Thanks huggie, I can't actually find any decent 80mms in stock in any stores in this country! I will wait but I figured it's 2am, may as well ask. Cheers 
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The ultimate beginner's guide to PC FANS
- Thread starter ScrubNinja
- Start date
Holy crap I realised you can sort Delta's fan database by specification. Do believe I've found the best single Delta in overall terms, APART from noise, of course.
Hope you can read that, it's really small on my screen. The same data as a PDF is here.
Seems to be new... no real search results apart from Delta's sites.
Hope you can read that, it's really small on my screen. The same data as a PDF is here.
Seems to be new... no real search results apart from Delta's sites.
Nice thread, ScrubNinja. The vast world of PC fans just got a little less daunting, for me anyway.
Glad I could help mate - It's pretty easy to buy a shitty pc fan if you don't know the deal. 
Strangely
Member
Hi Scrub! I was having a gawp at various lengths of wood the other day (oooh err) and was wondering which out of MDF-12mm, MDF-18mm, Exterior Plywood-12mm, Exterior Plywood-12mm, would be the best for a micro grow in terms of keeping things quiet? Presumably it wouldn't effect the heat as air would be (hopefully) moving too fast to seep through the wood?
Hey Strangely,
My advice is to downplay the sound dampening qualities of the construction material and use what you deem best as a construction material. Overall, MDF should give better sound insulation - but it's not a huge difference on its own and should not be determinative of your cabinet materials selection.
For sound insulation, you will gain the most from just lining your cabinet in foil covered polystyrene insulation. It's essentially 2" thick Styrofoam insulation which is covered on one side with a reflective foil. It cuts fairly easily too.
You can also use Reflectix for sound insulation. It's not as good as polystyrene insulation for sound - but it will work to muffle your cabinet noise. It is, more importantly, a far better reflective material and rates among the very best reflection available for use in any grow cabinet. Reflectix is essentially insulated bubble wrap. It is covered in Mylar, which is applied with a dimpled finish to provide a diffuse reflection of light (as opposed to a mirror finish like 2mm Mylar foil). For a number of reasons, while it is counterintuitive, you get better light reflection from a diffuse Mylar reflector than you do when you use a mirrored finish Mylar reflector. Reflectix is available at Home Depot in the HVAC section. It's a little pricey, but well worth it.
There is nothing that prevents you from using both polystyrene insulated foam and Reflectix for added acoustic sound insulation and superior reflection. It will work extremely well in combination for your purposes. The real downside is the space taken away from your cab interior. Do appreciate that the thickness of the materials must be taken into account if you go that route. In some very small micro grow cabs, the loss of 2" or so off of all interior surfaces due to the thickness of using these materials is a significant loss in the overall grow space - especially when it comes to depth of a repurposed C13 style cabinet. In many larger cabs, the loss in interior space is an acceptable trade-off. YMMV.
If grow space is at a premium, I'd try to find a thinner polystyrene covered with Reflectix - or simply use just the Reflectix alone.
Some cab growers have tried to use a thin rubber acoustic insulator. This stuff is manufactured for use in the automotive industry for application on irregular metal surfaces to sound proof the passenger area from engine and road noise. Acoustic rubber insulation is very expensive and the results from cab growers who have tried both is that using styrene insulation performs better than acoustic rubber at a vastly cheaper cost - but it DOES take up more room.
Good luck!
My advice is to downplay the sound dampening qualities of the construction material and use what you deem best as a construction material. Overall, MDF should give better sound insulation - but it's not a huge difference on its own and should not be determinative of your cabinet materials selection.
For sound insulation, you will gain the most from just lining your cabinet in foil covered polystyrene insulation. It's essentially 2" thick Styrofoam insulation which is covered on one side with a reflective foil. It cuts fairly easily too.
