Colorado Medical Marijuana Analytical Lab

[veta]

If anyone here can help me gauge what interest the colorado community might have in an analytical laboratory that specializes in cannabis quality control. I am a biotechnology researcher with 10 years of experience in analytical methods. In the past I have provided quality control services on a limited case by case basis for producers, and recently I have been asked to provide these service much more regularly. As I currently can not provide regular testing in my current setting, it has been suggested to me that the larger provider community would be very interested in utilizing such a service, and that it might be viable as a stand alone business. I am looking for any feedback from the community that I can get.

A little bit about what I have provided in the past. I have developed a method for cannabinod analysis of samples utilizing HPLC (High Performance Liquid Chromatography) and GC/MS (Gas Chromatography/ Mass Spectrometry). What this means is that I am able to determine the content of THC, THCV, THCA, CBD, CBN, CBDA, and CBC in just about any cannabis material (raw plant material, oils, consumables, and extracts). I use only about 250 mg or material per test (a very small amount) In the past this information has been used primary for strain improvement, but it can also be used to provide characterization and quality control. Other services I could provide include mold and fungus detection and characterization, detection and quantification of the presence of pesticides and residual fertilizers, and bulk sterilization of products.

I have a few questions that will help me determine if providing these services to the community could form a self sustaining business. If you could answer the questions below it would be very helpful.

Would you be interested in any of these services?

As a patient would knowing the content of your medicine be something that you would find desirable?

Would it effect your choice of provider?

If so, which services do you see as the highest priority? I am assuming that cannabinod analysis would be the most attractive based on past experience.

If you are a dispensary or care giver, how many samples a month do you think you would require? A single sample could quantify a whole crop/bake good/extract/etc. In the past people have used this to test new clones and monitor strain production over time.

I estimate the cost of running and analyzing a sample right now to be 35-40$, does this seem like a ok price point?

If not, what do you think is a viable price point? Keep in mind each sample needs about 30 mins of tech time, 45 mins of machine time, plus reagent costs.

Finally would you or anyone you know be interested in investing in this type of business? If so, please forward them this message, and have them contact me at tor.talk(at)gmail.com or PM here.

I am considering offering pre-purchasing of sample analysis, at a significant discount to help fund the venture, is this something you might consider?


If anyone has any other questions or comments go ahead and post them here.

I thank you for your time.

veta

 

[pikes peak 69]

This sounds exactly like something we need in Colorado. That of course is only my opinion.
As far as answers to your questions,
1 yes
2 yes
3 yes
4 yes that would be most important I feel also.
5 2-3 per month? I'm small time LOL
6 I think that is reasonable prices
7 ^^^
8 Don't know anyone to help financially
9 I would probably pay as you go, Sorry no money

Hth
pp69

If anyone here can help me gauge what interest the colorado community might have in an analytical laboratory that specializes in cannabis quality control. I am a biotechnology researcher with 10 years of experience in analytical methods. In the past I have provided quality control services on a limited case by case basis for producers, and recently I have been asked to provide these service much more regularly. As I currently can not provide regular testing in my current setting, it has been suggested to me that the larger provider community would be very interested in utilizing such a service, and that it might be viable as a stand alone business. I am looking for any feedback from the community that I can get.

A little bit about what I have provided in the past. I have developed a method for cannabinod analysis of samples utilizing HPLC (High Performance Liquid Chromatography) and GC/MS (Gas Chromatography/ Mass Spectrometry). What this means is that I am able to determine the content of THC, THCV, THCA, CBD, CBN, CBDA, and CBC in just about any cannabis material (raw plant material, oils, consumables, and extracts). I use only about 250 mg or material per test (a very small amount) In the past this information has been used primary for strain improvement, but it can also be used to provide characterization and quality control. Other services I could provide include mold and fungus detection and characterization, detection and quantification of the presence of pesticides and residual fertilizers, and bulk sterilization of products.

I have a few questions that will help me determine if providing these services to the community could form a self sustaining business. If you could answer the questions below it would be very helpful.

Would you be interested in any of these services?

As a patient would knowing the content of your medicine be something that you would find desirable?

Would it effect your choice of provider?

If so, which services do you see as the highest priority? I am assuming that cannabinod analysis would be the most attractive based on past experience.

If you are a dispensary or care giver, how many samples a month do you think you would require? A single sample could quantify a whole crop/bake good/extract/etc. In the past people have used this to test new clones and monitor strain production over time.

