UVB VS NO UVB Side by Side

[led05]

I have been following UVB info and have used Reptisun T5 in a small grow. I don't have room for a side by side so I am not making any claims but it makes sense that it adds in my mind. After all the info I could glean it seemed that the best UVB bulbs only reached 5-10 inches or so and watching you tube vids testing seemed to bear that out. Yet you say 3 FEET??! Wow. If that's verifiable that's impressive.

Initial treatment with these for skin disorders (psoriasis for example) is 90 seconds at 18", at 18" the UVI is 30+, the meter i used is 100% accurate to outdoor readings both on gauges I have tested and local known weather UV index readings...

The cool thing is u can buy them as they are also used in industry so not restricted ... buy a couple, stand 20" from it for 5 mins, you'll see... I've only ever run them 3 hours daily from at least 3' away, they work and anyone who's ever used medical UVB for skin issues know how strong these things are...

The power veg at like 8-10" are UVI per my meter a 5, the ushio mid range reads 100+ that close... I know, UVI reading that high are nuts but if it's an 8 outside it reads 8, it reads exactly as it should and these mid range up close burn skin in under 30 seconds, they are a serious bulb

I use them in winter personally too for vitamin D and my psoriasis

 

[Guest]

Initial treatment with these for skin disorders (psoriasis for example) is 90 seconds at 18", at 18" the UVI is 30+, the meter i used is 100% accurate to outdoor readings both on gauges I have tested and local known weather UV index readings...

The cool thing is u can buy them as they are also used in industry so not restricted ... buy a couple, stand 20" from it for 5 mins, you'll see... I've only ever run them 3 hours daily from at least 3' away, they work and anyone who's ever used medical UVB for skin issues know how strong these things are...

The power veg at like 8-10" are UVI per my meter a 5, the ushio mid range reads 100+ that close... I know, UVI reading that high are nuts but if it's an 8 outside it reads 8, it reads exactly as it should and these mid range up close burn skin in under 30 seconds, they are a serious bulb

I use them in winter personally too for vitamin D and my psoriasis

Can you provide a link to where you bought these? From what you imply one of these 12" tubes can cover a footprint of 2-3' per side from a distance of 3 feet above canopy?

 

[led05]

Can you provide a link to where you bought these? From what you imply one of these 12" tubes can cover a footprint of 2-3' per side from a distance of 3 feet above canopy?

Quick search of what I already said led me here, 2 seconds...


Link failed see below - btw, it is NOT THE BLACKLIGHT, look closer


Do some research, look at meter I choose, think why, look at the bulbs, the exact prsks NM etc, educate yourself and see why, lots went into selecting these and huge fact I could buy AND also fit into an easily purchased fixture


Just google ushio mid range 306nm and poke around, learn a bit about lighting & wavelength it will benefit u forever

 

[ambertrichome]

Also look into the Solacure Flower Power bulbs.



Specifications:

FR40T12 multi-wattage, multi-peak UVB/UVA horticultural lamp.
Wattage: 32-40 watts standard, can be run as high as 80w for special applications.
Color: white to violet. Color temperature >10,000K
Dimension: 4 foot by 1.5 inches. Will fit almost any shop light.
Reflector: Built inside the lamp. No external reflector needed.
UVA/B: 5x the power of the SG-1 and Universal UV. About 20 to 50x the power of reptile lights.
UVA/B rating: Equivalent to a 30% UVB lamp, but we do this in very different frequencies, so they don't equate.
Life: 1000 hours at 70% of original power.

From the ground up, this lamp was engineered to do nothing but operate as a horticultural lamp. It can operate as low as 25 watts and as high as 80 watts, but is centered to us a standard 4 foot 32w fixture and it's own timer. It is four foot long, 1.5" in diameter, so it can be used in virtually every 4 foot fixture at the hardware store. Our entire goal was to make it simple and cheap to operate. All the really interesting things are happening inside the lamp, not in the fixture.

