When do I cut the flowers with seeds???

inpain0013 · Nov 21, 2009

I was going to ask this question in the breeder's lab. But, it would't let me. Maybe you all will help me here.

This was my first grow. And, I have one Northern Lights female that was accidentally pollinated (newbie goof

. The up side is that I'll have some free seeds!!

But, how do I know when it is time to cut the buds/flowers with the seeds?? And, how long do I need to let them dry/cure before planting them?

Thanks for any help you are willing to lend!!

IP

:

Pseudo · Nov 21, 2009

you wait until the seeds are mature and popping out of the calaxs, they should be dark in color or a mottled look, make ssure they are not easy to crush and not white, or lite green, let them dry a couple months and repeat, btw, a plant bearing seeds should be fed more of a veg formula than bloom
good luck

chizzleonetime · Nov 21, 2009

if they are light green when bud is chopped will they ever dry out and be usable or is it strictly coloured beans that are viable?,,,,cos i i got a bean drying now that was green and soft and is now turning hard and grey colour ?

inpain0013 · Nov 21, 2009

Here's some pictures of the seeds that I harvested from a "test" spot. I clipped the area off and let it hang and dry for about 5 days. When I picked it up on the morning of the 6th day, I noticed that a seed fell out. So, I went ahead and harvested the seeds. The outsides of all of them (including the greener ones) were hard. When they would fall on the glass plate that I was using, they would sound like a very small rock striking the glass.

The first three pics are without a flash and the last two are with a flash. I didn't do any color enhancements or anything that way. All I did was to crop them and resize them. Here they are:

Alright guys... what say you... do they even have a snowflake's chance in Hell of sprouting????? Thanks in advance for your input!! And, thanks to Pseudo and chizzleonetime for you input!!

IP

ibjamming · Nov 21, 2009

I've never removed seeds while the bud was still wet... But looking at the mottling on some of them...I'd imagine they're fine. Next time, let the bud dry before removing the seeds.

RebelYell · Nov 21, 2009

chizzleonetime said:
if they are light green when bud is chopped will they ever dry out and be usable or is it strictly coloured beans that are viable?,,,,cos i i got a bean drying now that was green and soft and is now turning hard and grey colour ?

The squeeze test isn't perfect and will kill a small percentage of viable seeds, but should give you a good idea of maturity.

Some will probably germinate, but most will not. To increase your chances, let them dry for a month or two. Then throw them in the freezer for a couple weeks to simulate winter. I know its not necessary to freeze them, but I always do it anyway in hopes of improving germ rates.

inpain0013- the seeds in the pic look pretty good to me. Obviously they could have gone a little longer, but I think you'll still get pretty good results.

foomar · Nov 21, 2009

Have been sorting a lot of different seed seed batches this year and have recorded all pertinant information and have found that .....

Plants need 35 days from pollination to produce good seed in quantity.

The appearance can be deceptive , some crosses produce seed that looks pale and immature yet is fully viable , others will form seed with a hard dark shell by 25 days but are hollow.

If they pass a pinch test the only real way to tell is to germ a sample and see.

As they are for your own use i guess it doest really matter as plenty will pop.

Was a seperate male involved or was there a hermi problem ?

inpain0013 · Nov 22, 2009

Thanks for the input, guys! When I cut the rest of the buds, I will let them dry out good before I harvest the seeds.

I did a pinch test on 10 of the 63 seeds that I harvested. I tested more of the more green ones than the other ones. 10 of 10 of the seeds passed the pinch test with flying colors!!

At least that is a step in the right direction. And, before long, I will do a germ test on a few of them.

foomar said:
Was a seperate male involved or was there a hermi problem ?

No hermie. It was a male that was raised from the same seed pack that came from Nirvana Shop (10 mixed seeds).

The newbie goof that I made was not chopping down the male soon enough. Lack of experience... not looking close enough... outright stupidity on my part... whatever it was, I didn't think that my female was showing signs of flowering any time soon... though she and the male were planted at the same time and came up at the same time. Intrigued by his beauty, I allowed the male to grow. Before I went to bed one night, I checked him and decided I would cut him down the next day. I had something urgent come up and wasn't able to get to him until 3 or 4 days later. When I finally cut him down, about 30 to 40 pollen bags exploded!! Of course, my fan was going. And, pollen flew everywhere! I tried to clean up, dust off, and vacuum up as best I could. But, apparently I didn't do a good enough job. Or, maybe it was simply too late. At any rate, that's how my female got prego!!!

Any suggestions as to how best to clean everything and get rid of or sterilize any possible "left overs" from the pollen before my next grow?

BTW, I did take some clones from her. So, the male problem won't happen on this next grow! And, I WILL be much, much more careful on my next "from seed" grow. At the first sign of a male, he will get cut down, chopped up, burned, stomped on, spit on.... and, then I'll bury him!!

Thanks for your input and information!!

IP :smoker:

RebelYell · Nov 22, 2009

inpain0013 said:
Any suggestions as to how best to clean everything and get rid of or sterilize any possible "left overs" from the pollen before my next grow?

Pollen isn't viable for that long in an open area... maybe a week? I am sure you can research it's shelf life, but there is abslutely no worry about it carrying over to your next grow.

foomar · Nov 22, 2009

As its a proper male then they should certainly be worth popping , have grown out many Nirvana and incrosses from single packs and they have been as good as the originals with a few more freaks , good and bad.
If you can run the numbers this is a good place to find the odd stunner on the cheap.

