Republicans and marijuana

[DiscoBiscuit]

I actually thought this might be a place where Republicans discuss their accomplishments toward decriminalization or even legalization. There are a few decent posts in here but also a few of the usual characters that look for something personal to ridicule.

I think there are Republicans that do well in conversation or debate about issues. And then there are those that see the world as a reflection of their ideas and emotions.

So, to get some of you back on track, I'm interesting in hearing anything relevant to Republicans and marijuana. You can make another boring thread of personal insults if ya want but I think I'll go find some info that backs up my take on the subject.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

hoosier, everybody knows if your pacifier has an R on it, you'll sit in the corner quietly and suck. I'm perfectly capably of debating the other member w/o reducing it to your poo-flinging comments.

Actually, no you are not capable of debating this guy. All you have is rhetoric. Magpie-ish rhetoric at that.

Once again, this post has a specific theme. Republicans and marijuana. Your paranoia over "those who are trying to take our freedoms away" has nothing to do with Republicans and marijuana. You've got a hammer called religiopolitics and everything in your view is a nail.

No, what you seem to miss is that it has EVERYTHING to do with it.

And if you are actually interested, you do a google on a cat named Gatewood Galbraith. I know the man personally and he can teach you a thing or two about our personal freedoms. And fuck all about what party he signs for, because I can tell you he runs on issues, and not party line rhetoric. He is a true conservative that values our freedoms, and he recognizes the huge potential in cannabis.
He is the top fighter we have right now, and folks don't know about him. Just a simple KY lawyer (yeah a rotten lawyer) with a plan.
We need more like him, and less like...welll...let's see...take the whole left wing and that about does it. Save for maybe Barney Frank, who already has a security risk since he was popped for a 1/4lb when they raided his home for being a gay brothel. (shrug)

 

[hoosierdaddy]

I actually thought this might be a place where Republicans discuss their accomplishments toward decriminalization or even legalization.

Yeah, but see right off the bat comes out the hatred and misconceptions of anything "right" of the political spectrum. That stupid shit needs to be cleared up before the real conversations begin.

 

[kmk420kali]

Ron Paul is a libertarian.

You are kinda right--

Ronald Ernest "Ron" Paul (born August 20, 1935) is an American physician and Republican Congressman for the 14th congressional district of Texas. Paul is a member of the Liberty Caucus of Republican congressmen which aims to limit the size and scope of the federal government,[2] and serves on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, the Joint Economic Committee, and the Committee on Financial Services, where he has been an outspoken critic of American foreign and monetary policy. He has gained notoriety for his libertarian positions on many political issues, often clashing with both Republican and Democratic Party leaders. Paul has run for President of the United States twice, first in 1988 as the nominee of the Libertarian Party and again in 2008 as a candidate for the Republican nomination.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Republicans Try Marijuana at Higher Rate Than Democrats

Republicans Try Marijuana at Higher Rate Than Democrats

Posted in Chronicle Blog by David Guard on Mon, 11/26/2007 - 4:07pm

It’ll come as a surprise to most, but Republicans try marijuana at a higher rate than Democrats. A Gallup poll found that 33% of Republicans have tried America’s favorite (and safest) illicit drug while a slightly lower 31% of Democrats have inhaled the celebrated herb.


Thinking back, I remember when it was learned that House Speaker Newt Gingrich, Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, Minnesota Senator Norm Coleman and other Republicans had enjoyed marijuana in their pasts, and I recall the 2002 Republican congressional page scandal in which eleven pot smoker pages sponsored by Republican House members were dismissed subsequent to the discovery of marijuana in their Capitol Hill dormitory. I guess I should have put two and two together.


Politically speaking, the obvious question is “Why doesn’t this translate into more Republican support for marijuana decriminalization or legalization?” Only 21% of Republicans want the herb legalized while 37% of Democrats do. Do Republicans experience different effects? Do they feel guilty after imbibing?
Maybe we just need more Republicans to bring their views on marijuana laws out of the closet. Take Gary Johnson for instance.



