Looking for FloraNova alternatives.

[GrowerGoneWild]

I should emphasize that I'm a soil, and to a lesser extent, soiless grower. Many of you guys are talking straight hydro, and I can't vouch for Maxi's performance in that medium, although I imagine it would work as well or better than FN.

Good to know, I am talking strictly hydro applications only.

Thanks for clearing that up.. Now I understand why your PH was kinda high, those were values for soil.

I'll have to do a little write up maxi. I have a little room in my garden to do a DWC trial of Maxibloom, before I change over.

 

[GrowerGoneWild]

I use both (gro and bloom). If you're using them with tap that has 100-200ppm of dissolved solids, you don't have to add Cal-Mag b/c it's already in the tap. The problem with tap is that most municipalities are switching to chloramines (sp?) as opposed to standard chlorine. Chloramines do not evaporate out of solution, no matter what you do, whereas chlorine will after about 24 hours.

I know my municipality is making the switch to chloramines, so I'm probably going to go with RO or distilled, with about 1ml per gallon of Cal-Mag (Bontanicare) added prior to mixing in the Maxi. MaxiBloom and MaxiGro are "simple" one part nutes, which effectively means they were designed to be used with tap, which has present roughly 50-100ppm of dissolved cal-mag on average, once you factor out all the other junk that's in there.

In other words, MaxiBloom and MaxiGro most likely lack the levels of Cal (and perhaps Mag) needed to take a crop to harvest. If you're using a soil or soiless mix that has a good shot of calcium (via bone meal or other), you may not have to worry about this, depending upon how large you grow your plants. But most growers and most situations, even the ones using the aforementioned mixes, will probably benefit by adding 1ml a gallon of cal-mag.

If you wanted to keep it real simple, you can use Maxi with RO or distilled, and then add dried and powdered egg shells to the top of your soil/soiless mix. When you water, a little bit of calcium will leach down into the soil. This is, of course, not nearly as precise as metering out a dose of Cal-Mag, but it'll get the job done K.I.S.S. style. If you're growing hydro, I'd imagine Cal-Mag would be the only alternative if you're not using tap.

Interesting point on chloramines, I usually carbon filter my water. I suppose those than have to deal with chlorine could simply use a product like decholr juice. But that's just another added cost, a shame that you couldn't let it sit like the good old days.

Cal-Mag deff, can be made up with epsoms. I'm not too worried about Cal, most water tends to have that, its the Magnesium that the water lacks. Or just throw a couple bottles of San Pelegrino mineral water in the mix. Hey, its cheaper than cal-mag

Cool thought on the eggshells, but wouldnt the delivery be more consistent using something like food grade calcium carbonate like tums antacid? (calcium carbonate).

I know.. off topic, but thanks for posting that stuff. I like it when I can get all kinds of grwo tips.

 

[*mistress*]

2 tsp sounds like a lot per gallon, 3-5ml is what i usually used. I don't think he meant 2 tsp, he probably just made a mistake.

One thing i'm wonder is, for Pro-Mix i was told to use 3ml every watering or 8ml every 3 waterings when i was using FloraNova. With this i'm assuming i just use 1 tsp per gallon even if i'm using promix and feeding every watering right? I'm just wondering, because Pro-Mix seems to take nutes differently compared to other mediums and this will be my first time using the Pro-Mix.

actually, use full strength bottle instructions...
1 tbsp/gal, or, 15ml/gal...
'max strength for rapidly growing plants' is what bottle says... depending on meter, can be ~2.0-2.6 ec... 1400-1900 ppm, depending on meter...

some plants, if selcted for such, can take that & much more...

feed-water-feed-water-feed, etc, etc... they need far more water than fertilizers, but when get it, get full strength...

promix peat based... holds much more water than other media...
gh has 'drain to waste' formula around somewhere... maybe it is full strength... they changed it much.

gardener can find own levlels, etc... by checking health of SweetIndica2's plants... if heathy, feed no more...

plant is only 4% fertilizers when dry... much more carbon, hydrogen, & water... plants release 96% of solution as water vapor - out of 100% solution (water + ferts) supplied - if healthy, within hrs... so only require little ferts - but in balance... some chems mixed together too long get out of balance.

if drain to waste... or, no run-off (check link in sig), can feed stronger. mini-flushes between feedings. higher ec thru out...

maybe feed cal & mag separately than regular solution...... in separate solution by itself.