I estimate the cost of running and analyzing a sample right now to be 35-40$, does this seem like a ok price point?

If not, what do you think is a viable price point? Keep in mind each sample needs about 30 mins of tech time, 45 mins of machine time, plus reagent costs.

Finally would you or anyone you know be interested in investing in this type of business? If so, please forward them this message, and have them contact me at tor.talk(at)gmail.com or PM here.

I am considering offering pre-purchasing of sample analysis, at a significant discount to help fund the venture, is this something you might consider?


If anyone has any other questions or comments go ahead and post them here.

I thank you for your time.

veta

 

[Jsmoke]

They already have this service at the Harborside Club in the bay area and it is extremely helpful. Since you can ensure that your medicine does not have any harmful molds that could affect an already ill patient. Also you have a better idea of the potency of your medicine. As someone who lives in cali and colo i would say this is a necessity.

 

[alphaguru]

sure sounds good

 

[clonedoctor420@]

bump

 

[Ms_Weekend]

35 bucks?! sounds cheap...but i guess places with 20 strains + 5 hashes it could get expensive.....ohh, what about cookies & stuff, can you test those?.

I dont know if your could make a "good" living here yet....but if the scene keeps growing i could see it happening

looking for any investors?, or sales people?

 

[dc2bar]

sign me up for at least 2 analysises, for just my personal stash. I think something like this would be a great thing for the community...growers can drop off a crop to the dispensary, and based on potency a fair price can be worked out. In the end the customer gets a good product priced correctly too. win/win/win imo.

 

[Kola Radical]

The thing about growing cannabis is the stick buds gather all kinds of dust, lint, fibers, hairs, and anything else blowing in the wind. I'm for anything that makes a more pure product without the adulterants.

 

[veta]

It really is the next logical step in the whole process, and coming from a industry/ pharmaceutical background it is hard to believe that there isn't some sort of legislation that requires this already. It is being sold as a medication, and patients should really demand that they know what they are receiving. Ideally, it would become something that patients come to expect from providers....

Plus, should the government ever try to change the laws having this type of testing system voluntarly in place would go a long way to makeing the whole system more seem more legitament to the larger public. The PR value alone is huge.

As to the price, most analytical labs offering HPLC services have a 200$ setup fee then 50-100$ per sample after that. The idea here is to try and get a number of clients so I could dedicate a machine and technologist to just one assay, and keep cost low. In order to do this the service needs to get 100's of samples a month to keep costs low.

I have written a business plan that includes different methods of setting up the company. It could be a corporation, non-profit, or CO-OP. But the start up costs are not trivial. I need to raise 70,000$ to do it right, and ensure the business could remain open for a full year while it builds a clientele. I have run this type of service before, and you need to think on years long time scale. I am not looking to get rich off doing this, but I also want to make sure I don't lose my house either.

Assaying food stuffs in not a problem. In fact in some ways it is easier.

Mold/fungus/pesticide testing is very straight forward and doesn't requier as expensive testing equipment as the cannabinod analysis.

I am talking with a lawyer about how samples could be sent to the facility. In the start they would probably need to be dropped off, but I think they could be shipped eventually, which would allow the service to reach a larger area. Making sure the service is not breaking laws is a not exactly straight forward. Receiving and storing samples on the premises may expose the owners and workers to law enforcement action. The laws are not 100% clear on this in colorado. I could apply for a DEA permit, but they are not likely to approve it for this type of operation.

It has been suggested that I should try to get each dispensary in colorado to purchase 2000$ in tests up front, and offer a 25% discount for the first 2000$ worth of tests. (IE, they would get 65 test for 2000$ as opposed to 50 for 2000$) That number of tests would probably be 4-6 months of testing for a small dispensary. (but it really depends on the variety of products they offer)

Anyway, its all on paper right now. Maybe there is a wealthy investor out there that could back the whole venture, but I haven't connected with them yet.

Keep the feed back coming. Patients, talk to your providers. Providers, think of the added value it would bring to your products. The entire community should at least be thinking about it.

 

[Pythagllio]

I really want to develop a high CBD low THC strain. The objective would be a true breeding medicinal plant to blend with a high THC strain or even as a stand alone for those who seek the medicinal qualities without getting high, and yes, there are lots of people who would pass on the THC if given the opportunity. But there's really little way to quantify a high CBD strain without a testing facility. Then I'd need a source of seeds...funny I can get high THC strains all day long with no problem, but where do I find non-psychoactive seeds? Prohibition has strange side effects indeed.

