150w HPS Club and Resource Guide......
- Thread starter Pipedream
- Start date
Hello all,
I am considering getting a 175w mh for my NGB style cab.
I currently have 6 24w cfls and frankly they just don't cut it for vegging in my opinion.
Yes the are great for seedlings and cuttings and early veg but are lacking for getting more agressive growth of larger plants. IMO.
This is where my bottle neck in my perpetual harvest schedule is occuring.
Now I have looked at 1000 bulbs and econolight. I am going to order a 175w mh ballast (venture) and bulb and socket.
I have two questions.
First, should I get a standard 175w MH or a pulse start 175w MH?
Secondly, in replacing the 6 24w cfls with a remote ballasted 175w bulb should reduce my heat generation in the cabinet due to the ballast being remote...is this correct?
I eagerly await yoru opinions.
minds_I
I am considering getting a 175w mh for my NGB style cab.
I currently have 6 24w cfls and frankly they just don't cut it for vegging in my opinion.
Yes the are great for seedlings and cuttings and early veg but are lacking for getting more agressive growth of larger plants. IMO.
This is where my bottle neck in my perpetual harvest schedule is occuring.
Now I have looked at 1000 bulbs and econolight. I am going to order a 175w mh ballast (venture) and bulb and socket.
I have two questions.
First, should I get a standard 175w MH or a pulse start 175w MH?
Secondly, in replacing the 6 24w cfls with a remote ballasted 175w bulb should reduce my heat generation in the cabinet due to the ballast being remote...is this correct?
I eagerly await yoru opinions.
minds_I
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Bulénath
Member
MindsI,
I have three 19 watt CFL's giving 55 watts per square foot. They can veg six plants, in those common 4"-5" flimsy black plastic square pots, for a good three months!
I also can keep a mother in there, and have for over two years, along with being able to keep my cloning box and over four vegging plants in four black square pots at once. Needless to say, your amount of light, is waaaaay more than enough light.
Keeping them in 4" square pots for 3+ months, with low-dose veg-ferts, they wont get very big, but they will be very strong, and as soon as you transplant them (given you adjust the roots acording to the duration of veg + how they look), they should take off like crazy, enough for a good stativa to fill an enite 3 square foot area with a 150 hps in two or three weeks, with a five gallon pot, the right soils and ferts.
Your plants dont have to be very big going into the flower chamber, but a good precurser is the stage where they can take some ferts, so about 2-3 weeks old minimum, and preferably 3-4 weeks old.
If you can't obtain plants good enough to flower with the amout of CFL-power you are using, then it's porbalby either:
A) Your not using the right spectrum CFL's for veg. i.e. 5500K-6500K
B) Your not giving them enough wattage per square foot, meaning your grow cab is not sufficiently and symetricaly sized to reflect the lights, such as having a grow box with 50 watts per square foot. Or it could also very well be not enough ventilation i.e. five air exchanges per minute, which is the heart of every grow.
C) Your not using the right soils and ferts to get them going during veg and flower...
Also, you want higher humdity for veging babies. It is a little easier to get away with well established clones that have root systems, but for seedlings, you need higher humidity, which will help with a more optimal enviroment for obtianing a better female/male ratio. The HID lights like HPS and MH will zap the humidity much more than CFL's do, for the bulb does get much hotter. However, if you have the bulb in a air cooled hood or cool tube, that might change things.
Still yet, CFL's are one of the best for vegging plants. You can position them better, giving a more well-rouded light distribution throughout your grow chamber. They are small and compact, they dont get very hot, they are easy to deal with, you can get your plants really close to them, like 1" away, etc...
Now, let's say that you are trying to do a shallow, yet large-surface area scrog, with a short distance to the bulb, which will supress the stretch, and you need your plant to fill out a lot in the pot before flipping to 12/12.
I'd say, you sould be able to transplant into your flower chamber and veg it out for a week or two longer, then flip 12/12. I am currently doing this with my new cross, which is very indica.
I have three 19 watt CFL's giving 55 watts per square foot. They can veg six plants, in those common 4"-5" flimsy black plastic square pots, for a good three months!
I also can keep a mother in there, and have for over two years, along with being able to keep my cloning box and over four vegging plants in four black square pots at once. Needless to say, your amount of light, is waaaaay more than enough light.
Keeping them in 4" square pots for 3+ months, with low-dose veg-ferts, they wont get very big, but they will be very strong, and as soon as you transplant them (given you adjust the roots acording to the duration of veg + how they look), they should take off like crazy, enough for a good stativa to fill an enite 3 square foot area with a 150 hps in two or three weeks, with a five gallon pot, the right soils and ferts.
