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    Hiya Moose!


    Never thought I 'd see the day you used the word 'magic' (a few posts ago). And expense? Yep ... AU$20000 to remove a kidney.


    I think you also previously referred to 'unfinished business'. Stuff that needs to be fully 'digested' before one can 'let it go'. Important stuff, that stuff ...



    Just wondering: Besides medical issues ... Who have you got to talk to?

    Comment


      Originally posted by Teddybrae View Post
      Hiya Moose!


      Never thought I 'd see the day you used the word 'magic' (a few posts ago). And expense? Yep ... AU$20000 to remove a kidney.


      I think you also previously referred to 'unfinished business'. Stuff that needs to be fully 'digested' before one can 'let it go'. Important stuff, that stuff ...



      Just wondering: Besides medical issues ... Who have you got to talk to?
      I use the word magic rarely (as you surmised) and often in quotes. not a believer in magic, other than sometimes as a metaphor for persons who are highly skilled, engaging in some feat that few to no others could pull off; that's a form of 'magic' in my world.

      Otherwise, while being a Doubting Thomas, I am more of a realist than most persons I know. I have the optimism, of a hopeful child inside, but rarely let it run free.

      The best solutions to problems, imo, are those that take into account the entirety of a situation, good, bad, or ugly, and includes mental or other schematics on what can go wrong at any moment, where, why, how, and who.. etc.

      In short, if solutions don't include the totality of reality, they're apt to fall on their ass.

      That said, there are times that novel approaches or solutions can take on an air of 'magic,' only in that they are sometimes so obvious or illuminating, that I end up slapping myself in the proverbial forehead as I surprise myself at how often I/we can miss obvious variables or answers.

      Re. unfinished business, that can incorporate any number of topics; unfinished business with persons who have passed on leaves persons with baggage and conflict for which they will need more creative resolve to end, and so forth.

      In that regard, I believe you may have been referencing my brief mention of my 2 older kids setting themselves up for similar outcomes... But we all know that American young adults and adolescents have the inside scoop on all of life's mysteries, so there's nothing in that trap for them to avoid... unless we talk to them 5 to 20 years after I'm cold rotting tissue in the ground, and they can no longer holler anything approaching witty or effective come-backs, cause I'm in a place where I don't give a rat's ass.

      Other than for that, my social circles are intentionally shrunken, and have been for 2-3 years or longer now. Most of the generalized patterns our species possesses in terms of social or group behaviors, leaves them/us as a species to be wary of; not 100% across the board, and not with substantial individual exceptions, but in general, we're a mixed bag, as critters go.

      So I have the 3-6 persons I can typically speak with socially, across the globe, whom I can phone, and talk about weather, death, dying, fishing, weed, etc.

      Beyond that, more often than ever before in my life, some of the times that I receive incoming phone calls, and I'm attempting to rest, trying to keep my skin, brain, and body together in one place, and not leave a silhouette of my torso's outline in a hole in the ceiling from blasting off into outer space from tension and concerns, as the stress simmers to the point that I can feel my skin popping, and feel like my insides are going to explode graphically, and I tell my wife in non-verbal language to tell who ever is on the phone that I'm asleep.

      Long ago I came to the conclusion that having 2 or 3 real friends, who -are- -real- friends, beats the snot out of social media, pretend concern, disingenuousness, or a multiplying of lesser-engaged ears and minds, which often accompanies a lessening of sincerity and an increasing of presence of inflated ego, re. the motivations for the dialogue.

      That's led me to a place that I believe, where social membership is involved, that "Less is more."

      This thread, aside from reaching out for information for myself and a fair bit of venting or pressure relief of sorts, (and I'm FAR from concluded in gathering all the information I need), will also serve as a disjointed resource, so that if some other poor motherfucker finds that, after they're diagnosed, they're sleeping like a marathon slumber competition is happening, they've lost their strength or desire/will to do those things that will help them to get as better as they can, lost their appetite, are having to flounder through abrupt changes to various aspects of lifestyle, and they're caught in the questionable conclusion of that they're going nuts, and this is unique to them, they can rest in some degree of twisted relief, knowing that there's other disturbed desperado bastards out here that did the same dance they are now consumed by, and that there are solutions for SOME of us, not all, but -some-, where we MAY get back our function, not need to forfeit the joys of life or sex, and not need to embarrass ourselves into old age, filling adult diapers with urine or feces, as people move away from us on buses, or in stores, because we smell funny.