Again we licensed Sol Glass for this lamp, like our SG series lamps. It is more transparent to any other UV glass made, and allows transmission of UVB between 280nm and 300nm, something other lamps don't do well. This is one reason our lamps have been so successful in the labs, testing for resin/flavonoids/terpenes/THC. The new spectrum uses many of the same spectral peaks as the SG, but are 3 to 4 times stronger in the UVB, while still having a solid UVA profile. UVA is seldom discussed in many circles, and it is too large a topic to discuss here, but we design our lamps with a sun similar UVA spectrum because we have good reason to think it is also very beneficial for UV started plants. The UVA to UVB ratio is very different than the sun, however, as the effective ratio is about 4 times higher than the sun. This is why you can use half as many lamps and still get twice as much UVB. In short, you use few lamps farther from from your plants. This makes using them easier and cheaper for you, while being more effective. It is hard to overstate how big a leap this lamp is.


Like most Solacure lamps, the Flower Power has a built in reflector, so you don't need to worry about using reflective material with it. Mylar, white paint, all these absorb UV anyway, they are useless for reflecting it. The image on the left shows a regular lamp, the image on the right is how the Flower Power is designed, with an internal reflector. It forces all the light to go in one direction, making designing and installing a system much easier. This means the lamp has about 50% more total UV output than a non-reflector design with a home made reflector.


For all flowering plants (including fruits and vegetables) grown indoor or in a greenhouse environment. The exact amount of UV needed for each plant will vary, and must be determined by the grower. To offer enhanced UVB, most growers will use two of the Flower Power lamps for every 1000w HPS/MH or equivalent. Obviously these will work on cannabis and are designed to maximize the UVB needs of the buds, but it was designed to be a greenhouse light and to provide the missing UVB for any plant.


How to use these lamps
Use two Flower Power lamps per 1000w hood, one on each side for even coverage, 12" to 24" from the plants (farther is weaker so needs to be run longer, but covers a larger area). Run 1 to 4 times per day, 1 to 6 hours per cycle for up to 12 hours (single cycle). How much depends on your particular plants, so start with 2 to 4 hours and work your way up, looking out for burned edges. The goal is to stress the plants, push them, without damaging them. Only run during your day cycle. Use during flowering and fruiting stage. Also proven to suppress mold and mildew as well as discourage many insects.

Another method that is claimed to produce higher CBD is the "Pulse Method". You run them 15 minutes on, 45 minutes off. This will shorten lamp life somewhat, but will still get you 2 flowering seasons worth of use. These claims have been made by a few professional growers. Most tests that instead run the UVB continuously for several hours have shown to not dramatically affect CBD production (flat to slightly higher).

Already certified to get 20% to 35% higher THC and flavonoids and anecdotal evidence that approaches 40% higher, and results keep coming in

 

[Guest]

Quick search of what I already said led me here, 2 seconds...


Link failed see below - btw, it is NOT THE BLACKLIGHT, look closer


Do some research, look at meter I choose, think why, look at the bulbs, the exact prsks NM etc, educate yourself and see why, lots went into selecting these and huge fact I could buy AND also fit into an easily purchased fixture


Just google ushio mid range 306nm and poke around, learn a bit about lighting & wavelength it will benefit u forever

I already found the tubes and where to buy them from several vendors. About $17 ea +- and a fixture as well for about $20. I have spent a lot of time reading over the last year plus and there are a very few YouTube vids about it and a couple showing testing of output with expensive meters.
I'd like to see some evidence backing up the claims of this particular UVB tube and a idea on how much of a footprint it covers. I believe you when you say you have measured it but want to see some more real life opinions coinciding with yours.

The other suggestion of flower power is interesting and have seen them before. I'm in a small foot print (less than 3'X3') but 7' tall so their bulbs are too long for my application. I'm not going to spend the money for 4 lights and fixtures in that small of a space.