The former Republican governor of New Mexico supported the legalization of marijuana in a very public way when he was in office, in fact, he was eager to make it part of his legacy. He also wanted people to understand that he didn’t just “experiment” with the weed: “In running for office during my first term, I offered up the fact that I smoked marijuana. And the media was very quick to say, ‘Oh, so you experimented with marijuana’…No, I smoked marijuana. This is something that I did. I did it along with a lot of other people. But me and my buddies, you know…we enjoyed what we were doing,” said Johnson in 1999.


Of course, there’s another high-profile Republican not shying away from telling people marijuana should be legal -- Republican presidential candidate Ron Paul (R-TX) who has served in Congress for almost 20 years. And, heck, he just recently set the GOP’s one-day fundraising record of $4.3 million. Hmmm, it sure doesn’t seem like his supporters are afraid of his marijuana legalization spiel.


George Shultz, former Secretary of State under Ronald Reagan, also wants marijuana legalized. Almost 20 years ago, he coined an op-ed in the Wall Street Journal to tell people “...We need at least to consider and examine forms of controlled legalization of drugs.”
Another of Reagan’s most trusted aides, Lyn Nofziger, who also worked for Nixon and shares responsibility for unleashing the Reagan drug war on America, joined Rep. Dana Rohrabacher (R-CA) at a 2002 Capitol Hill press conference to support a federal medical marijuana bill and to push President Bush and other Republicans to get onboard. “I've become an advocate of medical marijuana…It is truly compassionate. I sincerely hope the administration can get behind this bill,” he said.


And then there are some of the Republican Party’s luminaries. Highly respected and influential ultra-conservatives like William F. Buckley, Jr. and Milton Friedman have called for marijuana legalization at least since Nixon famously visited Beijing, Hangzhou, and Shanghai in 1972. I suppose the appropriate question is “When will the Republicans decide to take the high road to China on this one?”

Note: It is interesting and important to realize that all of the conservatives whose viewpoints on drug policy were discussed above, save Nofziger, go much further than only wanting marijuana to be legal. In fact, they have either explicitly called for all drugs to be legalized or have strongly alluded to the idea they should be.

http://stopthedrugwar.org/speakeasy_main/2007/nov/26/republicans_try_marijuana_at_hig

Well, that was enlightening. A single writer was able to come up with almost a page of info, spanning decades over the subject of reefer-friendly conservatives. I'm sure there's more.

Another interesting aspect is that we all have something to gain when the fear of arrest and/or incarceration is a thing of the past. Remember, no federal law has been changed and another president can take a different position over Justice Department actions.

I don't put all my eggs in the Libertarian or Democratic baskets. I side with those who don't sweat political affiliation over their common interests towards reform. Peeps that divide over political affiliation will succeed at division, nothing more.

It's my opinion that a few here would rather distinguish their differences politically than to do anything positive (like recognizing a common interest.) As I mentioned earlier, I'm not speaking of Republicans as a whole, just the party and they way they've governed for decades. They just don't appear to be the group that will embrace reform. Lets face it, some will lose when reform is reality. Power to the people has always been seen as less power to the fat cats.

If I'm a fat cat and I don't want my financial boat rocked over reform, I'm going to lobby legislators I feel will best thwart reform. IMO, Republican legislators will stand in the way of reform more than any other party. This isn't a slight to republican voters, it's an opportunity to show what they're doing to help (or at least not obstruct) reform.

Who knows, maybe The Republican Party will adopt a reform plank (not unlike Libertarians.) Maybe they'll relax their moral standards as individuals and more legislators will speak out (not unlike some Democrats.) Until then, the party of personal freedom and responsibility stands more for making us personally responsible for the freedoms we choose to take.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Actually, no you are not capable of debating this guy. All you have is rhetoric. Magpie-ish rhetoric at that.

