Several questions about growing outdoors. Please help!

[LiveFreeOrDie]

Hi ICMag,

I'm a new grower and I have several clarification questions. I've been reading and lurking, a lot, but if you could help answer even a few of these I'd be extremely grateful.

I'm currently working on an outdoor guerrilla grow this summer. I have a few plants out already, but I want to get as many out in in the next few weeks as I can.

I currently have several plants of several different strains vegging in two stealth towers. Some just germinated two weeks ago, but I have five plants of five different strains (Strawberry Cough, Hashberry, Sensi Star, Ice, and Blackjack) which are about 5" - 8" tall, and which I intend to be mothers. All but the Hashberry are feminized seeds. These plants have been vegging for a while and I expected to have rooted clones transplanted outside by now. No such luck. I should have started germing them a month earlier, I guess. the intended mothers seem to have lost their vigor and are growing very slowly. In fact, I'm just beginning to see 1/2" - 1" shoots sprouting from the main stem. This is very discouraging, because I can't take clones, and at the rate things are going it seems it'll be far to long before I can get clones outside.

I'm looking for any general advice, as well as answers to some of the below questions.

Right now they're vegging under CFLs. I know the sun's more powerful, so am i being counterproductive by keeping the plants inside? I would move them outside to my guerrilla plot, except many of them are the only plants I have of the strain, until I can take clones. If I moved them to my guerrilla spot, what is the likelihood they'll die (pests, weather, animals, etc)? Once outside I can still come back to take clones, so this is what I'm leaning towards so they'll grow much faster. Should I move these mothers outside?

I have some plants (from seed) that are currently growing their third set of leaves and are 3" - 4" tall. Are they mature enough to go out?

I've also neglected to feed them any nutrients so far, so I plan on picking up some early next week. What nutes would you recommend? Is there anything else I can do to speed up growth, particularly in the side shoots? Would topping these plants speed up the growth on the side shoots (how long does it take cannabis to recover from topping)? I know this is a dumb question, but when cloning, does the branch grow back that I cut it from? I should clone from a branch off of the side shoot, not the entire side shoot itself, correct?

My current plots I have selected are between wooded areas and cornfields, out of view of the road. However, I only feel comfortable with a few plants in each of these locations, and I'll need to find more spots soon enough. I do have access to several large wooded areas, but they're heavily wooded in most spots, so the plants won't get a lot of sunlight. Are these poor spots, an will they send my plants directly into flowering? If so, what would be the expected yield of a 4" - 8" plant that goes directly into flowering?

Also, an unrelated question, but what quality of bud can I expect from an outdoor harvest? I know this varies greatly, but with good genetics, I won't be growing shitty bud, right? I want quality. I plan on removing all males.

I've also read about people using "water crystals" outdoors. Where can I buy these? What's the latest one should put plants outside this summer? Late July?

I had big hopes for this season (and still do), and I planned on having 20 - 30 cuttings outside by the 1st week June. Obviously this won't be happening, but I'd like to step up production and efficiency in any and every way possible. That's why I need your help. I've already invested a lot of time and money into this. If you can help me answer any of these questions, I'd appreciate it more than you know.

 

[LiveFreeOrDie]

C'mon ICMag! I could really use your help. I know it's a lot of questions; answering just one or two would be great.

Perhaps this thread would have been better suited for a different section?

 

[Hazy Lady]

Did you top your 'mother' plants to encourage side growth?, your plants can go out any size as long as it is warm enough and the days are long enough for your plants to grow some before they start to bloom.
Generally speaking, as long as the plant has it's needs met, outdoor plants should give the best expression of your strains but with a slightly looser bud than indoor grown.
OK I read it fully now, you would do better if you could get them out, the days are long now and will produce big plants in a matter of weeks, top your's and place outside and you'll be able to take cuts a week faster with ease.
I don't know what nutes to recommend I grow in coco.

I hope this helps you some.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=159846&page=123#post3554400

This thread has more info for outdoor growers than any I have seen, have a read through.

