Let's say I break into your house

[SpasticGramps]

I would love nothing more than for the people of the world to recognize that we are all human and not fight.

But, because we live in a global state of anarchy that's impossible IMO. The problem is national self-determinism which leads to a group-think mentality for each nation or state.

If all the states were good and peaceful then everything would be peaceful, but if there is one bad actor, one bad state that decides, "Hey, none of these other guys have any protection, I'm gong to take their stuff," then that's game over for peace right there.

Because now each of the other states must arm itself to protect itself against that one bad actor. One bad apple or one bad state/nation/leader is all it takess. Just one dude in charge to fuck everything up.

I always think there is always going to be that one bad person, that one bad state that is always going to want that little bit more control, power, and money.

The only way around this is a World Government which would mean the power of the world consolidated to the hands of even fewer. That scares me because I believe, while humans can be reasonable as individuals, they become corrupt when acting collectively while holding power over each other.

If humans can ever get past being seduced by power then maybe we can get along, but seeing how security is a byproduct of power and it is natural for any animal to seek security, I think we may be in a bind.

 

[jmansweed]

You invoke the memory of people killed on 9/11 as "diligently" working to support immigrants? They could have just as likely been "diligently" working to support an evil government that allowed or even encouraged their demise that morning to happen. They could have been just as easily been "diligently" working to support a border wall construction to be put up in the coming years. Or a warship to be made from the recovered steel that burned through their bodies that day.

You say we rightfully retaliated? Was that when we let Osama Bin Laden escape in Tora Bora? Or when we killed more than a hundred thousand innocent Iraqi's (Iraq, a country which had nothing to do with 9/11) and decimated their infrastructure?

What exactly does it cost the US as a country to have illegal immigrant workers here? Idk, you seem to have added it all up already so let us know the specifics please. I think the benefit outweighs the negative but can't prove it so I don't say it. One point you make is health care costs. You want reduction in health care costs? Its simple, we go to single payer "socialized medicine" and cover any human that needs care happens to be in our country. Its a simple taxation (oh no he didn't) that you pay instead of your insurance premiums, and it would be cheaper no doubt, so that whenever you or your kid or your neighbor or the bus driver or that illegal immigrant need it they can go to the hospital and get whatever treatment without ever getting a bill meant to bankrupt you or them. Sounds like a cheaper better system than our current one no? Yet folks want to keep oppressing and suppressing others why? In the name of keeping the government small? That is ludicrous, we have embassies in most countries on the planet, are fighting several wars, are we not growing our government by doing things like this? Yet when do Americans see any of the pie for the things they need like education, like health care, like a 21st century infrastructure?

They were working, to support themselves, and yes illegal immigrants also. Not ONLY illegal immigrants. I don't support our governments current tactics and stated that clearly. I also believe we were rightfully entitled to respond. I did not say I agree our response was appropriate. I agree Iraq has little association with Osama Bin Laden, hence the reason I never mentioned it? My point is we don't need warships - we need to rethink our strategies.

I don't know specifics and your correct - on a public forum I should state facts only, in regards to a discussion of this nature. I in no way meant to imply our system is solid. Health care indeed needs over haul. Our general priorities need rethinking. Currently however, I'm well aware the system is breaking our backs in many ways.

I do not support the war and like many of us have lost loved ones as a result of it. This thread is about illegal immigration and a clever way to describe it. I stay away from these things because politics is so all encompassing it's hard to avoid. I appreciate your pov. My point was to defend someones obvious misunderstanding of immigration - not to argue the USA war policies..........I'll continue I suppose to avoid these threads. Happy Smoking - I need to trim some beautiful Reclining Buddha and smoke some scissor hash

Peace,

Jman

 

[Kaneh]

It's called war, we got more than enough bullets for every single terrorist on the planet, including all of their pathetic and weak offspring. I haven't heard about any complete capitulation yet, so the war will continue.

Yep, Just look like good your doing with war on drugs!
Oh, and in Iraq also, "mission accomplished!" RIGHT? ;D

 

[greenhead]

Yep, Just look like good your doing with war on drugs!
Oh, and in Iraq also, "mission accomplished!" RIGHT? ;D

The war on drugs is retarded. That doesn't mean that all wars are bad.

 

[rootfingers]

All wars are definitely bad.