Your plants dont have to be very big going into the flower chamber, but a good precurser is the stage where they can take some ferts, so about 2-3 weeks old minimum, and preferably 3-4 weeks old.
If you can't obtain plants good enough to flower with the amout of CFL-power you are using, then it's porbalby either:
A) Your not using the right spectrum CFL's for veg. i.e. 5500K-6500K
B) Your not giving them enough wattage per square foot, meaning your grow cab is not sufficiently and symetricaly sized to reflect the lights, such as having a grow box with 50 watts per square foot. Or it could also very well be not enough ventilation i.e. five air exchanges per minute, which is the heart of every grow.
C) Your not using the right soils and ferts to get them going during veg and flower...
Also, you want higher humdity for veging babies. It is a little easier to get away with well established clones that have root systems, but for seedlings, you need higher humidity, which will help with a more optimal enviroment for obtianing a better female/male ratio. The HID lights like HPS and MH will zap the humidity much more than CFL's do, for the bulb does get much hotter. However, if you have the bulb in a air cooled hood or cool tube, that might change things.
Still yet, CFL's are one of the best for vegging plants. You can position them better, giving a more well-rouded light distribution throughout your grow chamber. They are small and compact, they dont get very hot, they are easy to deal with, you can get your plants really close to them, like 1" away, etc...
Now, let's say that you are trying to do a shallow, yet large-surface area scrog, with a short distance to the bulb, which will supress the stretch, and you need your plant to fill out a lot in the pot before flipping to 12/12.
I'd say, you sould be able to transplant into your flower chamber and veg it out for a week or two longer, then flip 12/12. I am currently doing this with my new cross, which is very indica.
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Bulénath
Member
One-weekold
Other plants, same cabinet, about 2-3 weeks old. Vegged in 33% each: Perlite, vermiculite, worm castings (black gold brand)
25 days old, day of transplant. Straight from those 4-5" square black pots, to 5 gallons of 33% each Perlite, Worm castings, Black Golds Organic Potting Mix.
Day six flower
Day 8
about day 12
And 30-40 days
Later
Other plants, same cabinet, about 2-3 weeks old. Vegged in 33% each: Perlite, vermiculite, worm castings (black gold brand)
25 days old, day of transplant. Straight from those 4-5" square black pots, to 5 gallons of 33% each Perlite, Worm castings, Black Golds Organic Potting Mix.
Day six flower
Day 8
about day 12
And 30-40 days
Later
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Indica Monkey
Member
That's a nice veg cab there Bulenath, I will be building one myself over the next few weeks. Do you have a thread about the cab or the build I could look at?
I've always thought that one large LST'd plant or two smaller ones do well under a 150. They're easier to handle/manage and you can keep them in bigger pots, but lots of folks do more. PipeDream has as many as 6 plants going at once under his 150. Your choice.
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Quazi
Member
I've flowered out two girls in the same pot. One of the plants became a bit dominant. I have a feeling that they would have done better in their own pots so they wouldn't be competing for root space.
But there was nothing wrong with either of the plants in the end. They were just a bit smaller than they could have been.
-Q
But there was nothing wrong with either of the plants in the end. They were just a bit smaller than they could have been.
-Q
Bulénath
Member
Indicamonkey,
Which cabinet do you want pics of?
I havent done a tutorial, but probably should.
Bojo,
Twice I have grown two plants in a single 5 gallon pot. Never had any problems, but I know their roots are fighting for dominance. I feel kinda bad doing that to the plants, and although it dosent hurt them, it is still better to go 1 plant per pot.
Which cabinet do you want pics of?
I havent done a tutorial, but probably should.
Bojo,
Twice I have grown two plants in a single 5 gallon pot. Never had any problems, but I know their roots are fighting for dominance. I feel kinda bad doing that to the plants, and although it dosent hurt them, it is still better to go 1 plant per pot.
Bulénath
Member
vintner said:
I found that the amount of pots and thus amount of soil per pot should be proportionate to the strain and type of ganja plant being grown.
Some Indicas may do better with many plants in 2 gallon pots, for they can finish quick. But some stativas may do better in 5 gallon pots, becasue they can go for 90-120 days+, and even up to six months. But it all depends on the strain.
I suggest for everyone growing in soil, who has the means to do this, should first grow thier plant in one or two five gallon square pots, and let your plants ripen naturally to their fullest potential, regardless of pre-specified harvest time.