You can also use Reflectix for sound insulation. It's not as good as polystyrene insulation for sound - but it will work to muffle your cabinet noise. It is, more importantly, a far better reflective material and rates among the very best reflection available for use in any grow cabinet. Reflectix is essentially insulated bubble wrap. It is covered in Mylar, which is applied with a dimpled finish to provide a diffuse reflection of light (as opposed to a mirror finish like 2mm Mylar foil). For a number of reasons, while it is counterintuitive, you get better light reflection from a diffuse Mylar reflector than you do when you use a mirrored finish Mylar reflector. Reflectix is available at Home Depot in the HVAC section. It's a little pricey, but well worth it.
There is nothing that prevents you from using both polystyrene insulated foam and Reflectix for added acoustic sound insulation and superior reflection. It will work extremely well in combination for your purposes. The real downside is the space taken away from your cab interior. Do appreciate that the thickness of the materials must be taken into account if you go that route. In some very small micro grow cabs, the loss of 2" or so off of all interior surfaces due to the thickness of using these materials is a significant loss in the overall grow space - especially when it comes to depth of a repurposed C13 style cabinet. In many larger cabs, the loss in interior space is an acceptable trade-off. YMMV.
If grow space is at a premium, I'd try to find a thinner polystyrene covered with Reflectix - or simply use just the Reflectix alone.
Some cab growers have tried to use a thin rubber acoustic insulator. This stuff is manufactured for use in the automotive industry for application on irregular metal surfaces to sound proof the passenger area from engine and road noise. Acoustic rubber insulation is very expensive and the results from cab growers who have tried both is that using styrene insulation performs better than acoustic rubber at a vastly cheaper cost - but it DOES take up more room.
Good luck!
Haha oo-er indeed. Hmm well, I used (I think) 15mm exterior ply for one cab and I could have had rave parties in there and nobody would know. But it costs a bit more and is very heavy if that's an issue.
As mentioned the current cab is pretty good noise wise, it's thick MDF type stuff but I put thinner plywood on the back (12mm?) and I suspect the back is now the weak spot in the sound chain.
But that doesn't matter too much as the last fan in the chain is the real noisemaker. Even if you had 1ft thick lead walls, the exhaust fan is right there, buzzing it's bearings off. We've spent days reading this thread and we know to get a loud fan if we want to sidestep problems. That's why I planned the outer fan of mine to be a quieter model originally, and had the big loud fans pushing (and muffled) into the carbon, and a quiet external fan pulling. My general thoughts are that it's better to get a good loud fan and muffle it by pushing into carbon, than relying on a weak, quiet fan to pull.
18mm mdf seems overkill, but 12mm is on the thin side for sure, so I'd say go with 18mm MDF as long as you don't move house often. I think MDF is even better than ply for sound insulation, but not positive. Ply is hardier and will withstand the inevitable moments when you forget to close the drain tap on your bucket or whatever.
Yeah you will have it all painted so shouldn't be much seepage or that kind of stuff. If you pay attention to the pressure environments you're creating, anything like that is not an issue. Negative pressure in cab, slightly positive pressure in light section (if possible)
Edit: Didn't see fatigues answer there, all good advice.
As mentioned the current cab is pretty good noise wise, it's thick MDF type stuff but I put thinner plywood on the back (12mm?) and I suspect the back is now the weak spot in the sound chain.
But that doesn't matter too much as the last fan in the chain is the real noisemaker. Even if you had 1ft thick lead walls, the exhaust fan is right there, buzzing it's bearings off. We've spent days reading this thread and we know to get a loud fan if we want to sidestep problems. That's why I planned the outer fan of mine to be a quieter model originally, and had the big loud fans pushing (and muffled) into the carbon, and a quiet external fan pulling. My general thoughts are that it's better to get a good loud fan and muffle it by pushing into carbon, than relying on a weak, quiet fan to pull.
18mm mdf seems overkill, but 12mm is on the thin side for sure, so I'd say go with 18mm MDF as long as you don't move house often. I think MDF is even better than ply for sound insulation, but not positive. Ply is hardier and will withstand the inevitable moments when you forget to close the drain tap on your bucket or whatever.
Yeah you will have it all painted so shouldn't be much seepage or that kind of stuff. If you pay attention to the pressure environments you're creating, anything like that is not an issue. Negative pressure in cab, slightly positive pressure in light section (if possible)
Edit: Didn't see fatigues answer there, all good advice.
