Ebb and Flow Questions

[Toad]

Hello fellow growers! First off, I've read most of the main threads on E&F, especially the ones authored by yamaha_fan... great stuff!! I'm in the process of setting up a 2x4 foot e&f table and am wondering what size rez and water pump to use and where I can buy these. I'd like to keep my trips to the hydro store to a minimum so I'm trying to find some alternative stores.

My table is 2'x4'x6". I plan on watering three times a day for 15 minutes or so but will obviously tweek things as I go. I've been using Floranova nutes in my soil grow and will use these in this set up too. Should I just follow the bottle and go with those numbers? I plan on monitoring my ppm and adjust accordingly....

Thanks in advance for the help on the rez and water pump!

 

[FreezerBoy]

Water pumps can be found at Aquarium stores as well as any Home Depot type garden shop. The magic word for pumps is "Head" which determines the pump's ability to lift water a given distance.

Suitable containers are everywhere. Home Depot, restaurant supply, pet shops, feed and tack. If you don't want to DIY with a rubbermaid from the grocery store, Google plastic drums/barrels.

 

[jaw]

i have a 3x3 (same volume as a 2x4 tray) with a 30 gallon res i would go with 35 gallons or bigger, only thing i dont like about my res is that after 3 or 4 days when the level goes down a few inches the pump starts to strain becuase as soon as the water level goes down to the level of the pump it starts pumpin air and water. not a big deal i dont think. i just dont like the noise it makes when the tray is flooding. i use a 400 gph pump i plan to get a larger pump next run though prolly 600 or so, the pump brand is ecoplus.

i use floranova as well i love it, so simple. i am going light on them this round. i only use about 900 ppm after big bud and the nova. my plants seem to like it, ive always had problems in the past with burning the plants. so i will go easy on them and they are looking good so far. check out my grow in my signature. any other question fire away?

 

[Greyskull]

for a 2x4 table a 25-30 g rez would be about right... with either a 160 or 250 gph pump you should be styling. 396gph is what I like in a pump... but i am flooding 4x4s with 40gs.

in flower i flood 3x per light cycle, starting 1hr AFTER lights on, then 5 hrs later, then 5hrs later. 15 min pe flood.

No idea about the flora nova stuff.

Good luck.

 

[Greyskull]

hey jaw sounds like you need to be topping off the rez about mid week.

 

[Toad]

Thanks for the tips. I'll be making a shopping trip tomorrow... Sounds like I'll get a 400gph pump and a 30 gallon rez.

Question: Should I worry about using a rubbermaid bin as a rez because of its structural integrity? I can't see filling one of those up all the way without breaking. I'd rather go with something I can store under the table so the barrels are out of the question. I guess I'll get to the store and see whats available rez-wise.

Thanks again for the insight!

 

[Greyskull]

you could use the rubbermaid but you'll have to build some sort of frame.

I like the prefabbed stuff, myself.

 

[jaw]

if you do use rubbermaids maybe get 2 of them so you can put one down inside another for extra support. or get a really big one, so that the water does not go to the top of it

 

[d4twamp]

I use plastic totes for my res. they are not as durable as the retail hydro shop ones but they cost a whole lot less...they do push out on the long sides so doubling them up is a good idea...they owner of one of the local hydro store's says the eco-plus 396 is just fine for this 40 gal res w/ the 4x4 tray that still hasn't seen action....I've built a couple Ebb & Flow systems w/ underbed plastic storage tubs and rubbermaid res's...it works just fine with the eco-plus 185gph, the one thing I've found with growing Ebb & Flow is if you can get a lid and grow them in net pots in a lid so the roots can dangle into the tray I've found this to give a lot bigger root structure, which equates in bigger yields imho....I think a good way to go for pump to res size is: make sure your pump will move 100 gph for every 10 gallons of res volume ie: in my 18 gal res I use a 185 gph pump...if my res was 100 gallons I'd go with a 1000 gph pump...

I hope all my rambling helps you some...


later, D

 

[FreezerBoy]

you could use the rubbermaid but you'll have to build some sort of frame.

I wouldn't try to lift or move my 18 gal rubbermaid, let alone a 30.

Maybe something here Barrels and Drums

 

[Greyskull]

I know... people sometimes forget how heavy water is. Gotta pump it out before you move it. SO BE SURE YOU LIKE WHERE IT IS BEFORE YOU FILL IT UP.

The thing with the drums and barrells for me is that in order to have gravity return the soultion from the table, the table has to be pretty darn high up to begin with... which eats into your height. Unless you get another pump and rig something together.