 

[darwinsbulldog]

top them when they've got 4-5 nodes, they should take 1 week or so until you start seeing the laterals at the top you took off growing upwards quickly, doesn't take long at all. if you do a normal top (take 100% of the top) you'll get 2 new shoots (the laterals) if you do the FIM (take 70% of the top off) you'll get 4 new shoots 2 laterals plus 2 out of the bottom 30% of the top you left on the plant. further topping will bush them out even more but you'll need to support them if they get top heaving when flowering.

for me i'd keep them inside and under as much control from pests and the elements as i can until i had clones/back ups before chucking 100% of my stuff outside just in case anything went wrong and they all carcked it. use all the tops you cut off your plants as the clones so you'll have at least 1 per plant. wait a week or two til they root then unleash your plants outside if the clones look good. also in another few weeks the plant will really take off and you should be able to take some clones from lower side branches, these have better rooting/growth hormones so as clones they should take much more quickly = better success rate. doing this will also promote vertical growth of the plant as energy is put into the higher up branches. you can clone from anywhere, some places like the side branches are better than others, but make sure to take a growing shoot, cutting leaves off won't work as far as i know.

nutes wise, it depends what you wanna do, organic or chemical. either will work though i've heard organic will give you better yield etc, at this stage i'd unleash on some organic ferts to mix with your soil or layer on top of your soil like blood and bone or guano etc, water that in and they'll love it! also less chance that you'll overfeed them as it's more slowly releasing and they don't need a great deal at this stage. you can also get seaweed/fish emulsion stuff quite easily from any hardware store that you mix with water that is really good. few bucks a bottle = too easy!

anyway think i've answered most of your questions if i've missed some just ask me mate hope that helped!

darwin

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

YES to all of #1. You have a male factory their LFOD. Get them out from under those cfl's and out the door yesterday. Moms too. If you cut the branch off it wont grow back. If part of the branch is left, it will grow new branches.......
but cut the bottom branches off and use those for clones. The bottom branches are useless, they have no weed on them at the end of the season and they're just a nursery for mould. Let some air in. Clones or not, cut off the bottom branches.

#2. The plants need a minimum of 3 hrs of direct sunlight in order to grow properly or yield anything. Remember as well, the shade will promote mould and powdery mildew. cannabis is a sun lover so... Make sure that wherever you plant, find the southern sky and plant your plants on the southern side of any treeline or bush. The northern side of the bush will be in the shade all day. A compass is the most important tool you can have. Knowing where the southern sky is and the track of the sun across the sky is critical to the guerilla. The growth characteristics of the natural existing vegetation can give you info. Is it getting enough sun? Is it tall and spindly? IS THERE MOSS GROWING ON THE SOIL?

#3 The potency of outdoor bud depends on a number of things. First, genetics. Seeds from potent weed in general produce potent weed. 2nd. Healthy plants produce healthy smoke. Lattitude plays a part. The stronger the sun, the stronger the smoke. You can have decent smoke with less sun, but the more intense the sun.... Finally, Nutes. Too much nitrogen can cause potency and growth problems during flowering. High concentrations of nitrogen and pottassium can drive down the ph, reduce bud size, reduce potency and through the plants effort to dissipate the excess nutrients through the leaves it creates a green house for mould.

#4 Water crystals are of limited use outdoors unless your planting in pots. In pots crystals are beneficial, in ground not so much. If you use crystals in one hole and none in another hole , the 2 plants will need to be watered at virtually the same time if dry weather sets in. There is no noticable difference when the side by side plants are 5' tall.

LFOD, take a small plastic orange juice bottle or my wife drinks" Zero" water and i use those 12 oz bottles. Drill several 1/4" holes in the bottome and bury it beside your little plant, up to the neck. When water is poured into the little buried bottle, it is released below the surface of the soil where the roots can utilize it. If water is poured on theground around the plant, 1/3 evaporates, 1/3 is leached away to the surrounding soil and your plant gets a little. Avoid that with the little bottle.

Make sure and use sand or snail bait. Snails are a seedlings greatest threat.

