I know we have a lot of members from all around the world. Curious about the members from Scandinavian countries, France, and Great Britain. Would you trade your health care for a private system more like the US if it meant you could pay lower taxes and possibly get better, faster care but no guaranteed access?
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Non US residents, what's your health care system like?
- Thread starter cashmunny
- Start date
...if I get sick....I either get it fixed.......or I might die...
it's going to cost you something no matter where you are...
...if I am in the uk then its free usually.....even for Americans.....but if I am in Laos, then I have to pay for it..
.....gold for pain, you play with illness you pay for illness....someone has to make a living out of it....
it's going to cost you something no matter where you are...
...if I am in the uk then its free usually.....even for Americans.....but if I am in Laos, then I have to pay for it..
.....gold for pain, you play with illness you pay for illness....someone has to make a living out of it....
dragongrower
Active member
in DK healh care is free.. Just like all education..
We do pay 40-50% in taxes though.
But the Danes have been ratet as one of the happiest nations several times...
We do pay 40-50% in taxes though.
But the Danes have been ratet as one of the happiest nations several times...
Megas
Member
I lived in both Canada and the US. Things you'll notice wait times in US for procedures are done in less time. This isn't a failure of the system its one of population in reality. 30 million people cant expect the same fast treatment where 300 million people are pumping money into the system. A lot of stuff was a lot cheaper in Canada for some time I didn't have insurance there. Visiting a doctor cost $30-50 and medication was waaaaaaay cheaper. In the US visiting a doctor for me is $100+ The same tests I had done in Canada cost me $30-45 or so with no insurance. For my tests and appointment in the US I paid something like $300. To save $200 and wait an extra week for non emergency stuff I have no problems with. Paying higher taxes to me sucks however it gets people into the doctor more often keeping sickies healthy.
M
MoldyFrogToe
Keep in mind ur insurance in the us still varies greatly.
Some pay 100 for an ER visit sme pay 50
I pay 15 bucks fr a 400 buck doc visit, and nothing for a pretty major surgery here in the US. An MRI was scheduled for me and I waited about 1 week or less for my choice - a brand new mri facility close to me. Then again, I have pretty good insurance
Some pay 100 for an ER visit sme pay 50
I pay 15 bucks fr a 400 buck doc visit, and nothing for a pretty major surgery here in the US. An MRI was scheduled for me and I waited about 1 week or less for my choice - a brand new mri facility close to me. Then again, I have pretty good insurance
dragongrower
Active member
philcollins
Active member
I live in the U.S. I am a construction laborer..no health insurance...If i get sick..or hurt...i go see the witch doctor...Paying for a doctor visit would bankrupt me.
Yeah that's the weird thing. Insurance companies negotiate the best rates with health care providers. So if you don't have insurance you get charged 2-3 times what the insurance would pay for the same service. It's kind of strange. Basically the healthcare providers are trying to make as much money as possible from people who aren't in a position to haggle over the cost. The power of collective bargaining.
Although, I wonder what would happen if you tried to haggle down the cost of a Doctor visit if you were paying cash.
M
MoldyFrogToe
probably way too much. thousands for surgery and 400 x 3 doctors visits minimum plus a year of physical therpay 2 x per week ! crazy! pain pills, ER visits, x rays, MRIs, i would be broke
love?
Member
I live in an European country. I would not trade our system, even with it's many faults, for lower taxes. Even though I'm sure I could pay for my own medical needs (in fact I mainly use "non-government" health services when I need them and have a voluntary health insurance plan that covers some of them) there are many, especially old, people who can't and in a civilized society they shouldn't just be left for dead.
Besides, a man needs to provide for more than just himself and I have no kids so whatever I don't mind paying a bit of taxes.
I just wish they didn't use that money to try to put me in jail for growing a plant.
Besides, a man needs to provide for more than just himself and I have no kids so whatever I don't mind paying a bit of taxes.
I just wish they didn't use that money to try to put me in jail for growing a plant.
Not entirely...
Well that may be a portion of it, we also have many people here illegally that do not pay into the system, but also require healthcare and can't be turned away from emergency rooms.
Very expensive care that the taxpayers foot the bill on.
Well that's complex. Some of it is because Doctors and Nurses are paid a lot. But it's a free market, they are paid whatever the market will bear. Are salaries regulated in the EU?
It's possible that Americans are unhealthier. We're fatter, drive more, and walk or ride a bike less.
The uninsured wait until they get really sick and visit the Emergency room, which is expensive. And then they don't pay because they can't and the hospital swallows the cost and passes it on. Medical bills are the most common reason for people filing bankruptcy.
Preventive care is not emphasized because people with insurance switch plans every time they switch jobs which for most people is every 5-10 years. So the insurance companies have no incentive to pay for prevention since the problem they pay to prevent will benefit some other insurance company when the person leaves their current plan.