 

[xfargox]

Weapons are the tools of violence;
all decent men detest them.

Weapons are the tools of fear;
a decent man will avoid them
except in the direst necessity
and, if compelled, will use them
only with the utmost restraint.
Peace is his highest value.
If the peace has been shattered,
how can he be content?
His enemies are not demons,
but human beings like himself.
He doesn't wish them personal harm.
Nor does he rejoice in victory.
How could he rejoice in victory
and delight in the slaughter of men?

He enters a battle gravely,
with sorrow and with great compassion,
as if he were attending a funeral.

 

[greenhead]

All wars are definitely bad.

History disagrees with that statement.

 

[xfargox]

History disagrees with that statement.

History says some wars were successful, and accomplished things.

However, low quality weed will get you high. Does that mean it's the best option?

Imagine if we worked with unity, and used reason to solve our problems. The victor of a war is not always the person who was "right." This is because war is not about right and wrong, it's about whoever has the biggest muscles. Hell, war ignores the basic tenants of what we were taught in kindergarten. Especially considering how many wars were fought over land and whatnot.

 

[greenhead]

Imagine if we worked with unity, and used reason to solve our problems.

You are free to imagine that, but it will remain a fantasy.

You can not reason with psychos or a group or country that is intent on conquering others, it simply doesn't work and history has proven over and over again that it doesn't work. The only language they understand is force.

 

[greenhead]

This is because war is not about right and wrong, it's about whoever has the biggest muscles.

When you're right and you also happen to have the biggest muscles, then it's all good. Right or wrong is not judged by who is the strongest.

 

[Zoolander]

Bring those muscles to a gun fight and see who walks away . You live in a dream so let me know when Santa and the Easter Bunny get home

 

[greenhead]

Bring those muscles to a gun fight and see who walks away .

And that was the whole point - Nobody can outgun us.

 

[JamieShoes]

EDIT - I'm addressing a 3 yr old post.. nice ressurection, but I'm only interested in answering the OP

 

[greenhead]

quite right.. the US should not allow ANY immigrants...

I believe that you left out the word "ILLEGAL" in your post. I'm sure it was just a small error on your part.

 

[jmansweed]

hXXp://immigrationcounters.com/

 

[bombadil.360]

the paradox with legal vs. illegal immigration resides in the fact that to be able to move to the U.S legally and be able to work, you have to already be doing pretty well in your home country; so many people who could immigrate legally don't because what is the point? it is the people who have it the most rough in their own home country that opt to illegally cross the boarder, but they do it knowingly that there is demand for illegal workers in the U.S, a demand which is greater than the demand for legal workers in their home countries.

it is crazy to think a country does not have enough work for its people... when actually there is never not enough work.

 

[blinx420]

It's very simple they get hired by greedy busnesses if there are no jobs they wouldn't be here.

Now that there are no jobs in cali alot are heading back to mexico so all the goverment would've ever had to do is pass a law to tackle busnesses that hire immigrants with stolen SSN to be held accountable with fines and possible prison time an create a task force to enforce it.

Only problem is the politicians are funded by those same companies donating for there campaigns an such so those companies that are making a killing paying minimum wage to illegals persuade politicians in there favor in the words never gonna happen.

 

[rootfingers]

Weapons are the tools of violence;
all decent men detest them.

Weapons are the tools of fear;
a decent man will avoid them
except in the direst necessity
and, if compelled, will use them
only with the utmost restraint.
Peace is his highest value.
If the peace has been shattered,
how can he be content?
His enemies are not demons,
but human beings like himself.
He doesn't wish them personal harm.
Nor does he rejoice in victory.
How could he rejoice in victory
and delight in the slaughter of men?

He enters a battle gravely,
with sorrow and with great compassion,
as if he were attending a funeral.

.

 

[the lonely shoe]

if you broke into my house ,my hamsters would eat you
be warned they're from Russia

oh and i feed them to the snakes

 

[stihgnobevoli]

no man owns any part of this planet, we are all "illegal immigrants" in the strictest sense. yet we go around like we own the place. digging up the ground for "treasures" putting up fences and staking out borders on a place none of us has a right to. we all die at the end of the day so how can anyone purport to own any part of the planet or deny anyone else from any part of it?

my 2 pesos'.