Help needed to diagnose this deficiency/issue.

[Sojourner]

Hi everyone. This is my second time trying to grow in coco coir. The last time was pretty much a failure and I ended up transplanting back to soil. I'm giving it a go again, but I've already run into a couple problems. Right now, as a trial run, I've only got one seedling going in coco, the rest are in soil.
The plant in coco appears quite a bit behind my soil plants. It has also started showing some odd leaf spotting, which I believe is some kind of deficiency. I don't recall any of my plants grown in soil to look quite like this before.

I filled out the sick plants form:
How long has this problem been going on? 8 days
What STRAIN are you growing? Dutchgrown - Witche's Weed
What was the establishing technique? (Were the seed or clone?) Seed
What is the age of your plants? 17 days
How long have they been in there mixture they are in now? since germination
How tall are the plants?4 inches
What PHASE are the plants in? (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? seedling
What Technique are you using? Hand watered coco
What substrate/medium are you using? Coco coir
What Nutrient's are you using? General hydroponics flora micro and bloom, Calmag+
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? 3ml flora micro, 4.5ml flora bloom, and 0.5ml calmag+ per gallon
How often are you feeding? Everytime I water
What order are you mixing your nutrients? Flora micro first, then bloom, then calmag+
What is the pH of the "Tank"? The pH of 1 gallon mixed hovers around 6.0-5.8, I add GH pH-down until pH shows 5.5-5.6
How often are you testing your pH/PPM/EC/TDS? I test pH everytime I mix nutes
Are you sure your calibration is correct on your equipment? Yes. Last week I compared my Milwaukee pH meter to pH test strips, results very close[B/]
When was your last watering? Yesterday
When was your last feeding change? None, I've been feeding the same since day 1
What size bulb are you using? One 42 watt CFL and two 13 watt CFLs
How old is the bulbs you are using? less than 3 months
What is the distance to the canopy? approximately 12 inches
What is your RH Factor(Relative Humidity) Hovers between 50 and 60%
What is the canopy temperature? Digital thermometer at plant height shows between 75-80 fahrenheit
What is the Day/Night Temp? Virtually no change, lights on 24/7
What is the current Air Flow? 40cfm
Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its running and not running ? 1 computer fan exhausting at 40cfm, fan on 24/7 passive intake.
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?No. passive intake provides airflow across canopy
Is your water HARD or SOFT? I use bottled water
If using RO,Distilled,mineral water, what is the ppm/EC/TDS without any additives? unknown, I don't have a ppm meter
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned off of or pinched No
Are plant's infected with pest's No



Heres some pictures I took:

Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance

 

[Mr. Greengenes]

Hard to guess the size of the container from the pictures, but they look big for the size of the plants. Too hard to know when to water. They probably don't need much food at this small size either. A big pot full of soilmix provides plenty of nutes if you water infrequently enough to encourage healthy rootgrowth.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Use more Calmag

 

[Kush Farmer]

The plant is still young. You are probably over feeding it. Feed everyother watering. What kind of bottled water are you using (i.e.; spring water, distilled water, purified water)? I also don't see a point in the cal-mag yet. I assume you are using Lucas because the use of Bloom already.

 

[theHIGHlander]

stop adding PH down, 6.0/5.8 is sweet dont change that....you aint feeding to much as there aint a sign of burnt tips on the leafs...

sort your ph and it will all fall into place

keep it green
highlander

 

[Kush Farmer]

stop adding PH down, 6.0/5.8 is sweet dont change that....you aint feeding to much as there aint a sign of burnt tips on the leafs...

sort your ph and it will all fall into place

keep it green
highlander

I wasn't recommending he was over feeding because there were signs of it. I said that because his schedual is pretty stout for how young they are. Better to be proactive. Do you not think it is a bit much? I would barely be using 1/4 strength, every other watering on a baby that age. You?

 

[theHIGHlander]

I wasn't recommending he was over feeding because there were signs of it. I said that because his schedual is pretty stout for how young they are. Better to be proactive. Do you not think it is a bit much? I would barely be using 1/4 strength, every other watering on a baby that age. You?

its never to much unless you see burt tip lol

i start of at 1/4 aswell (first week),,,them my plants get full strenth.....i wouldnt recommend that to people but thats what works for me (maybe because i know my mother that good lol).....i like my plants to have a burnt tip (just a little bit) then i know thats the max thay can take....but again over feeding dont always show with burnt tips you can get the claw happening with to much N = to much food ect ect... (just like the claw my Domanatrix has lol)

i know your werent recommending over feeding bro,,just though i would drop it in there

 

[Core]

maybe you might wanne drop the cal mag and use it only time to time...and not every watering!...(if at all) i say this because most fertillizers do have enough of that stuff in the bottle....you may wanne suppliment a little when needed, but they have limits...1:4 strenght should be good for this plant....i also suggest some perlite next time...just to get the coco more airy....Nhow just sharing my

 

[Kush Farmer]

its never to much unless you see burt tip lol

i start of at 1/4 aswell (first week),,,them my plants get full strenth.....i wouldnt recommend that to people but thats what works for me (maybe because i know my mother that good lol).....i like my plants to have a burnt tip (just a little bit) then i know thats the max thay can take....but again over feeding dont always show with burnt tips you can get the claw happening with to much N = to much food ect ect... (just like the claw my Domanatrix has lol)

i know your werent recommending over feeding bro,,just though i would drop it in there

LOL! I too run familiar strains with a hefty diet. I feel it is better to gluten than starve as my ganja goes. I actually get pretty rough with P/K boosters sometimes. I was more so "rule of thumb"ing for a newer grower. That baby might be three weeks old and she eating like a toddler almost, lol. I like the way you think though.