 

[LasVegas420]

Just switched from FloraNova Series to MaxiGrow & MaxiBloom. Both are 1 part powders from GH. At the moment the plants look happy in the 5th week 12/12, but the buds may be a tad smaller. IMO. I'll have to verify this after harvest.

I was happy withe the switch as I hated cleaning my rez. Rez looks a lot cleaner now and PH is pretty stable.

I run E&F tables so I'm not sure how they will act on your sprayers, but I would expect some type of salt build up from looking at my rez cover. Perhaps a filter bag along with a in line filter would do the trick.

 

[SweetIndica2]

actually, use full strength bottle instructions...
1 tbsp/gal, or, 15ml/gal...
'max strength for rapidly growing plants' is what bottle says... depending on meter, can be ~2.0-2.6 ec... 1400-1900 ppm, depending on meter...

some plants, if selcted for such, can take that & much more...

feed-water-feed-water-feed, etc, etc... they need far more water than fertilizers, but when get it, get full strength...

promix peat based... holds much more water than other media...
gh has 'drain to waste' formula around somewhere... maybe it is full strength... they changed it much.

gardener can find own levlels, etc... by checking health of SweetIndica2's plants... if heathy, feed no more...

plant is only 4% fertilizers when dry... much more carbon, hydrogen, & water... plants release 96% of solution as water vapor - out of 100% solution (water + ferts) supplied - if healthy, within hrs... so only require little ferts - but in balance... some chems mixed together too long get out of balance.

if drain to waste... or, no run-off (check link in sig), can feed stronger. mini-flushes between feedings. higher ec thru out...

maybe feed cal & mag separately than regular solution...... in separate solution by itself.

enjoy your garden!


enjoy your garden!

That's weird, because i was never able to feed my plants anywhere close to 15ml of FloraNova. Most people on here seem to agree, that it's very strong and i know most people follow the lucas formula (5ml) or use even less (3ml or so). Even at 5ml per gallon i was getting some slight nute burn, and that is only 1/3 of the recommended full dose on the bottle.

I'm probably getting the Pro-Mix HP, which is the high porosity version and adding atleast 25% perlite to it to make it a light mixture. I'll start off with 1tsp of the MaxiBloom per Gallon this grow and see how they like it, and make my adjustments from there.

 

[jawnroot]

Here's the Maxi feed chart, which will give you an idea of TDS for a given dose:

I would start with about 3/4 tsp and work up from there, depending upon what your strain is telling you.

 

[*mistress*]

That's weird, because i was never able to feed my plants anywhere close to 15ml of FloraNova. Most people on here seem to agree, that it's very strong and i know most people follow the lucas formula (5ml) or use even less (3ml or so). Even at 5ml per gallon i was getting some slight nute burn, and that is only 1/3 of the recommended full dose on the bottle.

if read the original lucas threads (though originals were on c*nn*bis world & og... cw, mostly, believe...) there was much back-forth over exact amounts to use...

& what amount to use for which growing style & light intensity...

lucas refined pH's formula from older internet postings (in 1990's)... so, lucas carried on & now all say 'lucas', 'lucas'... not bad thing, but if read original threads, there was not 100% consensus on feed amounts...

others did not adopt the 'lucas' formula & made/make own mixes...

one of the most prolific & accomplished members of the past that used higher nutes was GrowGreen... used to post on cw... lucas refers to GG much in posts...

many just have neglected to actually read the old threads...
here are a few... should be recalled that lucas interacted w/ many, many different gardeners on these boards to establish 'standards'...

however, those nute standards are very much based on type of growing method & wattage used... not to mention the actual requirements of the specific cut...

if all grew same cut, could make universal regime, easy. but even plants from same mum - in different containers - may require different needs.

starting w/ a classic GrowGreen excerpt from the LUI SOG thread from C*nn*bis World... re-posted from & discussed in this recent thread:

Is any1 else slamming their plants with high ppm?
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=2688392&postcount=31

Posted by kiingbee on March 8th, 2004 12:11 PM:
Ive known this for a while>> but after thinking it thru, the sensi-pro is too pricey for my current situation.

what do you think about the Floranova?

