soil/coco tips?

[guest1ab]

***** thread moved *****
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thanks to gaiusmarius for moving my thread. So.. I'm trying to figure out if there are any special considerations in a coir based mix, basically. I'm looking to get some soil:coco synergy going, if possible. There's not a lot of info on coconut coir/soil mixes here (at least there wasn't in the coco coir forum)...

Thank you.
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What's the word on coco/soil mixes?

If you were to use an organic soil with the beneficial microbes, mycorrhizae, and everything, how well would that work with coco?

I'll probably sound like a noob asking this (which I am!), but FoxFarm recommends their Big Bloom to help prevent salt buildup in coco coir....Is there anything to that? We're bound to hear from some Fox Farm haterz, but if bene's improve coco and coco improves soil, it seems like a coco/soil mix would be nice.

For an outdoors application, this is what I have in mind:
50/50 coco:soil (FoxFarm Happy Frog)
+dolomite lime (to supplement calcium & magnesium)?
+FoxFarm Light Warrior (drainage + mycorrhizae)

topdress with guano in bloom

....All in 2 gallon (for AF) or 5 gallon (non AF) bags, burried with a few inches of sand or gravel below to aid drainage.

Am I on the right track so far?

 

[DocLeaf]

What's the word on coco/soil mixes?

If you were to use an organic soil with the beneficial microbes, mycorrhizae, and everything, how well would that work with coco?

Just fine.

Last season we used coco/soil mixes with added guano and wormcast,, (photos in gallery)... and found that a mixed soil/coco media was more responsive to feeds of guano tea than in soil.

Use fresh coco where possible,, and with 2nd hand coco wash before mixing to remove any residual salts.

Plants also root faster in coco/soil than they do in soil.

Outdoors.. added coco tends to reduce soil temps,, so in winter and spring months this makes the growing medium colder .!

Hope this helps

Overall,, yes you're on track.. All the best

 

[guest1ab]

thanks Doc!

 

[guest1ab]

Is the dolomite a good idea do you think?

 

[whadeezlrg]

my very first run indoors was a ffof and canna mix with pbp nutes, it's what got me hooked on growing, easy and with good results. I don't think you'd be dissapointed. something to consider, I saw 50l bags of black gold coco/soil at a local NURSERY for about $5 a bag...helluva deal imho. good luck! hopefully someone else will chime in with an answer about the lime, I don't want to comment on something I have little experience with.

 

[*mistress*]

this may be helpful:

goalre-fertilized coco+water only
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=126834

enjoy your garden!

 

[ChaosCatalunya]

Just fine.

Last season we used coco/soil mixes with added guano and wormcast,, (photos in gallery)... and found that a mixed soil/coco media was more responsive to feeds of guano tea than in soil.

Use fresh coco where possible,, and with 2nd hand coco wash before mixing to remove any residual salts.

Plants also root faster in coco/soil than they do in soil.

Outdoors.. added coco tends to reduce soil temps,, so in winter and spring months this makes the growing medium colder .!

Hope this helps

Overall,, yes you're on track.. All the best

Dang, I did not know this and have only just shaken off a Winter Cold problem in my Coco plants, next Winter it will be Soil and/or NFT. Coco will eventually heat up indoors, but takes a day or two with the heater on.

Second hand Coco and Runoff feed work great on the rest of your garden, rooting cuttings of all sorts of plants is way easier in Coco as you cannot rot the fledgling roots.

 

[Castelvetro]

your mix sounds very interesting, im over straight coco myself, just dont like its rhythm if u will and performance, i think it can be improved. i may run coco,perlite, worm castings or even a blend of ffof and coco, i like that hydro erbs smells less while growing, the stealth factor appeals to me, my first run was with coco plus little rich compost n lime, plants liked it, now im on straight coco, plants also like it but looked better my previous grow. some folks have more ph issues with a mix, some less.

 

[guest1ab]

Thanks for the comeback, people!

whadeezlrg - I'm hearing that. FF soil certainly isn't cheap in my area..thanks 4 the heads up. It looks like that's got some dolomite in it too, btw, but it's also got a lot of peat in it so maybe for different reasons.