Also, brand name medications are very expensive here. There really is no regulation of prescription prices. Again it's whatever the market will bear.
I think that has something to do with a distaste for interference in free markets here in the US. Although obviously with the recent financial crisis, that laissez faire attitude only goes so far.
love?
Member
Right I see there's more to it than just the more expensive personnel costs.
Salaries aren't regulated but of course in a government owned hospital the goverment decides what they pay... Private hospitals pay more of course but the jobs might not be as secure etc. And the cheap "goverment" alternative keeps prices (and therefore salaries) in private hospitals down a bit too I guess.
Interesting point about preventive care. It probably is a good idea financially (to the end user / citizen) to have good preventive care, obviously the healthcare industry wants to suck out as much money as it can and is against it. But of course "preventive care" kinda sucks too because it's easy to use as a political tool. I'm of course referring to the "weed can't be legalized because it causes health problems and if it was legalized healthcare costs and taxes would go up" -argument. Which also I suppose is one of the reasons why some people are against public healthcare, but not me as I'm sure they'd just use some other political scare instead if this wasn't an option.
Salaries aren't regulated but of course in a government owned hospital the goverment decides what they pay... Private hospitals pay more of course but the jobs might not be as secure etc. And the cheap "goverment" alternative keeps prices (and therefore salaries) in private hospitals down a bit too I guess.
Interesting point about preventive care. It probably is a good idea financially (to the end user / citizen) to have good preventive care, obviously the healthcare industry wants to suck out as much money as it can and is against it. But of course "preventive care" kinda sucks too because it's easy to use as a political tool. I'm of course referring to the "weed can't be legalized because it causes health problems and if it was legalized healthcare costs and taxes would go up" -argument. Which also I suppose is one of the reasons why some people are against public healthcare, but not me as I'm sure they'd just use some other political scare instead if this wasn't an option.
MrMcBean
Member
I lived in the USA for 10 years without real healthcare. After moving back to may country it was a blessing to be able to go to the doctor without worries.
In my country there is a mandatory Healthcare that takes 12-15% of your full paycheck.
If I get sick, injured, or have a baby, the healthcare has got my back 100%. Even if I dont need the benefits 99% of the time, Im glad to know that everyone else on the street is being taken care of to a high standard. I also cant say I dislike illegal Immigrants using our hospitals. If they need the care they are going to get it, Its one step to a better world.
No matter how you argue against it, getting injured and having medical bills as your greatest worry because society doesnt give a crap about you, is NOT acceptable for a "great" country like the USA... Having healthcare not passed soon is sending a weird message internationally about the American public..
EDIT: even though we have this system, My family and I are insured privately through an Employer. It costs the same but we get even MORE benefits.. muahahha
In my country there is a mandatory Healthcare that takes 12-15% of your full paycheck.
If I get sick, injured, or have a baby, the healthcare has got my back 100%. Even if I dont need the benefits 99% of the time, Im glad to know that everyone else on the street is being taken care of to a high standard. I also cant say I dislike illegal Immigrants using our hospitals. If they need the care they are going to get it, Its one step to a better world.
No matter how you argue against it, getting injured and having medical bills as your greatest worry because society doesnt give a crap about you, is NOT acceptable for a "great" country like the USA... Having healthcare not passed soon is sending a weird message internationally about the American public..
EDIT: even though we have this system, My family and I are insured privately through an Employer. It costs the same but we get even MORE benefits.. muahahha
I suppose I forgot an important but controversial point. Some of the cost of healthcare in a private system goes to paying profit margins. So it raises a philiosophical issue, should healthcare be a for profit business and closely related to that, is health care a right or a privilege?
The conservative view of that is that the competition inherent in private enterprize drives costs down and efficiency up.
Which is probably true to a point, but is not the whole picture since if competition drove quality, then we would have the healthiest citizens in the world which we clearly don't.
IMO competition is fine as long as the rules are clearly defined and make sense. But reasonable people can disagree on what makes sense. So here we are.
The conservative view of that is that the competition inherent in private enterprize drives costs down and efficiency up.
Which is probably true to a point, but is not the whole picture since if competition drove quality, then we would have the healthiest citizens in the world which we clearly don't.
IMO competition is fine as long as the rules are clearly defined and make sense. But reasonable people can disagree on what makes sense. So here we are.
Interesting, so it's really a public/private system. Sounds like the public system is kind of a bare minimum with add ons available if your employer is so inclined. I imagine we'll end up with some flavor of that here eventually.
FarOut1
Member
I'm an American who has been treated far better by my host countries France now Spain than i was at home
in 15 years i have worked legally under contract for 6 months and had my own company once for 1 year another time 3 months.
Apart from those times i never paid taxes but have had to go to the hospital on several occasions, some costly specialists for scans and the like concerning my back, never paid a cent and very little for meds.