I will most likely try floranova along w/ Synergy.

do you use the floranova grow + bloom? ml/week?

which do you better>> PBP or Floranova?
________________________________________________________________________
Posted by GrowGreen on March 8th, 2004 04:53 PM:
kiingbee

Floranova Bloom (FloraLucas) is my preferred nute currently.
Never tried the Synergy, ceteris paribus uses it and he likes it.(is that a pic of Frank Zappa on the bottle?)
I like the GH Floralicious Bloom as a additive. The best product I've used so far. I use it with PBP and FloraLucas
Adds great “flower” aroma and trich production. Have used the Liquid Karma too, it left a film on everything.

I mix the Floranova per bottle instructions. To a ppm of 1330 or so. I don't baby my clones. After 20 days I bump the ppm up to 2000. Then add the Floralicious.

The PBP works as well, just have to add Cal/Mag to it.
...
Peace
GG
__________________
..more Cow Bell Gene...

bold added by *mistress*

what is even more interesting is that gg did not flush plants... even after 'higher' ppms given...
& arguably had some of the healthiest looking plants on cw... w/ yield to match...

& lucas using gg as reference:

Calculating Nutrient levels
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=330174&postcount=1
more data:

Against Bubblers (lucas)
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=26021

very dependent on light applied & dehumidification... w/ more light & more dehumidification, plant respires & transpires more - requiring more nutes...

in smaller container, w/ less light, less nutes required...

yes, most 'follow the lucas formula'... w/out ever having read the actual original threads... either from og, cw, or here...

lucas contributed much respect, but there were/are other pov's... mainly, lucas consolidated various formulas & found a soild vase from which to work from... depending on plant size, light intensity, growing style, etc, etc...

in those threads, there were disagreements about nute strength. lots of variables. & different set-ups...

a tree, vegged to 3'x3'x3' before initiating flowering will drink more water & use more fertilizers than a plant in a 6" container, or even a 3 gal container...

yes, the 'lucas' formula seems safe & doable... but it is not the only method; nor are the limits set by that formula applicable to every garden.

15ml/gal is on bottle... for 'rapidly growing plants'... but, if plants are healthy w/ 5ml...

ultimately, to find ea cultivars' nute requirements, healthy leaves provide as much info as can be acquired - w/out leaf/tissue analysis...

hope this helps. enjoy your garden!

 

[jawnroot]

Many people are in the habit of pumping their nute mix unnecessarily high. 2000ppm, that's verging on absurd. With all respect, who is GrowGreen and why should we value his opinion? More importantly, do you have experience running nutes that hot? I've had plenty of experience with DWC in the past, and I can tell you 2000ppm is a recipe for disaster.

It's possible GG had some nice looking plants, but I'll bet money he wasn't giving them a 2000ppm solution, regardless of what he says in those posts. And rooted clones fed with a 1300ppm solution? I don't know what planet GG is living on, but earth weed would not survive those nute levels that young.

Mandala, a breeder and grower for years, recommends a mix of about 700 to 1000 ppm absolute max. Start low, determine what your plants want, and go from there. Always low ball when it comes to nutes.

...man, I'd love to see a plant that's been exposed to a 2000ppm solution over an extended period. I imagine the fan leaves would look like a couple McDonald's french fries. I mean, take a look at the GH chart I posed above. It tops out at 1000-1400 ppm, and that's from a manufacturer well known for providing hot feed schedules.

 

[Work2much]

Never use FNB @15ml per gallon. At least without a proper ramp up to see if the plant can handle that much. That's an uber strong dose.

 

[Helis]

I am in a micro-cab, so considering feeding anything 1200PPM is deadly. Not enough light, not big enough plants. I like the lucas formula because I can keep the ratios the same and drop my EC low enough to not freak out my babies. 1.0 EC to me IS "heavy feeding" for full bloom. I have seen 1.0-1.4 recommended by seed companies to get the most out of their products. I agree with you that there is no sense to bombarding a plant with what it cannot even uptake.

