulus

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

I did answer your question but let me do it again. If you can lay all your "morality" and "honesty" aside and look at the bottom line you will see that the market currently cornered by the average joe will be taken over by government and big business, also known as fascists. 215 places political power and economic power in the hands of the individual worker in California, keeps corporate competition out, and protects the small time grower from fear of prosecution.

I don't believe that Californians can afford to give any more money to the state, a tax in any form, so it can be passed on to corporations and individuals not in the state. It is a corporate grab at the biggest cash crop in the state dominated by the average Joe. Any fascist knows this is intolerable. Lets just sugar coat the prop with worlds like "legalization" and catch phrases like "end the 800,000 arrests" and see how they react after a lifetime of fascist propaganda.

"If the public becomes more intelligent in its commercial demands, commercial firms will meet the new standards. If it becomes weary of the old methods used to persuade it to accept a given idea or commodity, its leaders will present their appeals more intelligently." Bernays

While I am one up on the fascists in Sacramento I would hold out for a better prop and legalize myself through 215. Patting yourself on the back for taking the "moral" stance of denying medicine to only the sickest of people is a Hollywood story that has trained you to react in positive manner while reinforcing your own slavery.

One last thing, while spelling and using big words don't necessarily make me right, poor grammar and simple sentences are not helping you much. Here is one you might understand.

Piece out!!!

I guess you do have to lay morality and honesty aside to justify such a horrible and irresponsible view as "keep marijuana illegal so I dont lose money".

Thats like McDonald's saying "Our big mac has mad cow disease, but just dont tell anyone because we might lose a few dollars. What are a few peoples lifes compared to my profit margins...?"

You dont have any power, you have just fooled yourself into thinking so, and the day you get arrested for illegally selling your cannabis you will find that out.

Jesus I feel like im listening to fox news with all this talk of "poor us" the big old mean corporations are bullying us.....

When did the teabag party come arrive at ICMAG? Its really comical to me to watch you all scramble to make any ridiculous claim to oppose 19.

Do you really think anyone is going to agree with your anti-tax sentiment? Sorry if you dont agree with taxation, but marijuana legalization is not going to be the catalyst for an anti tax movement.

 

[blancorasta]

LOL _ I really didnt come in here for a fight... but you guys are on the attack... looks like Im wearing teflon today cause you guys havent overcome a single point Ive made. not one.. LOL

and none of them are going to, cause none can. spend your time more wisely, somewhere else on the site....or in your legal mmj garden.

peace

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Thought I would re-post this as it has received alot of support from both the NOs and the YESes....

There are 3 players here. The little guys, the middle guys, and the big guys. The middle guys (me, Tr3E, and even Lee) I believe are in for a rude awakening if they believe this thing will open any doors for them in its current form. No, the big guys and little guys (and cannabis) would be the winners here and the rest of us will be shit out of luck for a while I'm afraid. We all want to see it treated like micro-breweries etc, but that will take quite a bit of future shuffling around me thinks. I truly believe this to be the case, that this is the beginning of the end for guys like me. Question my motives if you like but I have like zero desire/ambition to try to compete with big biz nor go swimming around in some giant pool of red-tape.

Maybe we will get squeezed out, maybe we will get bigger. But there is so much more to cannabis then just the growing and selling of it. Money is a great motivater, but I have had it all, from big houses and fancy cars, to living in a single 1 room apartment and a riding a beach cruiser for transportation. Im not worried, I dont need money to be happy, it sure helps, but id like to think it doesnt control my every action...

This is far more important than richard lee, profits, or big biz. This is a movement to keep innocent people from having their lifes destoryed over something as rudimentry as cannabis.

My only incentive for pushing this through with such a passion is I do not want to see any more people have to go to prison for a plant. Sure the way its written many of you will still say that it is open to keep the prision population flourishing, but I just dont believe that will happend. The title of prop 19 it self is far more important than of what is actually in the language and once localities realize how much money can be produced, many of them will write much more leniant laws and issue liscense for production. Than all you need to do is lobby your local representives to help create legislation that helps the people in your area.

I truly believe this is a good thing for all people involved, even if they dont realize it.

If nothing else, this will rocket tourism, increase demand, bring 1000s if not tens of 1000s of new jobs to california, put money back into our communities, legitimize billions of dollars of blackmarket sales, remove all the social taboo that goes along with having a unregulated market and start a social movement across the nation that is no longer hindered by hearsay and propaganda.

 

[Smoke Buddy]

you obviously did not read the link..

this is getting redonkulus

I read it. Maybe you will BOLD the part about the state and/or county card being required in any way and Ill then bow down and admit I was wrong while Im calling my grower friends to alert them that none of us understood the law. We actually need a state card to be legal. a guy from MI on the nets says so.. LOL

 

[Yes4Prop215]

so under 19, where is all the richard lee bud gonna get sold? through the 215 dispensary system? local liquor stores...what is the language in the bill about that shit? what about delivery services? i want some clarity on this, is there a potential for 19 to totally fuck up the court systems ability to prosecute cases like growing or selling. WIll there still be felony distribution charges, or instead some other shit like "unlicensed sale". If it goes under current business laws, arent the fines and penalties for selling shit unlicensed pretty steep?

and also...so you no longer need a card to go into a pot club and buy it?

and say i get busted with 5 pounds in my house, along with all my guns. under 215 im facing a couple years probably, maybe seizure of my guns.

under 19 will i be free and clear? i can say i grew the 5lbs and saved them from my last grows, they cant prove it. then since its legal to possess any amount of cannabis i shouldnt have a gun enhancement charge for committing a felony while in possession of a firearm.

how much safety will 19s passage give current 215 growers/dealers who are operating illegally now. i might be willing to trade a small percentage of revenue for the ability to be able to own guns and have alot of pot at the same time, and to know that the court systems will loose alot of power to prosecute criminal marijuana cases.

