No Better than a Placebo for pain?

[tobedetermined]

In the last week the press has latched onto a story about a study of cannabis for pain studies. From the CNN article:

“The placebo response amounted to 67% of the pain relief associated with genuine cannabinoids” CNN Pain relief from marijuana comes from a belief it helps, study finds​

The study of the studies they referenced: Placebo Response and Media Attention in Randomized Clinical Trials Assessing Cannabis-Based Therapies for Pain - A Systematic Review and Meta-analysis

The study’s conclusion:

“Placebo contributes significantly to pain reduction seen in cannabinoid clinical trials. The positive media attention and wide dissemination may uphold high expectations and shape placebo responses in future trials, which has the potential to affect the outcome of clinical trials, regulatory decisions, clinical practice, and ultimately patient access to cannabinoids for pain relief.”​

And the statement from the International Association for the Study of Pain:

“Due to the lack of high-quality clinical evidence, IASP does not currently endorse general use of cannabis and cannabinoids for pain relief.”​

With the caveat:

“While IASP cannot endorse general use of cannabis or cannabinoids for pain at this time, this is not intended to dismiss the lived experiences of people with pain who have found benefit from their use.”​

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So, they are basically saying that the relief we feel from pain when using cannabis might be fairy dust and we only believe it works because the media overwhelmingly tells us it does. And future pain studies attempting to prove or disprove the benefits of cannabis will all be fucked because we all believe it works already.

Somebody has an agenda.

 

[exploziv]

If it's just a placebo, then it's the best that ever existed!

 

[armedoldhippy]

it may not truly ease your pain very much (very subjective), but it sure as hell makes you obsess on it less, which is damn near as good. i've gotten bad migraines years ago after smoking, but have also had it seriously knock the pain down before as well. nothing works every time for everyone.

 

[armedoldhippy]

“The placebo response amounted to 67% of the pain relief associated

exactly how do they measure something they say does not exist? i'm confused...and if they're RIGHT, cannabis was credited with a third of perceived pain relief. when i'm in pain, i'll take what i can get. 2/3 placebo effect, one third weed....hand it over.

 

[armedoldhippy]

If it's just a placebo, then it's the best that ever existed!

THIS! ^ my older brother passed from pancreatic & central nervous system cancers. for the last year or so, his doctors scripted him 6 oxycontin a day for his pain. he took one with breakfast so he could eat, and then smoked weed the rest of the day. he could function on weed (well, sort of, lol) go fishing and do shit you want to do versus sitting in the recliner thinking about eating a pistol. it made his last year livable...

 

[tobedetermined]

And what cannabis were they using? I know from my experiments - very subjective of course - that something like an Ace Malawi or a Zam is useless for pain. If anything it might actually pinpoint it a bit and make it more acute. But smoking a heavy Indica like Pink Kush instantly eases things. And the couple of times that I have tried a pure distillate, I was seriously underwhelmed with the effect. So in my mind, the terpenes/entourage effect of different strains and application methods have to enter the discussion. But I agree, for real deep acute pain, cannabis is a flyswatter - for me anyway.

 

[Gry]

What I have found that has value for me are strong high quality extracts taken sublingually on a schedule to keep a steady amount in the bloodstream.
Over a period of time, I have found that it helps to reduce the over all pain levels.
Felt like I had a reasonable understanding of pain as a result of having lost a kidney to cancer.
Until I was diagnosed with shingles, when I learned how mistaken I had been.
Have greater appreciation for extract than before.

 

[armedoldhippy]

Until I was diagnosed with shingles,

hate to hear that, Gry. i've never had it, but have been told it is horrible. i went and got vaccinated for both it and pneumonia weeks ago...

 

[big315smooth]

tore some ligaments in my knee beginning summer during a tolerance break when i came back to puffn it was mostly healed but still sore and the herb took that little bit of pain away

 

[midwestkid]

I've noticed Lemon scented varieties will help my pain. But I've also had troubles finding a good lemon strain. I'm still looking. Any recommendations for lemon?

My nightly ritual for pain and sleep:
I lay out two ibuprofen. One ibuprofen I cover in CBD paste and the other one gets a squirt of RSO. I squish them together like an oreo and down the hatch. Nighty night.
Only drawback is I can't remember any of my dreams.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

THIS IS A META-ANALYSIS OF 20 STUDIES!

In plain english... out of the thousands of available studies they cherry picked 20 which most suited their goals.

Anyone who's used 'quality' cannabis can attest to the pain reduction which cannabis brings. I myself only need to stop using cannabis for 2 weeks for all MY pain to come back. That's no Fcking placebo I assure you.