      Maybe this isolated thread, in the medical section of a weed site, will be where someone finds out that Docs sometimes/often don't know everything, and when their depressing prognoses makes a person want to put a bullet up-side their own temple, and cover their head with the blankets, feeling like no matter how warm a room is they're cold, and praying to die because there's no hope on the horizon.... they'll realize they're not quite so alone and hopeless, though there's no promises in any of this, other than eventually we pass on... and the System will want money from us for that.

      My/our findings, in this thread and elsewhere, is that some Docs are full of shit, and their attitudes, skills, knowledge, and presentation, might be the difference between a patient putting too much stock in what the insensitive healthcare provider uttered without thinking, and deciding to shorten their suffering a'la the Jack Kevorkian model, versus knowing from research, other patients, better Docs, etc., that the negative BS being pushed by Docs who should've -stopped- being Docs the first time they let their own personal BS and burn-out destroy a patient's will to keep going, is not necessarily reality or truth..

      That was quite an essay re. your couple of notes, Teddy, but that's a minor glimpse of what's going on in my brain for too long now.
      Last edited by moose eater; 12-22-2020, 03:24.

      Comment


        Oh, nearly forgot, I sent off my release of info forms to 2 Seattle area clinics/hospitals, to 2 Docs at each hospital.

        2 of the Docs at the 1 clinic are toward the top of 1 list's compilation of 'Seattle's best urologists.' (*No subjectivity in those rankings, I'm sure.. but, you go with what you got, knowing that not all information is of equal quality).

        Anyway, the preferred (for now) clinic/hospital was one that has a hotel within the hospital, limiting exposure to COVID-19 when/if I'm there.

        So furthering the mapping out of needs, plans, etc., I phoned Alaska Airlines...

        Rates for round-trip to SeaTac are pretty attractive, if a person doesn't mind flying during the Black Plague. Direct from Interior Alaska to Seattle, round-trip, no stops either way, and currently no difference in pricing between the red-eye, and a more sane, mid-day flight; $256 round-trip. Can't beat that with a stick!!!

        That's when the ticket agent informed me that Alaska Airlines will no longer be blocking out seats to provide distance for passengers, re.COVID-19, starting January 7..... and that if I want space for social distancing on those flights, I'll have to buy an 'extra seat.'

        At those prices, the 'extra seat' was not entirely a dead-end, no-go deal, so I inquired as to whether or not, since I would be buying 2 seats, do I also receive 2 sets of air miles??.. NOPE. The passenger's name on my second ticket would apparently read, "Extra Seat.' (*Wondered if that invisible person would prefer to be addressed as 'Mr. Seat', or more informally as just 'Extra,' which is likely what they tell their friends to call them).

        Few efforts have encapsulated the concept of some aspects of life being a matter of '1 step forward and 1 step back', the way this effort has. I told my wife that, looking back at the times I should've been dead or in prison, and the mystical mental exercises that had us toying with ideas such as, all the times things went to shit, helped to pull my proverbial bacon out of the fire in those close calls.... The balance of bad luck interceding to provide good luck; a metaphysical homeostasis of sorts...(*Definitely superstitious, and magical thinking to some degree, but stoking that tiny fire built on 'hope').

        Now all I need is for 1 of the top Seattle Docs and clinics to agree they can help me to the extent that I want to be helped, that they believe I have a good chance of over-coming this in the ways I would like or need to, and I'll be giving Alaska Airlines some more of our money or air miles, and then making concrete plans to run the gauntlet of the planes, airports, ground transport, lodging, surgery, and the reverse course, and just like that....

        We'll see what happens.

        Comment


          That sounds like a plan, moose eater. I like the thought of this thread being an anchor for a drifting soul in the future. You're on one helluva ride, and the thoughts you have shared are common to the disease.
          Sharing your fears and emotions and musings and humor is hard work. You're doing a good job.
          “The sun will eclipse soon unless you sacrifice the prince consort to the goddess of the moon.”
          Hans Bornefeld

          Comment


            Originally posted by buzzmobile View Post
            That sounds like a plan, moose eater. I like the thought of this thread being an anchor for a drifting soul in the future. You're on one helluva ride, and the thoughts you have shared are common to the disease.
            Sharing your fears and emotions and musings and humor is hard work. You're doing a good job.
            Thanks for the encouragement, buzz.