Which is why the Ushio product is intriguing for me. A 12.5" tube that puts out UVB seemingly on a magnitude that is multiples of any claims of other UVB tubes. And not expensive if the coverage and output is as claimed. I could theoretically attach just one on the center of the frame of my Timber grow light.

 

[led05]

I already found the tubes and where to buy them from several vendors. About $17 ea +- and a fixture as well for about $20. I have spent a lot of time reading over the last year plus and there are a very few YouTube vids about it and a couple showing testing of output with expensive meters.
I'd like to see some evidence backing up the claims of this particular UVB tube and a idea on how much of a footprint it covers. I believe you when you say you have measured it but want to see some more real life opinions coinciding with yours.

The other suggestion of flower power is interesting and have seen them before. I'm in a small foot print (less than 3'X3') but 7' tall so their bulbs are too long for my application. I'm not going to spend the money for 4 lights and fixtures in that small of a space.

Which is why the Ushio product is intriguing for me. A 12.5" tube that puts out UVB seemingly on a magnitude that is multiples of any claims of other UVB tubes. And not expensive if the coverage and output is as claimed. I could theoretically attach just one on the center of the frame of my Timber grow light.

I think someone above you was trying to advertise something, I read quick and am busy...

The 15w version puts out 3w near pure uvb, no joke, it's by far the best and fits reptile fixtures,, like I said it's legit uvb, be careful, by 3 months edge of ur cheap ass fixture is burnt like the mountain sun

Get your own uvb meter and measure it, I'm offering fee advice and have spent thousands getting here

 

[DocTim420]

For those of us that don't use LED or florescent bulbs and desire a good UVB bulb to enhance flowering--I would investigate these two:

7.2k kelvin https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/115289/PX-MS6007200.html
10k kelvin https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/88311/PX-MPS60010K.html

Spec sheet for both: https://a89b8e4143ca50438f09-7c1706ba3fabeeda794725d88e4f5e57.ssl.cf2.rackcdn.com/spec_sheets/files/000/047/401/original/plantmax-px-mps60010k-specs.pdf?1482944613

Both of those are 600 watts, and there are 1k watt bulbs available...but I found those to be tooo much (requiring an incredible amount of space between bulb and plant canopy).

First couple of weeks plants go under 7.2k bulbs...last couple of weeks they finish under the 10ks...with HPS 1k watts during the rest. That's what I do.

Safety first fellas, wear UV protective glasses when working under UVB lamps (I paid $3 at a welding supply shop for mine...same place I refill my CO2 tanks...$9/tank)

 

[DemonTrich]

Philips 315 cmh 940 and 930 bulbs have a nice uva/uvb specrum.

 

[Guest]

Phaeton

I've done quite a bit of research (all anecdotal unfortunately, no lab) but did find what I consider by far the best UVB bulbs accessible to most and that will throw substantial UVB mid range 3-4' plus, easily, this could be of benefit for you or others at a minimum.

Look into the Ushio Mid Range UVB bulbs (306nm) - there are various sizes, I found them as I know about dermatological lamps which is one of their uses. They put out 10+ UV Index over 3' away using 15 watts or so, think the 15w ones are the size I use, there are various ones as mentioned.

I tested everything there out there, MH, CMH, Aquarium MH, LED, HPS, all types, the Ushio mid-range UVB are best bang for buck, BY FAR...

I tested with this meter, hits the right peaks for UVB, near perfectly, also nice to see in a measurement I understand, UV Index

https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html


I found that UVB def does things, especially on the terpene side... Grow some regular herbs (basil, oregano etc.) in a Greenhouse vs outside, the outside stuff has a lot more flavor etc to it due to a number of factors but UVB being present outside vs not under Poly is one of them, for sure, same holds true inside for most herbs, the plant of interest here, especially , run with REAL UVB and you'll see.