Take the time to look behind the curtain of the 'research' the media pushes most violently.

 

[St. Phatty]

Cannabis is an EXTREMELY effective pain medication.

But it doesn't work on all kinds of pain, for all ages of patients.

Cannabis is restricted for the same reason Hemp is restricted - the 2% doesn't like competition with their Petro-chemical technologies.

 

[Cactus Squatter]

And what cannabis were they using? I know from my experiments - very subjective of course - that something like an Ace Malawi or a Zam is useless for pain. If anything it might actually pinpoint it a bit and make it more acute. But smoking a heavy Indica like Pink Kush instantly eases things. And the couple of times that I have tried a pure distillate, I was seriously underwhelmed with the effect. So in my mind, the terpenes/entourage effect of different strains and application methods have to enter the discussion. But I agree, for real deep acute pain, cannabis is a flyswatter - for me anyway.

Zamaldelica has actually been extremely helpful for me with my lower back pain.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Indeed, different cannabinoids for different pains, which is why some strains work for some and not others.

 

[BrassNwood]

10 years ago my Colon exploded and tried to kill me. Diverticulitis was the diagnosis. Three major surgeries over the next four months including a colostomy bag for 3 months.

While it all works more of less like it originally did I'm left with a belly full of Abdominal Adhesions. Normal sober mode anything can set off the Dragon in my belly. Sneezing, Tying my shoes. Deep knee bend motions. The crappy part is it's a delayed pain that strikes up to an hour later and i have to think back WTF did i do 20 minutes ago to trigger it.

It starts as a bayonet being driven into the old stoma site about 8 inches deep then rotated clockwise 2 full 360 degree rotations. If not for the screaming pain the sensation is quite fascinating. Once that finishes the gripping starts and it feels like a hand in my guts squeezing, twisting and trying to yank a big handful out through my navel.

Cannabis stops that cold and opens that clenched hand in my belly like magic. Smoked Cannabis the relief only lasts 45 minutes. A strong edible prevents it from starting and shuts it off for 24 hours. This is NOT a Damn placebo. It takes a serious dose of an opiate to knock this level of pain down and they have that pesky Constipation issue and my reconstructed intestine track doesn't really want that.

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Found here on ICMag and several other Cannabis sites around the net this is the real deal.

BNW

 

[Nannymouse]

Some plants are pretty wonderful at relaxing muscles. If a person has a condition that causes spasms, they very well could find that Cannabis can prevent or even relieve the pain caused by that.
Some plants are pretty wonderful for inflammatory conditions. The list goes on.

If i sat around all drugged out on opioids, my arthritis would be far worse, plus my guts stop working on most pain meds. Nothing like a good 'get up and go' plant to help combat the arthritis stiffness. And there's also a type of plant that will keep a person in 'chill' mode, when continuing with activities would just make pain matters worse.

Something to consider is that preventing the pain is half the battle.

 

[przcvctm]

I smoke for mental health reasons. I also suffered a bicycle accident a couple of years ago. The road rash was awful. While toking for my head, I noticed that the road rash transformed from hot and stinging to cool and itchy. I don't claim to know much about the placebo effect, but I don't see how it could have been a factor when this effect took me by surprise with zero hope or expectation that it might ease my physical pain.

 

[YellowCanaryConsulting]

I have tried nursery bred cannabis grown by thousands of unique operations. It is undeniable: production methodology is a limiting factor on par with genetics. One grower's 'Specific Kush' will numb my spine in a way the body cannot deny, while another growers 'Specific Kush' does nothing.

I'm not letting genetics off the hook. One of my favorite flavors with trippy visuals made me more sensitive to spine pain. Had to let it go.

 

[Rider420]

I wonder why pharmaceutical companies don't like cannabis and claim it does not work? Follow the money!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/07/13/one-striking-chart-shows-why-pharma-companies-are-fighting-legal-marijuana/

When Voters Legalize Cannabis, Big Pharma Stands to Lose Billions

A study in the journal PLOS One forecasts corporate losses when patients choose (or grow) green medicine.

www.webmd.com

 

[Hammerhead]

Thinking your stoned and really being stoned are very different. If they used quality cannabis it would be easy to feel those effects from a placebo. Cannabis doesn't control pain the same as opiates. I would guess their dosages were not correct. All of us know that cannabis gives short term relief. After 1-2 hrs max, those effects are gone. It would be better suited as a breakthrough pain medication.

Anyone that has used cannabis would tell if its a placebo lol.