            Some mornings I'm faltering in my drive more than others. One of them days.

            I need to get to town to get Christmas shopping and groceries done; my youngest son has been incredibly generous with gifts, time, energy, etc., and I cringe when I consider all of the different pressures he's ill-equipped to speak about, and here he is , practically acting like a parent and providing Christmas and support.

            While he's a young man now at his age, he's also still a minor who will need to sort out a whole lot of whit in his head about all of this, which he's less adept at discussing that some might be, if only from age and lack of practice.

            Time to check a couple more messages, and then head into town for a ham, some gifts, a few other odds and ends.

            Mama wants a water pic tooth brush of some decent sort, power tools, and the younger son wants some pillows and in-soles for his work boots. What ever else falls into the cart that catches my eyes is fair game.

            Comment


              Well, right in line with energy and timing of late, I left for town only about 2-3 hours later than intended, after getting up about 4 hours later than intended.

              Dropped more release of info waivers in town, did some Christmas shopping, grocery shopping, and bills, then, when I was down to one last stop, where I might've encountered my older son at his work place, I was feeling some notable nausea, so I decided to just return home.

              Was getting ready to have a bite of smoked turkey drum stick, intending to eat a VERY conservative amount, then realized that was equally deserving of the same disdain I have held at times for those who were type II diabetic, who insisted on having bowls of chocolate candies on their desks, as though the whole battle is wrapped up in a pill, with no requirement for personal responsibility and proactivity...

              So, there! I got to bitch myself out at Christmas time, just like I do everyone else... So... world!!! We're fucking even now!!.. Maybe.

              Phoned home to see if there were any new developments, messages, etc., and was informed that the 1st-choice clinic in Seattle had phoned, and they want to schedule an IN-PERSON interview/consult/appointment.

              Apparently they don't do TeleHealth, Zoom, Doxy, or other. Live and in color only.

              So I thought about that for a while as I ran errands in town. "No guts, no glory" came to mind several times. As did, "Well, you wanted the gold, right?? That might take some extra."

              So I'll call them tomorrow, and in my best submissive voice of politeness, right at the threshold of begging for mercy, ask if I DO head down via aircraft for an in-person consult, what are the chances of going straight into surgery (???), if after the consult is over, they agree they can do for me what I want done, and we still care for each others' company..

              At least that would mean only (I'd hope) ONE trip down and back, running the gauntlet of aircraft and airports, persons, passengers, hospital, surgery etc., etc., and back home. One roll of the dice beats the shit out of 2 rolls of the dice at this time, where C-19 risks are involved, so... .I guess we'll see.

              Or... If I'm at the top of my 'persuasion game' tomorrow, MAYBE, just MAYBE, I can effectively convince them that a TeleHealth meeting just to get the initial questions out of the way, might be best, and that during COVID-19, they might improve their standing in the Cosmic Metaphysics category if they took into account that they're dealing with persons who are likely immuno-compromised, and they're, at this time, insisting on Interstate travel via airports for initial meetings.

              Oh well.. .What are ya' gonna' do??..

              So, we'll see what that contact holds for us tomorrow.

              And, on the bright side, I managed to avoid puking again. Cool.

              Comment


                By the way, buzz, re. your past references to coming to see small gains as victories, or something along that line of thought, as of tomorrow, Dec. 23, 2020, we'll get 20 seconds more actual light in the day, as we're past Winter Solstice as of yesterday, 12/21/2020.

                It was on the way home that I was listening to a special production on the radio, honoring some of the elders and the older ways and existence in Alaska, presumably First Nations specific.

                There was a senior First Nations fellow on there, talking about being born on the trap line, where both his mother and father worked the hides and harvest, I assume some where near the 1940s, which made Alaska a very different place than it is now, in re. to modern conveniences.

                Anyway, I thought about the modern conveniences that so many of us, not all, but many, have at our disposal now for things as common as child-birthing, and how being pregnant, ready to birth, and running a trap line with a dog sled team, working her way through the parts of life that don't always coordinate well with other needs.

                I felt a bit more safe, more protected by my resources, and wondered that, while it seems cancers have broadened their types and presence in our world, (possibly/probably in part due to our contaminants we accept so readily these days, whether preservatives, pesticides, herbicides, hormonal, anti-bacterial, and on, and on), but that 80 years ago, +/-, when that old-timer was being birthed by candle or kerosene lamp, his mother and father the only ones present, in a tiny trapping cabin in the middle of the bush, that back then a person might not have known they had cancer, had a plague, were pregnant, had what ever form of medical need, until it came to be too late.