BTW I think Harborside charges $100 per sample. I guess I think that's not unfair for a single sample, but how about some quantity pricing?

 

[veta]

100$ is pretty standard for most HPLC runs. They probably don't do many of them a week, which keeps the price up. I'm hopeing to keep the price low, and work on volume. The goal is to make it accessible to a large segment of the population. 100$ a smaple is probably to high a price point for routine use. I would eventually like to get it the price down to 20$ a run, but that will take some time to build up the volume.


Volume discounts are in the current draft of the business plan.

 

[Hydro-Soil]

I
As a patient would knowing the content of your medicine be something that you would find desirable?

Yes.

I would prefer to have all of my strains tested so that I can begin to get a comparison between different cannabinoid levels and how that correlates to how my brain functions on them.

 

[BudGood]

This sounds like a great idea, and the price sounds right. Get it started, and start advertising. I'm sure the people will beat a path to your door!

 

[r13f]

A question brought up on another thread here - hash oil for dummies, the THC & cannabinoid percentage is 85, but what is the other 15%? Can this be determined blindly? Or must you be looking actively for the other components? Would solvents pop up in the result if they were left in the product?

 

[veta]

A question brought up on another thread here - hash oil for dummies, the THC & cannabinoid percentage is 85, but what is the other 15%? Can this be determined blindly? Or must you be looking actively for the other components? Would solvents pop up in the result if they were left in the product?

From my experience the content of oil can vary based on how it was manufactured.There are alot of different solvents people use to extract the oil, and each pulls different impurities with it. That other ~15% IME is usually fats, terpenes and waxes. Testing should be able to identify some of the impurities. It is not really possible to just look/smell/taste it and know what impurities you are dealing with. There alot of ways to clean it up, but most are not things the average home experimenter can do.

Fractional distillation can get a 90-95% pure THC product, even higher if you really sacrifice your final yield. It needs to be done under vacuum and usually needs a small scale apparatus, unless you have a good amount of product, usually >100 grams.

Column chromatography can get a >99% pure product. It can be done on smaller amounts but if also needs special equipment. It is a non trivial process. This is how HPLC standards are made.

 

[veta]

This sounds like a great idea, and the price sounds right. Get it started, and start advertising. I'm sure the people will beat a path to your door!

That is what I have been told, but I want to gauage the level of interest before I start begging, err soliciting, start up money from every one I know. This kind of community interaction is part of what they call "market research"

2 people can tell you its a great idea, even 10 or 20. Still doesn't mean it is. You need to poll a large diverse group to really get a feel for it.

Speaking of that, you guys know of any other forums I should post to? I have sent a email to about 40 dispensaries in CO and am slowly hearing back from them. If anyone has a full list of them that would be a big help too. I have a feeling that raising the money should not be that hard once people start to learn more about it.

Mostly I feel it is going to be a word of mouth thing. Slow to start but builds good steam.

 

[still2big]

its a great idea for not only the dispensaries but for the growers that sell to the dispensaries as well. I would be more than interested in this myself.

Imagine a grower being able to offer tested product to dispensaries! Having the THC, CBD, CBN, THCV, CBC, CBL etc, levels of a product would help progress the actual medical community 10 fold. Not to mention having growers that try new things in there room being able to see whats working and whats not. Whats helping improve the levels of not only THC but the other MORE beneficial cannabinoids as well.

I could go on and on but yes its a great idea, yes i would test everything that went out the door.

 

[rooted]

veta this is a wonderful opportunity for you and all of us in colorado, caregivers and patients alike....i really hope this takes off, and i'm sure plenty of us are curious enough and ready to really analyze our medicine for the better of the community.

i'll be in touch

 

[BudGood]

Get your post count up to 50 veta, time to go crusing the website. The Tokers Den is a cool place, but there are many sub-forums. Come by my thread, I'd love to have my stuff tested. I could see your biz taking off, if I could tell my patients all that info about the meds, it'd be great. Props to you for doing this!

 

[Hydro-Soil]

there are lots of people who would pass on the THC if given the opportunity.

I wouldn't pass on it as it has many medicinal properties but I would definitely appreciate it NOT being the most prevalent active compound.

I would really appreciate the opportunity to breed an anti depression/anxiety strain and your services would be such a boon.