Also I picked up a tub of Maxi Bloom yesterday, 4lbs $30, going to last me a while. Going to do some tests tomorrow with my tap to see how it does with pH (why I bought it). Very excited if this doesn't swing right back up, my local tap is buffered quite well.
Should make next grow very much easier being dry & 1part.

 

[RedReign]

actually, use full strength bottle instructions...
1 tbsp/gal, or, 15ml/gal...
'max strength for rapidly growing plants' is what bottle says... depending on meter, can be ~2.0-2.6 ec... 1400-1900 ppm, depending on meter...

15 ml per gal of Floranova Bloom is MUCH higher than 2.0 to 2.6 ec, it would be closer to 3.5 to 4.0 ec. Get a clue, dumbass.

 

[LasVegas420]

Under HID's I'll keep my rez anywhere from 1.8-2.0 EC throughout the flowering period. (I guess this is sort of a Lucas type formula)

I do my runs a tad on the safe side since I work with different strains and it just makes my life a whole lot easier.

 

[Helis]

Ok so I dumped some MaxiBloom into water... 2.5 grams into 1/2 gallon, exactly.
Made 1440 µs (1.44 EC) and pH 5.9. DAMN, that's perfect.
I made some at 1.25g to 1/2 gallon too, 700 µs and ph 6.1. Floralicious brought it down to 5.8.
"Next year" I will check on their pH levels (tomorrow). Rise in res pH (NON-recirc) has been a problem due to my tap's buffers. If they're where they are today, tomorrow, then my next grow will be quite a fun one indeed.

Thanks to this thread and its contributors! You very well have helped me find exactly what I needed.

 

[GrowerGoneWild]

Many people are in the habit of pumping their nute mix unnecessarily high. 2000ppm, that's verging on absurd. With all respect, who is GrowGreen and why should we value his opinion? More importantly, do you have experience running nutes that hot? I've had plenty of experience with DWC in the past, and I can tell you 2000ppm is a recipe for disaster.

I gotta agree with ya, in DWC they are always feeding, its safer and cheaper to run a little on the lighter side of the feed.

There are a few strains that can tolerate feeding that high. Not saying you can't do it but..

Generally speaking, I tend to top out at 1500 in DWC, Aero, E&F, anything past this in an unknown strain causes problems.

 

[*mistress*]

Many people are in the habit of pumping their nute mix unnecessarily high. 2000ppm, that's verging on absurd.

plants can take much more than 2000 ppm...
when run same cut over & over & over & do many tests, may find that they can take ec of 3.6, or greater...

used @ certain moments during cycle, will certainly enhance final fruit quality.

but, if comfortable w/ k.i.s.s. ...

not here to say this/that 'better', nor does *mistress* really care 1 way or other if viewers use bottle instructions...

only providing excerpts from the field. after running many, many diff nutes/variations over several gardens.

With all respect, who is GrowGreen and why should we value his opinion?

you would, maybe, be more objective, if were around cw & og... 'before the fall...'

gg's gardens were masterful work+art...
along w/ ddoc, acry4hellp, & many, many more...

there were gardeners that simply never returned to these boards after servers fell into other hands... or, @ least were copied, @ minimum...

lots of lost data...

some... came back to share limited data.
& to share techniques that are simply not widespread in current boards...

nobody running kbs buckets... but decade ago, may have been 20 pages devoted just to air pumps & air diffusers... the technical base was, seemingly, greater then...

now, the remnants of those yrs are evident... threads upon threads of gardeners quaoting 'lucas formula' - w/out ever going back to read original threads...

More importantly, do you have experience running nutes that hot? I've had plenty of experience with DWC in the past, and I can tell you 2000ppm is a recipe for disaster.

yes...

posted that above...
in previous post:

actually, use full strength bottle instructions...
1 tbsp/gal, or, 15ml/gal...

...& even hiogher than that...
it is not the ppms that 'burn' the plant, it is the chemical reactions between the nutes, that can cause 'lock-out'...

there is no bright-line rule that 2000ppm will make plant up & fall over & die... where did this myth come from?

It's possible GG had some nice looking plants, but I'll bet money he wasn't giving them a 2000ppm solution, regardless of what he says in those posts. And rooted clones fed with a 1300ppm solution? I don't know what planet GG is living on, but earth weed would not survive those nute levels that young.

maybe can find entire thread... maybe not pics...

no, that gardener was giving accurate accounts...

gg even tested tissue sap w/ brix (refractometer) meter... &, again, did not flush...