Cheers, fwiw, I know Sam doesn't agree with me on this, oh well
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How many hours a day do you start with for the 15 watt bulb for a grow in flower and whats your minimum distance to top of plants if you could tell me? Start mid flower or ?? I have a cheap fixture to use for a trial with one bulb and if it works I can upgrade to a sunblaster fixture. If this throws that much UVB I dont want to overdo it. Any pics of setup you can share?

 

[Guest]

Quick search of what I already said led me here, 2 seconds...


Link failed see below - btw, it is NOT THE BLACKLIGHT, look closer


Do some research, look at meter I choose, think why, look at the bulbs, the exact prsks NM etc, educate yourself and see why, lots went into selecting these and huge fact I could buy AND also fit into an easily purchased fixture


Just google ushio mid range 306nm and poke around, learn a bit about lighting & wavelength it will benefit u forever

Well I thought you might be able to provide me some new information or examples of your grow. I have seen everything you have listed last year but really hoped you could provide your own example. I used the T5 Reptisun in Sunblaster fixtures in flower hanging 10" or less above the canopy and moved them every other day. I dont know if it made a difference or not but I will use them again when I get that far in this grow.

 

[Guest]

I think someone above you was trying to advertise something, I read quick and am busy...

The 15w version puts out 3w near pure uvb, no joke, it's by far the best and fits reptile fixtures,, like I said it's legit uvb, be careful, by 3 months edge of ur cheap ass fixture is burnt like the mountain sun

Get your own uvb meter and measure it, I'm offering fee advice and have spent thousands getting here

I was just wanting to see if you had any new info or could post some test results? Being a good IC member I had hoped you would share some of your info.
This is one of several vids that have been around for a time and Id love to see you post something even just pics with your meter and the bulbs you mention and how the results show.
This is a fascinating subject and Im surprised more people dont look into it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BykzI1hlxI

 

[Guest]

For those of us that don't use LED or florescent bulbs and desire a good UVB bulb to enhance flowering--I would investigate these two:

7.2k kelvin https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/115289/PX-MS6007200.html
10k kelvin https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/88311/PX-MPS60010K.html

Spec sheet for both: https://a89b8e4143ca50438f09-7c1706...al/plantmax-px-mps60010k-specs.pdf?1482944613

Both of those are 600 watts, and there are 1k watt bulbs available...but I found those to be tooo much (requiring an incredible amount of space between bulb and plant canopy).

First couple of weeks plants go under 7.2k bulbs...last couple of weeks they finish under the 10ks...with HPS 1k watts during the rest. That's what I do.

Safety first fellas, wear UV protective glasses when working under UVB lamps (I paid $3 at a welding supply shop for mine...same place I refill my CO2 tanks...$9/tank)

Is there any testing to demonstrate the UVB output?

 

[DocTim420]

Is there any testing to demonstrate the UVB output?

Not that I am aware of...since UVB is invisible (not seen by the naked eye)--we should not use what our eyes see as an indicator of UVB. But when my eyes observe the response by the plants, I am confident of the higher than normal UVB output...especially on the 10k Kelvin lamps.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Also look into the Solacure Flower Power bulbs.



Specifications:

FR40T12 multi-wattage, multi-peak UVB/UVA horticultural lamp.
Wattage: 32-40 watts standard, can be run as high as 80w for special applications.
Color: white to violet. Color temperature >10,000K
Dimension: 4 foot by 1.5 inches. Will fit almost any shop light.
Reflector: Built inside the lamp. No external reflector needed.
UVA/B: 5x the power of the SG-1 and Universal UV. About 20 to 50x the power of reptile lights.
UVA/B rating: Equivalent to a 30% UVB lamp, but we do this in very different frequencies, so they don't equate.
Life: 1000 hours at 70% of original power.