Seedling cages are helpful.


Good luck

 

[LiveFreeOrDie]

Did you top your 'mother' plants to encourage side growth?, your plants can go out any size as long as it is warm enough and the days are long enough for your plants to grow some before they start to bloom.

Thanks. I topped them all after reading your response a few days ago. Most of the tops died/rotted except for the largest one, but they were so small I expected it. How long should the clones be before I take the cut?

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=159846&page=123#post3554400

This thread has more info for outdoor growers than any I have seen, have a read through.

Thanks, looks like a lot of good info.

for me i'd keep them inside and under as much control from pests and the elements as i can until i had clones/back ups before chucking 100% of my stuff outside just in case anything went wrong and they all carcked it. use all the tops you cut off your plants as the clones so you'll have at least 1 per plant. wait a week or two til they root then unleash your plants outside if the clones look good. also in another few weeks the plant will really take off and you should be able to take some clones from lower side branches, these have better rooting/growth hormones so as clones they should take much more quickly = better success rate. doing this will also promote vertical growth of the plant as energy is put into the higher up branches. you can clone from anywhere, some places like the side branches are better than others, but make sure to take a growing shoot, cutting leaves off won't work as far as i know.

Thanks, wise advice. Once I have clones I'll move them all out. I just feel like currently they're growing so slow and the potential areas for cloning are almost nonexistant.

nutes wise, it depends what you wanna do, organic or chemical. either will work though i've heard organic will give you better yield etc, at this stage i'd unleash on some organic ferts to mix with your soil or layer on top of your soil like blood and bone or guano etc, water that in and they'll love it! also less chance that you'll overfeed them as it's more slowly releasing and they don't need a great deal at this stage. you can also get seaweed/fish emulsion stuff quite easily from any hardware store that you mix with water that is really good. few bucks a bottle = too easy!

Thanks - though I'm new to growing, I've done a lot of research and I feel as if I know a lot about growing. However, nutrients and fertilizers are the topic I'm the least knowledgeable in. I'm okay with chemical nutrients - they're easier to administer, right? I might try both chemical and organic. Are there any chemical ones you'd recommend? Can I find most of these things at a garden section of somewhere like Walmart or Lowes?

Right now I'm planting primarily in the native soil, so I'd like to learn as much as I can about soil mixes/nutrients/feeding. Because of the guerrilla spots, it'd be rather difficult to transport a lot of soil and organic mixes to the spots since they're a long walk through the woods.

YES to all of #1. You have a male factory their LFOD. Get them out from under those cfl's and out the door yesterday. Moms too. If you cut the branch off it wont grow back.

Why do you say I have a male factory? lol. I took a few cuts for clones and will be moving the majority out tomorrow, finally.

but cut the bottom branches off and use those for clones. The bottom branches are useless, they have no weed on them at the end of the season and they're just a nursery for mould. Let some air in. Clones or not, cut off the bottom branches.

Will do. Unforatunely, even on the largest plants, the bottom ones are still so small I'd doubt they'll root.

#2. The plants need a minimum of 3 hrs of direct sunlight in order to grow properly or yield anything. Remember as well, the shade will promote mould and powdery mildew. cannabis is a sun lover so... Make sure that wherever you plant, find the southern sky and plant your plants on the southern side of any treeline or bush. The northern side of the bush will be in the shade all day. A compass is the most important tool you can have. Knowing where the southern sky is and the track of the sun across the sky is critical to the guerilla. The growth characteristics of the natural existing vegetation can give you info. Is it getting enough sun? Is it tall and spindly? IS THERE MOSS GROWING ON THE SOIL?

Thanks, I hadn't heard or read this anywhere. I will keep it in mind. Is just three hours of sunlight enough to keep the plants from going into flower?

Also, how late in the season can I put plants out?

#4 Water crystals are of limited use outdoors unless your planting in pots. In pots crystals are beneficial, in ground not so much. If you use crystals in one hole and none in another hole , the 2 plants will need to be watered at virtually the same time if dry weather sets in. There is no noticable difference when the side by side plants are 5' tall.