*mistress* - definitely an eye-opener. k+!

 

[guest1ab]

your mix sounds very interesting, im over straight coco myself, just dont like its rhythm if u will and performance, i think it can be improved. i may run coco,perlite, worm castings or even a blend of ffof and coco, i like that hydro erbs smells less while growing, the stealth factor appeals to me, my first run was with coco plus little rich compost n lime, plants liked it, now im on straight coco, plants also like it but looked better my previous grow. some folks have more ph issues with a mix, some less.

how much coco did you use?
I'm guessing if you want to mix it with soil you would want the pH a little higher (like a soil) than with straight coco. I'm guessing....

I gotta go figure out what this 6/9 ratio thing is about, this stuff is complicated.

 

[guest1ab]

thanks to gaiusmarius for moving my thread. So.. I'm trying to figure out if there are any special considerations in a coir based mix, basically. I'm looking to get some soil:coco synergy going, if possible. There's not a lot of info on coconut coir/soil mixes here (at least there wasn't in the coco coir forum)...

Thank you.

 

[whadeezlrg]

just mix 33/33/33 coco/soil/perlite and run pbp soil/coco formula I'd prob let the ph be 6.0-6.5 myself and get ready to harvest some nice buddage, ain't nothin to it but to do it so get started mang!

 

[guest1ab]

just mix 33/33/33 coco/soil/perlite and run pbp soil/coco formula I'd prob let the ph be 6.0-6.5 myself and get ready to harvest some nice buddage, ain't nothin to it but to do it so get started mang!

hehehe... and maybe .01 tar, like in Superman III?

It'll be a while before I'm able to grow any buds. I guess I could try a few things this summer in the veggie garden. I found some really nice compost yesterday.

 

[guest1ab]

Alright let me know what you all (all of you experienced organic growers) think of this mix..please?

50% compost/humus (I found a good local source for this... score!)
50% long-fiber coco
Dolomite lime at 2tbsp/gallon
Espoma organics Sea Kelp at recommended levels
just a little bit of high P guano (I'm trying for the 3-1-2 NPK base)
Gypsum at 1/4 cup/gallon (see below)
Azomite or Rock Powder - 1tbsp/gal

I'd also like to use maybe 1/4 cup of used coffee grinds/gallon, to supplement Nitrogen but I don't want to over-do it... I don't want to have too much N when the plants go into flower. Hopefully at 1/4 cup/gallon it won't be too "hot", and I'll just get a nice steady amount.

I'm adding the Gypsum to improve water retention, supplement Ca and S, and because I'm told coco (when it decomposes, I assume) has a lot of Mg but not a lot of Ca.

I'm also trying to take advantage of the high CEC of the coir, but I'm concerned that maybe 2tbsp. of Dolomite plus 1/4 cup of Gypsum would be too much Ca (ie. I might get a buildup of Ca)?

Any thoughts? Does anything there stick out being wrong?


Thanks in advance...

 

[guest1ab]

oh yeah... the other thing is I don't know what's in the compost or it's composition.

I'm sort of trying to compensate for that unknown by adding "just enough" of a few essentials.

 

[Stoned Crow]

Last season we used coco/soil mixes with added guano and wormcast,, (photos in gallery)... and found that a mixed soil/coco media was more responsive to feeds of guano tea than in soil.

Doc~

I've been thinking for a while about adding coco to my homemade mix, but I've read a couple different places that it acts somewhat like a cutting additive, therefore you have to use a bit more nutes. Was this your experience?

