billyjojimbob11
Member
Here, harvest day... This was not possible before the amber spot light. Dont forget, side lighting or 45deg lighting is also very important, somthing that leds do very well. Time for a coffee...
U
unthing
How much more mass did the amber provide?
Tanuvan
Member
Here, harvest day... This was not possible before the amber spot light. Dont forget, side lighting or 45deg lighting is also very important, somthing that leds do very well. Time for a coffee...
Absolutely amazing. So the next question naturally...is are there any lights currently available that include the Amber spectrum?
billyjojimbob11
Member
Lots man, lots 25-35%
VladTheInhaler
Member
I'm having trouble sleeping lately because I ordered UFO with Red 630-Blue 460-Orange 615 in 7:1:1 for flowering. Have I screwed up with those reds?
VladTheInhaler
Member
Well some UFO knockoffs are using 590nm yellow/orange.Absolutely amazing. So the next question naturally...is are there any lights currently available that include the Amber spectrum?
billyjojimbob11
Member
Not a chance, you should be fine, however if it doesnt do what you want, add a spot light or two to the sides of the color of your choice. I recommend amber.
From what I have learned so far, its not exact colors that will improve your yield, it's three things:
1. A little more light.
2. Diversificaton of par light, the more different red/orange/yellow colors, the more efficient the plant can use that light. I still believe that using one narrow band of light is hardly efficient to a plant, I think you can overkill most any color and loose efficiency.
3. Side lighting, or angled lighting.
Leds are perfect for achieving these 3 points. Your ufo will likely account for 70-80% of what you will need. You dont have to spend too much more money to enhance the ufo, maybe a couple of cfl's or halogen spot lights if you go the cheap route. But if you want to stay with led, I recomend ledsplus.com for additional led fixtures. They are cheaper than most, and the cool fin spot lights disperse heat very well, and the chips are a good upper mid range name brand led.
My buddy bought 8 of those spot lights and made an entire cab with the back of the light heat sink outside of the cab and only the front side of the fixture inside the cab. It's so stealth the way he did it because he does not use a fan at all, most of the crude heat from the leds never enter the cab, the heat is routed to the outside of the cab. His fixtures are mounted at different angles, top, side, corners, etc. There is no smell or sound whatsoever. And it is working like a dream so far. He didnt add amber, but after he saw my latest crop, he is replacing one of two blue's for amber.
VladTheInhaler
Member
Well, I was thinking in line of imitating what hps does, only with more blue light. I remember something being said about lower efficiency of 660 nm LEDs, hence the 630 ones. But as soon as I confirmed my order, a little voice in my head started saying: 'Hey Vlad, you moron, you should have gone with 660's or 50:50 ratio on 660:630.'
U
unthing
I've been wondering about the 630 vs.660 or both with what ratio-thing too. There doesn't seem to be a clear answer.
dontae1000
Member
what are people yeilding of theese l.e.d lights? are people getting an oucne even?
I like the idea of using LEDs as a light source. But I went to a electronics catalog and looked at prices. Here's one at random. Digikey sells an OSRAM, blue 470 nm, 3.5V 1.4 Amp (!) 75 lumen LED for $8.29.
That seems like a high cost per lumen, $829 for a 7500 lumens of LED light. Not to mention 140 DC amps is nothing to sneeze at, even though it's only 3.5 volts, still it's 490 Watts.
What am I missing here? Are there better sources for cheap LEDs that are more efficient in terms of lumens per watt.
Someone set me straight.
That seems like a high cost per lumen, $829 for a 7500 lumens of LED light. Not to mention 140 DC amps is nothing to sneeze at, even though it's only 3.5 volts, still it's 490 Watts.
What am I missing here? Are there better sources for cheap LEDs that are more efficient in terms of lumens per watt.
Someone set me straight.
Good thing we're not after lumens
(luminous efficacy = brightness/watt perceived by the human eye.)If we were looking to get the most lumens/W, we'd all be retarded using CFL and HID lighting. That's because what we'd need to go for is scotopic vision, aka human night vision.
At illuminance levels below 0.034 lm/m2, the human eye uses rods to sense light. The rods' absorption maximum is approx 1700 lm/W. So say we buy a 25% effective 507nm peak LED rated at 0.030 lm.When using this single LED to illuminate 1 m2, its luminous efficacy is almost 425 lm/W !!!
Anyways, those LEDs you found weren't cheap. And 7500lm of 470nm is roughly 120W of pure light. I guess that's what a 600W HPS puts out.
So what you were missing was the concept of lumens
Oh I almost forgot to say hi to you guys. Been lurkin' around for a while. I've got a 22W micro grow coming, and I read this thread like three times. Weez, knna, billyjojimbob, bf74, DaVinci, everyone: Hi
Thank you all for your great posts and efforts!
Excellent post, Pinstripe!