Prefab reserviors like botanicare's are nice and solid and have a good low profile. they can slide right underneath the trays... some are trays and reserviors are designed to piggy back (tray on rez).

either way the drums & barrells and prefab hydro rezies all work the same in the end - they hold the solution.

 

[FreezerBoy]

The thing with the drums and barrells for me is that in order to have gravity return the soultion from the table, the table has to be pretty darn high up to begin with... which eats into your height.

And height is worth it's weight in liquid plutonium. Good point.

 

[yamaha_1fan]

Rubbermaid has a commercial line of products. Thats what my rezes are made of. They are probably too large for your size. But if you have a tractor supply near you, you may be able to find a smaller size.

I have also seen some strong bins at Home Depot

For the pump, try to get a bigger one. Then you can put a tee on it with a valve. That way every time the pump turns on, it mixes the res. And you can use it to mix nutes etc by closing the valve to the table.


I have a question for the experienced E&Fers. Do you have filters on your system? I wanted to put an inline filter in but then when the water drains back through the filter, its going to clean the filter. I thought of a pump bag, but same thing.

 

[Greyskull]

For the pump, try to get a bigger one. Then you can put a tee on it with a valve. That way every time the pump turns on, it mixes the res. And you can use it to mix nutes etc by closing the valve to the table.


I have a question for the experienced E&Fers. Do you have filters on your system? I wanted to put an inline filter in but then when the water drains back through the filter, its going to clean the filter. I thought of a pump bag, but same thing.

Never thought about te TEE thing... NICE! mahalos man.
No filters BTW (except the standard filter on the pumps). Been thinking about the pump bag for about a yer now...

 

[Chomas]

where is a good place online to get a good pump for a 3x3 ebb and flow setup? Everything else you can get at home depot Toad.

Maybe ill use a 50 gallon res? still have to decide on the res size myself but you want a BIG reservoir or else you could burn our your pump easy, by doing what jaw is doing(careful bro! have an extra pump on hand for sure) - pumping air and water which strains the pump.

I run a 2'x2' setup now with a 20 gallon reservoir which is good for like a week before it needs to be topped, but a 3x3 table is over TWICE as much volume as a 2x2

 

[jaw]

where is a good place online to get a good pump for a 3x3 ebb and flow setup? Everything else you can get at home depot Toad.

Maybe ill use a 50 gallon res? still have to decide on the res size myself but you want a BIG reservoir or else you could burn our your pump easy, by doing what jaw is doing(careful bro! have an extra pump on hand for sure) - pumping air and water which strains the pump.

just google hydroponics water pump one of those sites will be fine.

ya i have a few extra pumps laying around. and i check on my girls daily, still worries me, thats why i recommended a larger resivour. i like ebb and flow because of the simplicity and automation, and having to top off a res every few days takes away from the automation. ima a lazy grower

 

[OgreSeeker]

Don't forget that you can get a 55 gal plastic drum/barrel (the kind with the screw-in bung rather than the one with the removable lid), make sure the bungs are tight, lay it on it's side and cut a hole. You may have to brace it so it doesn't roll but this works very well for DIYers that require larger volume reservoirs and head space.


*EDIT*

Found my 55 gal plastic drums (total of 10) for $5 each on craigslist. I see them all the time on CL for around $10 to $20 each

 

[Medium Pimpin']

what size res for a standard 2' x 2' table?
couldnt find a link for calculations.
would 20 gallons be ample?

 

[cemchris]

^
honestly the bigger the better. ran 15 gal res's with the 2x2's and had to fill multi times a week. I would go for a 20+.


As far as pump bags are concerned. They work great for mediums like coir but all depends on the nutes. Molasses, LK, Big Bloom, Extreme Serene, Maxicrop ect - thick organic tea like mixtures - will clog the bags QUICKLY I mean in a matter of days which in turn can lead to burned out pumps (which is why a double of all your equipment in hydro is a good lesson to learn early on).

I run the standard 40 gal rezs with the 4x4's from bot. If I had bought them seperatly I would have gone with 50 or maybe more. Late into flower I will top off twice a week sometimes more size dependent. Cutting down on plant number helped some but still it can be a chore. Plus bigger rezs stay more ph stable.

 

[sativa_cyborg13]

for what it is worth, i have an airpump in my rez of my ebb and flow system to keep things stirred up. it seems to be working fine so far. i got my air pump at a discount tool store also known as harbour freight, and paid next to nothing for it. the rubbermaid for my table came from the big lots, which supprisingly carries a decent variety(relatively speaking). I cannot offer any other help, because i am new at this as well. but i do firmly believe in bargain shopping if the quality of the product is worth it.