No, what you seem to miss is that it has EVERYTHING to do with it.

And if you are actually interested, you do a google on a cat named Gatewood Galbraith. I know the man personally and he can teach you a thing or two about our personal freedoms. And fuck all about what party he signs for, because I can tell you he runs on issues, and not party line rhetoric. He is a true conservative that values our freedoms, and he recognizes the huge potential in cannabis.
He is the top fighter we have right now, and folks don't know about him. Just a simple KY lawyer (yeah a rotten lawyer) with a plan.
We need more like him, and less like...welll...let's see...take the whole left wing and that about does it. Save for maybe Barney Frank, who already has a security risk since he was popped for a 1/4lb when they raided his home for being a gay brothel. (shrug)

Galbraith might indeed be a reform warrior. If he's a constitutional WHATEVER, he'll be the last to affect change, IMO. Constitutionalists are like literal religious interpreters. They'll be arguing for decades over what something means while the rest of the world moves around.

BTW, it makes no difference if he's a lawyer. Capitalism embraces all types of (legal) moneymakers. Why the mistrust of lawyers? Because fat cats don't always get their way in court. Can't blame the jury, might as well blame trial lawyers.

Yeah, but see right off the bat comes out the hatred and misconceptions of anything "right" of the political spectrum. That stupid shit needs to be cleared up before the real conversations begin.

But your idea of clearing up the conversation is not unlike the Republican Party fracturing from the inside. You want to get all the like thinkers you can together, then declare everybody thinks like you or isn't worth consideration. You have a hard time grasping the aspect of compromise with peeps you can't have your way with.

I'm not above misconception, I may have brought it here. But I assure you you'll have the opportunity to express your feelings free of a turd throw unless you can't do it yourself. Remember, you told me you respond the way you're responded to. Here's another opportunity.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Republicans Favor Medical Marijuana, Poll Shows

Republicans Favor Medical Marijuana, Poll Shows

By ANDY NEWMAN

Medical marijuana’s support among voters in New York State is so solid that even a substantial majority of Republicans favor its legalization, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released Thursday. The poll found that 71 percent of voters supported medical marijuana, including 55 percent of registered Republicans. The poll numbers seem to confirm others cited by sponsors of the current medical marijuana bill in the Assembly. The poll, on a range of issues before the State Legislature, also found that 75 percent of New York voters support a wage freeze for state workers to help balance the budget, while 78 percent oppose cutting state aid to schools to do so. Gov. David A. Paterson’s proposed tax on sugary sodas, meanwhile, was opposed by 57 percent of voters.

Looks like Republican voters in New York are well ahead of their representatives in Washington. This is exactly what will bring reform, consensus opinion. We're a lot stronger together than we are separated by political differences.

 

[ChronJohn]

37% of self-described Republicans are "very happy" with their lives versus 25% of Democrats. To quote the study, "This big GOP edge in life’s happiness sweepstakes is not a new phenomenon. Ever since the General Social Survey first asked the question in 1972, Republicans have always been happier than Democrats. But the current gap is among the largest on record."

Ignorance is bliss

And I'm being perfectly serious. Maybe democrats are more aware of the issues that present themselves on a daily basis and are, as such, more on edge all the time? I am personally a libertarian, but I side with both Democrats and Republicans on many issues. For example, I am very much a 2nd amendment supporter, but I also think that by cutting out a shit-ton of wasteful spending, we can indeed afford to give every American healthcare. You are correct in saying that neither the Republicans nor Democrats champion cannabis legalization, but at the same time it has been the Democrats who, as of recent, are incrementally dismantling the War on Drugs (see: Jim Webb, Barney Frank, Rockefeller Law reform, crack sentencing disparity reform). Now that is not to say Republicans didn't have a hand in it, but there really aren't many climbing over each other to help either. As an example, look at Barack Obama and John McCain's answer to an MMJ when asked if they will use Federal funds to arrest patients. It's really night and day. But of course, that's where the differences stop. Unfortunately Barack Obama has let politics take over his will to do what is right. We're still dicking around in the middle east, we're still increasing our deficit instead of reducing it, hell they just approved a $3 trillion debt increase. It's absurd. But on the other hand, you have the republicans who turned a budget surplus in a $3.5trillion deficit, it was a Republican (bush) who bailed out both the banks and the car companies and got us involved in the middle east to begin with... my apathy and cynicism in American politics is not unfounded. To me it's all the same shit, different pile, and Americans would be doing themselves a favor by smoking some weed and reading Revolution: A Manifesto by Ron Paul. shit starts to make sense afterward