<--- snip marketing --->

How to use these lamps
Use two Flower Power lamps per 1000w hood, one on each side for even coverage, 12" to 24" from the plants (farther is weaker so needs to be run longer, but covers a larger area). Run 1 to 4 times per day, 1 to 6 hours per cycle for up to 12 hours (single cycle). How much depends on your particular plants, so start with 2 to 4 hours and work your way up, looking out for burned edges. The goal is to stress the plants, push them, without damaging them. Only run during your day cycle. Use during flowering and fruiting stage. Also proven to suppress mold and mildew as well as discourage many insects.

Ok, so this is interesting. Though the marketing is a bit over the top, their pages quote 20-30% increase in THC (Uh-Huh), they do make the appearance they've done some testing with cannabis. Ambertrichome, or anyone else, is there more information somewhere such as any dialogue with employees/testers of the company?

Another method that is claimed to produce higher CBD is the "Pulse Method". You run them 15 minutes on, 45 minutes off. This will shorten lamp life somewhat, but will still get you 2 flowering seasons worth of use. These claims have been made by a few professional growers. Most tests that instead run the UVB continuously for several hours have shown to not dramatically affect CBD production (flat to slightly higher).

Already certified to get 20% to 35% higher THC and flavonoids and anecdotal evidence that approaches 40% higher, and results keep coming in

THIS is something I definitely want more information on. Also the effect the "Pulse Method" has on terpene production/profile.

Anyone?

 

[Guest]

Not that I am aware of...since UVB is invisible (not seen by the naked eye)--we should not use what our eyes see as an indicator of UVB. But when my eyes observe the response by the plants, I am confident of the higher than normal UVB output...especially on the 10k Kelvin lamps.

We should not only depend on "when my eyes observe response by the plants". Not that your wrong but using a reliable and proven UVB meter like the SolarMeter 6.2 or similar model is the verifiable measurement. Even side by side grows without testing on the finished product for THC levels doesnt seem to have been done that I can find with test results shown.
Seems like there are plenty of folks who swear by UVB and I believe it probably helps but if it were that obvious and provable it seems there would be more info and hard proof of the results.

If I had the space Id buy a sample of the most recommended 3-4 bulbs and grow two plants under each sample (all same strain or clones) and measure using a Solarmeter to document the levels. Then at end of grow send samples to labs for testing.

 

[DocTim420]

First a quick background--for over a decade I grew conventionally (veg MH & flower HPS) then about 6 years ago, I experimented with mixed spectrum in my flower environment (checkerboard style: alternating lamps between HPS and normal MH). About 2-3 years ago I adopted my current strategy (start and finish under MH-UVB with HPS during the rest).

Finishing under high UVB lights (10k Kelvin), I have noticed a few things--

1. Some of the plants I can run longer than 80 days (still not more than 21 days under UVB) turned 100% purple (buds, leaves, branches, etc).
2. In addition to the nice golden color (attributed to normal leaf senescence), hues of various colors of red also appeared.
3. The duration for the trichs to turn amber was reduced--or perhaps more accurately to say it "accelerated".
4. Aromas are stronger and flavors are more complex (lots more going on--compared to 100% HPS...which I did for more than a decade, and even deeper when compared to "mixed spectrum" style).
5. Potency...this I have not tested. But this is my conundrum: When I ran mixed spectrum the lab #s indicated the THC increased about 10-20% (flowers that tested 20% TCH now were in the 24% neighborhood). Then when I changed to my current strategy (start and finish under high UVB)...POW, everything jacked up a notch or two higher (this I did not verify with lab #s....didn't need to as it was super obvious--immediate effect with a longer duration).

That said, I will be testing one of my new strains I am running, problem is...I don't want to run a plant without finishing them under UVBs...lol.

Now as for high UVBs during the first few weeks in flower, I observed an increase in both girth and height, as well as increased number of bud sites. Problem is, I also made changes to my grow medium and so it is kinda hard for me to exactly pinpoint the specific contributions of each (grow medium change vs 7.3k Kelvin for the first few weeks). But no matter what...lol, I will gladly accept the increase in girth, height and bud sites.