Jay_Druthers
Member
a 75lm 470nm with a 3.4 drop at 1.4 amps would give about 135 watts of radiant power (if you used 100 led's) in a narrow band of say +- 10nm in swagging terms. (i.e. not quite exactly par watts) and when you get into the 5 watt ones some heatsinking is required.
compared to a 400 hps that has 113 par watts.
and you don't add up the amps of each it's not 140 amps it's constant current drivers so if you wanted you could just take 3.5 volts and multiply by 100 and add 10 volts and you just need 360 volts at 1.4 amps which is still 500 watts. or a combination of splitting up the leds into strings of certain voltage with a fixed current of 1.4 amps.
anyways it is best to use a mixture of the leds over a wide area and use side lighting.
you could easily build a remote ballasted 100 par equiv. watt multiwavelength 10mm 1 watt 350ma led panel with only 50cfm air cooling and no heat sink for around $600
leds in bulk would run around $2.50 ea for 100 for 30-40lm 350ma 25-35% Efficient 470 590 636
compared to a 400 hps that has 113 par watts.
and you don't add up the amps of each it's not 140 amps it's constant current drivers so if you wanted you could just take 3.5 volts and multiply by 100 and add 10 volts and you just need 360 volts at 1.4 amps which is still 500 watts. or a combination of splitting up the leds into strings of certain voltage with a fixed current of 1.4 amps.
anyways it is best to use a mixture of the leds over a wide area and use side lighting.
you could easily build a remote ballasted 100 par equiv. watt multiwavelength 10mm 1 watt 350ma led panel with only 50cfm air cooling and no heat sink for around $600
leds in bulk would run around $2.50 ea for 100 for 30-40lm 350ma 25-35% Efficient 470 590 636
billyjojimbob11
Member
Ok guys, more and more of my perpetual is maturing with newer amber spot light. I am noticing even bigger colas than even last week. Also, the trichs are extruding longer and their growth is more vigorous. The plants are finishing a week earlier, and the potency has improved dramatically. Just thought I would let you know. I will provide pics next week of the harvest.
LeoRexTyrannus
Member
BF74 on his other thread has called a stop declaring the winner in his side by side as the HPS.
I wish he had done one strictly under the Jumbo UFO.
Hopefully someone can do that in the future.
I wish he had done one strictly under the Jumbo UFO.
Hopefully someone can do that in the future.
wintermute
Member
If money was no object
If money was no object
Power supplies:
4 x Sorensen XFR40-30 0-40 V, 30 AMP, Programmable DC Power Supply (Zero Voltage, Soft Switching)
[ 4.8kW resistive load total, 8.8Ax4 = 35-40A @ 208/230VAC 1φ ]
LED emitters
20 x RB-P100W White 6000-7000K LED Emitters (100W, 3.2A, 30-36VF, 4000-6000 lumens)
10 x RB-P10OB Blue 460-470nm LED Emitters (100W, 3.2A, 30-36VF, 1000-2000 lumens)
10 x RB-P100WW Warm White 2700-3300K LED Emitters (100W, 3.2A, 30-36VF, 4000-6000 lumens)
each PS drives bank of 10.
10year service schedule
Cost: outrageous. However, for the first time 4 independent programatically controlled banks of emitters, linear adjust lumens from 0 to 200,000, and spectrum from 2700k up to 10000k (20,000 lumens @ 10000K and 120,000 lumens at cold white 6000-7000K). Schedule can adjust mix of light over 100x per second continuously for custom start, veg, bloom, finish, and other cycles.
If money was no object
Power supplies:
4 x Sorensen XFR40-30 0-40 V, 30 AMP, Programmable DC Power Supply (Zero Voltage, Soft Switching)
[ 4.8kW resistive load total, 8.8Ax4 = 35-40A @ 208/230VAC 1φ ]
LED emitters
20 x RB-P100W White 6000-7000K LED Emitters (100W, 3.2A, 30-36VF, 4000-6000 lumens)
10 x RB-P10OB Blue 460-470nm LED Emitters (100W, 3.2A, 30-36VF, 1000-2000 lumens)
10 x RB-P100WW Warm White 2700-3300K LED Emitters (100W, 3.2A, 30-36VF, 4000-6000 lumens)
each PS drives bank of 10.
10year service schedule
Cost: outrageous. However, for the first time 4 independent programatically controlled banks of emitters, linear adjust lumens from 0 to 200,000, and spectrum from 2700k up to 10000k (20,000 lumens @ 10000K and 120,000 lumens at cold white 6000-7000K). Schedule can adjust mix of light over 100x per second continuously for custom start, veg, bloom, finish, and other cycles.
U
unthing
For what I've experienced the ufo and probably the jumbo ufo (as it has same 1 watt diodes, just being able to cover larger area) too don't have a lot of penetration, maybe best light zone is like 20 cm deep to the canopy. So scrog might be ideal to keep it that low. They can produce dense buds on their own, but big dense buds, dunno.
At this point probably everyone agrees that that ufo=400 w hps is ridiculous marketing lie, but that being said, I'd say that for micro even the commercial products have their use as the prices of ufos and such (cannot comment about the big lights, but seem to be too expensive to cover the costs anytime soon) are being lowered to reasonable levels, or at least the ebay ones.
At this point probably everyone agrees that that ufo=400 w hps is ridiculous marketing lie, but that being said, I'd say that for micro even the commercial products have their use as the prices of ufos and such (cannot comment about the big lights, but seem to be too expensive to cover the costs anytime soon) are being lowered to reasonable levels, or at least the ebay ones.