 

[ReelBusy1]

the momentum is probably the only positive thing i see about 19....but WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE THIS BILL!!

Because there are no others.
Lee was the only one of many cannabis reformers that reached the electoral finish line.
The rest were dreamers unable to execute their plan effectively.

It's been 14 years since Prop 215.
That's how long it can take.

Should we wait another 14 years until 2024 to keep cannabis users from going to jail?

What guarantees or hopes can you give that will make that sacrifice worthwhile to every cannabis user that faces jail, unemployment and more until then?

Seriously, what more do you want?

Prop 19, Unicorns not included.

Vote Yes baby.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

so under 19, where is all the richard lee bud gonna get sold? through the 215 dispensary system? local liquor stores...what is the language in the bill about that shit? what about delivery services? i want some clarity on this, is there a potential for 19 to totally fuck up the court systems ability to prosecute cases like growing or selling. WIll there still be felony distribution charges, or instead some other shit like "unlicensed sale". If it goes under current business laws, arent the fines and penalties for selling shit unlicensed pretty steep?

Since it gives cities the right to issue liscense for cultivation and sale im assuming you would have to sell what you grow in your town. Maybe this isnt correct, but honestly richard lee's weed is trash, so in my eyes, hes not even a noteworthy competitor. People who rely purely on #s dont give a fuck about quality, to them its how much can i produce at the lowest cost to me and how much return will i see in a retail market. People whove dedicated their life to produce and breeding only the best possible cannabis will have their conneseuir market, and richard lee can have all the crack heads and people who dont care what their weed taste like or effects them as long as they "get high"


and also...so you no longer need a card to go into a pot club and buy it?

correct, if mj is legal you will be able to goto amsterdam style coffeeshops to hang out and smoke and im sure there will be strictly dispensary styled pot shops that do nothing more then act as a canna outlet for anyone 21+

and say i get busted with 5 pounds in my house, along with all my guns. under 215 im facing a couple years probably, maybe seizure of my guns.

You can have any amount in your house and since the DEA and other LEO has been saying 1 plant = 1 pound it will be very easy to say that you grew 500lbs in a 5x5. It doesnt mean its true or possible, but theyve played that game with us for the last 30 years, now its our turn...

under 19 will i be free and clear? i can say i grew the 5lbs and saved them from my last grows, they cant prove it. then since its legal to possess any amount of cannabis i shouldnt have a gun enhancement charge for committing a felony while in possession of a firearm.

im also curious to how firearms would play into this, but it would be to MY belief that since MJ is no longer an illegal substance that it would no longer be a crime for cannabis users to own firearms. ive also heard people say that 215 allows patients to own firearms, however ive yet to see that play out

how much safety will 19s passage give current 215 growers/dealers who are operating illegally now. i might be willing to trade a small percentage of revenue for the ability to be able to own guns and have alot of pot at the same time, and to know that the court systems will loose alot of power to prosecute criminal marijuana cases.

well if you get raided you can always say that whatever your amount is personal. they would need proof that you sold mj illegal, which usually requires an UC to make a purchase from you, as anything else would be nothing more than hearsay. if nothing else i see the local cop stance becoming much more relaxed towards cannabis and if dea gets involved they are going after the 100,000 sqft warehouses and people reaping millions of dollars.


the better question is what might happend if 19 doesnt pass? we all thought carter was going to legalize back in the late 70s. but he never got it passed and as soon as he got out republican reagan came in and upped the war on drugs 10x fold. we cant allow that to happend again.....specialy since we are almost in an identical situation as it was 40 years ago.

19 isnt perfect and im not making it out to be perfect. but rather you think its legalization or not, that is how its being sold in california as well as across the nation.

if you truly want marijuana legalized, 19 is the right step. passing it will say THE PEOPLE SAY YES TO LEGALIZATION, which will help us a hell of a lot more then 19 failing and allowing the GOP right wing fanatics to run with it all the way to 2012 and elect some conservative asshole who may just wage a war on all mj, rather it be medical or not.

this is one of the few times in life where we have a WIN / WIN situataion.

VOTE YES ON 19 !

 

[CrazyCooter]

Because there are no others.
Lee was the only one of many cannabis reformers that reached the electoral finish line.
The rest were dreamers unable to execute their plan effectively.

It's been 14 years since Prop 215.
That's how long it can take.

Should we wait another 14 years until 2024 to keep cannabis users from going to jail?

What guarantees or hopes can you give that will make that sacrifice worthwhile to every cannabis user that faces jail, unemployment and more until then?

Seriously, what more do you want?

Prop 19, Unicorns not included.

Vote Yes baby.

Who over the age of 21 in California is going to jail for an ounce or less? This bill does not go far enough to improve the situation for the average California cannabis consumer.

 

[JJScorpio]

Who over the age of 21 in California is going to jail for an ounce or less? This bill does not go far enough to improve the situation for the average California cannabis consumer.

The thousands of people a year over the age of 21 that get charged with Felonies for small personal grows. That's who.....