 

[Guest]

First a quick background--for over a decade I grew conventionally (veg MH & flower HPS) then about 6 years ago, I experimented with mixed spectrum in my flower environment (checkerboard style: alternating lamps between HPS and normal MH). About 2-3 years ago I adopted my current strategy (start and finish under MH-UVB with HPS during the rest).

Finishing under high UVB lights (10k Kelvin), I have noticed a few things--

1. Some of the plants I can run longer than 80 days (still not more than 21 days under UVB) turned 100% purple (buds, leaves, branches, etc).
2. In addition to the nice golden color (attributed to normal leaf senescence), hues of various colors of red also appeared.
3. The duration for the trichs to turn amber was reduced--or perhaps more accurately to say it "accelerated".
4. Aromas are stronger and flavors are more complex (lots more going on--compared to 100% HPS...which I did for more than a decade, and even deeper when compared to "mixed spectrum" style).
5. Potency...this I have not tested. But this is my conundrum: When I ran mixed spectrum the lab #s indicated the THC increased about 10-20% (flowers that tested 20% TCH now were in the 24% neighborhood). Then when I changed to my current strategy (start and finish under high UVB)...POW, everything jacked up a notch or two higher (this I did not verify with lab #s....didn't need to as it was super obvious--immediate effect with a longer duration).

That said, I will be testing one of my new strains I am running, problem is...I don't want to run a plant without finishing them under UVBs...lol.

Now as for high UVBs during the first few weeks in flower, I observed an increase in both girth and height, as well as increased number of bud sites. Problem is, I also made changes to my grow medium and so it is kinda hard for me to exactly pinpoint the specific contributions of each (grow medium change vs 7.3k Kelvin for the first few weeks). But no matter what...lol, I will gladly accept the increase in girth, height and bud sites.

In case I missed it exactly what bulbs are you using for UVB ? Ah never mind. I thought you were using a stand alone florescant type in addition to other grow lights.

 

[atticflowers]

Is the UVB light from a LED better than UVB from a T5 saying they r both tha same %? Or which is more effective/efficient?

 

[Guest]

Is the UVB light from a LED better than UVB from a T5 saying they r both tha same %? Or which is more effective/efficient?

Take this with a grain of salt because I cant find the info I read recently. Google UVB Led and I came across it there somewhere.

LEDs making UVB in the range are not being made in any numbers and they dont put out a lot of UVB. Plus very expensive, at this point. Like I said that was the gist of what I found but it took a while. Seems there are hucksters selling questionable products and deceptive advertising.

I still dont get why there isnt any real world testing with pictures or vids of someone taking the readings from various sources. Which is why I think many of the bulbs advertised are not all that. Or the manufacturers would be promoting them for sales out the ass if they could prove their claims.

 

[led05]

Take this with a grain of salt because I cant find the info I read recently. Google UVB Led and I came across it there somewhere.

LEDs making UVB in the range are not being made in any numbers and they dont put out a lot of UVB. Plus very expensive, at this point. Like I said that was the gist of what I found but it took a while. Seems there are hucksters selling questionable products and deceptive advertising.


I still dont get why there isnt any real world testing with pictures or vids of someone taking the readings from various sources. Which is why I think many of the bulbs advertised are not all that. Or the manufacturers would be promoting them for sales out the ass if they could prove their claims.

The only legit source of UVB bulb form that actually puts out a legit and true UVB is fluros, either T5 or T8, LED are not, MH don’t BC their outer envelope filters it, buy a UVB tester, you’ll see.... I’ve said this all before in this thread, provided links etc to others work etc but I’ve seen it personally and tested over 35 lights and bulbs with a 250$ UVB meter and what I say above is fact as the market stands today...


I won’t share grow picks as a personal prudent choice, so if you’ve got those bulbs yet just stand a foot or two in front of them for a bit, you’ll smell it like laying out tanning