Would be cautious useing a standard vacume cleaner , unless it has a allergy/HEPA(?) filter the pollen can blow straight through.
Have found that pollen can be washed off with plain water , filtered and dried out and still be fertile : adding a wetting agent or surfactant like microsol kills it dead , spray and wipe down every surface should do it.

inpain0013 · Nov 22, 2009

RebelYell said:
Pollen isn't viable for that long in an open area... maybe a week? I am sure you can research it's shelf life, but there is abslutely no worry about it carrying over to your next grow.

Thanks for the info, Reb! I was thinking that I remembered learning in school (waaaaaayyyy too many years ago) that pollen didn't stay viable for a very long time unless it was stored properly. But, I will do as you suggest and do some research.

BTW... given where I'm from, I love the user name!!!

Yeeee Hawwwwww!!!!!!!

IP

1G12 · Nov 22, 2009

I leave seeds in the buds, in glass jars after drying for a couple months, removing the lids every day for 1/2 hour. Did a germ test last batch and got 40/40 to sprout. So, this seems to work pretty well. Just, after pollination, don't chop the plant for at least 5 weeks.

inpain0013 · Nov 22, 2009

foomar said:
As its a proper male then they should certainly be worth popping , have grown out many Nirvana and incrosses from single packs and they have been as good as the originals with a few more freaks , good and bad.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for more good than bad!!

foomar said:
Would be cautious useing a standard vacume cleaner , unless it has a allergy/HEPA(?) filter the pollen can blow straight through.

Because of the allergies that my wife has and the fact that our environment is kept dusty by the thousands of acres of farm land around us, we have two good vacuum cleaners. One uses bags... standard or HEPA... we always use HEPA. And, we normally use it for small, quick clean ups. The other is a bagless that has 2 HEPA filters in it... one is inside the canister and the other is in the cleaner's exhaust. We use it for routine cleaning of the house. Because of the extra good job of filtering out small particles, the bagless one is the one that I used to clean up the pollen.

foomar said:
Have found that pollen can be washed off with plain water , filtered and dried out and still be fertile : adding a wetting agent or surfactant like microsol kills it dead , spray and wipe down every surface should do it.

The only microsol that I have ever heard of is used by modelers to soften decals and cause them to corform to irregular surfaces. In most cases, it even causes the decal to become part of the paint. Is this the microsol that you are speaking of?

Not familiar with the term "surfactant," I searched for its meaning on Wikipedia.com. Wikipedia says, "Surfactants reduce the surface tension of water by adsorbing at the liquid-gas interface."

In your application, is the surfactant used to cause the pollen to absorb the water/wetting agent? If so, am I correct in assuming that water combined with a dishwashing liquid (ie., Dawn, Plamolive, and so on) can be used to effectively clean up the pollen?

Thank you for your input and information!!

IP

inpain0013 · Nov 22, 2009

1G12 said:
I leave seeds in the buds, in glass jars after drying for a couple months, removing the lids every day for 1/2 hour. Did a germ test last batch and got 40/40 to sprout. So, this seems to work pretty well. Just, after pollination, don't chop the plant for at least 5 weeks.

You must have made your post while I was typing my reply to foomar. Thanks for your advice. I'll definately give the glass jar drying a try. Using a jar will make collecting the seed much easier than anything else that I could come up with on my own!!

I guess what my grandmother would tell me as a small child really was right. She would say, "Two heads are always better than one... even if mine is a gourd head!!"

foomar · Nov 22, 2009

microsol that I have ever heard of is used by modelers to soften decals

That took me back forty odd years , took plastic modelling seriously till i discovered sex and drugs.

Different product by the same name was marketed here as an industrial cleaner/degreaser but is just a glorified detergent , washing up liquid does the same job.
The pollen grains are so microscopically small that the high surface tension of plain water droplets will not actually wet them to any usefull degree and detergent/surfactant/soap/wetting agent ect lowers this tension.

JackTheGrower · Nov 22, 2009

1G12 said:
I leave seeds in the buds, in glass jars after drying for a couple months, removing the lids every day for 1/2 hour. Did a germ test last batch and got 40/40 to sprout. So, this seems to work pretty well. Just, after pollination, don't chop the plant for at least 5 weeks.

Do seeds store long term without oxygen?

I can't remember reading that but, I have read a lot of posts in the past years.

BurmeseDragon · Nov 22, 2009

Seeds don't get to ripe unless they rot in the bud, or start to sprout there...which I've never seen.

It seems they don't always ripen up with what part they don't show, so it's good to wait until the plant is ready......unless you only pollinated the first early calyxes.

I have pollinated the early ones then made some more seed later on and they all turned out fine...in fact great.

exploziv · Nov 22, 2009

a good percentage of the seeds will germ just fine! you could select the plants that grow faster and better during the first weeks to be sure no plant has development problems, but this isn't a must.

good luck!

inpain0013 · Nov 23, 2009

foomar said:
That took me back forty odd years , took plastic modelling seriously till i discovered sex and drugs.

foomar said:
Different product by the same name was marketed here as an industrial cleaner/degreaser but is just a glorified detergent , washing up liquid does the same job.
The pollen grains are so microscopically small that the high surface tension of plain water droplets will not actually wet them to any usefull degree and detergent/surfactant/soap/wetting agent ect lowers this tension.

Thanks a bunch, foomar!!

IP :smoker:

inpain0013 · Nov 23, 2009

Daaaaamn... I didn't even realize there was a second page before I made my last post!

exploziv_gbb said:
a good percentage of the seeds will germ just fine! you could select the plants that grow faster and better during the first weeks to be sure no plant has development problems, but this isn't a must.

good luck!

Thanks a bunch, exploziv!! Sounds like a plan to me!!

IP

When do I cut the flowers with seeds???

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