Got noise problems? Get Dynamat. It's made for cars with loud stereo systems. 1.7mm thick, water resistant, and dampens noise, vibrations, and helps reduce heat. Comes in a few different "Paks". Large, med, small etc.
Tech detailsPDF)
http://dynamat.com/download/specs/2204_Spec_Sheet_Dynamat_Xtreme.pdf
Another PDF:
http://www.dynamat.com/download/2010_Dynamat_Sell_Sheet_Print.pdf
Manufacturer website:
http://www.dynamat.com/products_car_audio_introduction.html
If you live near a car audio place you could probably get it cheaper from the store rather than ordering online.
Stuff is kind of pricey but works extremely well.
Tech details
PDF)http://dynamat.com/download/specs/2204_Spec_Sheet_Dynamat_Xtreme.pdf
Another PDF:
http://www.dynamat.com/download/2010_Dynamat_Sell_Sheet_Print.pdf
Manufacturer website:
http://www.dynamat.com/products_car_audio_introduction.html
If you live near a car audio place you could probably get it cheaper from the store rather than ordering online.
Stuff is kind of pricey but works extremely well.
Got noise problems? Get Dynamat. It's made for cars with loud stereo systems. 1.7mm thick, water resistant, and dampens noise, vibrations, and helps reduce heat. Comes in a few different "Paks". Large, med, small etc.
Tech details
http://dynamat.com/download/specs/2204_Spec_Sheet_Dynamat_Xtreme.pdf
Another PDF:
http://www.dynamat.com/download/2010_Dynamat_Sell_Sheet_Print.pdf
Manufacturer website:
http://www.dynamat.com/products_car_audio_introduction.html
If you live near a car audio place you could probably get it cheaper from the store rather than ordering online.
Stuff is kind of pricey but works extremely well.
Word! I looked into that earlier on recommendation from another ICer. Definitely good stuff although a little over budget. I think it was $100aud for a 2-door kit in my middle-of-nowhere town...shit, I couldn't believe for once they had something in store, right there.
I was looking at a computer modding product a few days ago called AcoustiPack. I would like some of that too.
Hey scrub I'm interested in seeing this carbon filter you are going to be building. Got a parts list?
I gave in and made the move from a pc case to a small cabinet. Ac fan is working like a charm. Gotta get some dryer duct, and something to hang the filter with, and it's complete. Hopefully I'll get some pics up soon.
-Edit
Weird.. It inserted my post here instead of at the bottom where it should be..
Anyway my question: Do you think I'd run into any problems using a ceiling fan speed controller like this?
Definitely going to have to get a speed controller of some kind because this thing screams.
I gave in and made the move from a pc case to a small cabinet. Ac fan is working like a charm. Gotta get some dryer duct, and something to hang the filter with, and it's complete. Hopefully I'll get some pics up soon.
-Edit
Weird.. It inserted my post here instead of at the bottom where it should be..
Anyway my question: Do you think I'd run into any problems using a ceiling fan speed controller like this?
Definitely going to have to get a speed controller of some kind because this thing screams.
Anyone know why it's inserting my posts up here instead of at the bottom?
Anyway I'm about to rip the knob and stuff out a box fan, and try hooking it up to my fan to see if it will work to control the speed. Hopefully it won't blow my fan.
Wish me luck.. I'll post with the outcome in a few.
Anyway I'm about to rip the knob and stuff out a box fan, and try hooking it up to my fan to see if it will work to control the speed. Hopefully it won't blow my fan.
Wish me luck.. I'll post with the outcome in a few.
I ended up buying yet more fans for my server case. I've now settled on 2 ventilation fans total, one in the light hood:
Delta 92mm FFB0912EHE
And to filter the grow area I got a:
Delta 80mm FFB0812EHE
I also ordered the parts to make a carbon filter strictly out of PC ventilation products. If it works it just bolts together and gets filled with carbon, hopefuly nothing more needed. And a Vantec Nexus NXP-301 speed controller.