Yeah, but see right off the bat comes out the hatred and misconceptions of anything "right" of the political spectrum. That stupid shit needs to be cleared up before the real conversations begin.

I agree, personally I think the "right" has the better idea of how our government should be (small, limited interference, sound money, laissez faire economy, keeping out of foreign entanglements) unfortunately they jumped the shark a long time ago and now only neo-cons run the Republican party (and they're highjacking the Tea Party thing too) hence my alignment with the Libertarian party. The LP are what the GOP was, and should have been. But the "powers that be" (and holier-than-thou types) couldn't have that. So here we are. Inching closer and closer to the "Corporate States of America" (thanks Bush SCOTUS )

 

[SpasticGramps]

The modern Republican party is a disgrace to conservative values. Neither side gives two flips about conserving the Constitution. That's long gone.

While argued by some as a flawed document. The spirit of freedom lives in it, but that spirit has been squashed over many decades as states have succeeded power to the federal government.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

I have to agree that the Republican party has abandoned conservative values, but the true disgrace is on the other side of the aisle.

 

[WestCoast4Life]

I always hated how people assume that conservatives don't smoke. Trust me, we smoke down in the GOP too. I would wager that a large amount of people in the ICmag community would identify as a conservative. Human beings have been smoking marijuana for thousands of years before these parties existed.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

...the true disgrace is on the other side of the aisle.

Sorry, wrong topic. The Republican Party hasn't changed in my lifetime. They're still the party of big business. Over the years they've adopted planks along the way, such as smaller government, moral values and gun rights. Reagan preached about big government in the fifties. Goldwater warned of trouble from the religious wing co-opted in the sixties. Not really sure when Republicans grabbed hold of the gun issue but some of my Republican relatives have always been gun toters.

The key word that seems to get Republicans yearning for the good old days is the word conservative. But their definition of conservative doesn't always apply.

Republicans are conservative because they resist change, not some fiscal conservative idea that never happens. Reagan raised taxes twice and tripled the national debt. W added another 5 trillion. Nothing conservative about these two but Republicans hold them up as the best they've got, even though significant fractures within the party are beginning to crumble.

There's one thing that hasn't changed though. Republicans are still the party of big business.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

Maybe because there aren't too many dumb people that own business'?

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

You mean businesses. I'm all for big business getting a break ever once in a while, I just don't like to see it hit the little guy in the process.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

Big business needs no "breaks". What it needs is to let government to get out of it's way and let the free market work. And hitting the little guy is pretty much leftist rhetoric. Big business is not out to get the little guy.

 

[ColBatGuano]

I can't speak for Republicans as a whole but wait until legalization threatens big pharma's bottom line. The party of big business won't change.

I don't understand this sentiment. I have never read a single piece of evidence to support this claim. Contrary to what the choir here may believe, cannabis is not a "wonder drug" capable of curing much of anything. It certainly enhances the quality of life for many, but there hasn't been any definitive evidence that it cures anything. Anecdotal evidence is unreliable, which is why it is generally ignored by science. Hope and promise do not equal certainty.