Mandala, a breeder and grower for years, recommends a mix of about 700 to 1000 ppm absolute max. Start low, determine what your plants want, and go from there. Always low ball when it comes to nutes.

that is good base line... but not true for all plants... some plants can thrive on ec of 1...

but, this reality of plant physiology is that as the plant matures, & stores more & more compounds in the roots, the gradient for solution to get thru get higher...

since roots absorb inorganic ions (electrical charges, hence 'ec')... & once broken down, food stored in roots... & since roots absorb thru process of osmosis... if concentration of food in roots exceeds that of solution - solution will essentially be 'locked-out'...

why?

the concentration gradient is too much to permeate... just like reverse-osmosis... just, since plants get bigger & store more simple foods, the weaker ec of a solution will not get past higher concentration of root ec...

so... keep escalating ec so plant can keep getting bigger...
or, run low ec & maintain low root ec... problem w/ lower root ec is that means less sugar in fruit @ harvest...

not really new technique to increase ec of blossoming plants... whether they be in hop/mulberry family, or citrus, tomatoes, etc, etc...

...man, I'd love to see a plant that's been exposed to a 2000ppm solution over an extended period. I imagine the fan leaves would look like a couple McDonald's french fries. I mean, take a look at the GH chart I posed above. It tops out at 1000-1400 ppm, and that's from a manufacturer well known for providing hot feed schedules.

those charts have changed many times over the yrs... if have used gh ferts for some time, will recognize that. some of the older charts are harder to locate...

also, note that the ppms are for only the flora nova - not the supplements kool bloom (liquid &/or dry), & floralicious....

they have changed this several times. as they have released the floralicious (1st), then floralicious plus (2nd), & for liquid kool bloom (originally ka-bloom) & then dry kool bloom...

would not be shocked if they read these boards to see what dosages are being applied...

yes, their chart tops out @ that point... ???

the ppms of the solution can be as high as 2500ppm, or 3.6 ec... as long as the micronutrients remain in solution (ph issue) & as long as the nutes are chelated & buffered (gh includes humic acid for this very purpose), some plants can assimilate much more than 2000ppm... in fact, they desire it in wks 5-7...

also, must be noted that ec & ppms are dependent upon the meter used... even then, certain nutes deflect meters only by ~%...
if check links provided, they make this clear...

15 ml per gal of Floranova Bloom is MUCH higher than 2.0 to 2.6 ec, it would be closer to 3.5 to 4.0 ec. Get a clue, dumbass.

no... it depends on the meter used...

what meter did member RedReign use to get 3.5-4.0 ec, w/ just 1 tbsp of flora nova bloom?
please list starting water ppm & meter used...

EC 1, Hanna pen meter=500 parts-per-million.

EC 1, Bluelab Truncheon meter=700 parts-per-million.

EC 1, Utech EC meter=640 parts-per-million.

& which chart you want to follow...

note that the 1000-1400 ppm is before the addition of kool bloom, diamond nectar, or floralicious... which, if included, would take ppms over 2000, easily.

not to mention including a cal+mg+ supplement, &/or molasses, etc...

even then, plant will not topple over & die... so what if ec is 4.0? as long as micros held in solution & ph in range, theyll love it!
just means more sugars are being mfg & stored in roots & shoots!

having implemented these items... 10ml (2 tsp) of liquid kool bloom adds .7ec/350ppm (nacl scale) to the mix... nearly an entire unit of microsiemens (otherwise known as millimhos)...

in any event... the 'dumbass' statement is excessive & emotional outburst in gardening thread...

though not here to make friends, wont tolerate sniveling of ignorant, bitch-like insult...

not on icmag to fit into circles w/ squares that are lost in basics... the bottle instructions work just fine... maybe go back & read original lucas threads... before relying on everybody's references...

even in those threads, when 1ks are used, more nutes required...

point is - bottle instructions work, if really seeking simplicity. if seeking debate on subject, should be familiar w/ actual different meters used, ballast of the fert, different weights of the fert & few more things...

if not familar w/ all variables, well maybe *mistress* not 'dumb' one... already did research & many, many, many field tests...

not here to give affection, nor be agreed w/... this is about scientific facts... your comment only proves you dont know difference between meters, nor how they accurately deflect different metals/electrical charges... & plenty more lacking...