I've been eying coco for too long, I think I'm going to have to bring it in to my mix in 10% increments.....SC

 

[mycoboto]

i've had excellent results with coco coir grows. it's the closest thing to hydro in a soiless medium. you can get good results by just using plain coco coir and add in all your beneficial bacteria, carbohydrates, mycorrhizae, micro and macro nutrients. but here lately ive been mixing a 1/4 perlite, 1/4 coco coir, and a 1/4 vermiculite, and a 1/4 of humus, worm casting, and/or compost. I don't put any gypsum in it because gypsum is used to areate clay soils, plus the calmag is what i use is necessary. no lime cause everything in the mix is already pretty close to neutral, and any ph problems can be fixed with the nutrient solution. i think i should have good results. the main thing to remember is to feed lightly and frequently. even when the plant is mature ppm readings shouldn't exceed 600-800. and if your using reverse osmosis or distilled water you will need to supplement with calmag if it's not already available in the fertilizer or nutrients you are using. some nutrients or fertilizers already have magnesium and calcium in them so just check the back of the bottle. when the plants are small i feed with a nutrient solution of about 200-250 ppm and i have well water that reads about 20ppm before adding nutes. ive heard of some ppl putting a small amount of shredded wheat straw to their soiless mix to add carbohydrates, but you could easily just add molasses to your nutes.

 

[stlsoldier531]

Alright let me know what you all (all of you experienced organic growers) think of this mix..please?

50% compost/humus (I found a good local source for this... score!)
50% long-fiber coco
Dolomite lime at 2tbsp/gallon
Espoma organics Sea Kelp at recommended levels
just a little bit of high P guano (I'm trying for the 3-1-2 NPK base)
Gypsum at 1/4 cup/gallon (see below)
Azomite or Rock Powder - 1tbsp/gal

I'd also like to use maybe 1/4 cup of used coffee grinds/gallon, to supplement Nitrogen but I don't want to over-do it... I don't want to have too much N when the plants go into flower. Hopefully at 1/4 cup/gallon it won't be too "hot", and I'll just get a nice steady amount.

I'm adding the Gypsum to improve water retention, supplement Ca and S, and because I'm told coco (when it decomposes, I assume) has a lot of Mg but not a lot of Ca.

I'm also trying to take advantage of the high CEC of the coir, but I'm concerned that maybe 2tbsp. of Dolomite plus 1/4 cup of Gypsum would be too much Ca (ie. I might get a buildup of Ca)?

Any thoughts? Does anything there stick out being wrong?


Thanks in advance...

Adding both in small amounts wouldn't hurt anything..

 

[stlsoldier531]

Azomite would also be a good benefit to the mix

 

[FreshlyShaven]

Alright let me know what you all (all of you experienced organic growers) think of this mix..please?

50% compost/humus (I found a good local source for this... score!)
50% long-fiber coco
Dolomite lime at 2tbsp/gallon
Espoma organics Sea Kelp at recommended levels
just a little bit of high P guano (I'm trying for the 3-1-2 NPK base)
Gypsum at 1/4 cup/gallon (see below)
Azomite or Rock Powder - 1tbsp/gal

I'd also like to use maybe 1/4 cup of used coffee grinds/gallon, to supplement Nitrogen but I don't want to over-do it... I don't want to have too much N when the plants go into flower. Hopefully at 1/4 cup/gallon it won't be too "hot", and I'll just get a nice steady amount.

I'm adding the Gypsum to improve water retention, supplement Ca and S, and because I'm told coco (when it decomposes, I assume) has a lot of Mg but not a lot of Ca.

I'm also trying to take advantage of the high CEC of the coir, but I'm concerned that maybe 2tbsp. of Dolomite plus 1/4 cup of Gypsum would be too much Ca (ie. I might get a buildup of Ca)?

Any thoughts? Does anything there stick out being wrong?


Thanks in advance...

Sounds mostly good to me. A couple of suggestions: You could get rid of the coffee grounds and use some alfalfa meal or well-ground alfalfa pellets(at no more than 1 tablespoon per gallon) since alfalfa not only provides nitrogen but also has growth-promoting properties.
If you're growing nitrogen-sensitive strains, you should definitely reduce the 1 tablespoon per gallon ratio. Coffee grounds on their own aren't a very strong nitrogen source since the nitrogen isn't very easily available to the plant.

Also, you should probably increase the coco to compost ratio a little bit. Compost makes a great soil amendment but is not really an ideal medium. 2:1 would probably be a better ratio in my limited experience, but I'm sure there are going to be those who disagree.