Anyone ever implement co2 in veg? If so, how many ppm do you give, and is there a general reccomendation? Im guessing that co2 concentration depends on plant size tho, eh?
Co2 ppm in veg
- Thread starter smurfin'herb
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thepickle310
New member
this is opposite to what ive heard. i thought it was good for veg but bad for bud. is there more info on this? or opinions?
Oldmac
Member
IMHO the use of co2 during vegative growth is a waste of time and money. While it will increase growth rate some it does not save enough time or add enough increase in size to warrant the cost.
It is better used after 1 week into flower, when the plant is starting it's growth spurt till about a week before harvest. This time frame is a general guide, your strain and mileage my vary.
I do believe Lazyman has it right.
PPM that is best is dependent on temps, at 75degreeF 800ppm is good place to start at 95F 1200-1400ppm is needed and never exceed 1500ppm.
WARNING: get a co2 detector for outside your grow area in case, and if your home has anything that burns gas, get a dectector.
It is better used after 1 week into flower, when the plant is starting it's growth spurt till about a week before harvest. This time frame is a general guide, your strain and mileage my vary.
I do believe Lazyman has it right.
PPM that is best is dependent on temps, at 75degreeF 800ppm is good place to start at 95F 1200-1400ppm is needed and never exceed 1500ppm.
WARNING: get a co2 detector for outside your grow area in case, and if your home has anything that burns gas, get a dectector.
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If you are burning propane the cost is minimal and it is speeds up the veg process. The more CO2 available, the more stomata the plant will develop. More stomata = more CO2 uptake which means bigger buds!
I've seen growers use CO2 up to the last 2 weeks of flowering with great success, CO2 is a key ingredient in photosynthesis, so more CO2 will utilize your lights more.
And as for the CO2 detector outside your room, I think Oldmac means Carbon Monoxide (CO) detector. Which is deadly in small amounts.
Oldmac
Member
Hi marco,
Thanks for catching the error on the carbon monoxide detector, that is of course what I meant. I just think there are a couple of things we talk about on the boards that really should have some warnings about thier use.
We are in agreement about the use in flower, I think.
The veg issue we just slightly differ. I admit it adds plant growth vigor but to a lesser degree then when dealing with heat issues. I have never really had that problem. For during bloom when running HPS that's where the heat really happens. And it's great then.
Thanks for catching the error on the carbon monoxide detector, that is of course what I meant. I just think there are a couple of things we talk about on the boards that really should have some warnings about thier use.
We are in agreement about the use in flower, I think.
The veg issue we just slightly differ. I admit it adds plant growth vigor but to a lesser degree then when dealing with heat issues. I have never really had that problem. For during bloom when running HPS that's where the heat really happens. And it's great then.
no need for co2 in veg, but its not going to hurt either. maybe keep it at 500-700 considering they wont be absorbing as much
tmu
Member
The reason that people say never to go above 1500ppm is because it displaces too much oxygen at that level and can make you or your pet pass out. I've seen growth rates increase substantially at 4000ppm in veg at over 100* f. Keeping in mind that this was aero with an environmental controller. There was no need to cool the lights, wich was a big bonus. Remember that roots need oxygen and need to be quite abit cooler than the canopy.
Oldmac
Member
Hey TMU, it won't just make you pass out, it will kill you.
There are other factors that effect plant growth besides how much co2 a plant can process. Light strength and tempertures, don't just effect respiration but also water intake and they are all interconnected.
Here's a fairly recent scientific paper, dealing with all of this that someone posted on another thread. It's tough reading, but very interesting. Keep in mind it deals with sativa's responce but should not be too different for indicas.
There are other factors that effect plant growth besides how much co2 a plant can process. Light strength and tempertures, don't just effect respiration but also water intake and they are all interconnected.
Here's a fairly recent scientific paper, dealing with all of this that someone posted on another thread. It's tough reading, but very interesting. Keep in mind it deals with sativa's responce but should not be too different for indicas.
everyones enviro is different, it wont be to hard to compare co2 vs no co2 and see what works best for ya
Plant size doesn't determine what ppm you need, the amount of CO2 needed to achieve desired ppm depends on the size of the plants, how well the room is sealed, and lighting wattage. That said, CO2 will shorten the amount of veg time required to get the desired size to flip 12/12... I have used CO2 during veg with great success.
K
Kindman69
I use it during veg as well, cuts down my veg time (I like to scrog)
PonicallyMade
Member
I've always kept co2 ppm roughly around the nutrient ppm the plants are being fed.
I've only ever ran co2 from a natural gas generator so time and cost were not really a factor.
I DID notice extreme uptake of nutrient / @ higher strengths then previous grows where co2 was not used.
In my opinion - if you've got the ability to use co2 in veg - use it!
I've only ever ran co2 from a natural gas generator so time and cost were not really a factor.
I DID notice extreme uptake of nutrient / @ higher strengths then previous grows where co2 was not used.
In my opinion - if you've got the ability to use co2 in veg - use it!
Reg Dunlop
Member
Yeah I'm actually using co2 in my aero garden @ 800-1000ppms and I'm in veg right now. My ppms are right around 590 @.5 and everyday when I go to top off my rez the ppms are down about 100-150ppms.This is everyday! Now what I'm wondering is do I roll with what my rez is telling me or do I back off the ppms at a certian level? Btw it's bubba kush.