A few times we've had enough cash to live on, put in our accounts monthly (married a French girl) by the gov. when we just started a family and we were struggling. We needed help and they gave it, not something that wouldn't pay the bills either, they covered our modest survival and it was a blessing.
a year and change later later we went to the states where i started working making good money in a shitty printing job i hated, but i did to give security to my family. I worked for 1 year w/o missing a day even when i suffered from back pain (pop pills and get back to work is what good ole doc says)
One day i came to work and made a comment about this mexican guy who always did shit that shut down the press cause he didn't have to put paper & ink in a press that didn't run. The management knew about him but they couldn't fire him. I made a comment to the new boss that i had a run in with the week prior when he was only a consultant not the plant manager.
New boss's first day, he put this Mexican guy on my press, i had a deal with the old boss for many months that the Mexican worked for somebody else, so i could keep my press productive.
I went to tell the new boss i couldn't work with that Mexican because he is always causing down time, if the company stood for that fine, but i couldn't accept that kind of work ethic.
I was fired instantly for being racist.
I'm not gonna go into the racist debate but anybody that knows me, knows that's far from the truth.
The point is i was now jobless with a jobless wife from France struggling with the language and a 2 year old girl.
I had paid in lots of taxes cause i was earning over a grand a week, when i didn't find work i went to sign on for benefits, it was decided i would be eligible for max benefits as i had paid so much.
They denied me saying i could have expected to loose my job for calling somebody a Mexican
I later found another printing job where the whole shop was on crank served up by the boss, i was fired because i didn't wanna take drugs and work insane OT
We left America...
France and Spain have both helped us when ever we needed it.
And on a more important note i have grown for years with little paranoia in Spain, France another story there, but the police oppression here and France is still about 1 tenth of American experiences i personally encountered.
End Rant: Sorry bout that but i needed to get that off my chest since leaving in 98
This isn't to bash America in fact i want to come give it another try one day, no printing jobs this time.
Peace & Respect
in 15 years i have worked legally under contract for 6 months and had my own company once for 1 year another time 3 months.
Apart from those times i never paid taxes but have had to go to the hospital on several occasions, some costly specialists for scans and the like concerning my back, never paid a cent and very little for meds.
A few times we've had enough cash to live on, put in our accounts monthly (married a French girl) by the gov. when we just started a family and we were struggling. We needed help and they gave it, not something that wouldn't pay the bills either, they covered our modest survival and it was a blessing.
a year and change later later we went to the states where i started working making good money in a shitty printing job i hated, but i did to give security to my family. I worked for 1 year w/o missing a day even when i suffered from back pain (pop pills and get back to work is what good ole doc says)
One day i came to work and made a comment about this mexican guy who always did shit that shut down the press cause he didn't have to put paper & ink in a press that didn't run. The management knew about him but they couldn't fire him. I made a comment to the new boss that i had a run in with the week prior when he was only a consultant not the plant manager.
New boss's first day, he put this Mexican guy on my press, i had a deal with the old boss for many months that the Mexican worked for somebody else, so i could keep my press productive.
I went to tell the new boss i couldn't work with that Mexican because he is always causing down time, if the company stood for that fine, but i couldn't accept that kind of work ethic.
I was fired instantly for being racist.
I'm not gonna go into the racist debate but anybody that knows me, knows that's far from the truth.
The point is i was now jobless with a jobless wife from France struggling with the language and a 2 year old girl.
I had paid in lots of taxes cause i was earning over a grand a week, when i didn't find work i went to sign on for benefits, it was decided i would be eligible for max benefits as i had paid so much.
They denied me saying i could have expected to loose my job for calling somebody a Mexican
I later found another printing job where the whole shop was on crank served up by the boss, i was fired because i didn't wanna take drugs and work insane OT
We left America...
France and Spain have both helped us when ever we needed it.
And on a more important note i have grown for years with little paranoia in Spain, France another story there, but the police oppression here and France is still about 1 tenth of American experiences i personally encountered.
End Rant: Sorry bout that but i needed to get that off my chest since leaving in 98
This isn't to bash America in fact i want to come give it another try one day, no printing jobs this time.
Peace & Respect 
Lucky 7
Active member
If you don't belong to a group in the US (government/Corp./big employer) your insurance rates are thru the roof: basically these peeps are paying for the uninsured.
Being self employed, we pay $8,000/year for $3,000 deductible. It's good- policy pays 100% after deductible, but wtf, it's just not equitable!
This does nothing to inspire our lawmakers forward as they have Cadillac policies that pay for everything . . . .
Being self employed, we pay $8,000/year for $3,000 deductible. It's good- policy pays 100% after deductible, but wtf, it's just not equitable!
This does nothing to inspire our lawmakers forward as they have Cadillac policies that pay for everything . . . .