....i also suggest some perlite next time...just to get the coco more airy....Nhow just sharing my

Good eye on the perlite!!

 

[Koko Nut]

some coir has to be washed or it causes lockout. Get the one with tek in the name. For now, flush flush flush, and get a root excelurator or root protection additive.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Coir needs Cal Mag.

 

[Sojourner]

more information

more information

I am feeding according to the modified lucas formula described in Reservoir'sThe Recipe and H3ad goes Coco threads. I am following the pH range as recommended by these threads.

stop adding PH down, 6.0/5.8 is sweet dont change that....you aint feeding to much as there aint a sign of burnt tips on the leafs...

sort your ph and it will all fall into place

keep it green
highlander

Thank you. Although the rezipe reccomends the pH of 5.5, I am going to follow your advice and give it a go without the pH down.

The plant is still young. You are probably over feeding it. Feed everyother watering. What kind of bottled water are you using (i.e.; spring water, distilled water, purified water)? I also don't see a point in the cal-mag yet. I assume you are using Lucas because the use of Bloom already.

I do not believe I am overfeeding, as I have not seen burnt tips that I normally see with nute burn. Coco is also recommended to be fed with every watering. I am feeding according to the rezipe "Use the above 1/2-strength on seedlings and clones to 10" tall,then feed full-strength>on" The calmag is used because of coco's documented affinity for ca mg ions, causing deficiencies. I am using spring water, specifically labeled "artesian spring"

Use more Calmag

I have been considering bumping the calmag. I may do that next watering.

Hard to guess the size of the container from the pictures, but they look big for the size of the plants. Too hard to know when to water. They probably don't need much food at this small size either. A big pot full of soilmix provides plenty of nutes if you water infrequently enough to encourage healthy rootgrowth.

The container size is 1.5 liters, which is the same container size I use to start all my seedlings. I do not like to have to transplant young plants as I have difficulty with fine motor skills, I'm much too liable to crush, maim, or drop my seedlings if I tried to start in smaller pots and had to transplant.

I wasn't recommending he was over feeding because there were signs of it. I said that because his schedual is pretty stout for how young they are. Better to be proactive. Do you not think it is a bit much? I would barely be using 1/4 strength, every other watering on a baby that age. You?

I do not think it is too much, as I am using a hydro medium which provides no nutrients of its own. All i've read says coco should be fed every watering, except when flushing.

My ppms as calculated for the nutrient mix I am feeding

3ml micro, 4.5ml bloom, no calmag
Nitrogen 48.6
Phosphorus 29.8
Potassium 53.4
Magnesium 20.5
Sulfur S 13.7
Calcium Ca 48.6
Iron Fe 0.97245

3ml micro, 4.5ml bloom, 0.5ml calmag+
Nitrogen 51.4
Phosphorus 29.8
Potassium 53.4
Magnesium 22.1
Sulfur S 13.7
Calcium Ca 53.0
Iron Fe 1.10984
Based on my reading at the hydro section, this seems a fairly light feed suitable for seedlings.

some coir has to be washed or it causes lockout. Get the one with tek in the name. For now, flush flush flush, and get a root excelurator or root protection additive.

I am using a burpee coco brick. I saturated it with water and placed a screen on the bottom of the pot to prevent any coco from running out, I then placed it under the tap and ran approximately 20 gallons through it over the course of an hour. I let it drain thoroughly and then watered it with quarter strength nutrients. I believe I washed everything out that could cause a problem. I am doing some research on root excelurators/root protection additives now. Thanks.

 

[mean mr.mustard]

The leaves look like calcium deficiency to me. There could be varying factors but from the spots alone, especially given that you use straight coco, makes me think that's what it is.

 

[Sojourner]

The leaves look like calcium deficiency to me. There could be varying factors but from the spots alone, especially given that you use straight coco, makes me think that's what it is.

Thanks. That was starting to be my thinking too.


For now, my plan is to increase the calmag to 1ml per gallon, possibly 1.5ml after a few days. I will also try a few waterings with the ph at 5.8. I'll post up pictures if there is any change, good or bad.

 

[Sojourner]

update

update

I'm still learning how to grow in coco, but my little witche's weed appears to be doing better. The new leaves look green and healthy.

Since june 17, I bumped the nutrients to 5/8 strength lucas with additional calmag. Feeding 3.7ml flora micro, 5.6ml flora bloom and 2mL calmag+ at pH 5.6-5.8 per gallon every watering.

Pictures taken today.

My plants started in soil around the same time are big enough to clone off of, but this one in coco is growing quite slowly. Even though it's always been within 10 inches of the CFLs, last week it stretched quite a bit and was wanting to fall over. I cut the bottom out of a clear beer cup and pressed it into the coco around the plant, I filled it just below the leaves with loose dry coco and perlite for support.

It's occurred to me it might just be a runt, but it seems more like it's just stalled out. I'm planning to bump the nutrients up to 3/4 strength next watering and then full strength after that.

I'd of course appreciate any advice or suggestions on any of this.

Thanks