Ive always used co2 in veg and flower. Im pretty sure that if all other parameters are optimized, such as having good nutes and lots of light, that the CO2 makes for a more robust plant from which all thing eventually come. If you have the devices set up to do co2, the expense of the gas is really small compared to any benefits you might get. for example, in mid veg, my plants usually look like this, I dont think that they would if I didnt use c02. that said, I end up pruning back about half of the branches because they are too dense, but I think that that benefits the ones I leave behind. I also dont think I would get as robust of a final trunk without CO2 in veg, and while trunk size isnt a final goal, it ends up equating to larger yeilds and healthier plants for me, I think. Also, if your plant grows crazy fast, you reduce the chance of pests or diseases getting a foothold.
thirst4knwledge
Member
Sealed room? CO2 levels? Help!
Sealed room? CO2 levels? Help!
This thread seems to be pretty dormant, not sure why. There's a lof of great info here already, and I'm sure there's more. So this is how my grow room is going to be set up, and if anyone thinks this is adequate or has something to add or correct me on, please let me know. I'm doing a 12 plant 3k scrog in a rdwc. I was going to have it set up where the air draws through a carbon filter, through the air cooled hoods, and out through the exhaust fan. There would also be air brought in from the outside. But I've heard that in a CO2 supplemented grow room, everything should be sealed and never should outside air be exchanged, as that would waste the CO2. So now it will be outside air that is drawn through the air cooled hoods and out of the room through the exhaust fan (no exchange with outside air from grow room). I will be using air conditioning, a dehumidifier, and circulating fans; is there anything else I need to have an efficient sealed environment? Also, I plan on doing LST to the screen, flipping the lights to 12/12, and a week or two later changing to flowering nutes (giving the plants a bit to adjust to the photoperiod before nute switch). After reading through the thread, some people say it's useless, some say it helps. All I know is I want some fuggin bushes, so I'm thinking of using 700-900 ppm CO2 for veg and when switch to flowering nutes, switch to 1400-1500 ppm CO2. Is this optimal? Any suggestions as far as timing, ppm's, whatever? Sorry so long, I figure if I give better info I have a better chance and getting precise answers. Thanks.
-t4k
Sealed room? CO2 levels? Help!
This thread seems to be pretty dormant, not sure why. There's a lof of great info here already, and I'm sure there's more. So this is how my grow room is going to be set up, and if anyone thinks this is adequate or has something to add or correct me on, please let me know. I'm doing a 12 plant 3k scrog in a rdwc. I was going to have it set up where the air draws through a carbon filter, through the air cooled hoods, and out through the exhaust fan. There would also be air brought in from the outside. But I've heard that in a CO2 supplemented grow room, everything should be sealed and never should outside air be exchanged, as that would waste the CO2. So now it will be outside air that is drawn through the air cooled hoods and out of the room through the exhaust fan (no exchange with outside air from grow room). I will be using air conditioning, a dehumidifier, and circulating fans; is there anything else I need to have an efficient sealed environment? Also, I plan on doing LST to the screen, flipping the lights to 12/12, and a week or two later changing to flowering nutes (giving the plants a bit to adjust to the photoperiod before nute switch). After reading through the thread, some people say it's useless, some say it helps. All I know is I want some fuggin bushes, so I'm thinking of using 700-900 ppm CO2 for veg and when switch to flowering nutes, switch to 1400-1500 ppm CO2. Is this optimal? Any suggestions as far as timing, ppm's, whatever? Sorry so long, I figure if I give better info I have a better chance and getting precise answers. Thanks.
-t4k
xcrispi
Member
The reason that people say never to go above 1500ppm is because it displaces too much oxygen at that level and can make you or your pet pass out.
Sorry to hijack folks but the above is bad / inacurate info . You need to do your homework n research C02 toxcicity levels .
1500 ppm = 1/15 of 1% of an enviroment . We get a nasty headache at 3.5% - 4% or 35,000 - 40,000 ppm LOL . The average humans blood turns to gas and induces cardiac arrest at 5% / 50,000 ppm .
Peace guys
Crispi
How do I know ? I sold bottled gas for a while and M.S.D.S Sheets -AKA- Material Saftey Data Sheets .
tmu
Member
Well this is what I have read in many books and magazine articles (Maximum Yield, Growing Edge, High Times, Skunk, Heads...)
I could be wrong, though...
Plants do use more CO2 during vegetative growth. So more is better.
In a closed system roots need to get O2. Just aerate the water really well before watering if in soil. Or keep root zone atmosphere seperate in hydro by keeping the resevoir outside the room.
I could be wrong, though...
Plants do use more CO2 during vegetative growth. So more is better.
In a closed system roots need to get O2. Just aerate the water really well before watering if in soil. Or keep root zone atmosphere seperate in hydro by keeping the resevoir outside the room.
Substantially over the standard 1500ppm growth rates? Now you're talking triple the gas but if it resulted in another 5%+ output increase it'd more than pay for itself. Talk about changing the game!
Fake edit: While researching CO2 monitors that give a readout over 1500ppm I found this neat little guy which happens to be about the cheapest CO2 monitor (not controller) I've seen on the market!