This is gonna be crazy, son!
I do have an important question though.
Doh, no I don't, I edited it out
Delta 92mm FFB0912EHE
- 1 Amp
- 110 CFM
- 16.90 mmh2o
- 55 dB-A
And to filter the grow area I got a:
Delta 80mm FFB0812EHE
- 0.9 Amp
- 80 CFM
- 20.63 mmh2o
- 52.5 dB-A
I also ordered the parts to make a carbon filter strictly out of PC ventilation products. If it works it just bolts together and gets filled with carbon, hopefuly nothing more needed.
And a Vantec Nexus NXP-301 speed controller.This is gonna be crazy, son!
I do have an important question though. Doh, no I don't, I edited it out
Last edited:
Strangely
Member
Thick MDF it is then gents, cheers! I'll be undercoating with a waterproof paint prior to the matt white so hopefully that will help, as ScrubNinja accurately points out... 'withstand the inevitable moments when you forget to close the drain tap on your bucket or whatever.'
Might look into some further dampening materials as well for my fan section. Thin stuff though, as my proposed cab will be teeny! Scrub, Fatigues and Cloud9 - Thanks for all the advice!
Might look into some further dampening materials as well for my fan section. Thin stuff though, as my proposed cab will be teeny! Scrub, Fatigues and Cloud9 - Thanks for all the advice!
I ripped a speed knob out of a box fan, and it basically serves as an on/off switch unless your fans motor has different speed settings.
Speed: Low/Medium/High all switch the fan to high.(I think because the original motors lowest speed was my fans highest speed)
Switching to off cuts the fan off as it should..
A knob from a box fan also works on dc fans the same was it does with my ac fan.
So bottom line.. If you are looking for an on/off switch for any of your fans then the knob out of a box fan(or any fan I would guess) will do the job.
Speed: Low/Medium/High all switch the fan to high.(I think because the original motors lowest speed was my fans highest speed)
Switching to off cuts the fan off as it should..
A knob from a box fan also works on dc fans the same was it does with my ac fan.
So bottom line.. If you are looking for an on/off switch for any of your fans then the knob out of a box fan(or any fan I would guess) will do the job.
Thanks for the tip Cloud.
SVK, I was going to have CFLs in a glass shield but as of last night, I will now be doing a pure CCFL grow I would actually cherish the Ultra Kaze's. Are you sure you understand the concept of slowing them down so they aren't as loud? Look like a great fan to me. Otherwise I generally recommend the Smart Fan II for most micro grows as it has the speed dial and is pretty convenient and will cool most stuff. It's not as ultimately powerful as the Scythe though.
This is a 35w CCFL grow:
SVK, I was going to have CFLs in a glass shield but as of last night, I will now be doing a pure CCFL grow
I would actually cherish the Ultra Kaze's. Are you sure you understand the concept of slowing them down so they aren't as loud? Look like a great fan to me. Otherwise I generally recommend the Smart Fan II for most micro grows as it has the speed dial and is pretty convenient and will cool most stuff. It's not as ultimately powerful as the Scythe though.This is a 35w CCFL grow:
Okay today's discovery is the Sanyo Denki counter rotating fan.
300 cfm
48.9 mmh2o
7.2 amps
70 dBA
Looks like directly stacking counter rotating fans does work after all!
300 cfm 48.9 mmh2o 7.2 amps 70 dBALooks like directly stacking counter rotating fans does work after all!
Haha just checkin'! That sounds weird like your intakes are restricted to me. I've not noticed any kind of whistling when the SFII's are slowed down. Just a generic rushing air sound.
Can someone point me to a fan speed controller that is proven to work with an AC axial type fan. Price is an issue I would hate to spend more than $10-$15 for a speed controller
Ive looked around and have found a few but Im not sure if they will work with my fan since they are setting type controllers (with low,med,high) and not a continuous knob.
Any insight anyone has would be great.
Ive looked around and have found a few but Im not sure if they will work with my fan since they are setting type controllers (with low,med,high) and not a continuous knob.
Any insight anyone has would be great.