The next 'round, if you have the same plants' clones, try growing about five or six in 2 gallon round pots. You may see a difference in growth patterns, size, yeild, and even optimal harvest time.
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Bulénath
Member
Heres an example:
This is my CW-20 Strain, aka (G13 x Molokai) x Ducksfoot.
These are clones that went into my small cab, with better ventilation, much closer to the air condition, and much lower temps. These are flowered in 2 gallon round pots, under 17-1/2 inches from the floor to the Air-cooled reflector's glass sheild. Because of the cooler temps, they turned purple. Because of the small pots, and small flower chamber, they ripened in 85-90 days.
Here is the same strain, also grown under a 150 watt hps light like the above plants, but in a different cabinet. This plant had 32"+ from the floor to the light bulb, and five gallons of the same soil mixture. Since this cabinet is further from the Air Condition, and dosen't have as good ventilation, the temperatures are a little higher than the other cabinet, so the plant dosen't turn purple. This plant, on the other hand, went for 133 days. Remember, it is the exact same plant as the one above, for the above ones are clones.
And for those of you who read my last two posts, and are wondering what ever became of those two plants in the same pot... Well the above plant is actually one of the plants that were in the same pot! She is alone in the above pictures, for the first one was harvested at day 88, so she lived on until day 133. But the long flower time had nothing to do with being in the same pot as another plant, for the same strain, when in a repeat grow, flowered alone in a five gallon pot from the very start, and finished in 133 days aswell.
Here are the two, right about one or two days before I harvested the first one. So these pictures were taken about day 85ish flower...
Here is the dried product of the first one..
This is my CW-20 Strain, aka (G13 x Molokai) x Ducksfoot.
These are clones that went into my small cab, with better ventilation, much closer to the air condition, and much lower temps. These are flowered in 2 gallon round pots, under 17-1/2 inches from the floor to the Air-cooled reflector's glass sheild. Because of the cooler temps, they turned purple. Because of the small pots, and small flower chamber, they ripened in 85-90 days.
Here is the same strain, also grown under a 150 watt hps light like the above plants, but in a different cabinet. This plant had 32"+ from the floor to the light bulb, and five gallons of the same soil mixture. Since this cabinet is further from the Air Condition, and dosen't have as good ventilation, the temperatures are a little higher than the other cabinet, so the plant dosen't turn purple. This plant, on the other hand, went for 133 days. Remember, it is the exact same plant as the one above, for the above ones are clones.
And for those of you who read my last two posts, and are wondering what ever became of those two plants in the same pot... Well the above plant is actually one of the plants that were in the same pot! She is alone in the above pictures, for the first one was harvested at day 88, so she lived on until day 133. But the long flower time had nothing to do with being in the same pot as another plant, for the same strain, when in a repeat grow, flowered alone in a five gallon pot from the very start, and finished in 133 days aswell.
Here are the two, right about one or two days before I harvested the first one. So these pictures were taken about day 85ish flower...
Here is the dried product of the first one..
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C
Cozy Amnesia
Wowza Bulénath, nice work. 133 days? damn thats long. What's your yield with that strain?
Bulénath
Member
Thanks for the kind replies.
The 133 day plant yeilded 150 grams, both times.
But that is NOT 1 gram per watt. So many people get that mixed up! The golden pot growing-standard, the 1 gram per watt ratio, always pertians to a 60 day flower period. So the correct measurement is always X grams per watt per 60 days.
Because of the plant harvested at day 86ish, my GPW ratio was roughly 0.7 grams per watt, per 60 days, but no more than 0.7.
I have only once seen a person pull 1 gram per watt per 60 days using a 150HPS, with a circular scrog. I am hoping, because my new strain is a < 60 day finisher, that I can get about 0.8 GPW per 60 days...That is 120 grams. That would be a great goal for anyone who grows with a 150 HPS.
The 133 day plant yeilded 150 grams, both times.
But that is NOT 1 gram per watt. So many people get that mixed up! The golden pot growing-standard, the 1 gram per watt ratio, always pertians to a 60 day flower period. So the correct measurement is always X grams per watt per 60 days.
Because of the plant harvested at day 86ish, my GPW ratio was roughly 0.7 grams per watt, per 60 days, but no more than 0.7.
I have only once seen a person pull 1 gram per watt per 60 days using a 150HPS, with a circular scrog. I am hoping, because my new strain is a < 60 day finisher, that I can get about 0.8 GPW per 60 days...That is 120 grams. That would be a great goal for anyone who grows with a 150 HPS.
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