                In that regard, our safety, sense of tentative existence, and more, is often relative to what we have come to expect.

                If I had been present in person with that old feller, I probably would've, in non-C-19 times, patted him on the back, offered an embrace, and told him, "Man, that must've been pretty tough, and your parents must've been pretty damned amazing people!"

                Comment


                  Those precious seconds add up. Merry Christmas, moose eater. Your reference to 'magic' a few posts back made me think of a corresponding term of 'angel'. They are out there in the medical community and to find one is your goal. My angel came in the form of the tech who ran the EBRT. He and I 'clicked' and we shared stories of fishing and baseball and cancer and radio and jigsaw puzzles. My angel made coming back day after day for my 'dose' tolerable.

                  Give those folks in Seattle a full meal of schmooze and hang on.
                  “The sun will eclipse soon unless you sacrifice the prince consort to the goddess of the moon.”
                  Hans Bornefeld

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by buzzmobile View Post
                    Those precious seconds add up. Merry Christmas, moose eater. Your reference to 'magic' a few posts back made me think of a corresponding term of 'angel'. They are out there in the medical community and to find one is your goal. My angel came in the form of the tech who ran the EBRT. He and I 'clicked' and we shared stories of fishing and baseball and cancer and radio and jigsaw puzzles. My angel made coming back day after day for my 'dose' tolerable.

                    Give those folks in Seattle a full meal of schmooze and hang on.
                    Thanks buzz.

                    Yes, when I had spine surgery they served me a hefty portion of anesthetic, and I was about 4+ hours longer than the average person waking up.

                    When I opened up my eyes, had no idea who I was, where I was, etc., and was in some sort of seizure.

                    The woman tending to me 1:1 in my 'recovery area' was truly an angel; she stayed with me from the recovery area where she was with me for over 6 hours, on up through the maze of corridors and elevators form surgery recovery to my hospital bed.

                    She's yet another person for whom I meant to put a letter of commendation into her personnel file, but never did. Maybe still can, as it's not that long ago, really.

                    Anyway, the electronic records my local urology office sent o the 1st-choice clinic in Seattle are apparently minimally readable, so it was another 1 step forward, 2 steps back, again.

                    They are not able at this time to do any telephonic or computer consultations, so we're at that point of seeing who it is I would need to consult with, and maybe trying to line up a series of consults with various Docs from each tx modality they offer, and have enough time in between to not get tooo lost.

                    They have access to a town car/limo service, where I can get a car by myself to the hospital from SeaTac, and back again, alone in the car, and in theory, a disinfected vehicle.

                    A relatively simple room is not that expensive, and I've been offered air miles to get to and from SeaTac and home.

                    The ball is rolling, albeit with some less than perfectly rounded edges thumping along.

                    It seems I finally have some medical personnel involved who don't just look at me and ask, "So, Mr. Non-Doctor, what kind of treatment do you want us to provide?", instead, acknowledging that THEY are the pros, and I'm just the lesser-educated schmuck who just found out 2 months ago he has cancer near his nards.

                    Anyway, I doubt I'll hear back from the hospital in reference until next week, or maybe the next, but we'll see. Positive movement is good. Takes a minor amount of pressure out of the chest and mind.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by buzzmobile View Post
                      Those precious seconds add up. Merry Christmas, moose eater. Your reference to 'magic' a few posts back made me think of a corresponding term of 'angel'. They are out there in the medical community and to find one is your goal. My angel came in the form of the tech who ran the EBRT. He and I 'clicked' and we shared stories of fishing and baseball and cancer and radio and jigsaw puzzles. My angel made coming back day after day for my 'dose' tolerable.

                      Give those folks in Seattle a full meal of schmooze and hang on.
                      Oh, and Merry Christmas to you, too, buzz.

                      I meant to include a coupe questions for you and others, includ9g some who made contributions to this thread last year, who either had successful treatments, or others close to them who had such experiences..

                      You did radiation, if I recall, buzz, correct?

                      How long was your tx again?

                      Pain after procedure?

                      Time involved until normal bowel and bladder processes?

                      Time until normal sexual function?

                      Prosthetics or chemistry required for normal sexual activity or was it strictly non-spontaneous post-surgery?