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=2684515&postcount=22:

salt deflects meter
potassium chloride 100%
ammonium nitrate 90%
sodium nitrate 85%
potassium nitrate & urea 75%
ammonium sulphate 70%
calcium nitrate 45%
magnesium and
potassium suphate 45%
di & mono phosphates 25%
super phosphates 10%
gypsum & limestone 5%

calcium nitrate (45%), magneisum sulphate (45%), & phosphates are in fnb, so, still not getting full read, as these nutes are only deflected (registered) @ ~45% of their true values... etc, etc.

in any event, not trying to convince or persuade to use this/that much nute, etc... do whatever pleases gardener & plants... is ultimatately a plant-by-plant choice, especially if running multi strains...

anyway, for the advancement of icmag & such... & since access to few of the nutes in question...

meter: nutra-wand (decade old, now 'dipstick' brand)
water: tap.
initial tap water ppm: 840
initail tap water ec: 1.2
initial tap water ph: 6.2

two separate 1 gal (exactly) containers... container a & b...

the tap water ppm usually does not even register on the meter... evidently, changes have been made to the muni source. @ least temporarily. hope it gets back down to >280ppm, where the meter begins reading from... meter probably needs cleaning, but will suffice for this tech.

alright...

container a - flora nova bloom 4-8-7-4 ca-2 mg- 2 s
container says 1 tablespoon:1 gallon should derive 1350ppm.
lets see...

1 tablespoon of flora nova bloom into 1 gallon of above-listed tap water.
stir, shake, let settle. shake again. let settle.

ppm 1960 - ec 2.8...

so, we can deduce that 1960-840=1120 ppm... from 1 tbsp (15ml) of fnb in 1 gal of tap water...

ph went down to 5.7 from 6.2...
let sit, settle... test 15 min later...
ph settles ~6.2... this is what fnb usually does... settles ~ 6.0-6.2 - consistently...

as a side note, gh's new bio thrive vegan plant food settles ph around 6.4-6.5... & 2 tsp (10ml) provides ~700ppm...

back to the tech finding... the reason the ppms will settle between 1100-1400 for the fnb is that components of the mix may differ depending on batch... as mention earlier, ea bottle of fnb has different 'net weight', which alters how much ppms will wind up in final solution... & why they recommend that the bottle be 'shake[n] vigorously'... final ppm solution will be weaker if use tablespoon, but dont shake vigorously before-hand...

basically, a well-shaken bottle of fnb in 1 tbsp will give ~1000-1300 ppm...

to further complicate matters, only 30% of flora nova bloom is actual fertilizers... the rest is 'ballast' or 'filler', including the tiny percentage of humic acid they add... different than a tbsp of calcium nitrate, or even epsom salts, which is pure salt... fnb contains water, & other 'trade secret' ingredients... 1 amazing trade secret is how they can mix calcium in w/ the rest of the nutrients - esp potassium...

container b...
liquid kool bloom 0-10-10

bottle says 2 tsp (10ml)
for whatever reason, original ppms are around 840...
after pouring into 1 gal container,

ppm 1120
ec 1.6

1120-840=280ppms...

so, can see that the ~350 ppms were added... just like bottle says...

confirming that 1 tablespoon of gh fnb will provide ~1000-1400 ppms... & ec of 1.9-2.6, depending on meter... that bottle of kool bloom is ~2+ yrs in age.

the only question is whether this amount will burn your plants or not... only the individual gardenr can determine this...

can also find exact ppms by calculating molecular weight of the actual element... again, all of this is in link in thread.

hope this helps. enjoy your garden!

 

[THC_Decapitator]

I just got some cns17 , 2 part just like flora-nova ad easy to use .
It was like 9$ for a liter . The stuff is milky white , hehe

 

[jawnroot]

Not here to get in a tit-for-tat over nutrient schedules. It seems fairly obvious *mistress* was posting anecdotal information she's gathered from reading, perhaps layered with her own opinions and perspective. I imagine if she had a lot of first hand knowledge, that's what she would have offered out the door.