I don't imagine many diabetics going without insulin, epileptics going without Zarontin or Keppra, or MS patients going off interferon. I have friends who suffer from each, and while they all smoke pot, they also take the "big pharma" designer drugs which keep them healthy.

Big pharma doesn't care about cannabis being legal. As much as we may think they are evil, because occasionally they seem to be "inventing" silly diseases like "not enough eyelashes," those companies and their researchers continue to make products which save lives and increase the well-being of millions of people. Why shouldn't they be able to profit from their endeavors? What makes them different from any other company providing goods or services?

On the topic at hand in this thread, I've lately been using this quote from comedian Lewis Black, who said in his latest show:

"I don't know if you've noticed, but our two-party system is a bowl of shit looking in the mirror at itself."

I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Big business gets more breaks that you'll ever see. We saw what the free market did in the 19th and early 20th centuries. Read some Upton Sinclair to see how big business exploited the masses for profit. It's started happening again since deregulation began 3 decades ago. Since then, it's endured three consecutive busts, (tech, commodities and housing) and is headed in the same direction unless regulations are reintroduced.

 

[xfargox]

I always hated how people assume that conservatives don't smoke. Trust me, we smoke down in the GOP too. I would wager that a large amount of people in the ICmag community would identify as a conservative. Human beings have been smoking marijuana for thousands of years before these parties existed.

I think you're misinterpreting what people think of conservatives. I don't know/care if they smoke. The problem is that the conservative VOTE isn't there. If they smoke, why not want it to be legal? If you're not helping to legalize it for everyone, why does it matter if you smoke or not?

 

[ColBatGuano]

I think you're misinterpreting what people think of conservatives. I don't know/care if they smoke. The problem is that the conservative VOTE isn't there. If they smoke, why not want it to be legal? If you're not helping to legalize it for everyone, why does it matter if you smoke or not?

At the same time, why aren't the Ron Paul's of the party louder than those who espouse the moral authority brand of conservativism? This is where I parted ways with the party. I don't want associate myself with bible-thumping bigots and people who don't "believe" in evolution. At the same time, I am all for saving money, limiting government, and being fair and sensible about taxes (which I think should only be on money you spend--not on money you earn.)

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I don't understand this sentiment. I have never read a single piece of evidence to support this claim. Contrary to what the choir here may believe, cannabis is not a "wonder drug" capable of curing much of anything. It certainly enhances the quality of life for many, but there hasn't been any definitive evidence that it cures anything. Anecdotal evidence is unreliable, which is why it is generally ignored by science. Hope and promise do not equal certainty.

I don't imagine many diabetics going without insulin, epileptics going without Zarontin or Keppra, or MS patients going off interferon. I have friends who suffer from each, and while they all smoke pot, they also take the "big pharma" designer drugs which keep them healthy.

Big pharma doesn't care about cannabis being legal. As much as we may think they are evil, because occasionally they seem to be "inventing" silly diseases like "not enough eyelashes," those companies and their researchers continue to make products which save lives and increase the well-being of millions of people. Why shouldn't they be able to profit from their endeavors? What makes them different from any other company who provides goods or services?

On the topic at hand in this thread, I've lately been using this quote from comedian Lewis Black, who said in his latest show:

"I don't know if you've noticed, but our two-party system is a bowl of shit looking in the mirror at itself."

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Sorry I don't have the figures but the industry has many treatments that involve opiates, pain killers, muscle relaxers...the list is long on the shit they make to pollute peoples heads into thinking they need a new pill on Tuesday.

I don't advocate cannabis for all treatments. There are many things it won't help.

As for the political system, you won't get any argument from me. More political parties is just fine with me but a certain 20% of the population is convinced they're the majority (even though a president was voted in with 69 million votes and congress received the largest majority in years.) Are these 20% going to accept a smaller segment of the population being the majority in control? I doubt it. Republicans have had their opportunity to lead and most of the flock went along with the show. But now we've all been to the circus and seen the clowns and they got voted out last time.