                      And folks, anyone in addition to buzz, who has pertinent information, or can ask someone they know, please, PLEASE, feel invited to chime in. At this time, I'm 3 steps away from navigating this whole conundrum by brail, and there's few opportunities for do-overs here.

                      Thanks. Really..

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by moose eater View Post
                        You did radiation, if I recall, buzz, correct?
                        Yes, EBRT
                        How long was your tx again?
                        I think it was 45 treatments. M-F for 9 weeks
                        Pain after procedure?
                        No pain
                        Time involved until normal bowel and bladder processes?
                        I never had bowel issues. My bladder issues were frequent and urgent urination. I kept a jar in the car for those times I was stuck in traffic on my way for treatment.
                        Time until normal sexual function?
                        Sexual function was never affected.
                        Prosthetics or chemistry required for normal sexual activity or was it strictly non-spontaneous post-surgery?
                        Nothing more than being a horny old goat.
                        As with all things anecdotal... your mileage may vary.
                        “The sun will eclipse soon unless you sacrifice the prince consort to the goddess of the moon.”
                        Hans Bornefeld

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by buzzmobile View Post
                          As with all things anecdotal... your mileage may vary.
                          Thanks buzz.

                          One of the more unnerving aspects of most things medical, is that every person, every condition, etc., is unique. But knowing where the beginning and end are, of what ever the more common ranges on the continuum are, can provide some degree of sense of security, even if it's just loose contrast..

                          I guess I forgot to include in the questions;

                          How old were you when diagnosed??

                          How long between diagnosis and treatment?

                          How many Docs before you decided? (Yes, you likely answered that several times in these pages).

                          Time to water my deprived mothers, brush my teeth, and stare at the backs of my eye-lids until sleep sets in.

                          We were going to transfer fuel oil this afternoon/evening, but somewhat similar to the tx options and pushing the ball forward, Mother Nature decided to let the snow continue on into the evening, so I decided to transfer fuel oil Christmas eve.... which I guess we're into Christmas Eve Day, as I type this now.

                          Take care.

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCFDBi6R2Qc

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by moose eater View Post
                            How old were you when diagnosed??
                            59
                            How long between diagnosis and treatment?
                            Uncertain, but I think 3-4 months.
                            How many Docs before you decided? (Yes, you likely answered that several times in these pages).
                            4
                            We are awaiting a strong cold front today. Tornado watch and a slight chance of snow with Christmas morning low predicted @30F.
                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8pQBh2PNeU
                            The woodstove is ready to crank tomorrow morning.
                            “The sun will eclipse soon unless you sacrifice the prince consort to the goddess of the moon.”
                            Hans Bornefeld

                            Comment


                              Having come to resent waking up many mornings, I am, none the less, managing to begin modifying a sleep pattern that had been nothing if not out of control.

                              So it was this A.M., when, much to my surprise, the telephone rang on Christmas Eve morning, and it was the 1st-choice clinic in Seattle, but a different person, and a different Doc who had not been quite as regarded as the other 2 there I had written, but was still on that stellar list of the top 20.

                              I have an appointment for an in-person consultation with the Doc in reference in about 3 weeks, and I may try to work it out to meet with other Docs at the other 2 or 3 resources while I'm down there.

                              Rooms at the Inn in the hospital are reportedly sanitized in between guests, and it's possible I can get a room that has been remodeled, and therefore, hasn't had anyone in it in a while... making it that much safer. And the rooms were at decent rates.

                              Rooms also don't have shared air circ between them, so that's cool; even less risk of shared contamination.

                              Same-same for the Limo service, I was told; dividers and disinfected, and a flat-rate to and from the airport, to boot.

                              So I guess now once the nausea clears, my head is a bit more focused, and correspondence is complete, I need to make some reservations, and cross my fingers again.

                              Comment


                                By the way, a maybe-helpful tip to anyone else trying to mitigate nausea.

                                I had in increased sense of nausea at pill time, so I determined to remove 1 supplement or vitamin at a time, and if no changes, put that one back in its spot in the schedule and remove the next suspected source.

                                I moved a 65 mg dose of iron from A.M. to P.M. (an un-Godly looking purplish pill, better suited to coloring Easter eggs than augmenting human nutrition) due to knowing there was already a lesser source of possible nausea, and as of yesterday, there was a notable decline to the sense of nausea.

                                Yet another moment of successes.

                                Now, for an aircraft ticket and a room in Seattle..

                                Comment

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