Regardless, the following is a link to Mandala's fert write up. It's quality reading: Fertilizing Wisely

FYI, I was fluff_master92 on overgrow, and jawnroot on alt.rec.pot.cultivation (or whatever the newsgroup was) before that. Been around for a while, know what works and what doesn't for me. I'm not trying to offer dogma or rules, but a lot of what *mistress* is posting runs contradictory to my experience. Indeed, she keeps going on about bottle recommendations, but most anyone will tell you to stop it way down from bottle recs and work up from there. 15ml/gallon of FN seems obscene to me, but who knows.

Good luck with your grows. Let us know how the Maxi works out.

 

[SweetIndica2]

Yea, i mean i'm no expert. I am always here to learn, and i'm not doubting you Mistress. I'm just saying when i was feeding my ladies FN, i could never get anywhere near 15ml per Gallon without seeing nute burn. And i've used it on alot of Phenos, even my Blockheads who seemed to like alot more nutes than my other plants would show nute burn at even less than half that dose.

 

[*mistress*]

Not here to get in a tit-for-tat over nutrient schedules. It seems fairly obvious *mistress* was posting anecdotal information she's gathered from reading, perhaps layered with her own opinions and perspective. I imagine if she had a lot of first hand knowledge, that's what she would have offered out the door.

FYI, I was fluff_master92 on overgrow, and jawnroot on alt.rec.pot.cultivation (or whatever the newsgroup was) before that. Been around for a while, know what works and what doesn't for me.

experience is good...
knowing what works & doesnt, better...
for finding own limits & recognizing such...

I'm not trying to offer dogma or rules, but a lot of what *mistress* is posting runs contradictory to my experience.

Indeed, she keeps going on about bottle recommendations, but most anyone will tell you to stop it way down from bottle recs and work up from there. 15ml/gallon of FN seems obscene to me, but who knows.

either way... bottle instructions, 'pH' formula, 'lucas' formula, 'h3ad' formula, 'rez' formula, etc, etc...
in ea situation, the individual gardener selects & tests what is viable for them... & discards the other...

there are many, many posts where gardenrs state the run 'modified' 'lucas-formula'... what is this? it is their own variation...

if 15ml burns your plants - dont use that much...
if havnt tried 15ml gal, then irrelevant.
if dont intend to try 15ml/gal, irrelevant...

fwiw, here, dont 'feed' 15ml/gal daily... the regime is feed-water-feed-water... & not daily. maybe 2-3 times per week, do they get 'fed' - aside from the shallow mini-res in outer container, that always has solution delivered to roots via wick...

agree, disagree... doesnt matter. not trying to pursuade 15ml/gal - only stating that possible. & potentially beneficial for some. if that is not you/your garden, ignore...

Yea, i mean i'm no expert. I am always here to learn, and i'm not doubting you Mistress. I'm just saying when i was feeding my ladies FN, i could never get anywhere near 15ml per Gallon without seeing nute burn. And i've used it on alot of Phenos, even my Blockheads who seemed to like alot more nutes than my other plants would show nute burn at even less than half that dose.

what exactly were the 'nute burn' symptoms?

& did you feed this 15ml/gal daily? every watering?

run-off ec?
vs input ec?

most every crop that producing a fruit likes steady ec increase to sweeten fruit, make firmer, denser & sweeter...

if not applicable to gardeners, ignore...


do what makes your plants happy!

enjoy your garden!

 

[jawnroot]

It's one thing to say, in effect, "To each his own, in some situations X might work, and in some it might not," but posting a blurb about 1300ppm clone solutions and 15ml/gallon of FN is more or less the equivalent of suggesting we all get on a 7500 calorie a day diet. No one can handle that, not even the most bulked up and active body builder. Just as no MJ plants that I'm familiar with can take 15ml/gallon of FN.

I'm not trying to be a jerk or anything, but a newbie reading this thread might be mislead by what you're posting and burn the hell out of their plants.

...and at any rate, the original topic of this thread was the search for an FN substitute. I doubt the OP was looking for a protracted debate regarding feeding schedules.