I've read of people using them in outdoor guerrilla grows. How often is sufficient to water? I know it depends on a lot of factors. But with average summer temps in the 90s and scarce rain, how often would you water your guerrilla plots?

LFOD, take a small plastic orange juice bottle or my wife drinks" Zero" water and i use those 12 oz bottles. Drill several 1/4" holes in the bottome and bury it beside your little plant, up to the neck. When water is poured into the little buried bottle, it is released below the surface of the soil where the roots can utilize it. If water is poured on theground around the plant, 1/3 evaporates, 1/3 is leached away to the surrounding soil and your plant gets a little. Avoid that with the little bottle.

Wow! Another great peace of advice. Thanks bro. I've never heard of that before, but it makes sense. I will be utilizing that this season.

 

[LiveFreeOrDie]

A few of my selected plots are on the border of woods and some corn fields. I know it varies, but does anyone know when corn is typically harvest? I'm a little concerned that by the end of the season they'll be noticed by those harvesting the corn. Thoughts anyone?

I also hope to take some cuttings tomorrow from those I planted about two weeks ago. Taking clones outdoors, would it be sufficient to take the clones and just wrap them in a wet paper towel and put them in a zip lock baggie until I can transplant them maybe an hour later?

 

[darwinsbulldog]

hey mate. back to cloning, if they're growing slowly, maybe try and raise the temperature around the roots to increases growth and development. one way i've learnt from a guy named high country on here is to get a tub of water, an aquarium heater ($10-$20 max) put it in the tub of water set to about 24C (i think that's about 78F or something) and put another smaller tub that can float on the water with the clones sitting in it. the base of the clones will be warmed well and should grow quicker.

with respect to nutrients and your guerilla site mmmm if it's ages away, you'll have to decide whether you want to visit regularly and only take in small amounts of gear, or less often and have to take it larger amounts. for me, i would probably lug in some blood and bone ferts and maybe some compost etc to have mixed in with the natural soil, you won't need a great deal at first if they're small, and you can just top it up every few weeks until the plants put on size. you can always just take a small bag of it in each time you walk in, 10kgs worth. and top it up each time or just take in a 20kg-30kg bag and leave it there. there's that or there's chem/organic liquid nutes. there are a shit load of brands on the market and i'm still yet to really decide on one over the others, i'm using one called THC (i'm in aus by the way so dunno if you'll have access to the same brand wherever you live) but there're a heap of different brands of liquid nutes, organic or chem, that you can get online. i'd just go with whatever suits your cost and is popular. dutch masters is a world wide brand that is pretty good i hear. buy yourself 1gal of each bottle needed for grow and flower. sometimes they come in part A and B for grow and part A and B for flower as each part can't be mixed together until being applied. cart those in and leave them at your site or premix at home and take in water with the nutes in it. the latter is probably the easiest depending on how big your grow is. you may also want to invest in some insecticides for unwanted animal pests at your site. suss out my guerilla guide link below and scroll through to the pests section. should be a fair bit of info on there etc. anyway hope that's helped mate. if you have any other questions feel free to pm me or ask here.

darwin

 

[wisco61]

Corn depends on the type. If its for people (sweet corn) it will be harvested as early as August. If its for animals (feed corn) it could be as late as Oct. The bigger the field, the more likely its feed corn generally speaking.

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Im sorry Livefreeordie, i shouldnt have used the language "male factory". Its just that my experience has been that the male/ female ratio under artificial lighting results in fewer females than strong halides or even better, the springtime sunshine. Blue light= females. Plus, im a fanatic about getting outdoor plants outdoors as soon as possible. Dont over value my rantings on the subject.

I cut, root and plant right up until July 25

Generally, i would start with 1 gallon of water per plant per week after 12 days without any rain and temps at 85, and with no rain expected in the next 5 days..

If they get just 3 hrs, the will flower a bit sooner than normal but they wont go into flower unless theyve been inside under much longer light periods